Audi Quattros (A4, A6 etc.) and are they good in snowy weather?

Mayo Exile

Just wondering do any Audi Quattro (A4, A6 etc.) owners out there find the 4 wheel drive systems on these cars a big advantage in the current snowy/frosty weather? Just thought i'd post this thread as I have just seen a rwd beemer hopelessly floundering around in the snow on the BBC news!

Anan1

AWD will bring you up a hill you mightn't otherwise have managed but it won't make a car stop or steer any better. ESP is well worth having, though.

ikillcopiers

I have a 1999 S8, and came from Ballymena yesterday.

I can assure you, it was an asset!

There was a steep hill beside the house I was staying in,
to get a 206 up took a lot of work, wheelspin and 3 people pushing.

The S8 - just put it into first, and she glided up without an issue,
I was shocked at the difference, given that it weighs twice the 206.

So yes, quattro is great in this kind of weather, go to Andorra and just
about every second car is an Audi Quattro for this reason I reckon.

Don't forget though - 4WD gets the power down, but the brakes are
the same, stopping 1.8 tonnes on snow/ice takes some forethought.

When you're talking about the level of snow they had up there you need
snow chains or snow tyres by right, there is a limit to what normal road tyres
can accomplish in bad conditions, regardless of drive system.

Idbatterim

ofcouse all wheel drive is better in those conditions! but given how rare they are here, i would exactly be buying a car based on several days of bad conditions throughout the year!

HashSlinging

Honestly wouldnt waste my money on 4wd car, a good set of winter tires will do just fine, I'm in the wicklow mountains and recently stuck a set on, and I can tell you with common sense they are just as good as 4wd.

Unless you plan on driving like this..

Mayo Exile

Jesus! Deadly (and hairy!) video HashSlinging! I don't own an Audi Quattro myself but I've always liked them.

SomeDude

HashSlinging wrote: »

Unless you plan on driving like this..

That driver is a complete idiot. Probably inexperienced and hasn't been in enough situations to realise how dangerous that driving is (regardless of the car). I know a similar guy in work, he only started to drive in his late 20's. He had the opportunity to drive some very powerful cars soon after. It was a frightning experience being a passenger in those cars with him. He had an overinflated belief in his own driving ability and the cars ability to get him out of tricky situations....

Matt Simis

You will almost never get stuck or loose traction going straight, absolutely no benefit in corners or braking. Also tends to loose grip (when it does) on all four wheels leading to physics defying crab-walk sideways slides. Still better all round than FWD or RWD obviously, just dont expect to be able to drive around as if there is no ice/snow.

Put Winter tyres on an AWD car though and its another level of control however.


Definately another AWD (with rear bias) car on the cards for me at some point.

Rovi

He's obviously Irish, I see the old Culchie salute there at 1.07.

bazzachazza

Thats just nuts, why would you drive at that speed in those conditions on that road with other cars and pedestrians about.

JimmyCrackCorn!

I absolutely love driving on ice and have done it in everything from a rwd nissan 200sx to my current Honda accord.

Light cars turn better on ice and it doesn't matter if you have 4wd or not the hard part on ice will always be turning and stopping.

My brother has an a4 quatro while it makes hills a little easier it wont save you if you dont have throttle, brake control and just as important balance

HashSlinging

Just to clarify if you plan on getting a 4wd car get one with a winter set of wheels and a summer set . 4wd with just summer tires in ice and snow nah! they have a very good effect on a fwd car can only guess full winters with quattro. :cool:

Damn I want 4wd now.. with my winter tires..

Matt Simis

HashSlinging wrote: »

a good set of winter tires will do just fine, I'm in the wicklow mountains and recently stuck a set on, and I can tell you with common sense they are just as good as 4wd.

Ive seen a few people on the irish motoring forums threw on Winters this year. How much a difference did it make in a practical sense? I have no AWD anymore and if I wasnt juggling a few sets of alloys around at the moment would have picked up cheapish Winters for our RWD cars.

galwaytt

SomeDude wrote: »

That driver is a complete idiot. ...

unless you know who he the driver is, or his capability, maybe it's not he who's the idiot. For all you know, that was Hr Rohrl........

bazzachazza wrote: »

Thats just nuts, why would you drive at that speed in those conditions on that road with other cars and pedestrians about.

