Gracie Combatives belts in irish BJJ competition

dasmoose

We've recently received emails from some people (who will remain anonymous) training Gracie Combatives via the internet/DVDs. They told us that they would be taking their blue belt tests fairly soon (after approx 5/6 months of training) and as a result had two questions:

1. Would we list their belts on the belt list?

2. What division should they enter in BJJ tournaments in ireland?

To answer question 1, we note that their questions implicitly recognise a difference between "sport" BJJ belts and Gracie Combatives belts. Furthermore on the GC website itself they mention this:

As a result, a Gracie Academy “street” blue belt will win on the street but may not fare well in a sport jiu-jitsu match. On the other hand, a sport jiu-jitsu blue belt will perform well on the mat, but may have difficulty dealing with unpredictable and chaotic circumstances of a real fight.

From https://www.gracieuniversity.com/LC/testcenter_view.aspx?c=63QJ4TGT7X&n=28&t=1

Therefore it is the position of BJJ.ie that we will not recognise belts awarded by the Gracie University through online belt testing. As stated above they are not belts in the same area. We would also recommend that anyone wanting to learn BJJ make the effort to go to a qualified coach; even training once a month with a real coach and training with friends the rest of the time is (we believe) a vast improvement over trying to learn from DVDs.

To answer question 2? We're asking you, the BJJ practitioners and coaches of Ireland. How would you feel competing against someone in a white belt division and finding out afterwards he was a blue belt in Gracie Combatives? How would you feel in the same scenario as a blue belt? We would also like to point out that we are not a governing body merely a few people trying to run a website and help the sport, so it's not really up to us. It's up to coaches and competitors. However we think we can kickstart the discussion

Thanks,
Mark Curry
BJJ.ie

David Jones

Dont open it!!!

gstack

AFAIK Mark if as a whitebelt you want to enter the bluebelt division you are generally permitted to , so I would just consider them as whitebelts.


If they doing an online belt test, I would be surprised if they wanted to compete at any level to be honest.
If they do compete at blue and get dominated then they will either never compete again or cop on and throw away their Gracie Combatives belt and train at a real BJJ school.

Either way let them compete at blue if they want to

eoghan.geraghty

A white belt has always been allowed compete as a blue belt if he had sufficient training either in bjj or a similar discipline, ie judo comes to mind.

However as you've previously shown, according to their own academy they cannot be considered a "sport bjj" blue belt.

So let them compete in blue belt division.

EnjoyChoke

Agree with not recognising the belts, they are not BJJ belts, but competition is the great leveler. Let them enter the blue belt division or the purple belt division for all I care, they will be smashed.

Sid_Justice

Surely a Gracie Combatives blue belt is a super set of a GJJ blue belt. Therefore, shouldn't a Gracie Combatives blue belt have a similar skill and technical level of a GJJ blue belt as well as have combative skills?

One presumes a GJJ bluebelt is accepted as a BJJ blue belt so I don't see why GC Blue belts should be excluded. How about adding them to the list with an asterisk

* denotes bought blue belt online

cletus

I agree with not listing them as blue belts on the bjj website.

The people in question, having received blue belts, would, i assume, naturally want to wear them at competition, so that in itself negates entry into the white belt devision.

This does, however, raisde another question. If they have blue belts, should they be allowed to wear a white belt into competition

Doug Cartel

I'm not a BJJ guy, but this sounds like something you should play by ear. If an internet blue belt wins a white belt event, then he should be kicked up a level in future. If it starts to become a trend where internet blues are winning lower divisions, then it's definitely time to blanket ban them from whitebelt competition.

Barry.Oglesby

Hey lads. I got myself a degree from Drumcondra Upstairs Medical school, is there any chance I can be added to the register of GPs in Ireland? I'd like to dole out some antibiotics.

lawrencesummers

What do they do in other countries, bjj in ireland is a lot younger and less popular than in the UK, how have they handles the same situation?

