Check out this from Mexico, and we thought all the gun murders in Dublin were bad...

Palmerstown_guy

Have any of you checked this from BBC today?

Dublin city may have been branded as having the worst gun murders in Europe, but this place has the highest gangland gun murders in the world...just some perspective!

(disturbing images)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8362459.stm

My name is URL

Yeah, but at least the weather's good

Placid_Casual

A Latin American city has a worse murder rate than Dublin? Who'd have thunk it?

Mc Love

That video gave me chills!

over 2000 deaths this year.. jesus christ that's crazy..

wudangclan

...that's the continued effect of giving psychotic criminals lordship of a multi-billion dollar industry.

Lirange

My name is URL wrote: »

Yeah, but at least the weather's good

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aZD6tRvimM

There was also a spate of kidnappings and rapes of woman factory workers which went largely unreported in the press. They made a film about it starring Jennifer Lopez but it went straight to video and nobody saw it.

Lirange

There was a Minnie Driver film about Juarez a few years back as well.

Photi

Read 2666 by Roberto Bolano. It's set in his fictionalised version of Ciudad Juarez, called Santa Teresa in the book, and a major recurring theme of it is the hundreds of murders of young women in and around the city since the nineties. It's horrifying.

FouxDaFaFa

[quote=[Deleted User];63038908]There was also a spate of kidnappings and rapes of woman factory workers which went largely unreported in the press.[/quote]

Found out about these murders and kidnappings of women a few weeks ago, found it very disturbing and it's still going on.
The drug cartel murders seem to be well reported but since a big Amnesty campaign a few years ago involving Jennifer Lopez the murders of women seem to be slipping under the radar.

john-joe

Swine Flu , Now murders! what good has come out of mexico :mad:....


Oh yeah.... This;

http://cm1.theinsider.com/media/0/41/43/salma-hayek-cleavage-3.0.0.0x0.400x532.jpeg


Meow! :D

Reindeer

FouxDaFaFa wrote: »

Found out about these murders and kidnappings of women a few weeks ago, found it very disturbing and it's still going on.
The drug cartel murders seem to be well reported but since a big Amnesty campaign a few years ago involving Jennifer Lopez the murders of women seem to be slipping under the radar.

There is no slipping under the radar. It is a well-known problem in The States. Euro news just isn't reporting it.

I spent a few days in Juarez not too long ago. The nicer areas are OK, just avoid being out at night.

Bandit12

Thing is most people just don't give a **** once they have access to coke,gear,hash whatever. They know deep down the human effects of the drug wars but once if does'nt cross into their neighbourhoods then so what.

Palmerstown_guy

"Thing is most people just don't give a **** once they have access to coke,gear,hash whatever. They know deep down the human effects of the drug wars but once if does'nt cross into their neighbourhoods then so what."

Well that maybe true for some uneducated folk, not saying you are... but that sorry attitude has to change and change fast.

Blazer

Who cares about Mexico...Dublin's a shíthole anyway....nothing but murdering scum and junkies living there..:p

Palmerstown_guy

Are you happy now after saying that?

Captain Havoc

So the woman has just watched her husband get shot and the reporter decides to interview her, what a cock!

Biggins

Shocking. Coldly shooting a 7 year old child in the head!!!
Don't tell me such scum don't deserve the electric chair!

Blazer

Biggins wrote: »

Shocking. Coldly shooting a 7 year old child in the head!!!
Don't tell me such scum don't deserve the electric chair!

If only...of course we'd have all those liberal muppets telling us these people are human too etc.. to me these peopel are vermin and deserve to be treated likewise,.

star.chaser

wow, that place even makes the north of ireland during the troubles look like disneyland.

Overheal

Palmerstown_guy wrote: »

Are you happy now after saying that?

Of course. Anything to deny Ireland has a problem.

spitfireIRL

is this really a surprise to ye?? this has been going on in mexico for years.

Prof.Badass

Bandit12 wrote: »

Thing is most people just don't give a **** once they have access to coke,gear,hash whatever. They know deep down the human effects of the drug wars but once if does'nt cross into their neighbourhoods then so what.

