Renault Laguna

reilig

We did a deal on a 09d pre registered laguna with 15km on it yesterday. Its a 1.5dci 110bhb Royale. It wasn't a case of wanting a new car, it was a case of needing one. The Mrs does a lot of miles travelling to and from work. she has a 08 1.4 d4d Toyota Auris and has just over 100,000 km on it in less than 2 years. It really wasn't the car that we thought it would be. It has become a little rattly - toyotas shouldn't do this in my experience. The biggest problem that we have is the safety of the car though. Because it is quite a high car, when you drive it on a windy day, it blows all over the place and you feel like you will be pushed off the road. She had a polo before this and never had this problem.

Anyway we went off to a friend of mine who owns a Renault garage but has got us any make of car that we wanted in the past with the hope of buying a new VW Golf. He had just got a load of these 09d lagunas - they were coming off the lorry when we arrived. We talked for a while and one of the workers came to the office with the key and he offered us a drive in one. Unbelievable drive in comparison to the Auris. A lot of power, much heavier on the road. Serious interior finish. The technical specs are way ahead of the auris - 61mpg, 110 bhp etc.

So after a bit of talking, he told us that he could do the car for us at €5k off the list price. that left the straight price at €23k. He offered us €12k for the auris. We did the deal at that. have to pay €11k next week.

Last week we priced a VW garage for a trade in against a 1.9 Golf and we would have to pay €12 1/2k in January with the Auris for a 10 golf.

Do you think we got a good enough deal. Bearing in mind that the new laguna has a 3 year 150kkm warranty and 30kkm service intervals?
We have had a Renault Megane before, but it was nothing like this car to drive. But it was reliable and never let us down - it was a better car than the Auris IMO.

Would love a few opinions on it - haven't paid any money yet so can still go back on it if we find that its a bad deal.

Thanks

BrianD3

So 23k in a straight deal and 11k with the Auris?

I can only give you some prices for a straight deal. A few months ago I was offered a brand new (unregistered, 0 kms) Laguna Royale for 20k. Also, if you look on Carzone used cars section there is 09 one with 10 kms advertised for 18.9k.

I know trading is different than a straight deal but I think you could have pushed for a better deal based on:
09 for 18.9k and keep your Auris
or
09 for 11k and give them your Auris

Mr Benevolent

You could go for a better car tbh... Honda Accord diesel springs to mind (the '08 version).

sullydublin

French cars give alot of electrical trouble . i would stick with honda or ford are good also

bazz26

OP did you go to a different Renault dealer to compare prices against a similar Laguna? In my experience when it comes to business there are no friends or favours.

Stevie Dakota

If it was me I'd be pushing for a Dynamique or at a push a Privilage for the same money. The Royal is basic and won't be as easy to shift down the line (not that anything is).

Laguna is a good car, if it suits you needs go for it.

Henry Ford III

I reckon you paid maybe €2k too much.

EPM

I know your wife does a lot of mileage and any car will not be worth a whole lot afterwards but a high mileage, base model diesel Laguna would be nigh on impossible.

I'd be more inclined to go for something like this if I were in your position. You'd probably get a better allowance from a Toyota dealer with your Auris.



A high mileage Toyota would be an easier sell

reilig

I tried another couple of garages over the last few weeks, but none will even consider a 08 Auris with 100k on it for a trade in.

As for selling private and going for a straight deal, would you buy a 08 Auris with 100k on it that is out of waranty???????
I know I wouldn't.

The Mileage is a killer, but in reality, the auris lost only €8k in 2 years, that's only €4k per year which still left her with very cheap driving if you compair it to other cars.

R.O.R

reilig wrote: »

I tried another couple of garages over the last few weeks, but none will even consider a 08 Auris with 100k on it for a trade in.

As for selling private and going for a straight deal, would you buy a 08 Auris with 100k on it that is out of waranty???????
I know I wouldn't.

The Mileage is a killer, but in reality, the auris lost only €8k in 2 years, that's only €4k per year which still left her with very cheap driving if you compair it to other cars.

I presume the mileage isn't going to change so at the end of 2011 you'll be looking at a 2 year old Laguna with 100,000km?

If an Auris is currently worth €8k the Laguna would probably be worth about €5k if you can find a buyer. Massive depreciation, even though it's cheap to begin with.

Big problem is going to be that what ever car you buy now will lose a huge amount in 2 years / 100,000km.

reilig

Confab wrote: »

You could go for a better car tbh... Honda Accord diesel springs to mind (the '08 version).