I have no problem facing anyone in a competition as long as they can respect the rules, if people fight at a level above themselves so be it but you dont have to look far for people fighting at a level below themselves, let them enter where they think they will be challenged, and if they win its time to step up a level

Sid_Justice

Lol at the analogy between a profession that's been in formal existence for a number of centuries which is one of the most tightly regulated officiating bodies in the world and some martial arts thing.

We can make the argument that a BJJ listing is for people with BJJ grades from peer recognised organisations (BJJ revolution, Gracie Barra, SBG, Drysdale etc.) but what about the no-gi tshirts? Why are they in the list than?

I'm not saying a Dave jones / chris brennan blue belt isn't a legit blue belt, but is it the same system?

Barry.Oglesby

Sid_Justice wrote: »

Lol at the analogy between a profession that's been in formal existence for a number of centuries which is one of the most tightly regulated officiating bodies in the world and some martial arts thing.

I prefer the term joke to analogy

BobbyOLeary

Barry wrote:

Hey lads. I got myself a degree from Drumcondra Upstairs Medical school, is there any chance I can be added to the register of GPs in Ireland? I'd like to dole out some antibiotics.

What if the gracie combatives blue belt is of a blue belt standard? Shouldn't they be allowed on the list? Or do we only allow people graded from certain schools? Just an example, if I go away this summer and train some BJJ in California and get given my blue over there, do I get to bring it home or do I have to "earn" it here too before it's recognised? Where do we draw the line between the Drumcondra Upstairs Medical School and UCD? Not arguing, just genuinely curious as to where the line falls.

Chances are the combatives guys aren't as good as the average irish blue belt so it's a moot point though.

David Jones

We can make the argument that a BJJ listing is for people with BJJ grades from peer recognised organisations (BJJ revolution, Gracie Barra, SBG, Drysdale etc.) but what about the no-gi tshirts? Why are they in the list than?

I'm not saying a Dave jones / chris brennan blue belt isn't a legit blue belt, but is it the same system?

Not even going to go there, sid justice.

Tim_Murphy

Sid_Justice wrote: »

Lol at the analogy between a profession that's been in formal existence for a number of centuries which is one of the most tightly regulated officiating bodies in the world and some martial arts thing.

We can make the argument that a BJJ listing is for people with BJJ grades from peer recognised organisations (BJJ revolution, Gracie Barra, SBG, Drysdale etc.) but what about the no-gi tshirts? Why are they in the list than?

I'm not saying a Dave jones / chris brennan blue belt isn't a legit blue belt, but is it the same system?

That is actually a fair enough question IMO.

Why not just keep it simple, let them enter a competition at white belt and see how they get on? If they place then they can compete in the blue division next time.

Didn't know there was such a time as BJJ.ie, has that been around long?

da-bres

Is there a governing body of irish BJJ?

It really would help with these kind of queries.. im getting my info from here and bjj.ie.

bjj.ie seems to be the most organised setup. If there was an active governing body rules could be laid down and tournements..(cough cough sapo) would have to comply to standards.

Issues could be officially resolved:)

stevemc01

This thread has ticking time bomb written all over it.

Tim_Murphy

da-bres wrote: »

Is there a governing body of irish BJJ?

No, there is no governing body and it's pretty unlikely that there ever be. There isn't really a need as far as I can see.

cletus

I've been thinkng about this situation since I posted yesterday. I have revised my stance re. inclusion on the bjj.ie database. As its only real function is to list belts that have been awarded, it has no role in determining who should or should not be on said list. If any legit person has awarded a blue belt to somebody, then it should go on the list.

My initial response to this was from the point of view that it took me a lot longer than 5 months training to get my blue, and also my personal opinion on the Gracie Combatives course. However, objectively speaking, its not up to me as a blue belt to not accept a legitimately awarded belt, however it was awarded.

