Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

Consonata

westtip wrote: »

This must not be allowed again,m and remember their total focus in the past few years has been on freight not passenger services, a report produced by the WOT cronies at the Western Development commission could not prove the case for freight, let's not forget it folks but taxpayers money is actually our money.

Yes, the plan should've been finished instead of only doing 1/3 of the line. And funnily, it's westerners tax-payers. You can't just ignore the ~600k people this line would benefit.

mayo.mick

Consonata wrote: »

Yes, the plan should've been finished instead of only doing 1/3 of the line. And funnily, it's westerners tax-payers. You can't just ignore the ~600k people this line would benefit.

BoatMad

still in need of subsidy

perhaps they missed the bit

" all rail lines need subsidies "

westtip

Consonata wrote: »

Yes, the plan should've been finished instead of only doing 1/3 of the line. And funnily, it's westerners tax-payers. You can't just ignore the ~600k people this line would benefit.

Hilarious! Your posts are truly hilarious.:D did you not read that garbage that West on Track produced in 2006 and then look at the real numbers. Start your education by going through this thread and its predecessor!

eastwest

BoatMad wrote: »

bray is a satellite town, the DART was a major factor in its expansion

Outer commuter areas like Drogheda, have now a population twice that of waterford, directly linked to a combination of improved rail and road access

There is no argument that rail access can benefit towns, the issue is the type and nature of that rail access

It isn't appropriate for small places with low population densities.

eastwest

Consonata wrote: »

Yes, the plan should've been finished instead of only doing 1/3 of the line. And funnily, it's westerners tax-payers. You can't just ignore the ~600k people this line would benefit.

That's wotenomics, back of a fag box stuff.

Consonata

westtip wrote: »

Hilarious! Your posts are truly hilarious.:D did you not read that garbage that West on Track produced in 2006 and then look at the real numbers. Start your education by going through this thread and its predecessor!

A Line that starts in Galway and Terminates in Limerick is going to have low passenger nos, whether it was densely populated or no. A line connected from Sligo all the way down to Limerick would be used by the ~600k people who live along side it, whether it be students, commuters from Mayo to Galway, Holiday-makers, what have you. It's not a ludicrous idea to provide a service for nearly a 1/4 of your population.

EDIT: and shock/horror that Galway/Limerick line is actually gaining passenger nos. Up 70% this year. Now admittedly thats from a low base, but still. Not a complete disaster. But I guess since it's so far from Dublin, that is all it qualifies as.

BoatMad

westtip wrote: »

Hilarious! Your posts are truly hilarious.:D did you not read that garbage that West on Track produced in 2006 and then look at the real numbers. Start your education by going through this thread and its predecessor!

lets not get into plans and numbers, sure Irish rail in general would be finished

BoatMad

EDIT: and shock/horror that Galway/Limerick line is actually gaining passenger nos. Up 70% this year. Now admittedly thats from a low base, but still. Not a complete disaster. But I guess since it's so far from Dublin, that is all it qualifies as.

let me say this, in any reality the WRC should not exist, to suggest we re-opened the WRC and abandoned Dart Underground , in a capital completely at a standstill , is an example of the " reality " that exists in ireland today

Im see what the WRC is, a railplan that scavenged the rest of irish rail. Im not against it, but not at the expense of concession elsewhere on the rail network

Consonata

BoatMad wrote: »

lets not get into plans and numbers, sure Irish rail in general would be finished

Exactly, Sure let's cut the Sligo/Dublin and Galway/Dublin train. They have poor numbers too eh? Shure everybody drives in the wesht these days, what would they need a car fo'. Now let's nurse our Luas wounds

Consonata

BoatMad wrote: »

let me say this, in any reality the WRC should not exist, to suggest we re-opened the WRC and abandoned Dart Underground , in a capital completely at a standstill , is an example of the " reality " that exists in ireland today

Im see what the WRC is, a railplan that scavenged the rest of irish rail. Im not against it, but not at the expense of concession elsewhere on the rail network

That's true, but that was a product of the government of the time. My mind boggles at how the cabinet meeting went when they were proposing the Luas

"We're going to make 2 new Tram lines in Dublin"

*cheers*

"On both North-side and south side!"