The worst is those cunts who don't give a **** once they get voted in next time around. They know deep down the human effects of the drug wars but if it gets them voted in, so what?

0% of the moral blame lies with the drug user. It's not drugs that are causing these problems, it's their illegality. Do governments think they're playing a game of chicken or something? Hold out for long enough and let the death-toll pile up and eventually the population will be guilted into doing what they want?

In such a moral standoff it is the government who should set the example. They're far more organised and are actually paid to take action on things. If the government refuse to act morally, what makes you think the population will?

The drug war has been lost. Deal with it and stop ****ing up innocent people's lives.

prendy

vinylmesh wrote: »

The worst is those cunts who don't give a **** once they get voted in next time around. They know deep down the human effects of the drug wars but if it gets them voted in, so what?

0% of the moral blame lies with the drug user. It's not drugs that are causing these problems, it's their illegality. Do governments think they're playing a game of chicken or something? Hold out for long enough and let the death-toll pile up and eventually the population will be guilted into doing what they want?

In such a moral standoff it is the government who should set the example. They're far more organised and are actually paid to take action on things. If the government refuse to act morally, what makes you think the population will?

The drug war has been lost. Deal with it and stop ****ing up innocent people's lives.

i keep looking for the sarcasm but cant find it? Seriously?

wudangclan

vinylmesh wrote: »

The worst is those cunts who don't give a **** once they get voted in next time around. They know deep down the human effects of the drug wars but if it gets them voted in, so what?

0% of the moral blame lies with the drug user. It's not drugs that are causing these problems, it's their illegality. Do governments think they're playing a game of chicken or something? Hold out for long enough and let the death-toll pile up and eventually the population will be guilted into doing what they want?

In such a moral standoff it is the government who should set the example. They're far more organised and are actually paid to take action on things. If the government refuse to act morally, what makes you think the population will?

The drug war has been lost. Deal with it and stop ****ing up innocent people's lives.

+100

Pace2008

prendy wrote: »

i keep looking for the sarcasm but cant find it? Seriously?

The onus should be on the government to find pragmatic solutions to pressing societal problems. It's obvious that people are going to keep using drugs, so the powers that be have to accept this fact and employ harm minimisation measures other than 'Just Say No.'

cojomo2

jerseyeire wrote: »

So the woman has just watched her husband get shot and the reporter decides to interview her, what a cock!

was just thinking the exact same thing..

Takeshi_Kovacs

Here is a picture segment Boston big picture did on UN drug report... a lot of bewildering and ghastly photos are mainly from this part of Mexico, showing effects of drugwar and gangland conflicts.

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2009/10/2009_un_world_drug_report.html

vinylbomb

prendy wrote: »

i keep looking for the sarcasm but cant find it? Seriously?

I think the point that the previous post is getting at is that using laws to attempt to curb human impulses don't work in the long term.
Some people will always wish to alter their mindset or "reality" temporarily as a release (and I say this without meaning it to be derogatory at all).

If you look at the prohibition of alcohol as a case study it failed miserably.
As such the argument for legalizing drugs to some degree makes sense.

megadodge

wudangclan wrote: »

...that's the continued effect of giving psychotic criminals lordship of a multi-billion dollar industry.

You're obviously referring to bankers ??

The_Kew_Tour

I am not saying Ireland is safe I have been attacked once and lucky to have got away from few guys, but I have to say Ireland is one the most safest countries to walk any big cities herelike dublin ad cork.

I have been to every continent and about 65-70 countries and let me tell you, you be glad to live here when you see some the things in other countries that happen.

Not all I know but must murders in this country are normally from one criminal to another.

junkyard

Drugs, poverty and widespread political corruption, won't be long now before this is us............

Ciaran500

Takeshi_Kovacs wrote: »

Here is a picture segment Boston big picture did on UN drug report... a lot of bewildering and ghastly photos are mainly from this part of Mexico, showing effects of drugwar and gangland conflicts.