However, this also means that any competition a Gracie Combatives blue belt enters, should be entered at blue belt division, there shouldn't be a case of, "sure try white belt, see how you get on"

gstack

Look the belt is given after doing an ONLINE course in combatives whatever that is so how is it legitimate ?

colinlaird000

I guess, if they enter at blue belt and win, that would suggest that they are quite good. if they lose, then they aren't so good, (On that particular day anyway!) I don't know if fighters have to validate their entry in competitions by having a grade certificate or similar. Its worrying that guys can enter competitions more or less on good faith. Could joe public from some other country and enter a bjj comp at a darker coloured belt level? Obviously they would be found out when fighting, but isn't this a bit of a safety risk? Thankfully we are in a situation here where the number of clubs is small enough that those running competitions know the coaches personally, or have even graded them.
Apologies if this gets anyones heckles up. Just thinking out loud

cletus

gstack wrote: »

Look the belt is given after doing an ONLINE course in combatives whatever that is so how is it legitimate ?

I initially felt the same way about it, and I still have some reservations, but i've never rolled with anybody whos only experience of jiu-jitsu is the Gracie Combatives stuff

At the end of the day, even if you dont agree with how Rorion is grading these people, he's a lot more qualified to do so than anybody else on these boards.

as far as certificates go, I didnt get one when I got my blue belt, it was just tied around my waist.

@dasmoose: out of curiosity, did the people who contacted you express a preference for the level they would fight at, i.e. were they looking to go in at either white or blue

BobbyOLeary

Tim_Murphy wrote: »

No, there is no governing body and it's pretty unlikely that there ever be. There isn't really a need as far as I can see.

Even if there were a governing body, where would they draw the line between what's legitimate and what's not? I reckon if someone wants their name on the list then they should be allowed, BJJ is so small in Ireland that they'll be found out pretty quickly.

The whole thing of having an exclusive belt list rubs me up the wrong way somehow, reminds me too much of the political problems that happen in some trad MA circles.

Barry.Oglesby

Well a governing body for BJJ could organise national and international level competitions, send nationally representative teams abroad and attempt to get government funding for courses, competitions etc.

Tim_Murphy

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

Even if there were a governing body, where would they draw the line between what's legitimate and what's not? I reckon if someone wants their name on the list then they should be allowed, BJJ is so small in Ireland that they'll be found out pretty quickly.

The whole thing of having an exclusive belt list rubs me up the wrong way somehow, reminds me too much of the political problems that happen in some trad MA circles.

Ya I know what you mean, but it's just a list at the end of the day, nothing to get too worked up over IMO. Belts are just belts anyway, they only have so much meaning (I'm pretty sure I could whoop a lot of the purple belts on that list! :eek::) ).

cletus

Tim_Murphy wrote: »

Belts are just belts anyway, they only have so much meaning

I see what your saying Tim, but I would imagine a lot of people see them as recognition of sorts for the work they've put in. In the grand scheme of things they have little or no significance, but it probably rankles with people a little bit (i know it does with me) that people be given the same recognition without having to put in the same hours on the mat, being beaten up by Fergal Quinlan (ok the last part is mine )

Sid_Justice

I think it's commendable of the BJJ.ie lads to maintain the list and the website in general and come looking for feedback here (and elsewhere).

What purple belts would you bash Tim in the gi btw?

I'm amazed at the amount of guys still blue belts after 4+ years who have been training fairly consistently.

itch53

Hey,

Just jumping in here as someone who uses the Gracie Combatitives course. I was possibly one of the people emailing asking the questions, as I did send in queries a few weeks ago as to how competing would work.

Myself and one of my training partners are the only two Blue Belt holders through the Gracie University in Ireland at the moment as far as I am aware, so I was asking how competing would work. Basically to get the Blue belt, you have to perform the 36 techniques in almost a kata style to show your knowledge/reflexes with the 36 techniques they have specified. It does not incorporate live rolling, or any Gi based techniques at all. The general feeling is that you would be maybe a 2 or 3 stripe sport BJJ white belt when you achieve your GU blue belt. I'm not under any illusions that I'm at the level of the guys here who have earned their blue belts under qualified instructors, and spent months to years competing and rolling week after week. In saying that, in the grouping we do roll for at least 40 minutes at the end of every session, so we wouldn't be completely new to the pressure situations competing would bring.