*cheers*

"that are Un-connected!"

*..... Cheers*

BoatMad

"that are Un-connected!"

*..... Cheers*

They do actually connect, there are connections in oconnel street to allow engineering trains to connect, it just that the running trains wont switch lines ( thats common , just like the tube)

what is a mistake was not having a common interchange platform , thats an awful mistake

westtip

BoatMad wrote: »

what is a mistake was not having a common interchange platform , thats an awful mistake

Sure don't you know there is one planned in the wesht, claremorris! The West of Ireland's Clapham Junction.

westtip

Consonata wrote: »

A Line that starts in Galway and Terminates in Limerick is going to have low passenger nos, .

That is not what your friends in WOT said back in 2006, here is the rest of that brilliantly funny press release. Talk about Hans Christian Anderson, I'm really not sure what these guys were smoking at the time, but I'd like some!

WOT press release continued..... October 2006. If you really want a laugh go look at the business case for Ennis/Athenry, 100,000 passengers in year one (just being achieved in Year 6 after slashing fares and not telling us how many of the 100,000 are social welfare passengers, year 5 business case was for 250,000 - so now at 40% of projections, but I digress really if you want a good giggle read the figures from WOT in 2006 again! (give me a puff on that stuff please)

"The findings of the TG4 poll clearly justify the decision to proceed with the Ennis-Athenry section of the WRC and should encourage the Government to include Phase 2 from Athenry to Claremorris immediately.
"Working from the statistics in the poll it may be seen that potentially greater numbers of people would be using that one section of the WRC annually than currently use the Belfast-Dublin route, with numbers being at least as great as those currently using the Limerick-Dublin, Westport-Dublin and Sligo-Dublin routes," he added.
Example:
23% of respondents say they will use the train at least once a month.
As a % of total pop of Co. Galway over 18 yrs (150,000 approx):
= 34,500 people x 12 months
= 414,000 x 2 (return trips count as 2)
= 828,000 = DEMAND
Note: WEST ON TRACK projected a demand of 750,000

Yes this garbage was put in the public domain. Yes county councils in the West are still inviting West on Track in to give presentations. Yes the Government has committed to spend more public money on a feasibility/economic study of the WRC north of Athenry. Can you really believe this stuff!!!

marno21

West on Track are deluded if they think that a rail line from Galway to Sligo to Derry is in any way more advantageous compared to upgradinng the N17/N15/N13.

Are all the HGVs going to use the rail line so?

I think that it is important to remind people why railways were successful in the 19th century, it was because the roads were absolutely awful!

Consonata

marno21 wrote:

West on Track are deluded if they think that a rail line from Galway to Sligo to Derry is in any way more advantageous compared to upgradinng the N17/N15/N13.

Because a rail line connecting the 1st and 4th biggest city on the island is as justified as rail between the 4th biggest and the 5th biggest city on the island

end of the road

Consonata wrote: »

Yes, the plan should've been finished instead of only doing 1/3 of the line. And funnily, it's westerners tax-payers. You can't just ignore the ~600k people this line would benefit.

yeah but what lines are we closing to reopen the next section.

BoatMad wrote: »

let me say this, in any reality the WRC should not exist, to suggest we re-opened the WRC and abandoned Dart Underground , in a capital completely at a standstill , is an example of the " reality " that exists in ireland today

Im see what the WRC is, a railplan that scavenged the rest of irish rail. Im not against it, but not at the expense of concession elsewhere on the rail network

exactly, thats what it comes down to. protecting what we have.

marno21 wrote: »

West on Track are deluded if they think that a rail line from Galway to Sligo to Derry is in any way more advantageous compared to upgradinng the N17/N15/N13.