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2009/10/2009_un_world_drug_report.html

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2009/03/mexicos_drug_war.html

Palmerstown_guy

"In December of 2006, Mexico's new President Felipe Calderón declared war on the drug cartels, reversing earlier government passiveness."

Thanks for the link, excellent report!

Only if the Irish government would do the same in our Dublin ganglands!

Overheal

Palmerstown_guy wrote: »

"In December of 2006, Mexico's new President Felipe Calderón declared war on the drug cartels, reversing earlier government passiveness."

Thanks for the link, excellent report!

Only if the Irish government would do the same in our Dublin ganglands!

:rolleyes:

You've clearly got The Whole Picture.

But sure if thats what you want for Ireland..

Daroxtar

Funny how the huge increase in killings coincided with the $1.4billion given by the US government to Mexico to stamp out drug cartels. No surprises that that cash injection is left out of the wikipedia list. We really are not getting the whole picture at all.

Overheal

Daroxtar wrote: »

Funny how the huge increase in killings coincided with the $4billion given by the US government to Mexico to stamp out drug cartels. No surprises that that cash injection is left out of the wikipedia list. We really are not getting the whole picture at all.

well the wonderful thing about wiki's is not that their tops are made out of rubber or their bottoms are made from a spring; but you can always Add New Information and Cite Your Sources for the betterment of us all.

Palmerstown_guy

Sorry but I will never ever trust wikipedia, a site that anybody can edit.

It's simply the McDonalds of information.

Overheal

What dont you want to believe about it? That the drug war declaration was foolhardy and it led to bloodshed on the streets, involving huge corrupt sections of the police forces and civilian and guerilla warfare?

Frankly unless you can prove that the information is wrong, its Ad Hominem.

Virtually all of the events listed in that timeline are cited. Feel free to follow the links. Here is just one of 97 such citations.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601086&sid=aiBNfIX2wea4&refer=latin_america

Palmerstown_guy

I just don't like Wikipedia, anyone can edit it....I don't trust it.

Anyway....Mexico city is worse for murders than Dublin city, isn't that the point of the post, we should take things into perspective, we're not that bad at 20 murders per year even if the press say we're the worst in Europe :rolleyes:

Pace2008

Palmerstown_guy wrote: »

I just don't like Wikipedia, anyone can edit it....I don't trust it.

Anyone can edit it, but the more important articles are heavily moderated (and sometimes semi-protected) and any malicious changes or unverified claims are quickly removed. As the above poster mentioned, the articles are as reliable as their sources, which are frequently solid and numerous. It's a fantastic source of information and a good place to start research on almost any topic.

Hendrix89

Heading to Acapulco early next year. There was recently a large gun battle there at a beach resort between drug cartels and the police! 18 deaths was the outcome :eek:

Pretty scary to say the least.

vinylbomb

Mexico is fairly safe in the south, but from my time there talking to people that had traveled down, the farther north you go from Guadalahara the ropier it gets (Monterrey is meant to be lovely though, and an exception to the violence, as is the southern Baja peninsula).

Gorgeous country, and exceptionally friendly people - I'd go so far as to say almost like the Irish with a tan! Its not hard as a tourist to avoid all the sh*t that goes on there, any local will set you straight and say where is safe to go, once you stick to that you're fine

Overheal

Hendrix89 wrote: »

Heading to Acapulco early next year. There was recently a large gun battle there at a beach resort between drug cartels and the police! 18 deaths was the outcome

Pretty scary to say the least.

Google St. Patricks battalion.

Flash your Paddy-Port. They love you over there.

Palmerstown_guy wrote: »

I just don't like Wikipedia, anyone can edit it....I don't trust it.

If thats all you have to defend your position with :rolleyes:

I think we can agree that declaring war on the Crime Organizations operating in Ireland is not exactly the brightest way to go about it.

Anyway....Mexico city is worse for murders than Dublin city, isn't that the point of the post, we should take things into perspective, we're not that bad at 20 murders per year even if the press say we're the worst in Europe :rolleyes:

And Saudi Arabia and Sharia Law commit unthinkable acts against people for slights: Does it make the situation at Guantanamo Bay any less favorable?