Basically my question was that as having got our belts from the GU, we are probably only qualified to compete at a sport level at white belt. However, technically we have Jiu Jitsu (Gracie Jiu Jitsu branded versus Brazilian Jiu Jitsu)Blue belts, so how would this affect our eligibility in entering BJJ competitions.

I appreciate that this method of acquiring belts annoys people who have followed the traditional method of training, but at the moment this is the only training we have access to due to work commitments etc. We would still like to compete, but we're just not sure how to go about it.

I'd appreciate any input anyone could give on this.

Thanks,

Stephen

cletus

hey Stephen, thanks for posting in the thread. With regards to competing, what level do you think you should be competing at?

I have to comend your honesty in the situation, it would have been very easy for you to simply turn up at a tournament and fight in the white belt catagory, and mention nothing about the GU grade

itch53

cletus wrote: »

hey Stephen, thanks for posting in the thread. With regards to competing, what level do you think you should be competing at?

I have to comend your honesty in the situation, it would have been very easy for you to simply turn up at a tournament and fight in the white belt catagory, and mention nothing about the GU grade

Hey,

No problem at all, glad to be getting information on this myself!

At the moment, I'd have to say in Gi grappling, white belt level. All of our training so far has been No Gi, and as it's not really belted we'd be in the beginners category I guess? We've about 5 months grappling experience all in.

As for the Gi grappling, I really don't know. The plan with our training group was to switch to Gi training once the Gracie Blue belt had been achieved, and then look to compete after a few months of training Gi specifically. So I guess technically by the time we'd be looking to enter competition, we'd have 12 - 18 months of training behind us, which would put us close to experience levels of newer blue belts. However, to enter now, we would be at white belt level experience and skill wise. So it's definitely a fuzzy area!

The reality is it's not a sport Jiu Jitsu grade, it's an off shoot No Gi Jiu Jitsu grade which focuses on self defense rather than sport. The techniques cross over, such as triangles, arm bars etc. but it doesn't have the Gi specific set ups or guards, passing etc. So from a sport BJJ perspective, we would be white belts, however we have achieved Blue belts in a very similar art, albeit with a different grading system.

I really feel it's up to the organisers to decide what is fair. We realise what extra work we have to put in to compete at a BJJ caliber Blue belt level, so when we do enter, hopefully we'll be competitive at that level. However, if I were to enter now, there's a good chance I'd be killed! Perhaps the idea of if we have the blue belt, just enter us at blue belt and let us earn our stripes? I'm not above getting killed for 6 - 12 months to play catch up, I just want to compete, but I want to compete fairly. Despite the differences in BJJ and GJJ, I wouldn't want someone entering a white belt competition to feel cheated if I were to roll with them and they found out I had the GJJ Blue belt (assuming they don't wail on me!).

It's a tricky one!

Stephen

cletus

perhaps, considering your experience is mostly in no gi, it might be an idea to start competing in no gi comps first. They dont require belts, but rather base their catagories on time training, so you could legitimately compete in the "less than 1 year" catagory

The reality is it's not a sport Jiu Jitsu grade, it's an off shoot No Gi Jiu Jitsu grade which focuses on self defense rather than sport. The techniques cross over, such as triangles, arm bars etc. but it doesn't have the Gi specific set ups or guards, passing etc. So from a sport BJJ perspective, we would be white belts, however we have achieved Blue belts in a very similar art, albeit with a different grading system.

Quite a few guys on this forum would train no-gi, from a sport perspective, and they would have "modified" (for want of a better phrase) setups for all the above and more. Its possible to do most of wht you do in the gi without it.

Where abouts are you based? would you be able to travel to a bjj/grappling club and roll with some of the guys who train regularly. If you could do this even once, it might give you a good idea of where you sit skillwise

JohnMc1

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

What if the gracie combatives blue belt is of a blue belt standard? .

You can watch videos people submit to GC to be graded. As an MA practicioner it makes you sad to see what is considered "passing" in that system. Its like Rorian and his sons are everything possible to destroy what the Gracie have built in the MA world.

da-bres wrote:

Is there a governing body of irish BJJ?