Are all the HGVs going to use the rail line so?

the idea should be to try and cut hgvs really as they seem to do the most damage to the roads. not an easy task admittidly. i would agree though that dualing those particular roads would be more then enough in terms of road spending in those areas.

mikeingalway

on anther note, great news that the line has finally reopened between Ennis & Limerick again!

marno21

end of the road wrote: »

yeah but what lines are we closing to reopen the next section.



exactly, thats what it comes down to. protecting what we have.



the idea should be to try and cut hgvs really as they seem to do the most damage to the roads. not an easy task admittidly. i would agree though that dualing those particular roads would be more then enough in terms of road spending in those areas.

They are of course going to do damage to roads designed for horses & carts with no foundation. The N20 is crumbling and currently has 3 sets of roadworks on it, 2 of which are reparing damaged surfaces.

Actual modern roads won't be affected by HGV traffic as much as old 'roads' would be.

You also have the advantage of places like Charlestown, Milltown, Ballindine etc no longer having large volumes of HGV traffic running through their streets.

westtip

marno21 wrote: »

You also have the advantage of places like Charlestown, Milltown, Ballindine etc no longer having large volumes of HGV traffic running through their streets.

Do you know anything about modern supply chain logistics. Tell me how will all the food, milk, hammers and nails, newspapers, etc make their way to these towns. On a train?

Bray Head

Consonata wrote: »

BoatMad wrote: »

bray is a satellite town, the DART was a major factor in its expansion

Outer commuter areas like Drogheda, have now a population twice that of waterford, directly linked to a combination of improved rail and road access

There is no argument that rail access can benefit towns, the issue is the type and nature of that rail access

Agreed, Dun Laoghaire's population rocketed by 46% following the introduction of the DART, so it was a considerable factor.

That claim is nonsense. Vast majority of housing stock along the southside DART line is pre-1985.

Muckyboots

The D4 media attack on the Canney- WRC Plan cranked up a notch with Sean O'Rourke on Morning Ireland. "WRC at the expense of Navan"?
And he is a Galway man.

eastwest

Deleted User wrote: »

I think that it is important to remind people why railways were successful in the 19th century, it was because the roads were absolutely awful!

....and nobody had cars.

eastwest

westtip wrote: »

Do you know anything about modern supply chain logistics. Tell me how will all the food, milk, hammers and nails, newspapers, etc make their way to these towns. On a train?

The train is great for collecting milk from farms, for delivering concrete to building sites and for bringing heating oil to homes.
You just send it to the nearest station, you see, and a man with a horse and cart does the rest.

eastwest

mikeingalway wrote: »

on anther note, great news that the line has finally reopened between Ennis & Limerick again!

I'll get me flask and sandwiches, and see if the wife can come along as my carer.

savagethegoat

Bray Head wrote: »

That claim is nonsense. Vast majority of housing stock along the southside DART line is pre-1985.

people get confused between the coming of the DART and coming of the railways...in reality they are the same thing, the DART represents a Brand and an improved service.

Bray and Drogheda never lost their train and there is no evidence to suggest reinstating any line will create massive development of any town. Has the WRC made a single jot of difference to Gort? Tuam would be no different

eastwest

Consonata wrote: »

Because a rail line connecting the 1st and 4th biggest city on the island is as justified as rail between the 4th biggest and the 5th biggest city on the island

Even West on Track has given up on the line north of Athenry, except for some as yet unidentified freight.
Only the extreme Shinners who moved to Shannon from Derry during the early part of the troubles are still pushing the Shannon (sorry, Limerick) to Derry link.

Consonata

Muckyboots wrote: »

The D4 media attack on the Canney- WRC Plan cranked up a notch with Sean O'Rourke on Morning Ireland. "WRC at the expense of Navan"?
And he is a Galway man.

So a Navan commuter line is all well and good but a Sligo Galway line is completely out of the question

eastwest

savagethegoat wrote: »

people get confused between the coming of the DART and coming of the railways...in reality they are the same thing, the DART represents a Brand and an improved service.

Bray and Drogheda never lost their train and there is no evidence to suggest reinstating any line will create massive development of any town. Has the WRC made a single jot of difference to Gort? Tuam would be no different

Drogheda expanded on the back of the motorway link, not the railway which was a constant over the decades.