News and views on Greystones harbour and marina [SEE MODERATOR WARNING POST 1187]

Blandpebbles

New Clubhouse for Rowing Club approx 200k if self financed, free under PPP.

Hopefully when the hoardings come down we will all see what we are dealing with.

Huntthe

It will be a gradual thing the Council should help the local clubs to secure funding through long term loans. I assume the planning permission for the houses does not have an indefinite time span and we can crack on without fear of interference from the developer at a later stage ?

Blandpebbles

PPP Contract expires in 2014, however as the 'market conditions' clause was included SISK are under no obligation to build houses.

Loans for clubs wouldnt go down well with those who were sold the PPP as the solution.

Can't say I would be sorry if no houses were built but I worry for the great clubs we have in Greystones.

Huntthe

There isn't a snowballs that it will be completed by 2014.

Loans for clubs wouldnt go down well with those who were sold the PPP as the solution.

Sure, but they took a gamble or a leap of faith if you like, and it didn't pay off or at least only half of it did. They will have to accept the reality of the situation and roll their sleeves up to rebuild as they did before and I'm sure will again.

InTheTrees

Any chance someone could post some progress pictures?

pixbyjohn

There is a photo here> http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0222/1224264939272.html

Langerland

pixbyjohn wrote: »

There is a photo here> http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0222/1224264939272.html

I was down there for a look on Sunday and it seems like the outer wall is almost complete and the inner pier is also almost finished. The place is an absolute mess though. However, to make it anyway presentable, the marina, the new beach area and the public square would have to be completed.

I assume the batching plant above the north beach will be just shut down and left there while they decide what they are doing. That has destroyed the views coming in on the train.

darter

Langerland wrote: »

I assume the batching plant above the north beach will be just shut down and left there while they decide what they are doing. That has destroyed the views coming in on the train.

More than the views from the train, it has ruined the end of the very nice Bray-Greystones cliff walk. Although, if the north beach erosion isn't seriously addressed soon, the walk will be diverted to the road and there won't be a train as there won't be any tracks...

sysconp1

This may be worth further investigation...

A close friend of ours was in the Beachhouse last Saturday and was told that the company responsible for the harbour work is running out of money. Not sure how bad things are but anyone with connections may want to investigate this one further. I would have thought the local council would have been all over this like a rash, but then again you never know! I hope this isn't true and the harbour is at least made usable and not so much of a blot on a pleasant landscape.

Blandpebbles

This isn't a secret. They will finish off with the cheapest possible materials and finish now.

cavemeister

Guys,

Correct me if I am wrong (and I hope I am) but is it true that work on the new Greystones Harbour development is to cease? Was speaking to a fellow Greystonian and he was telling me that the funding is gone and developers are to start wrapping up. They are under instructions to "Tidy up" and hopefully in 2015, work will commence again!

Say it isn't so... just need someone to say "mis-informed" would be awful for the local community!

pixbyjohn

Didn't hear anything. Who is the fellow Greystonian who told you this ? Is he in the know about these things ?
Is he anti or pro the harbour developments ?
I would like to know first hand so if you have hard facts lay them on the table. There have been so many threads about the harbour containing lots of fiction.
Can you answer any or all of my questions please ?

loyatemu

merged into existing harbour thread.

Alan_P

Irish Times story from a month ago :-

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0222/1224264939272.html

Opening paragraph of above :-
"WORK IS to be “paused” on public facilities in the €300 million Greystones Harbour redevelopment project in north Co Wicklow, its backers have confirmed."

So yes the project is being suspended.


For completeness,and by coincidence, a follow up story from today's IT :-
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0323/1224266876139.html

Locals warn of increasing erosion on Greystones north beach.

cavemeister

Makes me sick to the pit of my stomach..... After all the asurances from the developers, they pull out!

Someone MUST be held accountable!

Langerland

It's a bit idealistic and naive to think somebody might be held accountable in this country. However, it is certainly on the shoulders of those in the Council that pushed this through to find an acceptable medium term solution to the mess that is down there now - Messrs Mitchell and Jones IT'S YOUR MESS - SORT IT OUT!

Fiachra2

cavemeister wrote: »

Correct me if I am wrong (and I hope I am) but is it true that work on the new Greystones Harbour development is to cease? Was speaking to a fellow Greystonian and he was telling me that the funding is gone and developers are to start wrapping up. They are under instructions to "Tidy up" and hopefully in 2015, work will commence again!

Say it isn't so... just need someone to say "mis-informed" would be awful for the local community!

