Is it time to cull the welfare state?

IrishManSaipan

I would like to start a discussion on the viability of the Irish welfare state if I may.

I believe as a country, we have two choices. Either enter debt enslavement for eternity or stand on our own two feet. The country is borrowing 500 million each and every week, just to keep the show on the road. The Department of Finance predicts it will take in 34 billion euro in tax revenue. My calculator says it wont break 29. This is simply unsustainable.

The sense of entitlement in this country is unbelievable. From farmers to bankers. From students to politicians. They seem to think the state is their personal cash cow.Is it time to cull the welfare state? If not, how do we continue to pay for it?

Joey the lips

Awaiting usual after hours answer!

MaybeLogic

I agree. We need a cull.
Enforced euthanasia after the age of 65 should keep the bills down to a managable level.

mikom

Palm flowers for everyone.

bleg

Legalised abortion would cut down on little welfare brats and a fall in crime in 15-20 years time.

donkey balls

MaybeLogic wrote: »

I agree. We need a cull.
Enforced euthanasia after the age of 65 should keep the bills down to a managable level.

nah leave it till they hit the new retirement age of 68 this way we get an extra 3 years of tax&prsi contributions off them;)and we could bring in another rule that their pensions they contributed too over the years are handed over to the state:D

ejmaztec

Firing squads down the dole office, mass sterilisation, Zyklon B, more Zyklon B, mass Easter crucifixions..........................................

IrishManSaipan

bleg wrote: »

Legalised abortion would cut down on little welfare brats and a fall in crime in 15-20 years time.

If a bird can get up the pole after just nine minutes, she can wait a further nine months to get back down it.

MaybeLogic

ejmaztec wrote: »

Firing squads down the dole office, mass sterilisation, Zyklon B, more Zyklon B, mass Easter crucifixions..........................................

The last time I saw a proper cull was during the foot and mouth crisis, so I propose a helicopter hovering outside the welfare office, with a sniper taking out the doleheads as they make their monthly signing.

smellslikeshoes

https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/56344/107366.jpg

This comes up here so often it hurts my head.

Do you not realise eliminating the dole would see the country overrun in burglaries, robbings, beatings, etc. as people scramble for money (and as much as I love the Gardaì, I still maintain we have the most useless law enforcement system in the world).

Cutting down on Social Welfare is a good idea. An idea I recommend we enforce... when we're out of recession or jobs become available.

Having it overly high during 'good times' and then cutting it when people need it won't work.

Rebelheart

IrishManSaipan wrote: »

I would like to start a discussion on the viability of the Irish welfare state if I may.

I believe as a country, we have two choices. Either enter debt enslavement for eternity or stand on our own two feet. The country is borrowing 500 million each and every week, just to keep the show on the road. The Department of Finance predicts it will take in 34 billion euro in tax revenue. My calculator says it wont break 29. This is simply unsustainable.

The sense of entitlement in this country is unbelievable. From farmers to bankers. From students to politicians. They seem to think the state is their personal cash cow.Is it time to cull the welfare state? If not, how do we continue to pay for it?

Would that be the corporate welfare state or the social welfare state?

DonJose

Cull Mary Harney and sell her blubber to the Japanese!!! [/recession]

Jesus Wept

IrishManSaipan wrote: »

Is it time to cull the welfare state?

How?

Just switch it off? Try that and see what would follow.

Do you have a proposal as to how?

IrishManSaipan

Rebelheart wrote: »

Would that be the corporate welfare state or the social welfare state?

Both.

IrishManSaipan

The-Rigger wrote: »

How?

Just switch it off? Try that and see what would follow.

Do you have a proposal as to how?

I will type up my ten point plan before the end of this evening.

kdave

IrishManSaipan wrote: »

Is it time to cull the welfare state?

What welfare state?

Jesus Wept

IrishManSaipan wrote: »

I will type up my ten point plan before the end of this evening.

Will there be donuts?

bonerm

I can definetly see a correlation between a safer and more secure society while the have-nots are given a decent weekly handout. I think this country would go to hell in handcart (even moreso) if we started cutting benefits. I don't begrudge the current levels and actually think of it as a decent investment in terms of just keeping the dregs in check somewhat.

As such I'd be more in favour of culling the people who live of SW than culling the SW itself. Perhaps we could set up some sort of reward scheme for single mothers and dole scroungers who DON'T have seemingly endless litters of children. Cash prizes for abortions etc.

IrishManSaipan

The-Rigger wrote: »

Will there be donuts?

Iced and chocolate.

Jesus Wept

I prefer jam and ring.

I presume they aren't free anyhow.

IrishManSaipan

bonerm wrote: »

I can definetly see a correlation between a safer and more secure society while the have-nots are given a decent weekly handout. I think this country would go to hell in handcart (even moreso) if we started cutting benefits. I don't begrudge the current levels and actually think of it as a decent investment in terms of just keeping the dregs in check somewhat.