As you can see, the car was in control the whole time, it was inside his and his cars abilities, and he slowed down in the congested area, so why the hell not ?

O/T: isn't the DSG so civilised ? I meant to throw in my tuppence yesterday, but the other thing that makes ice driving easier is........an automatic. If for no other reason, you just concentrate on steering and (not) braking. Throw in a clutch/gearbox/managing that, and it does add to the skill levels required.......auto's also have a habit of short-shifting when driving like that, which is exactly what is advocated in a manual, btw.....DSG is inclined to shift up at as low as 1500rpm

itarumaa

ikillcopiers wrote: »

I have a 1999 S8, and came from Ballymena yesterday.

I can assure you, it was an asset!

There was a steep hill beside the house I was staying in,
to get a 206 up took a lot of work, wheelspin and 3 people pushing.

Next time, just reverse the 206 over the hill and you will not have issues there:) If you don´t believe me, try it yourself, fwd cars are front heavy so when reversing the car you will get extra grip.

Anan1

galwaytt wrote: »

unless you know who he the driver is, or his capability, maybe it's not he who's the idiot. For all you know, that was Hr Rohrl........

Even if it was, is 198km/h on that road in those conditions safe? If he'd hit the oncoming car he'd almost certainly have killed anyone in both cars.

ikillcopiers

itarumaa wrote: »

Next time, just reverse the 206 over the hill and you will not have issues there:) If you don´t believe me, try it yourself, fwd cars are front heavy so when reversing the car you will get extra grip.

We actually tried that too, but to no avail!

In the end it was a good run that got it over half way up, they a lot of frantic
pushing and shoveling, it was like an automotive version of curling!

Mailman

There is a guy on Fiatforum in UK who has been ploughing through 16" snow and rescuing other stranded cars in his 4x4 FIAT Panda for the last few days.
There is a market for 4x4 passenger vehicles. In Ireland the demand exists for a few days every year then melts away.

Matt Simis

In fairness though, there is a very real and tangible benefit to AWD in Ireland in the Wet, which is nearly every other season in Ireland, once you start putting down decent power.

peasant

Matt Simis wrote: »

In fairness though, there is a very real and tangible benefit to AWD in Ireland in the Wet, which is nearly every other season in Ireland, once you start putting down decent power.

+1, even without decent power ...AWD is just soo much safer on dodgy roads, be they snowed under, icy, wet or just greasy/mucky.

alias no.9

Mailman wrote: »

There is a guy on Fiatforum in UK who has been ploughing through 16" snow and rescuing other stranded cars in his 4x4 FIAT Panda for the last few days.
There is a market for 4x4 passenger vehicles. In Ireland the demand exists for a few days every year then melts away.

A Fiat Panda 4x4


or a Fiat Panda 4x4

bazzachazza

Must be embarrassing having James May turn up and save you in his Panda.:D

Mailman

1.2 Nouva Panda 4x4

there is also nice pictures of another posters Orange Fiat Panda Cross in it's natural habitat on the hills above lake Geneva if you go searching.

peasant

different 4x4's going up a ski slope (or not)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOvTSM0IC7s

the three series is only RWD

tossy

That video of that flute in the 3.0 TDI Audi is one of the most stupidest pieces of driving i've ever seen,at first i thought it was a private or closed road but when i seen villages and on coming traffic i was shocked,sure he looked to be in control but if he had to brake suddenly due ot an animal running out of the woods etc the nit would have been a different story!

Michael 09

I have an Audi quattro but have yet to drive it in the snow (only got it in April). It's a TT 225bhp, would this be much use compared to the A6 or A4?

glynf

Mayo Exile,

I feel your pain re. rwd.I have an A5 3.0 Tdi Quattro, changed up from a 320 E90 2.0Tdi and its the dogs. I'm living up in Kilternan and its made a big difference.

The road I'm on has a particular tight left-hand bend & its uphill-it’s always like glass when it freezes-that was always a drama in the BMW-arse always went out, but the A5 takes it no problem, even though i've only a couple of mm thread left.

