Summoned for non production of insurance & licence.....having already produced it!!

threebeards · 08-11-2009 4:57pm #1

I was pulled for speeding in August while driving my wifes car. No dispute on my part, I was driving too fast in a 60km zone and was rightly fined. As I was in my wifes car, I didn't have my licence with me so was told to produce within 10 days. I went into the station that very evening and produced it. Dealt with a Ban Garda, she took it, did whatever she needed to do and gave it back to me. Job done. Got the subsequent letter in the post looking for the €80 which I sent back the same day with payment. As far as I was concerned, that was the end of it.....until today.

Just had 2 of our finest Gardai at my front door with a summons for not producing my insurance & licence - WTF??? Was given a court date for Dec 2nd. I told them that I'd produced it already but they said it wasn't their problem. What can I do? I've already done what I was asked to do. Will they double the points if I do end up in court.

supersaint3 · 08-11-2009 5:08pm

bring your licence and insurance to court and talk to the prosecuting guard, if what you say is true then he should have it struck out of court for you just like that, but if he won't, swear in and explain to the judge that you did produce on whatever date at whatever station, I can't imagine you'd get convicted. Bring your receipt for the fine, that you've already paid, you'll be grand, mistakes can happen i guess.

Anan1 · 08-11-2009 5:11pm

I'd ring the station where you produced, see if you can find the name of the Garda you were talking to. If she could tell the other Garda you produced then he might agree to have the matter struck out without your having to appear in court.

cascade35 · 08-11-2009 5:14pm

My younger brother was taken to court for failing to produce his licence(he did produce it), judge listened to what he had to say,but still fined him 60e.
In an ideal world we should be given some sort of receipt or docket when we produce paperwork at a guarda station.
I doubt this mistake happens very often but it does seem to happen sometimes.

johndaman66 · 08-11-2009 5:18pm

supersaint3 wrote: »

bring your licence and insurance to court

I'm not sure would it necessairly even have to go this far. It might be worth seeking out your local Super Intendant and explaining the situation. it probably might help you along if you had the name of the Ban Garda that you produced your license and insurance to before approaching him.

B11gt00e · 08-11-2009 6:12pm

... the exact same thing happened to me a few years ago... I cleared it with garda a few minutes before court.

... I was driving a car belonging to another family member who lives at a different address to me... and I produced my documents at my station which is on the other side of the city from the station of the garda that asked for these.

... The summons can sometimes be linked to the car you were 'checked' in, while the documents that you produced at the station are linked to your own vehicle...

I'd say this happens a lot and you've nothing to worry about. As the summons is for December, it might be too late for them to reverse anything, and you'll have to show up on the day (I did and all - pain in the a**)... Most judges are happy enough even if you produce your documents to the guard there and then... A pain, but no costs, except your time...

... I was cross at the judge as I had to take a morning off work due to them being badly organised, and I let her know that...

All the best with this anyways.

CharlieCroker · 08-11-2009 6:18pm

Reciepts should be issued to EVERY driver who produces. I always give them.

The name of the Garda who summonsed you will be on it, get in contact with him/her and call into to station to meet them and explain the situation. Make sure you bring you documents with you. Also, make sure that you have your facts straight on exactly when and where you produced.

By rights, it should be on the system.

colm_mcm · 08-11-2009 6:24pm

My other half is up in court for not bringing her NCT into the station despite having done so. she knows another girl that this happened to as well. seems they don't keep records properly.

warm24 · 08-11-2009 8:28pm

youre goin to court mate but it will be a strike out so dont worry, it's just the man remiding you that he can mess with you anytime any where to'spite your best efforts to be an honest man, you did your bit but now you probably have to take the day off work, tell your boss that you must go to court right at the time when he's thinking of letting people go, this kind of crap goes on all the time,they dont care about peples situation.. messin with honest people, makin us dance, all it would have took for you not to go to court was the gardai to look at the station book, he did'nt, now you have to go to court and your time and taxpayers money is wasted... for nothing, what a load of bu;;sh;t, .... the unconsiousness in our leaders is almost unbearable.

