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The conversion of England to the Catholic faith...
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18-12-2009 12:25am#1
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He discussed the possiblility that England would return to the Catholic faith and that this would lead to the re-christianization of Europe. Would be rather amazing if that happened!
As an English girl, I think this is highly unlikely. Even if 70 % of the population identify as Christians, this is largely nominal (i.e. they've been christened and that's it). There are ongoing campaigns to remove religion from every aspect of public life e.g. civil servants are not allowed to refuse to perform say, a gay marriage, on religious grounds. MPs who abstain from votes on religious grounds are ridiculed. Schools come under fire for promoting anythig other than the mildest forms of religion e.g. creationism is practically outlawed. Our rights (including my rights as a woman) are firmly enshrined in secularism and I predict a long and happy future in a country where I have the right to live and grow in a god-free environment.
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doctoremma wrote: »As an English girl, I think this is highly unlikely. Even if 70 % of the population identify as Christians, this is largely nominal (i.e. they've been christened and that's it). There are ongoing campaigns to remove religion from every aspect of public life e.g. civil servants are not allowed to refuse to perform say, a gay marriage, on religious grounds. MPs who abstain from votes on religious grounds are ridiculed. Schools come under fire for promoting anythig other than the mildest forms of religion e.g. creationism is practically outlawed. Our rights (including my rights as a woman) are firmly enshrined in secularism and I predict a long and happy future in a country where I have the right to live and grow in a god-free environment.
Hello Emma, I know it seems incredibly unlikely but so was the fall of Communism in Russia.
In Fatima on July 13, 1917, The Virgin Mary predicted that Russia would spread its errors throughout the world. Four months later, Russia fell to communism in the Revolution. Mary also predicted that communism would fall if all the Bishops of the world consecrated Russia to her Immaculate Heart. This happened in 1984 and the fall happened in 1991.
With God all things are possible. We'll see...0 -
Hello Kelly.In Fatima on July 13, 1917, The Virgin Mary predicted that Russia would spread its errors throughout the world. Four months later, Russia fell to communism in the Revolution. Mary also predicted the communism would fall if the Bishops of the world consecrated Russia to her Immaculate Heart. This happened in 1991.
Hmmm, unless the prediction included a few verifiable statements, such as dates/names/etc, I'd be rather skeptical of this. I understand that many real people predicted the end of Communism with far more accuracy...With God all things are possible. We'll see...
And without god, all things are equal.0 -
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No-one, other than the most deranged conspiracy theorists, think there is the slightest prospect of 30,000,000 more Muslims appearing (either by immigration, reproduction or conversion) in the UK and turning it into an Islamic society.
Agreed.Lets limit this thread to discussing whether 25,000,000 Catholics will appear instead.
If a few South Americans rock up and teach the "native" men how to dance properly, that might be a good thing 0 -
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LMAO.
So, OP, how might you predict the rise of Catholicism to be a dominant religion in England?
I can think of a few possibilities:
1. Wide-scale epiphany of "native" population. Unlikely, and most of us would think that it was some kind of terrorist attack to release a mind-altering substance.
2. Wide-scale immigration of Catholics. More likely and there is undeniably an influx of European Catholics (Enough to counter those leaving? I don't know). I'm unconvinced that many South Americans would swap the white beaches of Ipanema for the drizzle of England. Our shambles of an economy isn't necessarily attracting too many people at the moment anyway.
3. Wide-scale uprising in protest. (Sorry to mention Islam PDN but this might be relevant now.) I suspect that there might be a fair few people willing to defend what they perceive as a threat to their "native "culture by firmly standing up in favour of an obvious marker of that culture. Misguided? A token gesture? Almost certainly. But I have heard many people with no apparent religious conviction talk about "this Christian country". Now, if a vague assertion of Christianity is viewed as ineffective, maybe a more "hardline" Catholic revolution will take place.0 -
doctoremma wrote: »LMAO.
So, OP, how might you predict the rise of Catholicism to be a dominant religion in England?
I can think of a few possibilities:
1. Wide-scale epiphany of "native" population. Unlikely, and most of us would think that it was some kind of terrorist attack to release a mind-altering substance.
2. Wide-scale immigration of Catholics. More likely and there is undeniably an influx of European Catholics (Enough to counter those leaving? I don't know). I'm unconvinced that many South Americans would swap the white beaches of Ipanema for the drizzle of England. Our shambles of an economy isn't necessarily attracting too many people at the moment anyway.
3. Wide-scale uprising in protest. (Sorry to mention Islam PDN but this might be relevant now.) I suspect that there might be a fair few people willing to defend what they perceive as a threat to their "native "culture by firmly standing up in favour of an obvious marker of that culture. Misguided? A token gesture? Almost certainly. But I have heard many people with no apparent religious conviction talk about "this Christian country". Now, if a vague assertion of Christianity is viewed as ineffective, maybe a more "hardline" Catholic revolution will take place.
The prophesies appear to refer to the conversion of English Protestants to the Catholic faith. I know this is out of date but in the 2001 census, 71% identified themselves as Christian. I've no idea what it is now.0 -
The prophesies appear to refer to the conversion of English Protestants to the Catholic faith. I know this is out of date but in the 2001 census, 71% identified themselves as Christian. I've no idea what it is now.
A few stats extended from those census results:
18 % of the population practice a religion, around 10 % practicing a form of Christianity. Only 6 % go to church on Sundays. That's a hefty proportion only turning out for Midnight Mass once a year 66 % of the population say they have no link with a church of any kind. The "71 % Christian" census result therefore appears to reflect a cultural tradition rather than a religious conviction.
This is supported by the reported figures that less than 50 % of the population believe in god.
Edit: Update - I've found survey in 2008 which reports that less than 40 % of the population believe in god.
Some interesting stats here:
http://www.vexen.co.uk/UK/religion.html0 -
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It could happen if we are talking about formal, State-enforced religion. The Roman empire became 'Christian' under Constantine. It will just mean the pagans find room for their ideas and practices in the 'Church' and atheists go along with it for the sake of political unity. Perhaps in reaction to Islam? The Holy Roman Empire revived.Hello all, I was just looking at EWTN this evening and Raymond DeSouza was discussing the de-christianization and the islamisation of Europe.
He discussed the possiblility that England would return to the Catholic faith and that this would lead to the re-christianization of Europe. Would be rather amazing if that happened!
http://keysofpeter.org/w.project/de-christianization.htm
http://keysofpeter.org/w.project/why.england.htm
Apparently this was prophesied by St. Dom Bosco, St. John Vianney and Our Lady of Salette.
Has anyone else heard of such a prophesy?
God bless,
Noel.
But if we speak of true religious conviction, then the Bible tells us of a time when not only Europe but the world will be one spiritually:
Revelation 17:8 The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go to perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
2 Thessalonians 2:7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Almost everyone will be an ecumenist then. 0 -
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