Took it for a rip up to Glencree over the weekend & the roads were slushy/icy and it was no problem to it. It’s reassuring to know it works-bought the car more for the engine & thought that Quattro was a bit of a gimmick, glad it’s there now.

SomeDude

galwaytt wrote: »

unless you know who he the driver is, or his capability, maybe it's not he who's the idiot. For all you know, that was Hr Rohrl........

I have to disagree with you there. I don't care what capability the driver has. 198 kph on a road with pedestrians on it is simply not safe. I'm not sure how you could logically argue that it is. I'm afraid not many people would agree you.

Lex Luthor

I know a guy with 2 A4's, one quattro, one FWD and says there is a huge difference between driving both cars in the ice/snow

I've noticed a huge benefit of the AWD system on the legacy in the last week over driving any fwd or rwd car. Try doing this on a 2wd car

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7zyH80F1dU

itarumaa

Lex Luthor wrote: »

I know a guy with 2 A4's, one quattro, one FWD and says there is a huge difference between driving both cars in the ice/snow

I've noticed a huge benefit of the AWD system on the legacy in the last week over driving any fwd or rwd car. Try doing this on a 2wd car

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7zyH80F1dU

There is a huge difference indeed, but seriously, the youtube link you posted, any car with proper winter tyres would have no issues driving that ice track, you don't need 4x4 to drive it.

galwaytt

SomeDude wrote: »

I have to disagree with you there. I don't care what capability the driver has. 198 kph on a road with pedestrians on it is simply not safe. I'm not sure how you could logically argue that it is. I'm afraid not many people would agree you.

I don't expect anyone to agree. But, short of watching the whole thing again, he didn't do 198kph anywhere near the pedestrians.

galwaytt

Anan1 wrote: »

Even if it was, is 198km/h on that road in those conditions safe? If he'd hit the oncoming car he'd almost certainly have killed anyone in both cars.

You're right, if you hit anything at those speeds, it will be ugly, but you can pick any speed and at will be unsafe at some stage.

He's demonstrated good car control - smoothness above all - and that's key, especially in performance driving.

SomeDude

galwaytt wrote: »

he didn't do 198kph anywhere near the pedestrians.

Sorry, I forgot that he has APD (Audi pedestrian detector) fitted as an option. It's a brilliant safety feature - it helps you see around corners.

galwaytt

SomeDude wrote: »

Sorry, I forgot that he has APD (Audi pedestrian detector) fitted as an option. It's a brilliant safety feature - it helps you see around corners.

ok, I took my own advice and watched it again. Maybe you should try it.

Matt Simis

Amusing and informative (if obviously biased somewhat) thread on AudiSRS on driving their S4 / RS4 Quattro's in the recent UK snow:
http://audisrs.com/Grip_In_Snow_about9594.html

Bear in mind most of these lads have ultra performance Summer tyres (ie useless in the cold) and 300-500bhp purring under the bonnet.


Some AWD carpark spins:


EDIT- Note post hoppers, not the video people are arguing about below.

SomeDude

galwaytt wrote: »

ok, I took my own advice and watched it again. Maybe you should try it.

Yep, there are still bends and pedestrians in the video...

galwaytt

SomeDude wrote: »

Yep, there are still bends and pedestrians in the video...

yep, bends in the middle, no issue there. pedestrians at the end, not doing the big speed of earlier. No issue there, either.

SomeDude

galwaytt wrote: »

yep, bends in the middle, no issue there. pedestrians at the end, not doing the big speed of earlier. No issue there, either.

I think you are missing the point. He cannot predict what is around each bend.

galwaytt

SomeDude wrote: »

I think you are missing the point. He cannot predict what is around each bend.

You're correct of course - but don't let a wide angle lens at the back of the car inform you of what the driver can see.

I put a camera on my bike around the TT years ago, and did the up-at-6-before-they-close-the-roads practice run thing, and I have to say, what came out bore no resemblance to the actual experience, which makes me wonder just how they make F1 'look' fast........

peasant

tt ...you're fighting a losing battle.

That guy drove like a dick and you know it.

