Striking essential services

donkey balls

and here is the rest of the mgmt team jobs for the boys&girls/dail line up
http://www.iaa.ie/index.jsp?p=104&n=159

Overheal

Kradock wrote: »

Stressful , isn't it like playing a video game all day?

Not to defend Strike Action - but ATC is considered by many studies to be one of the most highly stressful jobs you can get, outside of a warzone.

InKonspikuou2

As a person who flies regularily in and out of this country i say let them strike until the can come to work happy. I don't want some disgruntled unhappy fúck deciding to run amok when my plane is approaching Irish air space.

The Pontiac

InKonspikuou2 wrote: »

As a person who flies regularily in and out of this country i say let them strike until the can come to work happy. I don't want some disgruntled unhappy fúck deciding to run amok when my plane is approaching Irish air space.

The poor things on €160,000 a year, with 35-hour weeks with frequent half-hour breaks, 46 days' vacation and 137 rest days a year. It boils down to greed and nothing else.

dresden8

<Ollie> wrote: »

The poor things on €160,000 a year, with 35-hour weeks with frequent half-hour breaks, 46 days' vacation and 137 rest days a year. It boils down to greed and nothing else.

"Somebody has better paid job than me" shock.

donkey balls

what amazes me is that no one picked up on dresden post #30 about the IAA CEO salary.

dresden8

donkey balls wrote: »

what amazes me is that no one picked up on dresden post #30 about the IAA CEO salary.

We only hate workers these days. Our lords and masters are above reproach.

NTMK

First things first ATC is one of the most stressful job in the world. if you f**k up in that job you can end up causing a massive disaster like The Tenerife airport disaster
Its not an automated job they are responsible for for every single plane that comes in to Irish Airspace and it is International Regulation that they take breaks on a regular basis to avoid fatigue

and the reason for the Big salary is because the retire early(Mandatory is 56) because of the pressure of the job considering its half what most experienced pilots salary and they have a mostly automated system and a longer career

The Pontiac

NTMK wrote: »

First things first ATC is one of the most stressful job in the world. if you f**k up in that job you can end up causing a massive disaster like The Tenerife airport disaster
Its not an automated job they are responsible for for every single plane that comes in to Irish Airspace and it is International Regulation that they take breaks on a regular basis to avoid fatigue

and the reason for the Big salary is because the retire early(Mandatory is 56) because of the pressure of the job considering its half what most experienced pilots salary and they have a mostly automated system and a longer career

I'm not arguing with any of that..but they're holding the country to ransom for not receiving a 6% pay increase arising out of a farcical wage agreement made during the Ahern era when the country was booming. They retire early alright, but with great pensions. Spoilt pathetic brats the lot of them..

dresden8

<Ollie> wrote: »

I'm not arguing with any of that..but they're holding the country to ransom for not receiving a 6% pay increase arising out of a farcical wage agreement made during the Ahern era when the country was booming. They retire early alright, but with great pensions. Spoilt pathetic brats the lot of them..

"People who have better jobs than me should be punished" shock.

Except management of course. They're so cool.

The Pontiac

dresden8 wrote: »

"People who have better jobs than me should be punished" shock.

Except management of course. They're so cool.

Oh dear god, what an immature post. I've backed striking workers in the past that had better paid jobs than mine. lol at your post..

dresden8

<Ollie> wrote: »

Oh dear god, what an immature post. I've backed striking workers in the past that had better paid jobs than mine. lol at your post..

Lol at your support for workers.

Hockney

dresden8 wrote: »

We only hate workers these days. Our lords and masters are above reproach.

No, what we hate is people on six figure salaries holding the country to ransom over something as simple as a slight change to work practices.

Since my main issue is with the workers and IMPACT, so I'm going to stick to IMPACT's views on why it's happening (i.e nothing to do with pay or pensions).

You earlier seemed to suggest people's opposition to the strike (or mandatory meeting, or whatever IMPACT are masking this as) was out of jealousy. I know my opposition to it is nothing of the sort.