Cuddlesworth · 08-11-2009 8:36pm

warm24 wrote: »

youre goin to court mate but it will be a strike out so dont worry, it's just the man remiding you that he can mess with you anytime any where to'spite your best efforts to be an honest man, you did your bit but now you probably have to take the day off work, tell your boss that you must go to court right at the time when he's thinking of letting people go, this kind of crap goes on all the time,they dont care about peples situation.. messin with honest people, makin us dance, all it would have took for you not to go to court was the gardai to look at the station book, he did'nt, now you have to go to court and your time and taxpayers money is wasted... for nothing, what a load of bu;;sh;t, .... the unconsiousness in our leaders is almost unbearable.

Fight da powa!! :rolleyes:

warm24 · 08-11-2009 8:52pm

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Fight da powa!! :rolleyes:

lol......nice...:D

lynchie · 09-11-2009 1:16am

B11gt00e wrote: »

... the exact same thing happened to me a few years ago... I cleared it with garda a few minutes before court.

... I was driving a car belonging to another family member who lives at a different address to me... and I produced my documents at my station which is on the other side of the city from the station of the garda that asked for these.

... The summons can sometimes be linked to the car you were 'checked' in, while the documents that you produced at the station are linked to your own vehicle...

I'd say this happens a lot and you've nothing to worry about. As the summons is for December, it might be too late for them to reverse anything, and you'll have to show up on the day (I did and all - pain in the a**)... Most judges are happy enough even if you produce your documents to the guard there and then... A pain, but no costs, except your time...

... I was cross at the judge as I had to take a morning off work due to them being badly organised, and I let her know that...

All the best with this anyways.

That's exactly what happens.. They dont seem to check pulse using your licence number or name.. They use the reg of the vehicle you were in and dont bother to realise that it may not be the vehicle your insurance is registered too. I too would make a point to the judge that its a waste of the courts time and your own time that mistakes like this still happen with a computerised system in place.

threebeards · 09-11-2009 12:14pm

Thanks guys for the advice. I've found out that the Guard who summoned me is working at 10 tonight so I'll go in and have a chat with him. I'll let you know how I get on.

AugustusMaximus · 09-11-2009 2:05pm

I think this thread is a lesson to all to get a receipt for producing anything at a Garda station.

I know I'll be asking for a receipt in any future instance.

TheNog · 09-11-2009 2:12pm

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

I think this thread is a lesson to all to get a receipt for producing anything at a Garda station.

I know I'll be asking for a receipt in any future instance.

Unfortunately there is no standard receipt that is issued. TBH I never heard of the receipt that Charlie spoke of but I am in favour of it.

masseyno9 · 09-11-2009 2:26pm

Agree with the idea of issuing a receipt on production of documents. I was going through a period of driving a van for work and my own car in the evenings and was stopped in the car when I had left the license in the van. Was told to produce, which I did and even asked did I need a receipt or anything. I was told no and thought it was a bit odd, but if thats the way they do things then who am I to question it.

Nothing ever came of it but it seems like a simple way to avoid wasting court time. If there was a standard receipt issued with simple details like name, date, documents produced (and any particulars like expiry dates, policy numbers etc), which is then signed by a garda and a station stamp at the bottom. This could also be somehow linked to the garda that requested the documents. Doesn't seem that complicated, especially when compared to making people take time off work, along with the judge and garda having their time wasted by a pointless case.

In the event of any conflict, the person in question can produce the receipt to the original garda who stopped them and the matter could be cleared up.

galwaytt · 09-11-2009 7:07pm

B11gt00e wrote: »

... .......I'd say this happens a lot and you've nothing to worry about. As the summons is for December, it might be too late for them to reverse anything, and you'll have to show up on the day (I did and all - pain in the a**)... Most judges are happy enough even if you produce your documents to the guard there and then... A pain, but no costs, except your time...