BJJ's problem and possible downfall is that there is no governing body anywhere.

Sid_Justice

itch53 wrote: »

Hey,

No problem at all, glad to be getting information on this myself!

Stephen

Thanks again for posting your story here. Just wondering if it was Gracie combatives itself (the self-defence focus) that attracted you to it,or the fact it can be trained online. I mean, if you could train in pure BJJ online (like following bj penn's video's etc) would you? Or do you prefer the combatives?

To be honest, there aren't many people that start from scratch, train 3 times a week in a Dublin bjj club (or any bjj club) and get to blue belt level in <6 months. That kind of development is rare.

BobbyOLeary

JohnMc1 wrote: »

You can watch videos people submit to GC to be graded. As an MA practicioner it makes you sad to see what is considered "passing" in that system. Its like Rorian and his sons are everything possible to destroy what the Gracie have built in the MA world.

I hear ya and I'd agree that the chances of a GC Blue Belt matching up to a Sport BJJ blue belt (didn't even know it was called that, I usually go with just Jitz) are slim. My point was more philosophical really. If and when a GC Blue Belt arrives who is of blue belt standard (which is what exactly?) will they be allowed on the list?

That said, if someone has achieved a blue belt without the explicit need to show their abilities in live rolling then they can hardly be a BJJ Blue Belt, or any coloured belt for that matter.

Tim_Murphy

Sid_Justice wrote: »

What purple belts would you bash Tim in the gi btw?

Ha ha, I never said I'd bash them, I said I'd whoop them!

Sid_Justice wrote: »

I'm amazed at the amount of guys still blue belts after 4+ years who have been training fairly consistently.

A fair share of these IMO would a) not have anybody to grade them and/or b) spend a lot of their training time focusing on no-gi, wrestling or MMA instead of gi BJJ.

cowzerp

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

I hear ya and I'd agree that the chances of a GC Blue Belt matching up to a Sport BJJ blue belt (didn't even know it was called that, I usually go with just Jitz) are slim. My point was more philosophical really. If and when a GC Blue Belt arrives who is of blue belt standard (which is what exactly?) will they be allowed on the list?

That said, if someone has achieved a blue belt without the explicit need to show their abilities in live rolling then they can hardly be a BJJ Blue Belt, or any coloured belt for that matter.

Dont mean to be smart but the grade is not a Brazilian Jiu Jitsu grade, its something else-so your a BJJ white belt, now with that said, if you are up to BJJ blue belt level competitively like some other non graded sub wrestling folk then you should probably enter in the division that you are best suited, Judo black belts tend to enter straight into blue belt level so you can enter in like that..

lawrencesummers

JohnMc1 wrote: »

...


BJJ's problem and possible downfall is that there is no governing body anywhere.

This is the internatioal bjj federation,
http://www.ibjjf.org/

Some countries also have their own federations, france and portugal are just two that i know.
http://www.fpjjb.com/index.php?lx

One of the things that i admire about bjj is the lineage that instructors and students can prove and are proud of, just because a club is part of the national federation of whatever MA it is doesnt mean the level is any good or bad, in bjj if you want to know how good an instructor is you just look at who promoted him/her and that speaks for itself.

BobbyOLeary

cowzerp wrote: »

Dont mean to be smart but the grade is not a Brazilian Jiu Jitsu grade, its something else-so your a BJJ white belt, now with that said, if you are up to BJJ blue belt level competitively like some other non graded sub wrestling folk then you should probably enter in the division that you are best suited, Judo black belts tend to enter straight into blue belt level so you can enter in like that..

Just a point Paul, it's not me who's the GC blue belt. I'm still a white belt, I think in total I've spent 4 or 5 hours in the gi in the last three years with the rest being no-gi.

Not trying to be smart myself but what is a BJJ grade then? I was always of the opinion, perhaps wrongly, that a BJJ grade was simply a matter of rolling and technical ability so if the GCJJ guy can hang with BJJ blue belts is he not a blue?

