Micheál Martin first EU Foreign Minister to Visit Gaza in 1 year

rich1874

Micheál Martin was the first EU foreign Minister in nearly a year to gain access to the Gaza Strip. He didn't get permission from Israel but got permission from Egypt and was not permitted to talk to any Hamas officials despite a Hamas delegation waiting for him at the border.

He described the scenes in Palestine as appualing and called Israels grip on the region as 'the collective punishement of 1 and a half million people'. In his interview with morning Ireland(here), he called for an end to the blockade but seemed slow to outrightly condemn Israel. As with most EU politicians he tip toed around the subject of Isael doing anything illegal.

Son Of A Vidic

More posturing $hite, why didn't he show some spine and say it like it is. Dare we offend Israel - OMG! They are running the worlds largest prison, the irony of it all. Their treatment of Palestinian civilians would make the old Nazi's proud.

El Weirdo

medicman2009 wrote: »

More posturing $hite, why didn't he show some spine and say it like it is. Dare we offend Israel - OMG! They are running the worlds largest prison, the irony of it all. Their treatment of Palestinian civilians would make the old Nazi's proud.

Ok. Who had post #2?

Dyr

Wonder if this is a sly dig at the israelis over the passports thing?

ejmaztec

Probably another Mossad hitman with a false passport.

rich1874

Wonder if this is a sly dig at the israelis over the passports thing?

The visit did coincide very nicely alright.

And Miriam O Callaghan had some Israeli bloke on primetime there. She asked 'Does Israel really care about Ireland's concern over the fake passports?'. To sum up his reply, 'well kind of... but no not really'.

The_Kew_Tour

The Israeli government and there foreign policy in the United States really shows you how strong a hold that Israel has on Gaza.

In America, Israel can do no wrong and once that continues to be the way then the Palestinians will always have a fight on there hands.

I lived in that region for 6-7 weeks and its frightening some of the taughts that go through the Isreali's mind at times. They are the most ruthless people I have met and arrogant.

Saadyst

but but but... the holocaust!

InTheTrees

How come Egypt doesnt let them in and give them Egyptian passports after 60 years?

Its like the Lebanese "refugee" camps. Everyone's using rthe palestinians as pawns.

Rebelheart

Bambi wrote: »

Wonder if this is a sly dig at the israelis over the passports thing?

If it is, my opinion of Mícheál Martin has gone even higher. I just hope his aides notified any available media to record it.

Mícheál Martin, despite his mistakes in Social Welfare and Education, is one of the most admirable people in Irish politics in the past three decades in my view. He is both down-to-earth and highly intelligent.

Any time I come back from a pub or hotel it is Mícheál Martin who is responsible for my clothes not stinking of other peoples' smoke. And to think of all the backward people who opposed his smoking ban at the time.

evercloserunion

Bambi wrote: »

Wonder if this is a sly dig at the israelis over the passports thing?

Why else would anyone accuse the Israelis of being anything but delightful towards the Palestinians.

strobe

El Weirdo wrote: »

Ok. Who had post #2?

Godwin isn't really in effect when talking about Israel and Palestine. It would be bizare not to draw comparisons with the Nazi concentration camps.

El Weirdo

strobe wrote: »

Godwin isn't really in effect when talking about Israel and Palestine. It would be bizare not to draw comparisons with the Nazi concentration camps.

Mike?

InTheTrees

El Weirdo wrote: »

Mike?

Cookie_Monster

why did he go?

what a waste of time and money :rolleyes:

strobe

El Weirdo wrote: »

Mike?

Bob!?

El Weirdo

InTheTrees wrote: »

strobe wrote: »

Bob!?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Godwin

K-9

rich1874 wrote: »

Micheál Martin was the first EU foreign Minister in nearly a year to gain access to the Gaza Strip. He didn't get permission from Israel but got permission from Egypt and was not permitted to talk to any Hamas officials despite a Hamas delegation waiting for him at the border.

He described the scenes in Palestine as appualing and called Israels grip on the region as 'the collective punishement of 1 and a half million people'. In his interview with morning Ireland(here), he called for an end to the blockade but seemed slow to outrightly condemn Israel. As with most EU politicians he tip toed around the subject of Isael doing anything illegal.

Condemnation, while popular and the right thing to do, probably wouldn't go down too well when trying to convince the Israelis to lift the embargo.

K-9

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

why did he go?

what a waste of time and money :rolleyes:

Yeah, big waste of money, highlighting the issue for people who may not be aware of what's going on.

caseyann

Control of PC world

Min

What a waste of our tax money, at least the Israeli's tried to save us some money....
I see in the news there were terrorists there waiting in hope of greeting him, maybe if they accepted Israel shouldn't be destroyed the 1.5 million people would have better lives.
The 'oh you can't do that brigade' were crying when Israel built their security wall, at least it has saved lives, though sometimes people just choose to see the Israelis as always being the villians while the Palestinians wouldn't hurt a fly.