In reality it is unlikely that anyone apart from a few senior people in SISPAR know the real financial situation regarding this development. It is unlikely that even the WCC officaials know where it stands. So I woulnt lend too much weight to any rumors of this kind. The developers have stated they will leave in the autumn with the harbour finished to some-significant- degree. Whats not clear is how much of the hoarding will come down and what degree of access to the harbour will be available. Some councillors are trying to establish this and when they do they will try and let you know.

There have been statements to the effect that the project "must" be completed by 2014. That would be inaccurate. The project will only be fully completed when the housing market picks up to an adequate level.

Blandpebbles

Fiachra is correct. It's a PPP, anything apart from the minimal harbour is funded by the Private Sale of Houses and Business Premises. As this will not happen, no further work will be done.

This a is a common practice within a PPP to ensure the Public receive some form of delivery and the Private element is not commited to further development without chance of return on investment.

Look around Ireland, nearly every major Apartment Complex made use of a PPP Agreement.

No one in SISPAR or otherwise is at fault here, as this was caused by a downturn in the market and as such covered in the PPP Contract.

What is a very big shame, is the Hubris of our Town's Councillor's in signing the agreement, but really did anyone including them, think a downturn was coming?

Langerland

Well without getting into a discussion on who foresaw the downturn or not, I would still hold the councillors who pushed this through (as well as Sispar) responsible for ensuring that the harbour area is returned to a somewhat aesthetically pleasing or presentable and usable format for the period the works are paused. I would not be very happy if those same councillors are not as vocal in this regard as they were when promoting this project. I only ever seem to read of Cllr. Fortune voicing concerns and looking for answers....

mjmorrisroe

What a frickin' joke... Useless, useledd, useless... Maybe when my kid is 15 we'll see the harbour finished... Government has a responsibility to finish it..

Blandpebbles

Why does the Government have a responsibility to finish it? The Company hasn't gone bust or reneged on their contract, they have committed to bringing it the contractually agreed finishing level.

Only issue is public's expectation of what this is, may vary a great deal from the contractual definition of finishing level.

Langerland

Who negotiated the contract with Sispar? Maybe they can enlighten us joe publics on what we can expect.

Blandpebbles

WCC and Sispar signed the contract.

As Derek Mitchell is the main Councillor talking about 'finished' by October 2010, I have asked him directly today to confirm who will be signing off on this phase of the Harbour and the exact details of the sign off criteria. That is, 'temporary finish' is not a sufficient criteria for any project signoff.

Blandpebbles

Derek has come back to me with the following clarification -

The harbour structures are to be fully completed by October 2010. The temporary surfaces refers to the landside after October 2011.

wakejiver

The situation for all concerned is very frustrating. There are a number of councillors who did ram this development through and they are the ones who should have ensured that the such an eventuality was covered under the bond. These concillors should be held responsible, some clearly are more concerned than others to resolve this i.e. Mitchell albeit given he is an avid sailor no surprise there.

The biggest frustation many of us locals have is trying to get a clear answer as to what we may expect when the hoarding comes down and the quality of the finish in lieu of budget constraints and this is not forthcoming from anyone.

micandre

given that last count this discussion had 4,379 views, is there an argument for a new sub forum under Greystones & Charlesland for the harbour?

Jammyc

micandre wrote: »

given that last count this discussion had 4,379 views, is there an argument for a new sub forum under Greystones & Charlesland for the harbour?

I wouldnt think so. Seems pretty excessive tbh. Not gonna be a permanent cause of chatter aswell.

thecommander

micandre wrote: »

given that last count this discussion had 4,379 views, is there an argument for a new sub forum under Greystones & Charlesland for the harbour?

Wouldn't say so. You'd have a sub forum with one post with loads of views.

darter

Work has really slowed down at the site. Was coming past yesterday on the DART at 17:15 and there was almost nobody there. Went past for the last few Sundays on my round-the-village walk and there is no-one working on Sundays now... Don't know about Saturdays. I didn't see a lot of difference last Sunday compared to the one two weeks before for the outer walls visible from the big circular viewing plastic window on the S side. I can't see that the harbour will be finished by September at this rate.

There does seem to be confusion about when the hoardings will come down. I read in some posts here it will be September this year, but the newspaper article said September 2011.

Does anyone have any real solid facts? Apart from the very few top managers in Sispar that is.

Blanchflower

I am currently in Greystones on vacation having grown up here and I am very upset at the state of the harbour. My friends tell me the building work has stalled as there is no more money around to finish it. Does anyone know how long more the harbour will be left in this terrible state?

Back home in the States this type of thing would never have been
be allowed to happen.