WW2 Pillboxes in Ireland

Morlar

I read on another forum recently about Pillboxes built by the Irish govt in the event of an invasion from the british army.

Here is a link to a 9 page acrobat file
http://www.meath.ie/LocalAuthorities/Publications/HeritagePublications/File,35795,en.pdf

page 5 has this text ;

3.9.11 During the Emergency (1940s) the main planned line of resistance against a threatened overland invasion by British forces based in Northern Ireland was formed by the rivers Boyne and Blackwater.A line of fortifications, comprising blockhouses and machine-gun pits concentrated along the riverbanks, was built.Thirteen of these structures lie within Brú na Bóinne (Fig. 13).

Followed by one photograph and 2 maps on page 6, you can blow the maps up to 300% + without distortion to get the detail. There were a series of approx 30 pillboxes in a 20k line from Navan to Drogheda following the Boyne.

I was wondering if anyone has been to any of these ? Are many still there ? Anyone have any information on the history of them, when exactly they were built, were they regularly occuppied for any period ? Does anyone have any photos of them now or at that time ?

marcsignal

Nice 1 Morlar

I haven't heard of, or been to any of these yet, but just got the Vespa fixed, so I feel a road trip coming on

lucky-colm

marcsignal wrote: »

Nice 1 Morlar

I haven't heard of, or been to any of these yet, but just got the Vespa fixed, so I feel a road trip coming on

groovy

leincar

There is a pillbox on the Waterford to Tramore Road. I think its midway between Waterford and Tramore on a rocky outcrop on the right hand side.

ttm

leincar wrote: »

There is a pillbox on the Waterford to Tramore Road. I think its midway between Waterford and Tramore on a rocky outcrop on the right hand side.

Often seen that one and wondered why it was there, another is/was on the North side of the River bridge at Fidown (on the old road), but you can correct me on that as I havn't been on that road in a few years.

FiSe

Hmm, interesting... One only wonders if 'they' were ever serious about the machineguns.
Doubt that the army had enough of ammo and guns and that the Dept of Finance would puke a few bob for the purchase, even if the Churchill would approve the transaction.

Fuinseog

Morlar wrote: »

I read on another forum recently about Pillboxes built by the Irish govt in the event of an invasion from the british army.

Here is a link to a 9 page acrobat file
http://www.meath.ie/LocalAuthorities/Publications/HeritagePublications/File,35795,en.pdf

page 5 has this text ;

3.9.11 During the Emergency (1940s) the main planned line of resistance against a threatened overland invasion by British forces based in Northern Ireland was formed by the rivers Boyne and Blackwater.A line of fortifications, comprising blockhouses and machine-gun pits concentrated along the riverbanks, was built.Thirteen of these structures lie within Brú na Bóinne (Fig. 13).

Followed by one photograph and 2 maps on page 6, you can blow the maps up to 300% + without distortion to get the detail. There were a series of approx 30 pillboxes in a 20k line from Navan to Drogheda following the Boyne.

I was wondering if anyone has been to any of these ? Are many still there ? Anyone have any information on the history of them, when exactly they were built, were they regularly occuppied for any period ? Does anyone have any photos of them now or at that time ?

i have only been to two of them. there is one in Limerick guarding the road to Ardnacrusha. easy to miss.

there is another in the woods overlooking Blessington. not marked on any OS map.

I was at both 20 years ago. i would be surprised if they have been removed.

chalkitdown

There are two on the river Shannon at Corbally Limerick, near the baths.
It's at a possible fording point, quite shallow, so I figured that there must have been some plan to blow the main bridges.

FiSe

I haven't heard about these before, so I'll be speculating here, but could part of them be WWI leftovers built as a protection against possible German U-Boots or some agents landing / secret service operations?

Ardnacrusha power plant had its own AA battery, or should I say a gun or two, during WWII, so that one could be a part of the guarding system.
There were worries from possible IRA attacks on some of the installments too, I believe...

chalkitdown

You can drive right up to the one at the end of the Mill rd. in Corbally, it covers the old Salmon weir.

Linus67

There are loads of Pillboxes scattered around the Curragh. Though I believe they date from the First World War.

Morlar

Linus67 wrote: »

There are loads of Pillboxes scattered around the Curragh. Though I believe they date from the First World War.

Do you have any photos or links to anything on these ?

Linus67

Morlar wrote: »

Do you have any photos or links to anything on these ?

I don't have any photo's myself but here is a link. The kids in the photo appear to be sitting on a pillbox.

http://www.curragh.info/landmarks/plains.htm

FiSe

Found this link:

http://forum.irishmilitaryonline.com/archive/index.php/t-9447.html

15th post from the top and beyond...

Caoimhín

I know where there are several, along the Boyne and another few beside bridges down the country. I was told that in addition to being used as pillboxes to shoot out of, the army had drilled holes in parts of the nearby bridges. If the British or the Germans attacked, the explosives stored in the pillboxes would be put into the holes in the bridges and blown up leaving the bridge useless.