Honda accord Diesels are 2.2 litre and have a list price of €37k. I know its a much better car, but it would not be practical for us with fuel economy, road tax or insurance. It would also have a greater depreciation than the Laguna.

I'm not racist, but I just don't drive Fords

reilig

R.O.R wrote: »

I presume the mileage isn't going to change so at the end of 2011 you'll be looking at a 2 year old Laguna with 100,000km?

If an Auris is currently worth €8k the Laguna would probably be worth about €5k if you can find a buyer. Massive depreciation, even though it's cheap to begin with.

Big problem is going to be that what ever car you buy now will lose a huge amount in 2 years / 100,000km.

The Auris is worth €12k.

The argument for the laguna is the 150kkm warranty - so when we trade it at 100kkm, it will be still under warranty for 50kkm

But i think that no matter what car we buy it is going to have huge depreciation because of the mileage.

EPM

reilig wrote: »

Honda accord Diesels are 2.2 litre and have a list price of €37k. I know its a much better car, but it would not be practical for us with fuel economy NOT MUCH DIFFERENCE I'D IMAGINE , road tax €302 FOR THE YEAR or insurance THIS IS THE ONLY CLINCHER I CAN SEE. It would also have a greater depreciation than the Laguna. NOT IN A MILLION YEARS IF YOU BUY RIGHT

I'm not racist, but I just don't drive Fords

See above.

Put the Auris up for sale on done deal and buy straight cash if possible or even from UK

R.O.R

reilig wrote: »

The Auris is worth €12k.

The argument for the laguna is the 150kkm warranty - so when we trade it at 100kkm, it will be still under warranty for 50kkm

But i think that no matter what car we buy it is going to have huge depreciation because of the mileage.

I'll stand by my valuation on the Laguna though.

While the fact it still has 50,000km left of warranty (3 years is it?) stands in it's favour, the fact it's a 2 year old Laguna with 100,000km on the clock outweighs all that.

Would a better idea not be to buy a low mileage, used Accord or something with a reliable reputation, and run it in to the ground (currently what I'm doing on 40,000km a year). Comfortable car to drive, unlikely to break, didn't cost as much as a new Laguna and well able to handle anything you throw at it.

reilig

EPM wrote: »

Originally Posted by reilig
Honda accord Diesels are 2.2 litre and have a list price of €37k. I know its a much better car, but it would not be practical for us with fuel economy NOT MUCH DIFFERENCE I'D IMAGINE , road tax €302 FOR THE YEAR or insurance THIS IS THE ONLY CLINCHER I CAN SEE. It would also have a greater depreciation than the Laguna.

See above.

Put the Auris up for sale on done deal and buy straight cash if possible or even from UK

Noone will buy an Auris private with 100k on it and no warranty.

The price diffwerence between the Laguna and an Accord is €15k. We just don't have that kind of money.

Fuel economy: Laguna: 5.1l/100km Accord: 7.1/100km (huge difference because of engine size)

Tax is twice on an accord to what it is on the Laguna.

Insurance - huge difference between a 1.5 and a 2.2

BrianD3

reilig wrote: »

As for selling private and going for a straight deal, would you buy a 08 Auris with 100k on it that is out of waranty???????
I know I wouldn't.

Fair point and it does show how the Laguna with its 3 year/150,000 km manufacturer warranty has an advantage over Toyota's and other manufacturers' 100,000 km warranty.

It is the case that no matter what new car you buy you will lose a lot of money on it if you try to sell again in 2 years. In general the more you spend, the more you lose. People in this forum get very excited about Renault % depreciation but rarely take account of the fact that the cars are cheaper to buy in the first place and often have big discounts off list price

No matter what car you buy I would be looking at keeping it a lot longer than 2 years. Tha Laguna is well capable of doing big mileage, it's not as if its going to be "worn out" after 2 years.

BrianD3

Just for info there is a revised Laguna for 2010, I think the UK has gotten this already. The 2.0 litre diesel with FAP and 150 bhp falls two tax bands into band B ie the same bands as the 1.5 DCi. There are also small styling changes.

So if you wait a bit longer they may be (more) desperate to get rid of remaining older models.

reilig

BrianD3 wrote: »

Just for info there is a revised Laguna for 2010, I think the UK has gotten this already. The 2.0 litre diesel with FAP and 150 bhp falls two tax bands into band B ie the same bands as the 1.5 DCi. There are also small styling changes.

So if you wait a bit longer they may be (more) desperate to get rid of remaining older models.

