Why is the LGBT so small in UCD

ciaran29391

I was just wondering, why is the UCD LGBT so small?. I'm a member of it, but i dont go to any of the events. This is mainly because most of them are stereotypical. And i don't go for the stereotypes.

Is this the reason for the society being small?

Whats your opinion?

RandolphEsq

It could be that, or else it's because the events are stereotypical like you said?

Raphael

Possibly it's because only a fraction of the people who join big socs will join LGBT, due to it being something of a niche interest.

ciaran29391

well then since they have become so alienated from people, who are normal and are gay, rather than people who are all about gay.. aka overly camp/overly butch...
Would it be a good idea to start up a new soc? like the UCDHSOC, ucd homosexual society lol.
It's just that its hard to meet other normal gay people as they're not easily spotted in the crowd.

dajaffa

It's actually fairly big on paper, somewhere in the region of 300 members afaik. Active membership is big enough too I think, there were a lot of people at the AGM last year anyway. Maybe if you think they should be doing something different you could e-mail the auditor and ask, or email the SU LGBT Officer who will be organising a number of things after Christmas. They're both very nice and approachable.

KeyLimePie

ciaran29391 wrote: »

I was just wondering, why is the UCD LGBT so small?. I'm a member of it, but i dont go to any of the events. This is mainly because most of them are stereotypical. And i don't go for the stereotypes.

Is this the reason for the society being small?

Whats your opinion?

well.....when I messaged them about meeting times I got no reply back off facebook so maybe that's one reason for them being so small

ciaran29391

dajaffa wrote: »

It's actually fairly big on paper, somewhere in the region of 300 members afaik. Active membership is big enough too I think, there were a lot of people at the AGM last year anyway. Maybe if you think they should be doing something different you could e-mail the auditor and ask, or email the SU LGBT Officer who will be organising a number of things after Christmas. They're both very nice and approachable.

Its not that they don't have many events, they do! its just that there's no gay people in it that don't fit the stereotype!.
They fight for equality and try to stamp out the stereotyping in their work, but most of they themselves are stereotypes....:rolleyes:
The point i'm trying to get across is that there is no non sterotypical gays in it. I'm gay for a reason, i like MEN, not men who act like women.
That sounds kind of harsh, but i mean it in an observant way

rainbow kirby

ciaran29391 wrote: »

there is no non sterotypical gays in it.

Wouldn't agree with that.

Extrasupervery

I considered joining but uh...didn't. Don't know much about it really. They should pimp themselves more.

ciaran29391

rainbow kirby wrote: »

Wouldn't agree with that.

ok, let me rephrase, there are some non stereotypical, but the majority appear to fit the stereotype.

Extrasupervery

^ Good for them.

Notorious

ciaran29391 wrote: »

I was just wondering, why is the UCD LGBT so small?. I'm a member of it, but i dont go to any of the events...

Is this the reason for the society being small?

Maybe because a lot of members don't go to events?

BlueLepreachaun

ciaran29391 wrote: »

I was just wondering, why is the UCD LGBT so small?. I'm a member of it, but i dont go to any of the events. This is mainly because most of them are stereotypical. And i don't go for the stereotypes.

Is this the reason for the society being small?

Whats your opinion?

Most societies have a gap between their membership on paper and active members. If you don't go to any of the events how do you know they are small?

ciaran29391 wrote: »

Its not that they don't have many events, they do! its just that there's no gay people in it that don't fit the stereotype!.
They fight for equality and try to stamp out the stereotyping in their work, but most of they themselves are stereotypes....:rolleyes:
The point i'm trying to get across is that there is no non sterotypical gays in it. I'm gay for a reason, i like MEN, not men who act like women.
That sounds kind of harsh, but i mean it in an observant way

I agree with that in terms of gay "community" generally, but I don't nessicarily think its a fair criticism of these guys at least not this year which is all I can base my opinion on.

I went to a meeting for the first time last week, and I found them to be a reasonably mixed group.
The girls were not steriotypical, and though one or two of the lads were campish they weren't the in your face annoying camp and seemed really sound, and thats the diffrence, if someones a bit camp leave them to it, so what, your just not attracted to them, long as they're not an annoying loudmouth (plenty of str8 camp annoying loutmouths its not just a gay thing)
One of them seemed surprised I was wearing a sports jersey that threw me a bit, but he was good lookin so he gets away with it. :cool:

Its not the fault of people who are more steriotypical that non-steriotypical people don't go.

