Photography, Art, The Individual and "Ireland"

Anouilh

It has been noticeable recently that, even though Ireland has thousands of very creative and skilled photographers, a central focus has not formed where like-minded people can explore this art form.

Many professionals complain that there is still little visual education at secondary school level or that "The Irish" have not made a great photographic splash in the World.

This looks like changing in 2010:

http://www.photoireland.org/

The art galleries, notably IMMA, have photography groups and classes, linking in with the other arts.

Here's to a exciting developments in the months to come...

kensutz

Art??? Are you sure it's art???

democrates

Interesting-ish, it comes across as photography for photographers which is not really my bag.

They don't seem to have a venue yet. The site generally hints at a surfeit of rhetoric and deficit of results - too many navel-gazers. They need to learn that the singular of media is medium, but #1 priority is to get a doer to the helm to turn the vision into reality.

elven

jeysus, my eyes glazed over barely into the second paragraph there. No plain english awards for that site...

During the crucial period of preparation, we will endeavor to propagate our enthusiasm to other organisations whose involvement or contribution to the festival would be of utmost importance.

I think what they are trying to do sounds fantastic but I expect it'll involve the usual suspects who are already doing the gallery circuit, and who all know each other already, and just be a giant group pat on the back. I'd love it if normal people like us could actually get involved - this could be encouraged by not writing in overly flowery art speak right from the off

ThOnda

Well, I was tempted offer my services time, but I am not local

artyeva

my eyes also glazed over - both from the unreadable, unecessarily complex english AND the fact that it looks like it's gearing up to be another dublin based insular incestuous luvvie-fest.

democrates

elven wrote: »

I think what they are trying to do sounds fantastic but I expect it'll involve the usual suspects who are already doing the gallery circuit, and who all know each other already, and just be a giant group pat on the back.

Funny you should say that, I attended a launch in temple bar years ago about getting Ireland on the map for multimedia (yup, pre dot bomb), but the meeting was dominated by a few people who knew each other by name and who went on at skull drilling length about abstract stuff - encrypted in academic jargon. That just left the rest of us with zero to say since we didn't have a frikken breeze what they were talking about. Since then the MIT Media Lab have come and gone, yep, wtf.

I read 'curator' and I'm back in Rome at the European Conference on Digital Libraries 2002 which I attended at my own expense. Everyone from Vatican curators to the FBI were there talking about digital collections and how to share them, how to conserve a tiff for a thousand years etc. and it was actually quite interesting to hear how people were tackling all these problems. But I think I was the only one who's trip wasn't funded by the taxpayer or a big company fishing for contracts, they all fortified their positions but I'm not aware of one producer of content who got anything from it.

At least this proposal says part of their goal is to showcase upcoming talent, if that's not just pr for government funding they should invite the likes of IPF and camera clubs to contribute since the talent is here, but I have a feeling 'upcoming talent' may already be hand picked...

Anouilh

Like all festivals, the event in 2010 will be as good as the people who participate and give their time to making it a success, I suppose.

This seems to have been very enjoyable:

http://www.nyphotofestival.com/site/?page_id=4151

It is a breakthrough to have such an event in Ireland at last and it should attract the general public, as so many people are now enthusiastic amateur photographers.


Getting the camera clubs alerted would make things very lively indeed.

artyeva

oh, it'll attract the general public alright. but i bet you a fiver it'll only be publicised in dublin, because as we all know, all the creative people in ireland live in dublin. the rest of us are still living in huts daubing muck on a wall to make the place look purty

by the way - i only say this because this doesn't exactly strike me as an 'all ireland' invitation:

