Gripes about modern games.

Syferus

Did someone say Kane and Lynch was a good game?

Even removed from being unviersally known as IO Interactive's worst creation by a long shot, it's important to highlight that the game's biggest claim to fame is the Jeff Gerstmann incident.

koHd

Syferus wrote: »

Did someone say Kane and Lynch was a good game?

Even removed from being unviersally known as IO Interactive's worst creation by a long shot, it's important to highlight that the game's biggest claim to fame is the Jeff Gerstmann incident.

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Stuff like Halo 3, the Darkness, Kane and Lynch, Excitetruck, off the top of my head which range from average to out and out bad. There's a lot of games I end up beating and realising that I didn't really enjoy them.

I don't think he was saying it was good.

Syferus

As per the above, I misread what you said!

I think I'm just a little biter that they're making Kane and Lynch 2 rather than a new Hitman game. Even a horribly out-of-date Freedom Fighters sequel with team-based game-play would be better than.. oh, wait.

Xluna

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

I have to say, the best gaming experiences I have ever had would include the following, in no particular order,
Playing Elite on my Speccy for the first time.
Playing Uridium on a mates C64,
Playing Battlezone on a Wales bound ferry, first time ever, and was blown away!
Bioshock, starting it, finishing it, and everything in between.
Doom, at 3am, in a old psychiatric hospital, on a PS, nice.
Getting a PS and Wipeout and realising the future was here, and I liked it.
Manic Miner, nuff said.
Playing Ghostbusters on the Amstrad CPC464 and knowing, from then on, that movie licences really had to earn a place in my collection.
Quake and Mechwarrior 2 on my first PC in '95
Tomb Raider on the same PC after I bought my first graphics card, a rendition beast, hmm...
Playing Mario64 on an import N64 in Gamesworld,
Playing Zelda OoT,
Metal Gear Solid on PS, in japanese, and finishing it...
Resident Evil on the GC, Wow, and same reaction when playing Resident Evil 4 on the same console a couple of years later.

Now that's just a brief snapshot of standout gaming moments, for me.
Been playing videogames since a guy got a Binatone Pong console back in '77, when I was 5 and there have been a lot of gaming done since then, 2D, 3D, rpg, shooter, driving game everything really.
Modern games and older games are all good, they should be seen as a continuum of gaming, not as discrete sections, divided off from each other, games have evolved over the years, C&C, Virtua Fighter, Tekken, Metal Gear, Mario Bros, Pacman, Final Fantasy, Morrowind, all games that had their templates set many years ago but have adapted to new hardware and interface solutions to bring us new experiences, not to mention allowing the appreciation of games past by the masses through VC/XBLA and PSN.

It's all good!

My best gaming moments;

Playing SF2 HF in the arcade

Getting SF2 for my snes

Playing Mario 3,Wizards and Warriors and Faxanadu on my nes.

Play great Snes RPGs such as Illusion of time, Secret of mana and Terranigma.

Playing Sonic 2 on the Megadrive.

Completing Zelda;Links Awakening on Gameboy.

Buying Street fighter alpha on the ps1(finally an arcade perfect SF game on a console.)

Playing Zelda and Mystical Ninja on N64.

Playing Suikoden 1 & 2 on the PS1.

97i9y3941

alot of modern games need you to install or broadband connection to download updates/releases,which is fine but if you live in a 3rd world country etc how hell you suppose do that,reminds me of windows preaching updates,well if you live in a backward country how are you suppose download?...

download only games,internet connection can be factor again,and i refuse to only have it on download i want it on disc so i can restore it god dammit!

Retr0gamer

Xluna wrote: »

Buying Street fighter alpha on the ps1(finally an arcade perfect SF game on a console.)

Arcade perfect? The PS1 port was far from arcade perfect. Loads of animation frames and background details were left out and loading times were atrocious. The Saturn port is way better.

Xluna

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Arcade perfect? The PS1 port was far from arcade perfect. Loads of animation frames and background details were left out and loading times were atrocious. The Saturn port is way better.

Yeah but compared to the Snes and Megadrive conversions of SF2 HF it was alot more faithful to the coin-op. I know there were animation frames cut put I never noticed the background details missing. Still not as obvious as the missing moon on the snes version of SF2 though.

BLITZ_Molloy

Development teams are too big, and games are too expensive to make -> more conservative gameplay and more sequels. We're in gamings Hollywood period at the moment.

They're having to appeal to too broad an audience. In the old days there were games for every type of individual. Nowadays they have to please everybody, which they inevitably don't.

I hate long games. They're inevitably full of filler, and duff levels, and weak watered down storylines that go on forever. Short games you can play over and over because they've condensed the gameplay down to the essence. There's an obsession with 'value' which doesn't mean quality, it means quantity. Few people say movies would be better if they were 5 hours long yet everybody gets insulted if a game isn't 10 hours long. Not that it should matter. Interactive entertainment should be replayable, it's not a passive experience that's the same every time.

Practically no challenge, unless you play multiplayer (one of modern gamings few saving graces, although when it comes to multi games the selection of gameplay styles is even narrower than with singleplayer).

