[BPB] Price/Size/Quality

melekalikimaka

ok research is underway on the book printing.

three things we need to know when approaching the companies

size - no of pages and actual size
quality - hardback or softback, print quality we can comprimise on
price - this is a important one... if we wanna go big we need to keep it low, recession and all that jazz

Buzz Lightyear

OK Mele,

First of all, well done and fair play for taking up the position of chairman of the board . May the force be with you

Last year we had 51 physical pages including the introduction. To be fair to all involved we need to have at lest 1.5 times this quantity. This leaves us with 75 to 80 pages. We could probably fill 100, but lets make a realistic figure of 80 pages. Its a good size book without being too big.

Last years book was a good size, I got the soft copy, however when compared to retail books its a bit small on height. I realise this goes down to budget, however a bit taller would go a long way to being a statement of a great book!

Looking on the books on my bookshelves, the majority of them are hardback. They last longer, look better and stand up for themselves.

Price - 5euro. Not a hope unless we're confined to the cheap books in Easons or your local book store. I can't recall how much I paid last year, however IMO the max figure would have to be 50 euro, even at that it would be hard for a lot of people given the time of year that it is being released. Ideally 35-40 would be a relistic figure.

Buzz

Dublin_Gunner

Has the layout / design been done yet?

Logo?

IMO you should go with a softback, squared spine. Will keep the costs down, and still have a nice effect, once a good quality gloss paper stock is chosen.

smelltheglove

I use the square books quite often and I have to say, I do fibd that the square makes design of the book harder, I think landscape was ideal for what we had last year.

I agree that hardback would be better however we were given the choice last year and considering budget I chose soft.

I still think this year we would be better with an image on the cover, I know the majority vote went with the black cover but I think if we were going to try to sell it then some sort of image would be better, my 2 cents.

I've been looking into book pricing and so far blurb is the best really, there are plenty of places that do books but blurb definitely seems to be the cheapest really. Shakespere is new and the quality is great, first impressions it looks more expensive but its not a huge amount more expensive and we would be keeping business in our country, postage seems to be less also.

However if we can get cheaper who are we to say no? I agree with Buzz on the price 35-40 should suffice, I think 50 may be a bit too much.

AnCatDubh

Last years prices;

€29,95 - Softcover
€40,95 - Hardcover, Dust Jacket
€42,95 - Hardcover, ImageWrap

It's blurb entry is here

Cover
The cover looked a little like this;



How many?
We had 102 pages (back/front) thus tallies with Buzz's figures. We need to consider how many submissions will be accepted.

We have 96 definite and 39 maybe's. If we stick to last years size - 102 printed pages / 51 physical pages allowing for intro etc, then by my calculation if all the maybes turned definitely then we've a little row on our hands.

Thing is - A mechanism is thus needed or decide on a larger book. Larger book = larger prices. Will there be anarchy on the streets (or at least on the forum )

Volume discount;

Discounts apply toward orders of 10 or more of the same book/cover type.

10 – 199 copies (single order) - 10%
200 – 400 copies (single order) - 15%

Postage and Packaging Not Included in the above details.

/pulls pin, throws grenade in mele's direction, and runs for cover

whyulittle

AnCatDubh wrote: »

have 96 definite and 39 maybe's. If we stick to last years size - 102 printed pages / 51 physical pages allowing for intro etc, then by my calculation if all the maybes turned definitely then we've a little row on our hands.

Thing is - A mechanism is thus needed or decide on a larger book. Larger book = larger prices. Will there be anarchy on the streets (or at least on the forum )

Volume discount;

Discounts apply toward orders of 10 or more of the same book/cover type.

10 – 199 copies (single order) - 10%
200 – 400 copies (single order) - 15%

Postage and Packaging Not Included in the above details.

/pulls pin, throws grenade in mele's direction, and runs for cover

But, we weren't limited to that amount of pages. We could have went to say, 140 pages, for the same price. I'm not sure of the exact numbers, but it should be on Blurb somewhere. EDIT: Prices are here. We could have went to 120 pages for the same price.

On the discount, we discovered last year that it is only available to the book's author. The DDG group had to log in using my login to order their books.

m_s_nixon

I say do the poll again with yes or no as the answers, anyone who answers yes pays a €10 deposit which will be allowed off the final cost of the book, just as a way to get people to commit to it

that may not work but just throwing out an idea

smelltheglove

m_s_nixon wrote: »

I say do the poll again with yes or no as the answers, anyone who answers yes pays a €10 deposit which will be allowed off the final cost of the book, just as a way to get people to commit to it

that may not work but just throwing out an idea

good idea

oscarBravo

I started a discussion on design, in which I've stated a case for keeping the book the same size (apart from page count) as last year's.

Obviously, that's just my view.

AnCatDubh

Don't forget when pricing the final product to include the charitable aspect of the production. I'm not sure if its been referenced up until now but I'm assuming that the Santa Strike Force should retain the forum's good will this year?

artyeva

i wasn't around for this last year so my view is totally without prejudice... i like the cover of last year. if there was to be an image on the front who would get to choose what it was? that seems like an unecessary extra tbh...

i think a simple text cover is sufficient... it's what's on the inside that counts

m_s_nixon

how about a light painting photo on the cover, just write "boards.ie photography yearbook 2010(/2009??)" or similar, maybe open a thread and people can submit entries, most thanked wins...

melekalikimaka

i felt the cover was excellent last year. boards.ie is what brought us all together and the cover was what all it was about. i liked it. we could go down two routes. stick to the same with a year change, or flip and go for some thing different. personally i think a continuity would work well. I'm only a co-ordinator, i am not making the choices so opinions are welcome, my job is to put this malarky together...sadly asap... so ideas welcome, we're a creative bunch, no time to be shy

CabanSail

I think a Plain Cover works best for a few reasons.

It says that we are a community & that all the images are given equal standing. Each viewer will have their own favourites but that is their choice. If we place an image on the cover it places that one above the rest. That is OK for a competition but this is more of a cooperative effort & does not fit.

If we keep the design similar to last year it gives that consistency.

It saves time as making the decision who would take the cover picture would be another step that we don't need.


There will be some who will drop out for various reasons. The idea of a €10 deposit to secure a place should give some commitment to the project. If they drop out then it's a bonus to the organisers for their production party Santa Strike Force.

AnCatDubh

I likeyd the cover last year. Only change i'd consider is the base colour if you want to differentiate this years production. Think in a couple of years - do you want to have a single colour running through the series on your bookshelf or a rainbow of colour running through the series.

oscarBravo

AnCatDubh wrote: »

I likeyd the cover last year. Only change i'd consider is the base colour if you want to differentiate this years production. Think in a couple of years - do you want to have a single colour running through the series on your bookshelf or a rainbow of colour running through the series.

I touched on this in the design thread. I like the idea of a consistent size, with a consistent spine design, but with different colours. There's scope to vary the cover design somewhat, while remaining true to last year's.

dakar

The logistics of a deposit are difficult to work through. It's fine for members of a delivery group, you can just get take it off the purchase price.

But for those of us (me \o/) who won't be part of a delivery group, there needs to be a means of returning the deposit. Not insurmountable if we use paypal or similar for collecting the deposits, but another job that someone will have to take responsibility for.

I'm all for streamlining the process as everyone is doing this voluntarily, from the photos themselves through the time taken to run this thing.

I suppose what it boils down to is whether there were any aspects of the project last year that didn't work, design, price, logistics etc. If we can significantly improve on any of these, well and good. If not and it ain't broke..........

The first installment of my 2c.

superflyninja

hey all. nice to see i made the submissions list. im a little fuzzy on one thing though. we all sign up to buy one copy is it?

AnCatDubh

superflyninja wrote: »

hey all. nice to see i made the submissions list. im a little fuzzy on one thing though. we all sign up to buy one copy is it?

Yes. The only precondition that is presently set is that you must buy one copy (at least) of the final publication. You can obviously buy more if you like.

melekalikimaka

wanna bump this.

we have a submission deadline set, we need the images shipped to blurb(if we decide defo on it) as soon as possible to get the books in for xmas. was close enough last year, and i dont want 100 boardsies abusing me for ruined xmases!!!

oscarbravo, maybe put forward a idea of what youd like, and maybe a few of the layout heads throw their oar in and wrap this up... at the end of the day, we can just repeat last years as it was perfect, but the option for chance is quickly closing

ThOnda

You should already think about method of submitting pictures - to prevent identity theft and so.

And as was confirmed last year, leave the picture submission as the very last step. If we all want to have a picture in the book, we all have to do something for it. I would strongly recommend sorting everything first (design, prices, file sizes...).

Paulw

Is there a set/agreed file size/format/dimensions?

oscarBravo

Unless there are screaming objections, I'm going to go with a layout not dissimilar to last year's, but with a white (or near-white) theme instead of black. I think there's broad agreement that the same page size as last year's book will make for the beginning of a nice series of books.

That means the book is 8"x10", landscape. Portrait photos will be accepted, but will be slightly smaller than landscape.

I'll come back with details of actual image sizes shortly.

smelltheglove

If we are going with the same I think the colour wheel is a great idea unless we decide to alternate years between black and white.

oscarBravo

I'm not averse to a colour wheel approach, with two caveats: first, we're starting from black, so we don't have a "hue" cue for the wheel. Second, it's predicated on the assumption that whoever designs next year's and subsequent books will follow the approach.

smelltheglove

True Oscar, but since this is the second year going if we decide the process now then we may not have to go through the design issue again next year. It can be the exact same cover bar the colour.

See the beklow link, we can decide ys we like the dark theme and select colours each year fromt eh inner most circle, being the darker circle therefor not being too much of a drastic change from last years, then if it goes beyond that circle in years to come we may be able to move up the next circle and around that way, therefor being completely consistent even with the order of the colours and just a brighter shade when the inner circle is compltely, in all honesty that is a long way away but the idea is there and in my head I actually think it would look great.
http://0101.netclime.net/1_5/248/300/2de/1175128988224848.png

ThOnda

Do I hear the words "another vote" hanging in the air?

Remember last year? I know it was many votes, but made it easy and transparent. I would suggest similar approach - show us samples and we will vote for them.

humberklog

Got a question on sizing. I use Picasa to shop my photo from a CD that that fuji film put my negs onto. However when I click on properties after doing what I do the dimensions are shown as 800x536. When I put thse images onto a memory card and have them printed to 6x4 they work out fine.
Are these dimension/resolutions suitable for the book though?

oscarBravo

humberklog wrote: »

Got a question on sizing. I use Picasa to shop my photo from a CD that that fuji film put my negs onto. However when I click on properties after doing what I do the dimensions are shown as 800x536. When I put thse images onto a memory card and have them printed to 6x4 they work out fine.
Are these dimension/resolutions suitable for the book though?

Can you just send them to me without resizing, and I'll figure it out from there?

edit: I may have misunderstood you - are they just 800x536 on the CD itself? If they're printed at the book's design size, they'll be just 100dpi. I honestly don't know how well that will work.

Also, I'm pretty sure we agreed on just one photo per submission, so you'll have to pick one, I'm afraid.

humberklog

oscarBravo wrote: »

Can you just send them to me without resizing, and I'll figure it out from there?

edit: I may have misunderstood you - are they just 800x536 on the CD itself? If they're printed at the book's design size, they'll be just 100dpi. I honestly don't know how well that will work.

Also, I'm pretty sure we agreed on just one photo per submission, so you'll have to pick one, I'm afraid.

Well the photo come on cd at 1840x 1232 then after whatever Picasa does then it's done with it brings it down to 800x536.

Hey no worries, I'll have to bow out so as I'm just behind on my whole understsanding of getting a pic to that position so I might have one ready for next year's! Someone else, more advanced in the process, will be glad of the space in the book.

oscarBravo

humberklog wrote: »

Well the photo come on cd at 1840x 1232 then after whatever Picasa does then it's done with it brings it down to 800x536.

Can't you just skip the Picasa step and send me the original from the CD?

Hey no worries, I'll have to bow out so as I'm just behind on my whole understsanding of getting a pic to that position so I might have one ready for next year's! Someone else, more advanced in the process, will be glad of the space in the book.

I really liked the pics you sent me, it would be a shame not to include one.