Some of the organisations we would like to engage with:
‐ The Arts Council of Ireland & Culture Ireland.
‐ Temple Bar Cultural Trust.
‐ Tourism Ireland & The Chamber of Commerce.
‐ Local communities in Dún Laoghaire‐Rathdown County Council, South Dublin County Council and Dublin City Council.
‐ Public and Private galleries & Museums, in particular those already involved in Photography.
‐ Universities, Institutes and educational bodies like NCAD, DIT, Griffith College and IADT, amongst others.
‐ International Cultural bodies like the Goethe Institute, Alliance Francaise, Instituto Italiano di Cultura, Cervantes Institute, etc.
‐ Artistic organisations, associations and professional groups like Visual Artists Ireland, The Irish Professional Photographers Association.
‐ Art and Photography magazines (like SOURCE) and other artist platforms, national and international.
‐ Charitable organisations, and other organisations who are delivering help to those most in need and could put forward solidarity projects.


maybe i'm wrong

Covey

artyeva wrote: »

oh, it'll attract the general public alright. but i bet you a fiver it'll only be publicised in dublin, because as we all know, all the creative people in ireland live in dublin. the rest of us are still living in huts daubing muck on a wall to make the place look purty

by the way - i only say this because this doesn't exactly strike me as an 'all ireland' invitation:

Some of the organisations we would like to engage with:
‐ The Arts Council of Ireland & Culture Ireland.
‐ Temple Bar Cultural Trust.
‐ Tourism Ireland & The Chamber of Commerce.
‐ Local communities in Dún Laoghaire‐Rathdown County Council, South Dublin County Council and Dublin City Council.
‐ Public and Private galleries & Museums, in particular those already involved in Photography.
‐ Universities, Institutes and educational bodies like NCAD, DIT, Griffith College and IADT, amongst others.
‐ International Cultural bodies like the Goethe Institute, Alliance Francaise, Instituto Italiano di Cultura, Cervantes Institute, etc.
‐ Artistic organisations, associations and professional groups like Visual Artists Ireland, The Irish Professional Photographers Association.
‐ Art and Photography magazines (like SOURCE) and other artist platforms, national and international.
‐ Charitable organisations, and other organisations who are delivering help to those most in need and could put forward solidarity projects.


maybe i'm wrong

Why not write and propose a themed exhibition in the Ballycroy National Park Visitor Centre ?

Covey

Anouilh wrote: »

Getting the camera clubs alerted would make things very lively indeed.

Or kill it stone dead, depending on your perspective.

Anouilh

Féach anseo...

http://www.artscouncil.ie/en/news/news.aspx?article=cf892302-b8cd-4e46-bc5a-10ce0e0538cf

democrates

Anouilh wrote: »

Féach anseo...

http://www.artscouncil.ie/en/news/news.aspx?article=cf892302-b8cd-4e46-bc5a-10ce0e0538cf

Haha, catchy. it's another good idea, and if that network were up an running already it would help in the team-building challenge for photoireland. Absenting that they should just ring the organiser of the Dun Laoghaire Festival of World Cultures and say "Halp!", they won't get spoon-fed but at least buy them lunch or dinner and get some good pointers.

Jesus wept though, how many of these arty types have Brillo pads between their ears? Deja vous on the Féach page: announce a plan, then the rest of it is explaining why it's a good idea. Nothing for example about how this network might operate, will it be meetings, online facilities? If it's too early in the process to spell out practical details like that, I'd at least flag some possibilities and invite suggestions.

If any Boardsies have suggestions, I bet the contact for Féach is the Arts Council Director Ms Mary Cloake who made the speech announcing Féach at Navan since no 'contact' is mentioned, you'll need to go through her PA Bernie O'Leary. I've a few ideas to send them, they need all the help they can get.

I feel sorry for the Arts Council as they really haven't a breeze what to do now that funding is to be drastically cut. The "highly competitive sector, with good productivity" that they keep on life support with grants will be decimated. Networking is a good answer because people who survive outside the Arts nest are far more likely to come up with good answers, they're the kind of people who won't call you darling but know about mundane things like profitability, cash flow, CRM, SCM, OTE, and tax returns.

Am I turning into a grinch or is there really too much bullsh1t around?

democrates

Covey wrote: »

Or kill it stone dead, depending on your perspective.