Similarly pointing to Mexico and the hundreds dead and the rolling heads in the streets - Does it honestly make it any less necessary for Ireland to look at itself and realize it has a growing violence problem that needs to be nipped in the bud?

Palmerstown_guy

The thing about wikipedia, it may be moderated, but sometimes it may take hours if not days before any moderation to occur. And please note it's created by non-professionals, so that is not good for immediate verifiability. I stick by my point it is the McDonalds of the info age and unreliable. But that's my opinion, so let's leave it at that

"Does it honestly make it any less necessary for Ireland to look at itself and realize it has a growing violence problem that needs to be nipped in the bud?

Yes! Ireland and especially Dublin city needs to assertive action on its drug gangland murders. 20 years ago we didn't have 20 murders on the streets of Dublin per year...what happened? It just didn't happen for no reason and we have to ask ourselves as a nation why and how can we prevent it from getting much much worse. Passiveness is what we DON'T need!

wudangclan

Palmerstown_guy wrote: »

The thing about wikipedia, it may be moderated, but sometimes it may take hours if not days before any moderation to occur. And please note it's created by non-professionals, so that is not good for immediate verifiability. I stick by my point it is the McDonalds of the info age and unreliable. But that's my opinion, so let's leave it at that

"Does it honestly make it any less necessary for Ireland to look at itself and realize it has a growing violence problem that needs to be nipped in the bud?

Yes! Ireland and especially Dublin city needs to assertive action on its drug gangland murders. 20 years ago we didn't have 20 murders on the streets of Dublin per year...what happened? It just didn't happen for no reason and we have to ask ourselves as a nation why and how can we prevent it from getting much much worse. Passiveness is what we DON'T need!

Have you considered the option that if the drug industry was legalised and moved away from the hands of psychotic criminals that the majoriy of these killings would cease overnight (also there would be less deaths resulting from the impurities in drugs and through better drug-use education).

Palmerstown_guy

"Have you considered the option that if the drug industry was legalised and moved away from the hands of psychotic criminals that the majoriy of these killings would cease overnight (also there would be less deaths resulting from the impurities in drugs and through better drug-use education)."

Yes. But I think it's unrealistic. Need to educate everyday folk who buy from these murderers, if you use illegal drugs you are on the murderers side.

Maybe more investigations by journalists would also help, there is not enough....journalists run scared here in Dublin because of what happened to Veronica Guerin. The drug dealing gangs are just laughing at us and have it their own way.

Pace2008

Palmerstown_guy wrote: »

Yes. But I think it's unrealistic. Need to educate everyday folk who buy from these murderers, if you use illegal drugs you are on the murderers side.

It's unrealistic to expect people to stop using drugs. Everyone and their grandmother already knows the drug trade is a bloody one. If there were legal outlets for obtaining psychoactives everyone would use them and cripple the gangs within months.

wudangclan

Palmerstown_guy wrote: »

Yes. But I think it's unrealistic. Need to educate everyday folk who buy from these murderers, if you use illegal drugs you are on the murderers side.

Maybe more investigations by journalists would also help, there is not enough....journalists run scared here in Dublin because of what happened to Veronica Guerin. The drug dealing gangs are just laughing at us and have it their own way.

I'm a regular user of certain illegal drugs.That's my choice and i use those drugs moderately and without causing harm to others.
Given the huge size of the demand for drugs and the potential profits to be made it's hardly surprising dangerous criminals have moved in to control the markets.This is a failing on behalf of the government (or governments) who perpetuate this situation wasting my tax money fighting an unwinnable war and who contribute to the deaths on our streets. (I offer as a different perspective with which to view the situation)

(also if you want to quote a post double- click on "quote" at the bottom right of the persons post and you get to reply with their post included)

Palmerstown_guy

"I'm a regular user of certain illegal drugs.That's my choice and i use those drugs moderately and without causing harm to others."

What!???Not directly but indirectly you are a big part of the problem! You are what's called the demand that keeps these murderers in business. You should be ashamed of yourself.