My understanding is:

1) New technology was introduced, Air Traffic Controllers were asked to take it on board and learn how to operate it.
2) Some ATCs refused, and were then suspended by IAA.
3) IMPACT, as a result of the suspensions, called their 4 hour meeting which all ATCs attended (in solidarity with their fallen comrades) while the planes were in the air, resulting in todays disruptions.

Please correct the above if I'm wrong.

As an engineer I'm absolutely disgusted that people working in such a technical area would purposely cause such mass disruption, over a refusal to learn new technologies.

el judìo wrote: »

To be an ATC you do need to be on the top of your game.

To be on top of your game means keeping yourself up to date with the latest technologies, and constantly bettering yourself so that you're more hire-able and less fire-able (if of course you are fire-able). If you can't or won't do this, you're not up to the job.

I believe it's a very stressful job. I believe ATCs deserve to be paid more than the average worker as a result.

What I don't believe is that it could be nearly as stressful as sitting at home unemployed, feeling like a failure with your wife and kids, awaiting the sheriff to come knocking.

There's a recession on. Go out and do your fvcking jobs, you should be glad to have anything above €200 a week, let alone €115,000 a year.

How ATCs can expect any sympathy from the public they've so wronged, is beyond me.

dresden8

Hockney wrote: »

I believe it's a very stressful job. I believe ATCs deserve to be paid more than the average worker as a result.

Hockney wrote: »

you should be glad to have anything above €200 a week,

Your statements are hugely contradictory. Even in the 1 post. Well done.

I will disregard your statements from now on because you're so obviously full of sh1t.

The Pontiac

And the new technology being introduced will apparently make their jobs easier. It's amazing how unrealistic and greedy people have become...

Red Alert

They really have some nerve... I don't begrudge some other public servants compared to these guys. I'm still in college: you see lecturers having to do more now than ever both in terms of research and in improving their teaching material- while taking a near 20% pay cut. Then you've these guys who when faced with easier-to-use technology throw their toys out of the pram. Every last one of them deserves to be fired with no dole.

dresden8

<Ollie> wrote: »

And the new technology being introduced will apparently make their jobs easier. It's amazing how unrealistic and greedy people have become...

It's amazing how stupid and unrealistic some people become. It's amazing what one quick google will bring up.

New technology doesn't always bring up efficiencies.

Maybe the instant experts that turn up on each of these threads should check it out. This is what 1 quick google turned up.

http://www.techcentral.ie/article.aspx?id=12346

For the overly opinionated and underly educated the address is

www.google.ie

Remember to tick the "pages from Ireland" button.

I'm trying here people, but I can't do it all myself. You're gonna have to do some of the work.

You really should try educating yourselves before posting.

The Pontiac

dresden8 wrote: »

It's amazing what one quick google will bring up.

New technology doesn't always bring up efficiencies.

Maybe the instant experts that turn up on each of these threads should check it out. This is what 1 quick google turned up.

http://www.techcentral.ie/article.aspx?id=12346

For the overly opinionated and underly educated the address is

www.google.ie

Remember to tick the "pages from Ireland" button.

I'm trying here people, but I can't do it all myself. You're gonna have to do some of the work.

You really should try educating yourselves before posting.

lol.

New technology doesn't always bring up efficiencies.

I never said it does, but it does in this instance.

Hockney

dresden8 wrote: »

Your statements are hugely contradictory. Even in the 1 post. Well done.

I will disregard your statements from now on because you're so obviously full of sh1t.

Good man. Really addressed the points I made.

You just go and put your fingers back into your ears, since disregarding what's going on around them seems to be something ATCs have been doing impeccably for the last 18 months or so.

The irony....

dresden8

Hockney wrote: »

Good man. Really addressed the points I made.

You just go and put your fingers back into your ears, since disregarding what's going on around them seems to be something ATCs have been doing impeccably for the last 18 months or so.

The irony....

No, seriously, you're still full of sh1t.

JuliusCaesar

For all those "there's a recession on" folks, chew on this: 70% of workers wages remain unchanged. In some areas, workers got bonuses (in the banks).