Too many non steriotypical people dont have the balls to come out of the ****ing closet, if they did we'd have a lot less problems, they have sex with lads then brag to their mates about how many (imaginary) girls they shagged to overcompensate all the while terrified their mates will find out, its a classic pattern, and the fears 90% unjustified, my mates were fine with it, even lads i knew I'd shared a locker room with in the past didn't give a rats ass, our generation generally doens't, and if they do ...**** um.


The auditor is a bit slow in responding all rite a second email i sent never got a reply a week later, but again thats not uncommon in UCD societies (the ComedySoc website hasn't been updated since 2006 depsite the society still being active...I don't think the C&E even have a website anymore)

Cubscout

I really regret not joining this, I have no gay friends at all(let alone in UCD), feel kind of alienated I suppose. I don't care for stereotypes really, I am just kicking myself for not availing of LGBT society.:mad:

BlueLepreachaun

If your still in UCD why can't you join it now?

Cubscout

I don't know the event listings so I never get to know when something is on.

BlueLepreachaun

I don't know the event listings so I never get to know when something is on.

Sorted....

A coffee morning is basically sitting around chatting about random **** the same way you do with your mates hanging around any other part of college.

Monday 23rd Nov: Irish Coffee/ Christmas cake afternoon 12-3 in the Blue Room.

Wednesday 25th Nov: Coffee morning from 10-12 in Meeting Room 1+2 in the student center

Friday 27th Nov: UCD LGBT Christmas Party. Astra Hall from 8:30-9:45 then off somwhere I don't know where


The blue room is upstarrs on the way to the health service, you'll see it just ask at desk where it is.

Boston

Here is their event calender and facebook group.

Handsome Bob

I'm not sure but I remember reading an article in one of the college papers a few years back with someone who was a member, he that it is quite cliquey and about "the beautiful people" and that he felt alienated. Maybe people get that impression when they join and don't turn up again. It would explain why they are big on paper but not that big with actual active people.

BlueLepreachaun

LZ5by5 wrote: »

I'm not sure but I remember reading an article in one of the college papers a few years back with someone who was a member, he that it is quite cliquey and about "the beautiful people" and that he felt alienated. Maybe people get that impression when they join and don't turn up again. It would explain why they are big on paper but not that big with actual active people.

Half of 1st years get that impression of the entire college, its sadly horrably predictable, I've lost count of the amount of people I've tried to convince that its' not like that. People get that impression, then they're scared off but most of the time its just that: an impression, or more like an assumption, some people all the need to see is a cantebury logo or blond hair (on guys or girls) and bam they start making hoardes and hoardes of assumptions about people being assholes.
Then the idea that its a clique becomes a self fullfilling prophecy because they withdraw and don't mix.

SarahChambers

Look, I don't want to appear homophobic, I really am not a homophobe. Gay people should not be discriminated against in society, but I don't think there shouldn't be a gay society in UCD, a predominantly Catholic university.

BlueLepreachaun

SarahChambers wrote: »

Look, I don't want to appear homophobic, I really am not a homophobe. Gay people should not be discriminated against in society, but I don't think there shouldn't be a gay society in UCD, a predominantly Catholic university.

:D:D:D:D:D:D oh...oh man I think I just pissed myself I was laughin so hard at that..

Handsome Bob

SarahChambers wrote: »

Look, I don't want to appear homophobic, I really am not a homophobe. Gay people should not be discriminated against in society, but I don't think there shouldn't be a gay society in UCD, a predominantly Catholic university.

Whut?

rainbow kirby

SarahChambers wrote: »

Look, I don't want to appear homophobic, I really am not a homophobe. Gay people should not be discriminated against in society, but I don't think there shouldn't be a gay society in UCD, a predominantly Catholic university.

Notorious

SarahChambers wrote: »

Gay people should not be discriminated against in society, but I don't think there shouldn't be a gay society in UCD, a predominantly Catholic university.

If the gheys weren't allowed have a society, wouldn't that be discrimination?

Obvious contradiction is obvious.

SarahChambers

Notorious wrote: »

If the gheys weren't allowed have a society, wouldn't that be discrimination?