A big part of the attraction for me with jitz was the lack of emphasis put on belts, this seems to be rearing up again with people talking about GC blue belts not being true blue belts. If they're good enough to roll with blues then in my opinion they're blues themselves.

cletus

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

If they're good enough to roll with blues then in my opinion they're blues themselves.

I think thats the issue. They have not had to roll with other blue belts, they havent been exposed to it in their training, so that why i suggested to Stephen that he try to get to a club to help him guage where he is

cowzerp

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

Just a point Paul, it's not me who's the GC blue belt. I'm still a white belt, I think in total I've spent 4 or 5 hours in the gi in the last three years with the rest being no-gi.

Not trying to be smart myself but what is a BJJ grade then? I was always of the opinion, perhaps wrongly, that a BJJ grade was simply a matter of rolling and technical ability so if the GJJ guy can hang with BJJ blue belts is he not a blue?

A big part of the attraction for me with jitz was the lack of emphasis put on belts, this seems to be rearing up again with people talking about GC blue belts not being true blue belts. If they're good enough to roll with blues then in my opinion they're blues themselves.

Sorry Bobby i just qouted yours as it was easier!!

A bjj grade is a grade for the art BJJ, GCJJ is a made up gimmick that is a self defense grade, not an actual recognised bjj belt, it might aswell be a kung fu belt.

Belts mean lots in BJJ even though its not elitist like in other arts, The thing is there not easily got and tarnished

on a side note-if there good enough to roll with blue belts fine-then grade in BJJ and they'll get there blue

(also 6 months GCJJ is not going to make you handle BJJ Blue belts who usually take 2-3 years to get) unless the person is gifted. its just not the same thing and the point is its not meant to be-its just a tool for the Gracie to make a few quid on the side..

Sid_Justice

Hold on, I think we're mixing up terminology.

GJJ - gracie jitjisu - the exact same as BJJ except this is the copyrighted term or what ever used by Rorion and his friends
BJJ - we know what this is
Gracie Combatives - a self defence thingymajiggy with bits of GJJ thrown in (called GJJ because it's organised by Rorion etc.).

itch53

Sid_Justice wrote: »

Thanks again for posting your story here. Just wondering if it was Gracie combatives itself (the self-defence focus) that attracted you to it,or the fact it can be trained online. I mean, if you could train in pure BJJ online (like following bj penn's video's etc) would you? Or do you prefer the combatives?

To be honest, there aren't many people that start from scratch, train 3 times a week in a Dublin bjj club (or any bjj club) and get to blue belt level in <6 months. That kind of development is rare.

Hey,

It was more so the flexibility in training the online course brought. What I mean by that is that I work a job with very odd hours, so making it to a class regularly enough to progress is a difficulty. With the online course basically myself and my friends and other guys in this situation could train when we had the free time and still make some progress.

Just to clarify to the other guys (sorry for only using the one quote), we're not saying as we have Blue Belts in this offshoot that we are at the level of BJJ Blue belts and should be let compete there, we're quite aware that it's not a sport BJJ level grade. Basically all we wanted to ask was if we were to enter a Gi competition which belt class would we land in? Blue is honestly too advanced for us at the moment, but I wouldn't want to tarnish any potential wins at white belt due to having a Blue in this Brand of Jiu Jitsu. That's all!

Cletus - Thanks for the advice, I really think that is a good way to guage progress, I hope to attend a few open mat days over the next few months to see exactly where I sit!

cletus

No disrespect intended here Stephen, but if you yourself dont feel that you are at a blue belt level, why would you want to be listed as such

itch53

cletus wrote: »

No disrespect intended here Stephen, but if you yourself dont feel that you are at a blue belt level, why would you want to be listed as such

Well this is what I'm asking, I'm not trying to argue that we should be blue belts, and listed as BJJ blue belt holders, I'm completely aware of the differences between what we're doing and what BJJ schools are doing. Is it sort of similar to having a belt colour in say Taekwondo? As in completely inapplicable on the crossover? Or as it's also more closely tied in as it's a lot of the same techniques as BJJ, just a different application of them, does the belt create some sort of grey area?