... I was cross at the judge as I had to take a morning off work due to them being badly organised, and I let her know that....

slightly off topic - but, pulled for doing 56 in a 50 in Portdrine years ago :rolleyes:, I duly attended Sixmilebridge courthouse and waited until about 15:00. Quite fun actually, some of the stuff I got to listen to. Anyhoo, I was one of 3 people pulled in the same place, same day. I travelled from Galway to attend (off work), and was suitably attired for the occasion. Of the 3, I was the only one who attended, Judge asked me how'd I plead, I said 'guilty', and asked the Garda if I'd been wearing a seatbelt, to which the Garda said I was, and he then asked me had I travelled down from Galway for the hearing that day, and I said I had, and he said right so, 'case dismissed'. I'm giving him kudos for the fact I'd learnt my lesson, wasn't acting the maggot on the road, and was suitably repentant. No fine, no endorsement.

Now, the other the other lads on the other hand, got fined the £60, and then the judge asked if they had had their seatbelts on........at least one, didn't, so Justice said, right, that's another £60 so ! Ho-Ho, dear day out and endorsements for those two boys.......

racso1975 · 09-11-2009 7:14pm

this happened to me before. Go to garda station. Ask for letter confirming that you produced on that date as they keep a record of all people who produce all you have to do is give the date you produced. Bring this letter to court and give to garda before the case and he'll strike it out

TheNog · 09-11-2009 7:41pm

racso1975 wrote: »

this happened to me before. Go to garda station. Ask for letter confirming that you produced on that date as they keep a record of all people who produce all you have to do is give the date you produced. Bring this letter to court and give to garda before the case and he'll strike it out

Problem is we dont issue letters. Best to talk with the guard who stopped you and he/she can then check

Turner · 09-11-2009 7:47pm

TheNog wrote: »

Unfortunately there is no standard receipt that is issued. TBH I never heard of the receipt that Charlie spoke of but I am in favour of it.

There is.

pm'ed.

lynchie · 09-11-2009 7:48pm

TheNog wrote: »

Problem is we dont issue letters. Best to talk with the guard who stopped you and he/she can then check

I got a printout of the pulse record of me producing licence and insurance before from my local garda station to use in court as proof. Not sure if its common to give out the prinout or not but the garda was obliging to help me out.

Turner · 09-11-2009 7:50pm

lynchie wrote: »

I got a printout of the pulse record of me producing licence and insurance before from my local garda station to use in court as proof. Not sure if its common to give out the prinout or not but the garda was obliging to help me out.

It is common, and what i was pm'ing TheNog about.

Maybe alot of members dont know pulse can create a receipt. Even has a place for the station stamp on it.

TheNog · 09-11-2009 7:57pm

Chief--- wrote: »

It is common, and what i was pm'ing TheNog about.

Maybe alot of members dont know pulse can create a receipt. Even has a place for the station stamp on it.

holy crap I never knew about it.

rebel.ranter · 09-11-2009 8:46pm

I was just thinking that if this ever arose one could draw up their own receipt & ask the Garda on duty to stamp it, but a print off from pulse is better.

A similar incident to the OP's situation happened to a friend of mine except the Garda on duty typed in the wrong reg on pulse! Que the start of a mess! These things happen & a chat with the Guards in question usually gets it solved. OP is doing the right thing.

threebeards · 09-11-2009 11:41pm

Lads, I went in to see the Guard a little while ago. In fairness to him he was sound. I showed him the summons and told him that I had already produced the documentation. He asked if I had the docs with me tonight, I did, so he took the details again and said he'll withdraw the charge on the court date. I asked him if I needed to turn up at the court but he said there's no need that I can forget about it now. I'm happy with that. Thanks for all your comments.