But a 2 litre is more expensive to run. We are happy with the 1.5 engine - its way ahead of the 1.4 toyota engine for power and for fuel consumption. If we wait to buy a new Laguna until 2010 we will be working off the full list price and therefore be paying €5k more. The Auris will have 110kkm on it by the new year and will be worth less again in a trade in.

reilig

BrianD3 wrote: »

Fair point and it does show how the Laguna with its 3 year/150,000 km manufacturer warranty has an advantage over Toyota's and other manufacturers' 100,000 km warranty.

It is the case that no matter what new car you buy you will lose a lot of money on it if you try to sell again in 2 years. In general the more you spend, the more you lose. People in this forum get very excited about Renault % depreciation but rarely take account of the fact that the cars are cheaper to buy in the first place and often have big discounts off list price

No matter what car you buy I would be looking at keeping it a lot longer than 2 years. Tha Laguna is well capable of doing big mileage, it's not as if its going to be "worn out" after 2 years.

Thanks.

I understand that some people on here have preferences for different makes of cars. I would prefer a VW or a Toyota to the Renault too, but the price difference is enormous. I think we are getting a fairly good deal with what we have agreed on. I am very good friends with the guy who is selling to me. He has always done me great deals for servicing (significantly cheaper than normal prices) and good deals for trade ins in the past too. Holding on to a car for more than 2 years really isn't an option for us with the amount of miles we do. We need to have at least 1 good reliable car in the house, I still think we have made the right decision.

Drummerboy08

You should visit Renaults website.

There's currently €1500 trade in allowance, and €1500 scrappage on a new Laguna, bringing the price of a 1.5DCi Royale to €24040. Add €600 for delivery and €500 for metallic paint, it brings it to €25140.

I'd have expected to get a new, unregistered model for around €23000. For a pre reg, I'd have expected at least another €1500 off it.

EPM

Seriously, 100k km isn't a lot really. Any car will last multiples of that if looked after. Your current or next car is going to lose value because of this anyway so why not keep it longer? You're doing yourself out of thousands for no real reason there

Drummerboy08

EPM wrote: »

Seriously, 100k km isn't a lot really. Any car will last multiples of that if looked after. Your current or next car is going to lose value because of this anyway so why not keep it longer? You're doing yourself out of thousands for no real reason there

100k in less than 2 years is serious mileage though.

As a Toyota needs to be serviced every 15k, it would cost more to keep it on the road, compared to the Laguna, which is every 30k.

On top of that, its out of warranty. A car with that mileage in a short space of time could be coming up on some issues fairly soon.

pcardin

sullydublin wrote: »

French cars give alot of electrical trouble . i would stick with honda or ford are good also

That is so untrue. I had so many diifferent cars in my life and the only cars with electrical problems were Mercedes, Bmw and VW.

EPM

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

100k in less than 2 years is serious mileage though.

As a Toyota needs to be serviced every 15k, it would cost more to keep it on the road, compared to the Laguna, which is every 30k.

On top of that, its out of warranty. A car with that mileage in a short space of time could be coming up on some issues fairly soon.

But €11k's worth?

Drummerboy08

EPM wrote: »

But €11k's worth?

Probably not, no.

Its always nice to have a new car all the same!

EPM

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

Its always nice to have a new car all the same!

Only reason I ever change:D

reilig

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

You should visit Renaults website.

There's currently €1500 trade in allowance, and €1500 scrappage on a new Laguna, bringing the price of a 1.5DCi Royale to €24040. Add €600 for delivery and €500 for metallic paint, it brings it to €25140.

I'd have expected to get a new, unregistered model for around €23000. For a pre reg, I'd have expected at least another €1500 off it.

Don't know what site you're looking at but €1500 from €27000 does not give €24k

Drummerboy08

http://www.renault.ie/pv_pricelist_index.asp

Right here.

I should know exactly what the prices are, i've priced 10 of em up this moning for someone. I know there's more room for the dealer to move on that price too...;)

Furp

Just to give an option on mileage while 100,000kms in two years might a a little on the high side, I've done it myself for a few years.

I hope people are not starting to think that a car with over 100,000kms is at the end of the life, the way some people do when a car has 100,000 miles on it.

After all 100,000km is only 62,137miles.