Time for the Palestinians to dump the terrorists if they want peace.

Rebelheart

Min wrote: »

Time for the Palestinians to dump the terrorists if they want peace.

Hilarious, absolutely hilarious.

Pete M.

Min wrote: »

'oh you can't do that brigade'

"Our message to the Israelis is this: we do not fight you because you belong to a certain faith or culture. Jews have lived in the Muslim world for 13 centuries in peace and harmony; they are in our religion "the people of the book" who have a covenant from God and His Messenger Muhammad (peace be upon him) to be respected and protected. Our conflict with you is not religious but political. We have no problem with Jews who have not attacked us - our problem is with those who came to our land, imposed themselves on us by force, destroyed our society and banished our people."

Khalid Mish'al is head of the political bureau of Hamas

R0ot

Pete M. wrote: »

"Our message to the Israelis is this: we do not fight you because you belong to a certain faith or culture. Jews have lived in the Muslim world for 13 centuries in peace and harmony; they are in our religion "the people of the book" who have a covenant from God and His Messenger Muhammad (peace be upon him) to be respected and protected. Our conflict with you is not religious but political. We have no problem with Jews who have not attacked us - our problem is with those who came to our land, imposed themselves on us by force, destroyed our society and banished our people."

Khalid Mish'al is head of the political bureau of Hamas

Something about this is oddly familiar.... Like something like this has taken place somewhere close to home.... :rolleyes:


/me waits for the "omg you're Anti-Israel that means you're Anti-Semitic!" comment

Min

Pete M. wrote: »

"Our message to the Israelis is this: we do not fight you because you belong to a certain faith or culture. Jews have lived in the Muslim world for 13 centuries in peace and harmony; they are in our religion "the people of the book" who have a covenant from God and His Messenger Muhammad (peace be upon him) to be respected and protected. Our conflict with you is not religious but political. We have no problem with Jews who have not attacked us - our problem is with those who came to our land, imposed themselves on us by force, destroyed our society and banished our people."

Khalid Mish'al is head of the political bureau of Hamas

Was he strapping a suicide bomb belt onto someone when he was saying that or firing rockets into Israel?
It is people like Khalid Mish'al who have Gaza in the mess it's in.

tolosenc

I don't get this mass sympathy for the Palestinians. I mean, they voted for a government of TERRORISTS... Maybe if they tried to be civil about it, I'd have sympathy, but quite frankly, if you elect people stupid enough to think they can seriously take on Israel, you nigh on deserve what you get...

epgc3fyqirnbsx

Toulousain wrote: »

I don't get this mass sympathy for the Palestinians. I mean, they voted for a government of TERRORISTS... Maybe if they tried to be civil about it, I'd have sympathy, but quite frankly, if you elect people stupid enough to think they can seriously take on Israel, you nigh on deserve what you get...

Well one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter
There's a lot of wrongs on both sides, it's gonna take a loooong loooong time to sort out, and we certainly haven't got the answer

Doc

Toulousain wrote: »

I don't get this mass sympathy for the Palestinians. I mean, they voted for a government of TERRORISTS... Maybe if they tried to be civil about it, I'd have sympathy, but quite frankly, if you elect people stupid enough to think they can seriously take on Israel, you nigh on deserve what you get...

You call them terrorists the people who voted for them do not.

K-9

Min wrote: »

What a waste of our tax money, at least the Israeli's tried to save us some money....
I see in the news there were terrorists there waiting in hope of greeting him, maybe if they accepted Israel shouldn't be destroyed the 1.5 million people would have better lives.
The 'oh you can't do that brigade' were crying when Israel built their security wall, at least it has saved lives, though sometimes people just choose to see the Israelis as always being the villians while the Palestinians wouldn't hurt a fly.

Time for the Palestinians to dump the terrorists if they want peace.

Ach, sure the same carry on happened with Clinton. There was a whole controversy over Adams being granted a Visa to travel.

Personally, while I understand why the Israelis are doing what they do, I also see the humanitarian crisis.

Cookie_Monster

K-9 wrote: »

Yeah, big waste of money, highlighting the issue for people who may not be aware of what's going on.

it was a very low key visit to be highlighting anything to people. Also the whole situation has been in the news for years and years and nobody has done anything about it. No sanctions against Israel, no aid effort for Gaza etc, no-one cares or wants anything to do with it as long as Israel is in the pocket of the US.

neil_hosey

one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter. Yous dont realise what is going on in palestine now, you dont have to live there, yet yous insist on commenting on the 'terrorists' in palestine hastling the poor israelis. Jesus wake the fúck up.

snow ghost

Obviously Israel doesn't have a lot for time for Ireland according to this interview on Australian TV - regarding the passport scandal - yesterday, wasn't this the same journalist on Prime Time saying Israel does care what Ireland thinks?:

"YOSSI MELMAN: Well, at the moment, I think that it's still, as far as Israel is concerned, it's a manageable crisis because the evidence presented by the Dubai police either is not applicable in a court of law, or the diplomatic arena. There are no direct links tying Israel to that, so Israel can still deny or claim they don't know what is going on.