The death of arcades, i.e. face to face social gaming. Playing games over the internet is a **** substitute for going down the arcade and meeting people. Competing with an audience watching you (either against another player, or against the computer getting to a really rock hard later level) is the best thrill or sense of accomplishment you can have playing games.

Unlocking, achievements, leveling and all that toss having to be in all games regardless of genre is really annoying. If it's satisfying to play then you'll have a sense of satisfaction and achievement. Giving people badges or flashing "AWESOME WALKING COMBO!" everytime someone presses the analogue forward and takes a few steps is patronising.

Syferus

BLITZ_Molloy wrote: »

Development teams are too big, and games are too expensive to make -> more conservative gameplay and more sequels. We're in gamings Hollywood period at the moment.

Not in the least. Perhaps five years ago the analogy would have been sound, but with the advent of Xbox Live Arcade and the XNA initiative, PlayStation Network, the rise of Steam as a congreation point for the pernially strong indie developer community on PC, the App Store, the sucess of the Wii for more casual players and the immense success of the DS - full of sprite-based shooters, RPGs and so on - the gaming industry is now more diverse than ever before, with a place for games of all sizes, types and price points.

Don't like what you're playing? Make the effort to take these other options seriously rather than applying the logic of the past (subconsciously or otherwise), that what's on the shelves and magazine front-pages today are the be-all and end-all of games.

Retr0gamer

We've had generic copy cat games since the 8-bit era. It's nothing new. How many mario clones and castlevania clones were there on the NES?

Xluna

Retr0gamer wrote: »

We've had generic copy cat games since the 8-bit era. It's nothing new. How many mario clones and castlevania clones were there on the NES?

Or Street Fighter clones on the SNES.

CiDeRmAn

For ever good fighting, driving or platformer on the 8/16 bit consoles, there are countless dreadful ones, always been that way, same on Saturn, PS, DC, PS2, 360, PS3, Wii, the same range of knock offs, same joy to be had finding the gems

o1s1n

Ah, I remember the horror of the days without the internets. Trying to navigate through that minefield of rubbish games was quite the challange.

Professey Chin

o1s1n wrote: »

Ah, I remember the horror of the days without the internets. Trying to navigate through that minefield of rubbish games was quite the challange.

Im looking at you Rise of the Robots :mad:

o1s1n

Ultimate Chin wrote: »

Im looking at you Rise of the Robots :mad:

Awh no! Baby Jesus cries whenever he hears someone paid money for that game.

Retr0gamer

Sega Power was my buyers guide

Professey Chin

o1s1n wrote: »

Awh no! Baby Jesus cries whenever he hears someone paid money for that game.

Stupid back of the box
I was young and naive

Adyx

del88 wrote: »

I was the king of gorf...or space avenger to be more persise..
I think the controls were simplier but the the moves with them were much harder...
It took be about 8 weeks and probably £400 to get to space avenger on gorf.
Most games on the ps3 i'd finish in a few days handy..

http://www.klov.com/G/Gorf.html

http://doda.tv/video/45oF2pTSwdg

I loved Gorf :eek: Trying to shoot those feckin bomber things that spun out from a vortex. I remember the day I bought it for my 2600. Still have it somewhere. Probably not a patch on the arcade version I'd say though.

Kevster

Xluna, I am also dismayed by modern games, but are you sure that you aren't just getting old (just as i am!)? :rolleyes: The memories from our youth will always be the most enjoyable, and it's hard for anything we do in adulthood to compare to the joys we had as kids.

Kevster

o1s1n wrote: »

I find it very hard to understand how people can not like shooters. Shooters ARE videogames. Things fire at you. You dodge and shoot back. You really can't get any more fundamental than that. It's pure videogames playing.

Everything else just takes that idea and expands it :pac:

Are you talking about modern 'war' shooters?; or old classics like BioMenace, Duke Nukem I and II, etc.?

o1s1n

Kevster wrote: »

Are you talking about modern 'war' shooters?; or old classics like BioMenace, Duke Nukem I and II, etc.?

No, I meant shmups. Gradius, R Type, Thunderforce, Blazing Star etc.
Ships/planes avoiding bullets and firing back.

That's what I'd refer to as shooters. I guess the term means different things to different people!

CiDeRmAn

Well, shooters mechanics were laid down by Space Invaders and refined by the genius that is Galaga, the side scroller was defined by Scamble, and more of the things we see as basic mow were fixed by Gradius, power ups etc.
Now we are blessed with, as you say, expansions on those ideas, Pulstar, R-Type Final, Gradius V, Dodonpachi, Rise of the Robots, no wait not that one, its just sh1t

Xluna

Kevster wrote: »

Xluna, I am also dismayed by modern games, but are you sure that you aren't just getting old (just as i am!)? :rolleyes: The memories from our youth will always be the most enjoyable, and it's hard for anything we do in adulthood to compare to the joys we had as kids.

There probably is some truth in that but at the same time I think there is also substance in the claim that things have gone worse in many ways. I remember feeling hugely dissapointed with the N64 and PS1 due to the shift to 3-D. At the end of the Snes' lifespan I was expecting to see beautifully detailed 2-D games,but I was dissapointed. I'm one of the few people who gave a big "meh" when I played Mario 64. The Zelda N64 games were great but I still would have preferred them in 2-D.