The unemployment has mostly hit the young, the unskilled, and construction sector workers. The pay cuts have mostly impacted the public service. While the govt was 'responding' to the snow, nurses and doctors (public service) stayed overnight in hospitals so that they could work the next day, and council workers (public service) were out shovelling and gritting at night.

dresden8

<Ollie> wrote: »

I never said it does, but it does in this instance.

How do you know that?

Or do you KNOW?

dresden8

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

For all those "there's a recession on" folks, chew on this: 70% of workers wages remain unchanged. In some areas, workers got bonuses (in the banks).

The unemployment has mostly hit the young, the unskilled, and construction sector workers. The pay cuts have mostly impacted the public service. While the govt was 'responding' to the snow, nurses and doctors (public service) stayed overnight in hospitals so that they could work the next day, and council workers (public service) were out shovelling and gritting at night.

You are wrong, senior management, bankers, developers and politicians saved the country. This is another public sector lie. Don't you know the public sector are overpaid scum?

Or something.

JuliusCaesar

dresden8, I have one word for you: PPARS

OK, here's another two: electronic voting machines

Sorry, feeding the troll.

The Pontiac

dresden8 wrote: »

How do you know that?

Or do you KNOW?

I know because I heard an expert discussing it today on the radio. Anyway, I won't be entertaining you anymore as you appear to be very childish tbh..

dresden8

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

dresden8, I have one word for you: PPARS

OK, here's another two: electronic voting machines

Sorry, feeding the troll.

That's PPARS that was brought in by private contractors?

In the late 90's the public sector had quite respectable IT systems, hell even Social Welfare had their Y2K project lodged in the Smithsonian as a shining example of how to handle computer projects.

This expertise was thrown away on the PD and FF vanity project to show that nothing was worth doing unless some private sector fat cnt was making a huge amount of money out of it.

10 years later public sector IT divisions are over-run with fat-cnt consultants fncking everything up. Locking themselves into long term "support" contracts, all signed off by Ministers that have bought into the privatisation project.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/computimes/1999/0412/99041200042.html

No, seriously, the address is

www.google.ie

Really, I can't do it myself, a touch of research by you overly opinionated tossers would help just a little bit.

bootybouncer

Shower of overpaid animals the lot of them

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0120/airport.html

In a statement, the IAA said the average controller earned a total of €160,000, with the top 10% earning up to €230,000.

Whats that all about, strining on those wages and conditions, outsource the fookers

Hockney

dresden8 wrote: »

That's PPARS that was brought in by private contractors?

In the late 90's the public sector had quite respectable IT systems, hell even Social Welfare had their Y2K project lodged in the Smithsonian as a shining example of how to handle computer projects.

This expertise was thrown away on the PD and FF vanity project to show that nothing was worth doing unless some private sector fat cnt was making a huge amount of money out of it.

10 years later public sector IT divisions are over-run with fat-cnt consultants fncking everything up. Locking themselves into long term "support" contracts, all signed off by Ministers that have bought into the privatisation project.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/computimes/1999/0412/99041200042.html

No, seriously, the address is

www.google.ie

Really, I can't do it myself, a touch of research by you overly opinionated tossers would help just a little bit.

Eh....ok.

So, how 'bout these planes not flying at the airport? I hear it's something to do with Air Traffic Controllers!

Any chance we could stay slightly on topic? Leave the public/private bullsh!t out of it.

dresden8

Hockney wrote: »

Any chance we could stay slightly on topic? Leave the public/private bullsh!t out of it.

Tell that to every media outlet that's covering it.

Tell Michael O'Leary to cut it out as well.

Plus I'd like to point out, I didn't bring up those points, I'm only answering them.

Take out your confusion with JuliusCaesar.

thebaz

for certain unskilled jobs that are open to exploitation , I would gladly support industrial action - striking should be a last resort though, but today it is the people (well paid already) in control of key services - ESB engineers, Consultant Doctors and the like, who can utilise strikes for their own selfish gain - while the majority would get sacked if they went on strike ,whilst working in much worse conditions (in particular financial)