Obviously, Israel doesn't ... doesn't attribute the same weight to all the five nations that are involved. There are more important nations and less important nations strategically for Israel. I assume that Israel can have troubles from the Australian Government, if they discover something, or from the British Government, that they would...

There is no doubt in my mind that those two governments would be less soft on Israel than maybe Germany, France. And Ireland is not known as a friend of Israel traditionally, so Israel is not attaching too much weight to the relations with Ireland. But with Australia and the UK, yes, it's serious. It may be serious."

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2010/s2830642.htm

Nodin

Min wrote: »

What a waste (.........)they want peace.

The "security wall" managed to effectively annex large parts of the West Bank and Gaza. Had they followed the 1967 borders, less would have been said.

The Israelis are colonising land outside their internationally recognised borders, while enforcing a brutal IDF run regime on the Palestinians in most of the West Bank and Arab East Jerusalem. Thats why theres Palestinian "terrorism".

FlutterinBantam

Nodin wrote: »

The "security wall" managed to effectively annex large parts of the West Bank and Gaza. Had they followed the 1967 borders, less would have been said.

The Israelis are colonising land outside their internationally recognised borders, while enforcing a brutal IDF run regime on the Palestinians in most of the West Bank and Arab East Jerusalem. Thats why theres Palestinian "terrorism".

Israelis are protecting their citizens against the numerous would be martyrs who would love to waltz into a crowded place of entertainment and relaxation, blow themselves up and take as many innocent bystanders with them as they can.

That's why there's a security wall.

FlutterinBantam

neil_hosey wrote: »

one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter. Yous dont realise what is going on in palestine now, you dont have to live there, yet yous insist on commenting on the 'terrorists' in palestine hastling the poor israelis. Jesus wake the fúck up.

From what I can see Martins excursion was a nice piece of PR to deflect attention from 'home affairs'.

Window dressing and useless at the end of the day.

Stop the indiscriminate firing of missiles into Israeli territory and make a real start on peace.

A nation can't stand idly by and watch a rogue force slaughter their citizens in their beds.

Bonito

Who paid for this "trip"

Nodin

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

..............
That's why there's a security wall.

A wall thats outside Israels borders and annexes Palestinian land
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8523221.stm

Nodin

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

A nation can't stand idly by and watch a rogue force slaughter their citizens in their beds.

Yet thats what you want the Palestinians to do.

There aren't Palestinian troops guarding Palestinian colonies in Tel Aviv....there are IDF troops guarding Israeli colonists in the occupied territories.

dvpower

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

A nation can't stand idly by and watch a rogue force slaughter their citizens in their beds.

Yes. But the are the Palistinians to do about the rogue state of Israel?

dvpower

Bonito wrote: »

Who paid for this "trip"

The Irish state I would expect. Micheal Martin is our Minister for Foreign Affairs. Its part of his job to go on foreign trips sometimes.

FlutterinBantam

Nodin wrote: »

Yet thats what you want the Palestinians to do.

There aren't Palestinian troops guarding Palestinian colonies in Tel Aviv....there are IDF troops guarding Israeli colonists in the occupied territories.

Nope, just stop firing missiles and sending suicide bombers into Israel.

Bonito

dvpower wrote: »

The Irish state I would expect. Micheal Martin is our Minister for Foreign Affairs. Its part of his job to go on foreign trips sometimes.

What do we have to do with Gaza though

dvpower

Bonito wrote: »

What do we have to do with Gaza though

Dept. of Foreign Affairs wrote:

During his one-day visit to Gaza, Minister Martin will visit an UNRWA school and an UNRWA food distribution centre in Rafah as well as visiting an industrial site in Karni and travelling to UNRWA’s operational HQ in Gaza city

The Irish state is a major contributor to UNRWA. It’s fully legitimate for Minister Martin to go and see what Irish taxpayers are contributing to.

UNRWA wrote:

UNRWA is the main provider of basic services – education, health, relief and social services – to 4.7 million registered Palestine refugees in the Middle East

Bonito

dvpower wrote: »

The Irish state is a major contributor to UNRWA. It’s fully legitimate for Minister Martin to go and see what Irish taxpayers are contributing to.

Learn something new every day

sbsquarepants

Should have visited Gazza instead, would have cost less and achieved more. More meaningless talk. The way those people are treated is disgusting, nothing is done about it cos israel keeps the arabs in check, then we wonder why they hate us!

wes

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Israelis are protecting their citizens against the numerous would be martyrs who would love to waltz into a crowded place of entertainment and relaxation, blow themselves up and take as many innocent bystanders with them as they can.