Sony had a lot to do with it. They made gaming "cool" and marketable to the mainstream public so games had to (de)evolve. Almost arcade perfect conversions of Tekken,Ridge racer ect started the death of the arcades in the west. I thought the early 3-D games looked shocking and I've been proved right as virtually everyone will admit these games hav'nt aged well compared to the 2-D Snes and Megadrive games. IMO, it's only now that 3-D games are beginning to look decent. But I still think Chrono Trigger looks better than Spirit tracks,both on DS.

Retr0gamer

I don't think anyone will argue that there aren't any 3D games that come close to looking as good as Chrono Trigger with the exception of hyper stylised offerings like Jet Set Radio and Okami.

The obsession with making games realisitc is silly to me. Why strive for realism when games offer a means of creating fantastic and beautiful new worlds and universe's.

I always like to see games **** with convention as well. Shin Megami Tensei: Lucifiers Call is a great one. It seems like another save the world storyline except within the first 30 minutes the world ends and you are left dealing with the aftermath.

Xluna

Exactly, I don't play video games to experience reality,quite the opposiate. If I wanted reality I'd watch Eastenders,the news or a DVD.
Urgghh...another gripe...Why do so many modern games have to look so dull,devoid of colour and generally depressing? Gears of War springs to mind along with two colours-grey and wine red. Seriously, I need prozac every time I see that game. I miss more colourful and creative games,such as Mystical Ninja and Super Paradious. And if some adolescent says G.T.A. is the best game ever one more time...

BLITZ_Molloy

Syferus wrote: »

Not in the least. Perhaps five years ago the analogy would have been sound, but with the advent of Xbox Live Arcade and the XNA initiative, PlayStation Network, the rise of Steam as a congreation point for the pernially strong indie developer community on PC, the App Store, the sucess of the Wii for more casual players and the immense success of the DS - full of sprite-based shooters, RPGs and so on - the gaming industry is now more diverse than ever before, with a place for games of all sizes, types and price points.

Don't like what you're playing? Make the effort to take these other options seriously rather than applying the logic of the past (subconsciously or otherwise), that what's on the shelves and magazine front-pages today are the be-all and end-all of games.

This is true alright. I was more making a statement about mainstream games.

I've been meaning to get a DS for a while. Really must pull my thumb out because there are a good 10 or 15 games I know I'd love on it. The iPod Touch/iPhone seems to be brimming with interesting indie content as well. Definitely the most surprising platform of 09.

I haven't got a 360 or PS3 yet (I know, I know, I'm skint) so I'm not as up on that stuff as I should be. I find it hard to justify spending hundreds of euro when I'll probably play nothing but SF2 HD Remix all day.

A relatively modern PC is the only thing I have going for me but I haven't exactly seen a glut of amazing pick up and play indie stuff on that. I suppose I should do more digging. Played a couple of the Introversion games and while I loved how they looked the gameplay didn't set my world on fire. Interesting games though. The new Gridrunner is delicious looking as well, shame it's so ridiculously easy.

Retr0gamer

BLITZ_Molloy wrote: »

I haven't got a 360 or PS3 yet (I know, I know, I'm skint) so I'm not as up on that stuff as I should be. I find it hard to justify spending hundreds of euro when I'll probably play nothing but SF2 HD Remix all day.

There's also Marvel vs. Capcom and Street Fighter 4 will keep you going forever if you get in with the fighting games forum crowd

Syferus

Xluna wrote: »

Exactly, I don't play video games to experience reality,quite the opposiate. If I wanted reality I'd watch Eastenders,the news or a DVD.
Urgghh...another gripe...Why do so many modern games have to look so dull,devoid of colour and generally depressing? Gears of War springs to mind along with two colours-grey and wine red. Seriously, I need prozac every time I see that game. I miss more colourful and creative games,such as Mystical Ninja and Super Paradious. And if some adolescent says G.T.A. is the best game ever one more time...

To be fair, Gears of War is probably the least realistic looking of the three!

It specifically has always been ridiculed for its spectrum of brown to grey. In reality most titles that aren't shooters have less of a problem with this - even Halo for all of its problems looks more like a carnival ride than a military shooter.

CiDeRmAn

There's plenty of great looking 3D games, Jet Set Radio Future, Madworld, XIII, Rez, Panzer Dragoon, Nights, Donkey Kong Country (ha ha), Okami, Quake, Tempest 2000, Wipeout HD/Fury, Eternal Sonata, Zelda OoT, Star Wars (early 80's arcade), PGR4 and that's just the one's that spring to mind, loads more, plenty of great looking games that are also lucky enough to be great games as well.

BLITZ_Molloy

Retr0gamer wrote: »

There's also Marvel vs. Capcom and Street Fighter 4 will keep you going forever if you get in with the fighting games forum crowd

Never been a big fan of Marvel Vs. Capcom at all. From what I've read on fighting forums SF4 is a bit broken from a competitive point of view. Maybe they patched it since it came out I don't know.