Morlar

FiSe wrote: »

Found this link:

http://forum.irishmilitaryonline.com/archive/index.php/t-9447.html

15th post from the top and beyond...

Those are brilliant - some great links there cheers. Never heard of that Geraldine Stout book or the Henry Willis study etc.

Mycroft H

I was up in mayo during the summer and there was several of the Aircraft warning posts with EIRE printed in big white letters dotted around the coast.

and if i remember correctly there is a pillbox overlooking the harbour at rosslare.

Morlar

I went down to some of these a few weeks ago with some guys off another forum, found one straight away but the ones I could not find were the ones at the back of the battle of the boyne centre at oldbridge, does anyone have more specific directions to locating them ?

Mike...

I have seen 2 in North Mayo(Belmullet Area) all facing the sea, prob watching ship movements etc

FiSe

Pillboxes or Coastwatcher's huts?

gizmo555

There is quite a few pillboxes dotted around Bere Island, in Bantry Bay, apart from the main fortifications at Rerrin Redoubt.

I don't know whether these were constructed by the Royal Navy, before it left in 1938, or whether perhaps they were built afterwards by the Irish army, with a view to repelling a return by force of the RN during the war . . .

In the same area, on Dursey Island at the tip of the Beara peninsula, there is one of the "EIRE" markers mentioned above, set out in stone. It was on the mainland shore of Dursey Head opposite the island that a Luftwaffe Ju-88 on a reconnaissance/meteorology patrol crashed with the loss of all four crew in July 1943.

http://www.hoelti.de/auschner/eng_reload.html?eng_fotos2.htm

Fajitas!

There's a few along the Waterford coastline too - One above the harbour in Dunmore East, by the weather tower. It's been flooded for years though. There's another at least three that I know of along the coast from there to the west.

who the fug

gizmo555 wrote: »

There is quite a few pillboxes dotted around Bere Island, in Bantry Bay, apart from the main fortifications at Rerrin Redoubt.

I don't know whether these were constructed by the Royal Navy, before it left in 1938, or whether perhaps they were built afterwards by the Irish army, with a view to repelling a return by force of the RN during the war . . .
]

Most of these would date back to the 1st world war , on Whiddy island there fortification built by the Americans who were based there during the first world war

FiSe

That's what I'd say too.
I think that the temporary Coastwatching Service structures - those 82 concrete boxes with large bay windows facing the sea and with the whitewashed stone 'EIRE' signs situated on the sites along the coast, was the largest pure Irish military development in Ireland during the WWII or 'Emergency'.
I am thinking as well, that most of the concrete machine gun pillboxes could be leftovers from the previous war, but could be wrong.

Just to make sure that we know what we are talking about. The original Coastwatcher's hut or LOP in perfect condition is on the Wicklow Head still in use today, housing some maritime radio setup.
Here's a picture of Rathlee Tower in Sligo, the coastwatcher's hut can be seen just to the left of the tower.

gizmo555

who the fug wrote: »

Most of these would date back to the 1st world war , on Whiddy island there fortification built by the Americans who were based there during the first world war

That's fascinating stuff - I've strong family connections to the area, but I never knew of the US WW1 airbase on Whiddy.

http://www.thebantrygrapevine.com/index.php/latest-issue-mainmenu-2/140-us-airbase-on-whiddy-island?format=pdf

In early March 1918 US Naval personnel arrived to build a seaplane patrol base. It was built on
the east of Whiddy Island, using prefabricated units as quarters for the men. A large hanger and
work shop was also built, all these were laid on a concrete base. A jetty was also built.
The base was commissioned as a Naval Air Station on 4th July 1918. Flight operations began
on 25 Sept 1918. The base operated for only 7 weeks under wartime conditions and closed 15
Feb 1919.
The base had an operational radio station capable of receiving messages from as far as U.S.
and Russia.
There were 5 Irish stations, Queenstown(Cobh), Wexford, Lough Foyle, Whiddy &
CastletownBere.. The sites were selected by the request of the British Admiralty in accordance
with their plan of operation against submarines. All stations were completed at the same time.
Queenstown (Cobh) patrol station was the repair and supply depot & headquarters of the
commander of US naval air stations.
Thw Queenstown(Cobh) base patrolled as far as Cape Clear and the Whiddy base (also known
as the Bantry Bay Station) from Cape Clear South West out into the Atlantic.
CastletownBere was a kite-balloon station where balloons were kept for use in conjunction with
torpedo-boat destroyers. The balloons were transferred from the shore to the destroyers, made
fast, & towed at an altitude of about 500feet.
Operations of all stations in Ireland.
Flying hours: 761 hours
Distance covered: 45,683 miles.
Oil patches sighted: 5, Oil patches bombed: 3
Submarines sighted and bombed: 7
2 of the submarines bombed were officially credited as having been so damaged that they had
to return to base. One of the subs was preparing to attack a large convoy of troop ships.
One Whiddy based pilot was killed in a crash on 22nd October 1918.
Considering that each station had for a large part only 2 seaplanes in operation, though at one
stage there were 5 based on Whiddy, and that pilots had to be trained and weather conditions
around the Irish coast are not the best, the results were significant. American air patrols
contributed significantly to the suppression of German submarine activity keeping them at bay
along the convoy routes. The aircraft themselves were very fragile and operations were
extremely hazardous.
With the end of operations all prefabs and the hangers were removed. What remains is the
concrete base, now overgrown. I am told, but this has not been confirmed, that it was the first
use of concrete in this area. Maybe a reader could confirm this!
Hazel Vickery
Photographs with permission of Ralph Gifford, taken while he was stationed on Whiddy Island
1 /