Obvious contradiction is obvious.

Yes, I said but, which would indicate that the statement which follows is a special case.

BlueLepreachaun

A legion of mary guy stopped me an my mate on the concourse at UCD one day and suggested we join, the poor guy could not have picked two less worthy recruits, a homo and a str8 manwhore.


Check out the catholic style skirts on the girls in the student bar, and the catholic style tight tshirts on the lads, its all very catholic, I'm sure they're not trying to get laid but just...tempting themselves to test their commitment.

SarahChambers wrote: »

Yes, I said but, which would indicate that the statement which follows is a special case.

Religous fundamentalists have socieites too, they're just not very popular, so everyone is catered for you see

Boston

SarahChambers wrote: »

Look, I don't want to appear homophobic, I really am not a homophobe. Gay people should not be discriminated against in society, but I don't think there shouldn't be a gay society in UCD, a predominantly Catholic university.

A lot of UCD societies don't adhere to the catholic ethos. There's a Muslim society for example. Just because the majority are one way doesn't mean the various minorities cannot be catered for. The Muslim society has no more an effect on Catholics then the LGBT soc, it just not a part of their life.

SarahChambers

Boston wrote: »

A lot of UCD societies don't adhere to the catholic ethos. There's a Muslim society for example. Just because the majority are one way doesn't mean the various minorities cannot be catered for. The Muslim society has no more an effect on Catholics then the LGBT soc, it just not a part of their life.

That is a good point. I think I may have been wrong actually. Sorry to anyone I offended I didn't think it through. I really am not homophobic and I am not actually religious myself.

BlueLepreachaun

Boston wrote: »

A lot of UCD societies don't adhere to the catholic ethos. There's a Muslim society for example. Just because the majority are one way doesn't mean the various minorities cannot be catered for. The Muslim society has no more an effect on Catholics then the LGBT soc, it just not a part of their life.

A lot don't? I can't think of any that do!

Don't tell me the B&L, C&E have a catholic ethos!
Unless Dramasoc has one, I've never ventured behind that desk under the stairs there might be a cathedral in there behind those black doors for all I know...

..I don't think GameSocs dungeons and dragons games count as catholic, in fact thats probably considerd pagan....erm...
..L&H don't count as catholic unless obnoxiousness is a sacrament

...FilmSoc might have shown Jesus of Nazerath once...though it's 9 hours long and the attention span of the average UCD student is 30 seconds so probably not....

...GermanSoc are probably prods....

.....I doubt the Islamic Society is big on Jesus....

....so apart from the St Vincent De Paul and Christian Union I don't think any are catholic.


I'd doubt theres more than a handful out of the 18,000 student body that attend church weekly anyway, and our weekend antics are definitly not christian (some are more like Rome in jesus time tho..thats...KINDA christian)

That is a good point. I think I may have been wrong actually. Sorry to anyone I offended I didn't think it through. I really am not homophobic and I am not actually religious myself.

Like the taxi driver that says DA POLES and DA BLACKS are takin over...I'm not racist now!

Boston

BlueLepreachaun wrote: »

Like the taxi driver that says DA POLES and DA BLACKS are takin over...I'm not racist now!

You can't be going around calling every one whose ignorant of the realities of LGBT issues a homophobe. Especially when they've just taken on board the points you've made and adjusted their attitude. It's counter productive.

BlueLepreachaun

Boston wrote: »

You can't be going around calling every one whose ignorant of the realities of LGBT issues a homophobe. Especially when they've just taken on board the points you've made and adjusted their attitude. It's counter productive.

I was joking, relax.
I also didn't call anyone a homophobe.

SarahChambers

BlueLepreachaun wrote: »

Like the taxi driver that says DA POLES and DA BLACKS are takin over...I'm not racist now!

No, that is quiet different, I am not part of the group which I was trying to defend, and anyway I recanted the statement, going after me after I have done that is just sad.

Boston

No you didn't call her a homophobe, you just compared her to a racist. You may be joking but to someone reading your post it looked like you were giving someone a kicking simply because they had the decency to apologise. Keeping in mind that the thread is about the UCD LGBT society and you appear to be speaking on their behalf, that's pretty poor form.