As such I'd be more in favour of culling the people who live of SW than culling the SW itself. Perhaps we could set up some sort of reward scheme for single mothers and dole scroungers who DON'T have seemingly endless litters of children. Cash prizes for abortions etc.

Wheres this cash going to come from? I refer you to me signature.

Cookie_Monster

the dole could be set so that it reduces 10% every year (or 6 months and so forth) you are on it.
could do something similar with other "benefits".

Cookie_Monster

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

the dole could be set so that it reduces 10% every year (or 6 months and so forth) you are on it.
could do something similar with other "benefits".

Until what? Everyone's dole runs out and everyone become a criminal?


If there are no jobs to go to, there is no way will people accept welfare cuts. (Of course there is always the boardsies that seem to believe there are endless amounts of jobs out there, but people are too lazy to look for them :rolleyes:).

tbaymusicman

Well it's the usual case of some people taking advantage of what can in most cases be a great help to people temporary in between jobs or suddenly let go from employment!i understand some people will gladly stay on the dole for ever if allowed and i know some young girls think they can just get preggers and let the state pay for everything!!The fact is people who have worked for a long time myself included have lost jobs and are now in need of there stamps that we have built up so should that be stopped?:O

Cookie_Monster

Deleted User wrote: »

(Of course there is always the boardsies that seem to believe there are endless amounts of jobs out there, but people are too lazy to look for them :rolleyes:).

there are endless amounts of jobs out there, but people are too lazy to look for them.

moonpurple

bonerm wrote: »

I can definetly see a correlation between a safer and more secure society while the have-nots are given a decent weekly handout. I think this country would go to hell in handcart (even moreso) if we started cutting benefits. I don't begrudge the current levels and actually think of it as a decent investment in terms of just keeping the dregs in check somewhat.

As such I'd be more in favour of culling the people who live of SW than culling the SW itself. Perhaps we could set up some sort of reward scheme for single mothers and dole scroungers who DON'T have seemingly endless litters of children. Cash prizes for abortions etc.

the dregs!

like that fella born in a stable in a nazerath, nailed to some wood some years later, looooser, feared nothing and regarded all as equals, what a nutter, knew it would all happen before hand and still he faced it, what a do gooder tree hugger and probably a fan of welfare that protects vulnerable people, crazy man

Mrmoe

In stead of giving cash to welfare recipients a voucher system should be introduced. This will allow people to get the necessary items that they need to survive and removing the situation where people spend the money on spurious tems like drinking and smoking. If you don't like the situation and you want to buy luxuries then you will be forced to get a job.

This might open a black market system where vouchers are traded for other luxury items but if it is well regulated this could be avoided. Using this method nobody can complain about the price of the dole being too high as all they are getting are their basic needs provided for with no frivilous spending.

admiralofthefleet

mike

bonerm

moonpurple wrote: »

the dregs!

like that fella born in a stable in a nazerath, nailed to some wood some years later, looooser, feared nothing and regarded all as equals, what a nutter, knew it would all happen before hand and still he faced it, what a do gooder tree hugger and probably a fan of welfare that protects vulnerable people, crazy man

Wow, he sounds brilliant! Who was he?

Mrmoe

Mrmoe wrote: »

In stead of giving cash to welfare recipients a voucher system should be introduced. This will allow people to get the necessary items that they need to survive and removing the situation where people spend the money on spurious tems like drinking and smoking. If you don't like the situation and you want to buy luxuries then you will be forced to get a job.

This might open a black market system where vouchers are traded for other luxury items but if it is well regulated this could be avoided. Using this method nobody can complain about the price of the dole being too high as all they are getting are their basic needs provided for with no frivilous spending.

This was brought up before and went nowhere.

How do you decide what people can and can't buy? What stores can the vouchers be used in? What about the items that people need to get by?

It's all good and well to be able to go to Tesco and get some food (though the govt. could never get away with that, as they wouldn't be 'supporting irish retailers') and whatever store did get thr govt. voucher deal would just up it's prices. Competition between stores would be crushed, meaning stores similar to those that were able to use vouchers would close up (equalling more unemployment) and there'd be a serious Hierarchial issue with stores that have govt. approval being at the top.


There'd also be the moaning that people shouldn't be allowed buy luxury items. What if your TV breaks? You need a new one (and in Ireland a TV is an investment for the govt. anyway as they can suck the TV license money out of you for years to come) and what if you ruin your shoes?

What about people who work in specialist areas and whose jobs would be considered to require luxury items. An out of work photographer damages his gear for example. Do we stop him from buying new cameras, lenses etc. as they're luxury items he can live without? He needs a camera to get work, so maybe we should let him have it?

What about the Joe Soaps that want to get into photography? Do we not allow them cameras and tell them they aren't allowed learn about it until they get a job?

(photography just came off the top of my head, im sure there are other examples).


A voucher system wouldn't work and considering people would be embarrassed using vouchers in shops, etc. I doubt many people would go for it.

Nice idea in theory, impossible in practice.