That's why there's a security wall.

Its interesting how you always ignore the simple fact that the so called security wall would work if built along the 1967 border. Care to answer why the wall needs to steal more land? I have asked this question to you before, and you always ignore it. Care to explain away the land theft then?!?

wes

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Nope, just stop firing missiles and sending suicide bombers into Israel.

Why is Israel still attacking and stealing Palestinian land in the West Bank then? No rockets being fired, and the PA is actively working with Israel to stop terrorists attacking Israel. Care to answer this question as well btw? Its been asked before and never answer by the pro-Israel crowd for some odd reason.

You see intent on ignoring inconvient facts of Israel constant aggression against Palestinians, that have nothing to do with what the Palestinians do. Israel was stealing there land long before suicide attacks and long before the existence of Hamas. So there land theft has feck all to do with those things, its all apart of the Zionist dream of a greater Israel based on a 2000 year old land claim for the secular nutters, and God gave it to us from the Religous nutters.

kraggy

Can't believe people are talking about the cost of the trip.

For 2 reasons:

1. Micheal Martin is our Minister for Foreign Affairs. It's part of his job to travel and keep in touch with goings on.

2. It's not as if it was like a St. Patricks Day holiday in a 5 star hotel in New York. Gaza isn't exactly a place you'd go to live it up.

meditraitor

kraggy wrote: »

. Gaza isn't exactly a place you'd go to live it up.

Its as close to hell on earth as we have at the moment.....

nacho libre

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Nope, just stop firing missiles and sending suicide bombers into Israel.

and your excuse for the lack of progress in the west bank is....? could it be israel is not an honest broker. as the pa have reined in the miltants in the west bank and yet the peace talk are stalled and israel still takes yet more land. at first it was the pa were unreconstructed terrorists, led by arafat, that israel could not do business with. now as we see there is another excuse.

snow ghost wrote: »

Obviously Israel doesn't have a lot for time for Ireland according to this interview on Australian TV - regarding the passport scandal - yesterday, wasn't this the same journalist on Prime Time saying Israel does care what Ireland thinks?:

"YOSSI MELMAN: Well, at the moment, I think that it's still, as far as Israel is concerned, it's a manageable crisis because the evidence presented by the Dubai police either is not applicable in a court of law, or the diplomatic arena. There are no direct links tying Israel to that, so Israel can still deny or claim they don't know what is going on.

Obviously, Israel doesn't ... doesn't attribute the same weight to all the five nations that are involved. There are more important nations and less important nations strategically for Israel. I assume that Israel can have troubles from the Australian Government, if they discover something, or from the British Government, that they would...

There is no doubt in my mind that those two governments would be less soft on Israel than maybe Germany, France. And Ireland is not known as a friend of Israel traditionally, so Israel is not attaching too much weight to the relations with Ireland. But with Australia and the UK, yes, it's serious. It may be serious."

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2010/s2830642.htm

yes, their mentality is if you can't prove it, we don't care. according to the Daily Telegraph the British government knew about this as far back as the end of january yet only started feigning concern when it entered the public domain.
they also report that MI6 has reassured mossad this will blow over soon enough and it will be business as usual.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Nodin wrote: »

Thats why theres Palestinian "terrorism".

And nothing to do with Palestinians just being terrorists?.

Why are they hated in Lebanon?. (There's a hint above)

Why when the PLO went to Tunis were they later expelled (there's a hint above).

Why were they slaughtered by the Jordanians [Black September] (yup, there's a hint above).

The Palestinians fled Israel before its independence with the promise from their Arab neighbours that they were going to slaughter the Israeli's and run them into the sea, as we all know Israel was invaded on the eve of its independence - resulting in a spectacular Israeli victory.

The Palestinians then tried to make a home land in Jordan, attempting to destabilise the Jordanian government through terrorism. If you think Israel are hardliners, the Jordanians make them look like kindergarden cops by comparison. During 'Black Septempter' (September 1970) the Jordanians killed more Palestinians than anyone before or since collectively.

The tried the same stunt in Lebanon, destabilising the Lebanese government and attacking the Galilee. Leading the IDF to launch 'Operation Latani' in 1978.

The Lebanese actually welcomed the IDF into the country, believing they (the IDF) would finally rid the country of the PLO.

This was followed in 1982 by Operation 'Peace for Galilee', again the IDF were welcomed into the country by the Lebanese who were tired to Palestinians terror again. Unfortunetly the IDF done a Brit's on it - outstayed their welcome and set up a security zone in the south (Lebanon).

The Israeli's never wanted to occupy Lebanon, they wanted a buffer zone to stop Palestinian rocket attacks against Galilee.