BlueLepreachaun

Jesus relax folks, I'm not speaking on anyones behalf, if you'd read the posts before looking for an excuse to get offended you'd see I only have been to one meetng, I'm not even a member.
You don't know anything about me or my views on LGBT issues, in fact I'd venture my views are probably closer to Sarahs than yours, so enough portraying me as some kinda gay millitant ready to pound people into hte ground for expressing a diffrent opinion.

SarahChambers wrote: »

No, that is quiet different, I am not part of the group which I was trying to defend, and anyway I recanted the statement, going after me after I have done that is just sad.

It was a joke and not intended to offend, I thought the cliche of the taxi driver saying "im not x not BUT" was well known.

Why do people on message boards alwyas take themselves way too seriously...

SarahChambers

BlueLepreachaun wrote: »

Jesus relax folks, I'm not speaking on anyones behalf, if you'd read the posts before looking for an excuse to get offended you'd see I only have been to one meetng, I'm not even a member.
You don't know anything about me or my views on LGBT issues, in fact I'd venture my views are probably closer to Sarahs than yours, so enough portraying me as some kinda gay millitant ready to pound people into hte ground for expressing a diffrent opinion.



It was a joke and not intended to offend, I thought the cliche of the taxi driver saying "im not x not BUT" was well known.

Why do people on message boards alwyas take themselves way too seriously...

Well it was very offensive to me, that is why I took it seriously. I respect all groups, christians, gay community, blacks, whites etc. and that is why I made the first statement, as well as that it is why I recanted it when I realised the huge error I had made in my thinking.

BlueLepreachaun

You didn't appear to respect all groups at first if you think that a group of people should not be setting up in a University just because of a group of other peoples religion, you'd never hear me suggesting the Christian Union should not be allowed to set up etc

But you were thinking out loud, we all do it, so lets not make a big thing out of it

I generally operate on the harm principle when deciding what I think should and shoudn't be allowed, I find it a good guide that lets everyone do their thing without interference:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harm_principle

That the only purpose for which power can be rightfully exercised over any member of a civilized community, against his will, is to prevent harm to others

...in other words if someones not harming or interfering with the corrisponding rights of another, they should be free to do as they please, the beauty of this idea is it allows a gay society to get up as wel as the Legion of Mary, despite them being in polar opposition to each other.

Boston

BlueLepreachaun wrote: »

Jesus relax folks, I'm not speaking on anyones behalf, if you'd read the posts before looking for an excuse to get offended you'd see I only have been to one meetng, I'm not even a member.
You don't know anything about me or my views on LGBT issues, in fact I'd venture my views are probably closer to Sarahs than yours, so enough portraying me as some kinda gay millitant ready to pound people into hte ground for expressing a diffrent opinion.

It was a joke and not intended to offend, I thought the cliche of the taxi driver saying "im not x not BUT" was well known.

Why do people on message boards alwyas take themselves way too seriously...

Offended? Not in the least. It's merely paints a bad picture.

BlueLepreachaun

:rolleyes:...whatever

Boston

I don't know where the impression came from that the members where self obsessed, obnoxious and offensive came from.

mloc

SarahChambers wrote: »

I don't think there shouldn't be a gay society in UCD, a predominantly Catholic university.

Without diving in the whole religion/atheism thing, I think it's fair to say that UCD is, for the most part, a Catholic university by name only, similar to many of its students.

While I've no problem with a church on campus, or other religious centres, I'm not a fan of mixing education and religion, at any level.

BlueLepreachaun

Boston wrote: »

I don't know where the impression came from that the members where self obsessed, obnoxious and offensive came from.

Who said that?

mloc wrote: »

Without diving in the whole religion/atheism thing, I think it's fair to say that UCD is, for the most part, a Catholic university by name only, similar to many of its students.

While I've no problem with a church on campus, or other religious centres, I'm not a fan of mixing education and religion, at any level.

One of the chaplans handles a lot of stuff but hes also a sudent advisor and hes' really good at his job, apart from that there isn't any mixing of it.

The church on campus is miltidenominational as far as I know, diffrent religions use it at diffrent times.

Kournikova

I was going to join, but then didn't.

I fear I conform to the stereotype above But whatever.

fillefatale

I have friends who are members and it all seems very stereotypical to be honest, I'd feel alienated - some of the members seem to be small minded, like purely gay issues is all they are concerned about, fair enough, but open your mind to what's going on outside the gay cliqué too, or else you are just pigeonholing yourself and prospective members.