Lol, without strict deadlines for submissions I can imagine the potential for delay ok.

elven

Anyone consider actually telling the people who are organising this what you think? Maybe if there's enough of a response they might actually consider making it more accessible. I did, but in a more positive and less bitchy kind of way as i may have phrased it above

Covey

Well the state has been kind to arts in the budget so lets all get out there and do something and stop talking about it

artyeva

democrates wrote: »

Am I turning into a grinch or is there really too much bullsh1t around?

definitelty not, and absolutely!!!

Covey wrote: »

Why not write and propose a themed exhibition in the Ballycroy National Park Visitor Centre ?

as it happens i'd been doing a bit behind the scenes on an idea i had for an exhibition somewhere since i moved down here. not many of the local galleries were interested though as i'm not ''local'' enough, and jaaaysus when i said i wanted to include a few photographers from dublin into it who weren't landscapey.... some of them fainted, regained consciousness then threw garlic and stakes at me

i might throw it at the NPWS though.

Covey

Ah sure your a "blow in" and I'm a "blow out", perfect combo PM if I can help in any way?

sheesh

anybody here thinking of putting in a punt for boards.

Fenster

Done:

Mark Grealish <mark@newworldphotos.net> Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 02:10
To: info@photoireland.org
Well hello there!

I am writing/speaking on behalf of both the active photographic community of boards.ie and as myself personally as a photographer. The point of this email can be made with a single pertinent excerpt from your website:

When: July 2010
Where: Various locations in Dublin.
FIND OUT MORE

Your website is registered in Dublin, is operated from Dublin, exclusively mentions Dublin and Dublin's institutions (six times on the front page alone) and trumpets that your festival will be held in Dublin. So what about the rest of the thirty-two counties, both North and South? Active photographic clubs, professional companies and single enthusiasts can be found from in both the great urban centers such as Galway and Cork to rural areas Donegal and Kerry. To advertise your festival as being 'all-Ireland' while simultaneously reinforcing the perception of being an event organized from and for the benefit of the city of Dublin is farcical.

Mark Grealish.

Fenster

No answer!

Covey

sheesh wrote: »

anybody here thinking of putting in a punt for boards.

What exactly do you feel Boards has to offer something like this??

Trev M

Wow - Someone needs a media course on good web design.:eek: Im by no means an expert but that site hardly engages you on first visit.

Covey

God isn't it typical of Ireland. Someone tries to do something positive and the rest just sit arouind trying to tear strips off it :mad:

From their Webpage

Get Involved

PhotoIreland is looking for early adopters wishing to get involve with the project at this stage, from sponsors, gallerists, art magazines, and photographers, to volunteers and interns. Contact us at info@photoireland.org or call 087 6856169

Get involved if you feel can contribute and it's much easier change things from the inside than bitching on a forum.

Trev M

Fenster wrote: »

No answer!

Heh jaysus give em a little time there chief...:D ya only sent it today and to be fair they give a contact number to call.

Trev M

Covey wrote: »

God isn't it typical of Ireland. Someone tries to do something positive and the rest just sit arouind trying to tear strips of it :mad:

From their Webpage

Get Involved

PhotoIreland is looking for early adopters wishing to get involve with the project at this stage, from sponsors, gallerists, art magazines, and photographers, to volunteers and interns. Contact us at info@photoireland.org or call 087 6856169

Get involved if you feel can contribute and it's much easier change things from the inside than bitching on a forum.

I think its fair comment to say they are trying to do something positive , equally I think its fair enough that people can comment on it from a personal perspective relaying their experiences etc no?

Fenster

Trev M wrote: »

I think its fair comment to say they are trying to do something positive , equally I think its fair enough that people can comment on it from a personal perspective relaying their experiences etc no?

I'm sorry, but how is it a positive thing when they advertise themselves as 'all-Ireland' while simultaneously coming across as an all-Dublin circle-jerk?

Covey

Trev M wrote: »

I think its fair comment to say they are trying to do something positive , equally I think its fair enough that people can comment on it from a personal perspective relaying their experiences etc no?