Just thinking my car is is over 153,000miles which is 246,000km's

BrianD3

As I said earlier I was offered a new, unregistered Laguna Royale for 20k from a main dealer without me doing any haggling. And there is at least one 09 Royale with delivery mileage on carzone with asking price 18.9k. But when you have a part exchange, things are different.

edit: the one for 18.9k actually has 100 km on it. Here is another one for 19,500 with 10 kms.
http://www.carzone.ie/search/Renault/Laguna/1.5dCi-1/200942195553655/advert?channel=CARS

BrianD3

Oh and as regard mileage and how long cars last and remain reliable - I drive 500-1000 miles per week in my 03 Laguna and it has over 215k miles up which is around 350k kms. Have owned it since new and it has been very reliable and needed relatively few wearing parts replacing. Still has original exhaust, battery, clutch, wheelbearings, 3 shocks, brake discs, most suspension etc.

Modern cars are very long lasting if they are reasonably well maintained. Diesels can suffer from more expensive faults and wear than petrols but really there should be a lot of reliable service left in that Auris, 100k kms is nothing. If you don't like the car then change it but don't change it because you think it's about to become unrelaible.

reilig

I outlined our reasons for changing in the first post. I never mentioned that the car was unreliable.

I made the final deal on the car this evening. I actually made a mistake on the spec of the car. It is a Laguna Dynamique. I didn't know that there were 3 specs in the laguna range. The Dynamique has a list price of €29k or there abouts. I am happier now, those of you that said I was paying €2k over were right on the button.

Thanks for the information and advice guys.

Stevie Dakota

Congrats, Dynamique is a much better proposition. Happy motoring!

VolvoMan

Can't think of a better car for clocking up the miles than the new Laguna either. Well wear with it.:)

Guy:Incognito

I almost had the missus sold on the new laguna early last year, but she wouldnt bite on a brand new car (women, what do they know:mad:). Ended up in an 05 Grand Scenic which we are very happy with. I always look fondly when a new Laguna goes by tho. There is always the hope I'll win a few quid a get myself a Laguna coupe though:).

Stevie Dakota

I have to say that when I see a Laguna I tend to look twice, it's eye catching in an early E60 kind of a way and I've warmed to it's looks more so now than at launch. It is a bit challenging but does make the Avensis/Mondea/Passat brigade look very predictable.

bazz26

Somebody got alot of car here for under €12k:

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=200942195537996

EPM

There's an 08 Koleos on there too for 15k-the model that it is was over 33k new last year! Why anyone would bother mind...

VolvoMan

bazz26 wrote: »

Somebody got alot of car here for under €12k:

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=200942195537996

I actually think the Laguna would be a pretty good car if it weren't so bloody dull.

Mr Benevolent

VolvoMan wrote: »

I actually think the Laguna would be a pretty good car if it weren't so bloody dull.

Just like Volvos eh? Seriously though, I think it's gorgeous, and the depreciation will make it a fantastic buy in a few years. Contrary to my original opinion, the Laguna 3 does seem to be reliable.

VolvoMan

Confab wrote: »

Just like Volvos eh?

Well I don't think Volvo's are any duller than the likes of Mercedes to be honest.

Seriously though, I think it's gorgeous, and the depreciation will make it a fantastic buy in a few years.

I think you are being wayyyyyy too generous in your description of what is a safely styled, anonymous family car.

pburns

I wouldn't call the Laguna III gorgeous or even desireable but I have driven one and do think it's better than many assume.

Firstly, Renault were badly stung by the catastprophic reliability record of the MkII and went above and beyond normal endurance testing to get things right. CAR Mag did a feature on it. (And before MkII owners come on saying they have driven one for 280,000 miles and all they needed was an oil-change and new tyres...you are EuroMillons lucky...look it up online - the early cars were horrendously crap).

Secondly the interior is really high quality - better than a Mondeo or Mazda 6 for example. It mightn't satisfy VAG fetishists but I find German interiors boring.

Thirdly the Laguna hasn't ballooned in sized like the Mondeo and some other rivals. At least it feels chuckable whilst still having lots of interior space.

I have to smile at the OP's worry about running costs and the assertation that the 1.5 has adequete poke even though (apparantly) the new 2.0 is the same tax band as smaller engine. Why are the irish so hung-up on small engines:o? I'd say the real world running cost differences would be minimal as the 2.0 won't be working as hard and it'd be much better to drive. Having said that a 2.0 would be substantally dearer and it'll be a while before they have a glut of them built up and ready to sell at reduced prices! 110bhp is good for a 1.5D but it's barely acceptable for a car the Laguna's size.

I think it's s/h the new Laguna will make most sense as the terrible reputation of the II has destroyed resale value, many won't realise the III is probably a substantally improved car...