El Siglo

SarahChambers wrote: »

Look, I don't want to appear homophobic, I really am not a homophobe. Gay people should not be discriminated against in society, but I don't think there shouldn't be a gay society in UCD, a predominantly Catholic university.

Firstly, nobody cares what you think or whether you're "not a homophobe".
Secondly, how exactly did you get into this "Catholic university" of yours? Was it like collect twenty tayto packets and you get into UCD?

I'm not even going to bother stating where I'm coming from on this matter but arguing the whole Catholic makeup of UCD is like arguing the Protestant makeup of Trinity, it's an absurd judegement to make in this day and age. Religion means nothing in universities now, just as sexuality and sexual preference means nothing in the running of the place and that's the way it should stay. However this doesn't mean religious groups can't be catered for, they can, just like LGBT groups can be catered for through the provision of facilities for amenities.

RandolphEsq

El Siglo wrote: »

Firstly, nobody cares what you think or whether you're "not a homophobe".
Secondly, how exactly did you get into this "Catholic university" of yours? Was it like collect twenty tayto packets and you get into UCD?

I'm not even going to bother stating where I'm coming from on this matter but arguing the whole Catholic makeup of UCD is like arguing the Protestant makeup of Trinity, it's an absurd judegement to make in this day and age. Religion means nothing in universities now, just as sexuality and sexual preference means nothing in the running of the place and that's the way it should stay. However this doesn't mean religious groups can't be catered for, they can, just like LGBT groups can be catered for through the provision of facilities for amenities.

That poster retracted that post rendering your rant invalid

El Siglo

RandolphEsq wrote: »

That poster retracted that post rendering your rant invalid

Fair enough. I too will retract accordingly. Is that alright?

lebowskilite

Couldn't tell you how I know this but the SU LGBTRO's email is lgbt@ucdsu.ie

If you're struggling to fit in in college because of your sexuality, he can help. It's confidential, etc., as well.
First off you'll find that the soc. isn't all that stereotypical. There's often a pesky str8 couple in there of late (shock!) and apart from that people are just talking about how much they hate exams, etc., and stupid things they did when they were drunk. That isn't stereotypical of gays, it's stereotypical of students.

If it does ostracise anybody, it's mature LGBT students, who may find the conversation annoying and perhaps justifiably so.

As for it being small, about 60 ppl voted at the last AGM. The L+H AGM the year before last was about that size.

As for the fem boys and the butch girls, I can't see this being a reason not to go. It's fairly annoying to hear this as a reason to dislike or feel uncomfortable around someone. It's usually a prejudice based on seeing gender lines being crossed, which is more often then not the route cause of homophobia. As an LGBT Society, you should suspect that gender lines won't be considered an issue by those who run it.

If you want to set up an alternative society on the grounds that you don't like gender lines being crossed, you'd be just as justified to set up a Men's Only Something Club or a Straights' only something club. It's just another form of prejudice that we need to overcome.

But you're obviously well entitled to your opinion, and I'm sure the SU officer won't discriminate on those grounds. The LGBT Soc committee this year has both a Men's and a Women's Officer, neither of which fit into either one of those stereotypes.

I do take the point about stereotypes, though. You may feel uncomfortable being labelled in the same manner. However, the society just isn't that stereotypical. Neither is the SU officer. I'd also like to point out that the only reason those "stereotypes" are considered to be such, is because it was they who came out of the closet first, and it was they who fought for and secured the rights gay people now enjoy. This is because they find it harder to hide, and require ore courage simply to exist. After they've found this courage political activism or even more vocal visibility is much easier to take on. It's no coincidence that the two loudest politicos in Irish gay politics are the self-proclaimed fairy David Norris and the legendary drag queen Panti (Rory O'Neill).

That email again, lgbt@ucdsu.ie

BlueLepreachaun

Assuming the (incorrect) premise that they are all steriotypical, we've had about 4 people say they don't wanna join for that reason...do you not see the obvious paradox in that? If all of you had joined the issue of all being steriotypical would not exist...

RandolphEsq

El Siglo wrote: »

Fair enough. I too will retract accordingly. Is that alright?

Kiss it

/presents ass

El Siglo

RandolphEsq wrote: »

Kiss it

/presents ass

Em....:rolleyes: