Everest Marathon

Rusty Cogs 08

Yup, it's a tall order, a new high, a challenge of Everest proportions (..get off the stage).

So on December 5th 2009 at Everest base camp (5,184m) I'll line up with 60 or so other frosty souls to start the 13th biennial Everest marathon.

This post is just to get the log started, I'll post frequently to keep all interested on my training, preparation, charitable goals and general thoughts on the event and my approach to it.

As altitude training in Dublin is limited to visiting the Guinness Storehouse I'll be getting up to the vertiginous heights of the Wicklow and Dublin mountains to hone my fell running skills.

I'm hoping for some Boardsie support in my goal. There's a lot more experienced runners of both the flat and the not so flat out there so all advice is much appreciated.

As many here are aware, I'm not long back from the Berlin marathon but I'll start my training log anew

T - 67 / Tuesday / 6m - Ft - 38'12" - Waaaay to quick, but it is Day 1*

*T = marathon day
m = miles
Ft = Flat (terrain)
Time is in minutes and seconds

Sleipnir

This should be good.....:pac:

DustyBin

Wow, that's really something special. Enjoy it & good luck!!

donothoponpop

Jeez, I didn't think this was going ahead... fair play to you! Give a shout any time you want company scaling any massive Wicklow peaks.

Rusty Cogs 08

T - 66 / Wednesday / 9m Ft / 61'06" / AvP 6'47" / AvHR 149

As John Turturro pleaded with Gabriel Byrne, 'listen to your heart'. (actually, I think he said 'look into your heart).

I intend to link my runs to my Garmin site soon enough so anyone interested can have a closer look.

The schedule I'm loosely basing this marathon attempt on is the Pfitzinger and Douglas 'Multiple Marathon - 12 weeks between marathons' schedule. I figure there are a couple of positives to this. One, it's a structure, if I left it to myself to simply try to maintain my fitness between marathons I might loose fitness or over train or just lose motivation. Two, it's specifically designed for bridging marathons so I get a slow(ish) reintroduction to longer runs and a taper at the other end. The negatives as I see them are one, it's not designed with a mountain marathon in mind, so at the weekend, when I'm meant to be running 18m LSR's I'll have to actually get up into the hills and work on that aspect of my running, two, P&D give three marathon schedules 55mpw,70mpw and 70+ mpw but only one 'bridging' schedule. So it's a one size fits all and the milage is actually a bit more than I need with six 60+ mile weeks in there. I'll have to cut back a little on some of those runs. I want to maintain fitness, not burn out.

Finally (and this is where the title comes in) as this marathon is not about a time goal, I'm going to try and run a lot of my runs according to my heart rate. That is, run in the middle of my HR reserve zone according to the pace dictated on the schedule. I hope that this maintains/improves my fitness without getting caught up in time goals which I don't need (nor have) to achieve.

So tonight I went out for a 'general aerobic' run, a 'standard, moderate effort, putting in the miles' run. My heart rate rose to 150 at the turn and I decided to stick to that rate for the remaining 4.5 miles. This obviously meant my pace slowed as I tired and probably signified two things. First, if I had of kept up my first half pace, it would have pushed up my HR and probably been too much a strain on me and second, I probably went out to fast that I couldn't maintain both my pace and my heart rate. The goal would be for both (pace & HR) to be constant, although that's a little metronomic an aspiration I admit.

Just to add, all this may change and I welcome (and indeed hope for) comments, suggestions, ribald humour at the whole endevour.

RacoonQueen

Best of luck Rusty

Krusty_Clown

Fair play to you. A very lofty goal. Do you have a link to the marathon page? Would be interested in seeing the route.
A 9 mile PMP run 9 days after Berlin? Trying to wriggle out of this Everest challenge already?!

earlyevening

http://www.everestmarathon.com/marathon_race_map.jpg

There's the course map. My buddy walked that route a few months ago and said it took 12 hrs. GOOD LUCK. That'll be some achievement. I look forward to following this thread.

Rusty Cogs 08

earlyevening wrote: »

http://www.everestmarathon.com/marathon_race_map.jpg

There's the course map. My buddy walked that route a few months ago and said it took 12 hrs. GOOD LUCK. That'll be some achievement. I look forward to following this thread.

That's actually a different race (The 'Tenzing Hillary Everest Marathon').

The one I'm doing is this
http://www.everestmarathon.org.uk/

It's the 'original' everest marathon with a smaller field, held every two years with more of a charitable slant as it's raison d'etre.

earlyevening

Two marathons up there. Who would've thought! Don't suppose they'd set up a handy 5 miler for me!

beertons

Wow, best of luck.

asimonov

best of luck rusty. sounds fantastic.

mithril

Fabulous experience.
I will be watching your progress intently. Its something I would love to do myself and might have given it a shot if work situation was more favourable. Let us know how we can contribute to your charity?

These events tend to be Darwinian and its often not the fittest athlete but the one who gets to the starting line without sickness or injury who will do best. Once you get safely to that point, your natural athletic ability will do the rest.

Rusty Cogs 08

T- 65 - Day off

Well a day off from running anyway. One big issue for me in this race is my ankles and knees. From the mountain running I've done in the past I've had trouble with my balance, particularly around decending (which most of the Everest marathon will involve). My physio tells me that my ankles are not particularly strong and too flexible for the strains put on them when decending. Obviously, the last thing I want is to go to Nepal, trek for two weeks, get up for the marathon start and then 'go over' on my ankle after half a mile and and thus end my attempt before I've even got going.

My physio has given me a few exercises to build up the muscles around my ankles including lunges, squats and using a 'balance' cushion (standing one legged on a cushion, Karate Kid-like, to strengthen the ankle muscles as you keep your balance).

So I suppose I'm looking for any input on what can be done to improve my ankles (and knees) for the task ahead. Exercises, gym work, whatever. I'm a little wary of actually signing up for hill races as throwing myself down hills under race conditions could very easily result in injury before I strengthen the areas I need to.

Finally, does anyone know a shop in the city that sells these 'balance cushions', the one off the couch has fallen out of love with me.

donothoponpop

IIRC, any injuries you've suffered have been from going at a fair clip in hill races- when you've been racing without any hill specific training. By all means stay away from the races (season's about done anyway), but the more (slow!) training runs you can do on mountain/trail ascents, the better you'll deal with balance, joints, stress, etc. For the first while, go slow as you like going down, and stress yourself a bit running up. Pretty obvious advice really, but I'd say it'd be the best thing for you. Sss-ll-o-o-w-w-w trail runs, as much as possible.

Rusty Cogs 08

Off the back of dp's sage advice. I'm looking for feedback on any good trails to train on. Part of the reason I didn't do more IMRA races this year is that I'm in the city centre and don't drive, therefore have difficulty getting out to mountain locations.

So if you have knowledge (map links would be great) of good runs in and around Dublin (say from Bray in the South, Ballinteer to the west and Howth in the north and everything in between) that would be great. These don't have to be super long runs, I can do laps and they may even be preferable as 'knowing' the run will assist in tackling it more safely.

Cheers

pgibbo

Serious looking event. Best of luck with it and the training.

donothoponpop

Rusty Cogs 08 wrote: »

So if you have knowledge (map links would be great) of good runs in and around Dublin (say from Bray in the South, Ballinteer to the west and Howth in the north and everything in between) that would be great. These don't have to be super long runs, I can do laps and they may even be preferable as 'knowing' the run will assist in tackling it more safely.

48A bus/cycle to Marlay Park, follow the Wicklow Way out of the top gate, up the road and onto the Wicklow Way trails, across the ridge (heading east) by Fairy Castle, over to Three Rock, back down by the back roads past the Three Rock Inn, and back to Marlay. Or any one of the myriad of route choices accessed from Marlay/Ticknock. The one I described is about 16k or so, easy path trails underfoot, good climbing and great views.

Howth you know about.

For a real Saturday treat, get the bus from Dublin city to Glendalough, and do a great loop run up the WW, up around Mullacor, over the sleepers, down and back any way you like. Lots of options around here, and this is the best time of year (autumn) to appreciate the trees and the area. I had my best ever running experience around these parts, around this time last year. It's really worth exploring these routes.

MrCreosote

Best of luck with the training! Looks great.

How're you planning for the altitude? Will you Diamox it??

Rusty Cogs 08

MrCreosote wrote: »

Will you Diamox it??

Now I could have googled that and pretended I knew what you were talking about but this whole thing is new to me so if you could explain, it might be something to take on board (both mentally and physically).

MrCreosote

Sorry! Diamox/Acetozolamide is used by lots of trekkers and mountaineering to prevent acute mountain sickness. I'm not sure how that translates to your marathon though- I'll see if I can find anything for you.

Do you start high and descend on the day?

Looks like a great event by the way!