Basically the clarification I'm looking for is, is it ok to enter competitions as white belt or does this GJJ belt make me ineligible? Or should I be entering at Blue belt in the interests of fairness and just earn my stripes there? I'm not trying to fight for recognitition as a BJJ Blue belt, I just really want to know where I would compete when I do look to enter competitions.

I know there is a Gracie Garage after opening up in Meath, and there are a few other students listed on the Gracie University site, so I think this will start to crop up more in the future, so basically I'm just looking for clarification on how everyone feels about which class to enter at.

Again, just to clear things up, we're not looking to be listed as BJJ Blue belt holders, we know that's not what we have graded in, we're just asking which is the fairest/best way to sign up for competitions. I just wouldn't feel right signing up for a white belt tournament if people felt that having the GJJ grade is an unfair disadvantage, that's all!

Thanks

Stephen

BobbyOLeary

cowzerp wrote: »

Sorry Bobby i just qouted yours as it was easier!!

A bjj grade is a grade for the art BJJ, GCJJ is a made up gimmick that is a self defense grade, not an actual recognised bjj belt, it might aswell be a kung fu belt.

Belts mean lots in BJJ even though its not elitist like in other arts, The thing is there not easily got and tarnished

on a side note-if there good enough to roll with blue belts fine-then grade in BJJ and they'll get there blue

(also 6 months GCJJ is not going to make you handle BJJ Blue belts who usually take 2-3 years to get) unless the person is gifted. its just not the same thing and the point is its not meant to be-its just a tool for the Gracie to make a few quid on the side..

Ha no worries mate. I think we agree on the whole thing actually, we both think the belts should be performance based and not just due to some money paid and katas.

I dunno, maybe it's just me but I'm not a huge fan of BJJ gradings. A longer period of observation by the head coach is what's needed in my opinion, not just what happens on the day. That said, I'm only a white belt so maybe my opionion will change as time moves on.

BobbyOLeary

cletus wrote: »

I think thats the issue. They have not had to roll with other blue belts, they havent been exposed to it in their training, so that why i suggested to Stephen that he try to get to a club to help him guage where he is

You're right of course. My point was only philosophical. As I said earlier, the chances of a GCJJ guy holding it to a normal BJJ guy are slim so it doesn't really matter.

gstack

Bobby every bjj school is different when it comes to giving out the belts.
Some give the belts after sucess in comps etc or if they feel the studentb has reached a sufficient level. Some do formal gradings , just depends.

Will Heffernan

gstack wrote: »

Bobby every bjj school is different when it comes to giving out the belts.
Some give the belts after sucess in comps etc or if they feel the studentb has reached a sufficient level. Some do formal gradings , just depends.

In some schools it doesn't matter what your experience or level is...some gorilla just comes along grabs the back of your gi and makes your life miserable 5 minutes at a time

cowzerp

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

I dunno, maybe it's just me but I'm not a huge fan of BJJ gradings. A longer period of observation by the head coach is what's needed in my opinion, not just what happens on the day. That said, I'm only a white belt so maybe my opionion will change as time moves on.

In my experiences the gradings are done by the method you say, its your actual level and how you perform on the mats consistently and in competitions also, The day grading i feel is just a formality, i dont think anyone ever just stands out and is given a belt tbh..

its up to your instructor to know your level and grade as such..

BobbyOLeary

gstack wrote: »

Bobby every bjj school is different when it comes to giving out the belts.
Some give the belts after sucess in comps etc or if they feel the studentb has reached a sufficient level. Some do formal gradings , just depends.

Oh no doubt. That doesn't stop me having an opinion on what way is best though. The competition idea appeals to me too, if you can win the Irish Open at the white belt level it's a pretty good sign you're on the way to blue. I dunno how this applies higher up though as the herd thins out dramatically after that.

Will Heffernan

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

Oh no doubt. That doesn't stop me having an opinion on what way is best though. The competition idea appeals to me too, if you can win the Irish Open at the white belt level it's a pretty good sign you're on the way to blue. I dunno how this applies higher up though as the herd thins out dramatically after that.

Cool...that means I was on my way to blue after a few classes