All I get from this thread is moaning and abject negativity.

I for one think it's a great initiative, that hopefully will achieve it's aims.

It's not too long ago we had the a long thread which contained the gem "Now we have the horses at the water, how do we make them drink" or something to that effect. Do nothing was the outcome of that:mad:

Before we should start critising other organisations maybe we should have a good look at ourselves.

AnCatDubh

think humberklog shot that horse iirc

rymus

Covey wrote: »

Before we should start critising other organisations maybe we should have a good look at ourselves.

Although I agree fully with that, I don't think anyone wants to re-open that can of worms. Last time that happened, it led to a mega rant that spanned many, many pages.

Covey

rymus wrote: »

Although I agree fully with that, I don't think anyone wants to re-open that can of worms. Last time that happened, it led to a mega rant that spanned many, many pages.

I agree with you there.

Funny though how everyone wants to comment on a Photographic "Art" project, when that type of interest here is seriously stifled. :mad::(

rymus

I think in this and several past instances, the definitions of what 'art' is have varied wildly.

Covey

rymus wrote: »

I think in this and several past instances, the definitions of what 'art' is have varied wildly.

You can call it what you want. I think you know what I mean though.

Calina

Fenster wrote: »

I'm sorry, but how is it a positive thing when they advertise themselves as 'all-Ireland' while simultaneously coming across as an all-Dublin circle-jerk?

So instead of saying "I'd like to be involved and I am based in XYZ and here's what I can contribute", you emailed a complaint about how it was Dublin centric. How is that constructive?

rymus

yeah, I think so

dakar

rymus wrote: »

I think in this and several past instances, the definitions of what 'art' is have varied wildly.

Yup, and the fact that everyone gets so defensive of their own version of 'art' (especially those who disdain it) is the root of the problem.

I've emailed them expressing an interest in getting involved in whatever capacity I can. I await developments with interest.

Covey

To settle the "art" argument once and for all.

Photography is a sub forum of "the Arts" on Boards. As Dev is more or less the Pope around here and infallible and all that,

unlike the mods who only think that

well thats it guys.

PhotoIreland

I would suggest, if I may, that we continue any discussions about PhotoIreland in the following thread:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055766368

Trev M

Fenster wrote: »

I'm sorry, but how is it a positive thing when they advertise themselves as 'all-Ireland' while simultaneously coming across as an all-Dublin circle-jerk?

Hi Fenster - I have no beef with you but just to respond to your question directly.

My perception is they have invited people to particpate, they are trying to be inclusive and progressive in what there aiming to achieve, my opinion is this is a positive thing.

Its your perception is its a Dublin centric circle jerk , its not a statement of fact nor is it their expressed intention. You are of course welcome to express you opinion... as Ive also suggested in my post above.

CabanSail

I have a problem with

Fenster wrote: »

I am writing/speaking on behalf of both the active photographic community of boards.ie and as myself personally as a photographer.

We are all users here but none of us can speak on behalf of the whole community. You are welcome to represent yourself however you like. Unless you have been given permission from Boards.ie Admin you have no right to speak on behalf of this Forum.

Trev M

Covey wrote: »

All I get from this thread is moaning and abject negativity.

I for one think it's a great initiative, that hopefully will achieve it's aims.

It's not too long ago we had the a long thread which contained the gem "Now we have the horses at the water, how do we make them drink" or something to that effect. Do nothing was the outcome of that:mad:

Before we should start critising other organisations maybe we should have a good look at ourselves.

I understand where your coming from - but people will always be critical , I guess its in the way they express their criticism is whats at issue.

Ive replied to the guy that I assume runs the site. My comment was in relation to the design, not designed to attack credibility or otherwise. I think the site is text heavy and remarkably deficient in terms of graphics and images for appealing to a target audience that likes visual stimulation ....graphics and images?

When you say "we" ? I dont really have a history here on the board so cant comment much, I guess there is/was a collective apathy at organising things? I thought this place was pretty active actually, walk abouts, year books etc etc