Rusty Cogs 08

Yup, you start around 5,200 and finish around 3,600. The first few miles are meant to be particularly tough due to the thin air.

MrCreosote

Here's the UIAA site on altitude with a bit on acetazolamide:
http://www.theuiaa.org/medical_faq.html

Just checked the WADA list though and it's on the list of prohibited substances! So not sure where that leaves you. The organisers might have a position on it.

mithril

Diamox is used by most people when climbing Kilimanjaro - 19,500 feet and climbed normally in 5-6 days.

In your case, you are in a better position since you have a much longer period to acclimatize to the altitude and are not going as high.

There are side-effects as well. The best thing is to get a proper medical consultation before you go (necessary anyway to get a diamox prescription) and follow the advice you are given.

another world

Best of luck Rusty. I´ll be following this with great interest.

I´ve been at altitude (2400m) for about a year and a half now so I know a bit about it but by no means everything. I´ve also done a fair bit of hiking (up to 5000m), I could barely walk to be honest at that altitude, especially when it was at the uphill parts.

The altitude in Ireland, even on the highest mountains will do very little to get you ready for the altitude at Base Camp at Everest. I´d recommend getting somewhere in Europe (Sierra Nevada mountains close to Granada in Spain springs to mind) if you can. That´ll give you a good idea of where you stand. Altitude effects different people differently so you won´t really know how it effects you until you get there, so it´s best to get there a week before, rest for a day or two and gradually build up the distance of your runs. You don´t want to arrive and go straight for a run, could be a complete disastor! Lots of water and eating lightly is also good general advice for altitude.

I don´t know much about the drugs part of it, I´ve heard they help but I don´t know what sort of effect they´d have on your running.

Anyway best of luck. I´m off to put this in my diary for 2011!

Rusty Cogs 08

If only I had the opportunity to train or even experience a bit of time at altitude. Unfortunately, most of '09's holidays are going into the Everest trip so it's going to be a first for the body in many respects. That said, I read that doing well at altitude can work one time and then cause problems another time so I won't get too hung up on not having the experience. The trek to the start is over two weeks in aclimatizing so hopefully the body will be able to deal with it. I don't think they'd have a race where large numbers were dropping out throughout the trek up (organisational nightmare) and they do have a number of doctors on hand to ensure that your in good shape with a final check up before they allow you to race.

I had to go for a medical on application for the race.

earlyevening

I'd watch the diamox for altitude. It'll dehydrate you. You'll urinate a lot more. It causes more problems than it solves. I'm walking the Annapurna trail in Nepal in March and amn't bothering with it.

Rusty Cogs 08

T - 64 / Friday / 9m Ft / 62'28" / AvP 6'56" / AvHR 151

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/15067673#

A late one this evening, didn't start until 7.50pm and wore a long sleave top for the first time, there was a stiff breeze on the return so combined with the fact that it's been a long day, it felt a bit tough. I have to say, running at night is not my favourite thing in the world but at least it was dry. Some randomer gave his mates a laugh by running along side me for a 100 m or so. It's always interesting to wait to see how long before they give up (with 7 miles to go as it happened).

A recovery run in the morning and then Sunday is my first day in the hills (or hill as I might start with Bray Head).

Rusty Cogs 08

earlyevening wrote: »

I'd watch the diamox for altitude. It'll dehydrate you. You'll urinate a lot more. It causes more problems than it solves. I'm walking the Annapurna trail in Nepal in March and amn't bothering with it.

Having read Mr Creosote's link on it (and as I havn't seen it recommended by the race organisers) I'd say I'll be giving it a miss. If the event doctors think I'm not coping I'll let them decide on the best treatment.

earlyevening

Yup. Emergency use only if you have to withdraw I think. I'd try and avoid it.

It'll also keep you awake 24 hrs a day while you take it.

Rusty Cogs 08

T - 63 / Saturday / 5m Ft / 37'23" / AvP 7'29" / AvHR 150

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/15125389#

Not so easy getting out of bed for this one, my elevated HR for the first mile testifying to this. Last night's green curry didn't appreciate the run either. A shade under 12 stone once I'd 'recovered'. Glad to get it done though as it's teeming down outside atm.

I'll probably bring my fell runners for Bray Head tomorrow as things will be a little soggier now. One issue I have with my Mizuno Harrier 2's is that they have a much narrower heel which gives me less feeling of support. As stated earlier though, I won't be throwing myself down the decents. These 'mountain' runs are all about building up experience, strength, technique and confidence.