SomeDude

On a complete tangent, I like the look of those 968s, very nice indeed. Surprised they haven't found a home.

ddarraghh

the guy in the video is a gob****e
he drove too fast and risked other peoples lives ,and it was so cool in his head, he recorded it .
no doubt that driver is inexperienced ,anyone used to driving at that speed knows the risks inolved and would not risks other peoples lives,
unless they are total ****

also his seating position looks to be wrong

tossy

Are pedestrians the only threat in that video? he is driving at insane speeds through an open wood land if a deer or other animal was to come out on to the road......

It's all very well,looking at his 'slick' car control,but when you have to brake hard on those type of road conditions the picture changes.

He drove like an idiot end of story.

ddarraghh

agree but
i didnt see any control just luck

copacetic

with the bigger engined car that most of the quattros come with it makes a massive difference, especially on year round tyres.

I've driven a few audi 3.0L quattros in slippy conditions and they grip really well, especially going around bends and pulling away. In comparison my car (RWD) is absolutely ****e in snowy weather, or even wet weather on sharp bends. Now you do get used to it, but in last years snow even with the most careful driving I couldn't get in and out of my estate, due to a steep hill with a curve. A lot of others got stuck too, but most of that was bad driving.

I have driven a similar car to mine with winter tyres and it makes a massive difference also.


So for snow driving, in order of pref:
4 wheel drive with winter tyres.
Rear wheel drive with winter tyres ~= 4 wheel with summer tyres.
Rear wheel with summer tyres and weights in the boot.
Rear wheel with slicks and no weights in the boot
4 wheel drive with summer tyres.

However for the few days a year I don't mind too much.

peasant

4WD with summer tyres

ToxicPaddy

Next car is definitely going to be a quattro.. have a FWD A6 at the moment and drove a 46 quattro a friend of mine has, what a car!! serious grip and feels so solid on the road .

If you're looking for serious off roader, this isnt the car for you, but if you're looking for something that gives excellent grip in all road conditions, its the one..

Get a diesel by the way, the quattro adds about 30% onto the weight of the car from what I'm told, so the mpg wouldnt be that good for petrol. I may be wrong though, some of the guys here would know more than me.

Tox

tossy

ToxicPaddy wrote: »

Get a diesel by the way, the quattro adds about 30% onto the weight of the car from what I'm told, so the mpg wouldnt be that good for petrol. I may be wrong though, some of the guys here would know more than me.

Tox

quattro + Diesel = a good car to bring the cattle to the mart.

quattro + Petrol = A proper car

galwaytt

tossy wrote: »

quattro + Diesel = a good car to bring the cattle to the mart.:D

.....which makes the one in the aforementioned-video THE car to have then, for those attending Athenry mart, on Tuesdays......

Matt Simis

ToxicPaddy wrote: »

Get a diesel by the way, the quattro adds about 30% onto the weight of the car from what I'm told, so the mpg wouldnt be that good for petrol. I may be wrong though, some of the guys here would know more than me.

Tox

God no, try less than 5%. A 30% weight penalty would effectively remove any handling improvement as well as absolutely murder MPG.

A4 2.0 TFSI AWD - 1490kg
http://www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/car/?car=121407

A4 2.0 TFSI FWD - 1425kg
http://www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/car/?car=121660

Marlow

copacetic wrote: »

Rear wheel with summer tyres and weights in the boot.

"Weights in the boot" is exactly the magic keyword for a RWD car with the engine in the front.

It's not that FWD is better, AWD is better or RWD is better. It's that you have to adjust your driving and your car to the situation.

My very first car was a VW LT31. Now, that's a 2.4D 3.2t van with the engine under the front seat and RWD. In the winter (in Denmark, where I'm from), I was running around with a bunch of concrete slabs in the back, to even be able to get anywhere. Works the magic.

Same with the BMW's. Stick a couple of sandbags, sacks of concrete, concrete slabs or something likewise heavy in your boot and with good tyres you should have no issues in this weather.

The reason why FWD cars handle better in this weather is because the weight of the engine helps them getting grip. The same is for RWD cars with middle motor or for example Porsche, where most have the engine behind the rear axle.

AWD will always be a help, compared to RWD or FWD, but you've got other downsides.

Remember, neither Volvo nor Saab did originally build AWD cars. Volvo only introduced them with the Volvo XC70. And Saab and Volvo are build for extreme weather like heavily snow in the winter.

/M