Seth Brundle · 10-11-2009 12:20am

did you get a receipt this time

threebeards · 10-11-2009 10:39am

kbannon wrote:

did you get a receipt this time

No, I ripped his shoulder badge off when he was distracted by the 4 guys in balaclavas with sawn off shotguns!!!!;)

warm24 · 10-11-2009 3:58pm

threebeards wrote: »

Lads, I went in to see the Guard a little while ago. In fairness to him he was sound. I showed him the summons and told him that I had already produced the documentation. He asked if I had the docs with me tonight, I did, so he took the details again and said he'll withdraw the charge on the court date. I asked him if I needed to turn up at the court but he said there's no need that I can forget about it now. I'm happy with that. Thanks for all your comments.

that's great to know, thank's

amg-slurp · 10-11-2009 8:36pm

Similar thing happened me a few years ago!

Was driving a car i had bought to sell, and had insurance transferred for the day to NCT it. Got stopped on way back from NCT at a random checkpoint, and was told to produce insurance etc within ten days . I produced the next day and all was well.......until i got a summons for not producing.

I called into the station where i produced and found it had been entered on pulse that i produced, but my details had not actually been inputted, human error.
I rang the Super. who had stopped me originally (who was stationed in the next town) and explained the situ..he assured me he would sort it on the court day.

Court day arrived and i and letter from insurance stating i had been covered, had all my paperwork, including Pulse print off.

Judge called me up (never so nervous and embarrassed in all my life!! lol) and conversation went something like this:

Judge: Why were you not insured?
Me: I was!
Judge :Have you proof?
Me:Yes ( and showed the Guard who had stopped me the paperwork)
Judge: Why did you not produce so?
Me: I did, and have proof i did, and i spoke to Mr.Guardaman about this a few days ago. (showed the guard the proof, and said i spoke to you about this already, he denied any such conversation took place)
Judge: Fine, you were insured and you produced.....but why no disc on display so?!
Me: I forgot, but i had my time to produce and i did, as ive proved.
Judge: So, forgetting is not a good enough excuse, €80 fine!!
Me: :-(

So, there are procedures in place if you dont have your disc displayed, and when the procedures are not followed correctly by the system, the system punishes you...nice!!

Also, because my disc would have had a different reg, should i display it?! or would that not be technically illegal?!

Hmm

Jo King · 10-11-2009 11:33pm

A disc does not have to be displayed for the first ten days the car is on cover. If you only transferred the insurance that day you did not have to have a valid disc on display.

Bits_n_Bobs · 11-11-2009 10:00am

Similar situation happened to me, produced everything etc and thought end of the matter. Several months down the line pile of summons arrive in the door and leaves me scratching my head as was certain had sorted everything at the local station.

Checked all the details, and found the guard in question had entered wrong date on the paperwork! Phoned guard in question and explained the situation to him, very dismissive attitude towards me even when I told him I had evidence of not even being in the country on the date he had written on the paperwork.

Thought f*ck this, and went and hired a nasty bugger of a barrister. The barrister said I should not of spoken to the guard at all, which was kind of news to me!

Anyways my day in court arrives, barrister tells me he is 'going to have a word with the guard' and I am sitting in the court feeling like a damn drug dealer or something. Case comes up, guard is in court (what a waste of his time, never mind my own!) and he has a big red head on him after his conversation with my nasty barrister. Barrister yacks on for 2/3 minutes, guard gets redder and redder head and judge flings it out of court.

So result...except;
a) it wasted my time
b) it cost me about €300 from what I can remember
c) it wasted the guards time
d) it wasted the courts time

Left a distinctly sour taste in my mouth regarding gardai in general as I was willing to show him perfect documentation (that was accepted in court) prooving that it was a mistake - and I totally accept mistakes can happen, but he was too arrogant to even entertain this. My advice - spend the (criminally high) fees on tooling yourself up with a legal expert.

Summoned for non production of insurance & licence.....having already produced it!!

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