kymkemp

My grandfather, Neil Kemp, and another man were in the plane that crashed. My grandfather survived but the other man didn't. I would love to know more about what his life was like there and what happened in the crash.

KerranJast

There were detailed plans drawn up at the time to coordinate British and Irish forces in the event of a German invasion of the South coast of Ireland. The Irish Army would slow the German advance until British forces from the North could get to front. There were also plans for reinforcement landings from Britain on the East Coast of Ireland. I highly doubt the Irish Govt at the time would therefore construct expensive defensive structures pointing the other way. Although maybe they were being cautious.

who the fug

kymkemp wrote: »

My grandfather, Neil Kemp, and another man were in the plane that crashed. My grandfather survived but the other man didn't. I would love to know more about what his life was like there and what happened in the crash.

A good book on Naval operations in the first world war was written by one captains of sloop that patrolled the south west approaches, I can't remember his name or the book title, but will ask my father at the weekend and get back to you (This book was first published circa 1932)


Off the top of my head


Overall command was in Cobh and they spend more time fighting the weather than the enemy

The USS Texas was based in Berehaven at the top of Bantry Bay for 1917/18/19


Suggest you also send a letter to Bantry Historical Society, Newtown, Bantry, Co. Cork Rep. of Ireland, who have been around for over 40 years, am sure in their records their will some accounts of life on Whiddy Island during the early part of the last century

What sort of information are you looking for?

kymkemp

According to my research, neither my grandfather nor the man killed (see obit below for more about him) were pilots. We have the gearshift of the plane, the watch he was wearing and I know my grandfather had some scars but we don't know much about the accident. The photo's show the plane crashed on land. The obit seems to indicate a sea crash. My grandfather never wanted to talk about what happened according to his daughter. I would love to know more.
----

Cassville Republican, Thursday, Dec. 12, 1918

IMPRESSIVE FUNERAL

AT SOLDIER'S GRAVE

Body Of Walfred Anderson

With Home Guard Escort is

Laid To Rest In Spring River Cemetery

The body of Walfred Anderson, a Barry County boy who was killed off the coast of Ireland in a sea plane accident was laid to rest in Spring River cemetery, Dec. 4, with military honors.

The largest crowd ever in attendance at a funeral in this section assembled at the cemetery in honor of the young here, who lost his life in defense of the colors.

On Wednesday morning members of the home guard of Marionville, in charge of Mr. Logan, came here to stand guard over the casket which was on view at Callaway's undertaking room. These guards acted as escort and pall bearers at the funeral.

The part left the undertaking rooms at 1:30 o'clock, the flag draped hearse following the soldier escort. In line there were hundreds of automobiles. At Verona they were met by Home Guards from Mt. Vernon, Verona, Crane, Aurora and Marionville, who marched in front and behind the hearse on the way to the cemetery.

Hundreds of people were waiting at the cemetery when they arrived. The grave was lined with the national colors and at one side the many floral emblems were banked on a flower rack. Immediately behind this was the speakers platform decorated in flags.

MarkR

There was / is two connected concrete pill boxes overlooking shannon airport, just out past aerospace. I remember going there as a kid. No idea when they were constructed.

FiSe

They must be the 'new' ones as Shannon Airport was constructed somewhere in the very late 30's early 40's, I think.

Mahatma coat

Theres a load of them dotted along the coast down In wexford,

Rosslare
Carne
Kilmore
Lough
Cullenstown
Blackhall
Fethard
Bagginbun
Duncannon
Slade
Dollar bay
Hook Head

We always called them coast guard lookouts when I was a kid

a fair few of the ones I listed there have been knocked down tho since I were a kid

but you can still see the concrete slabs for a few of them and as has been mentioned some are still standing, there was a fair network of them along the Wexford coast at one point AFAIK

FiSe

Mahatma coat wrote: »

Theres a load of them dotted along the coast down In wexford,

Rosslare
Carne
Kilmore
Lough
Cullenstown
Blackhall
Fethard
Bagginbun
Duncannon
Slade
Dollar bay
Hook Head

We always called them coast guard lookouts when I was a kid

a fair few of the ones I listed there have been knocked down tho since I were a kid

but you can still see the concrete slabs for a few of them and as has been mentioned some are still standing, there was a fair network of them along the Wexford coast at one point AFAIK

I still think that we are talking and mixing two or three different things together.

Coast Watching Service posts were build from concrete blocks during 1939-1942 as a pre-fab square structures, with 6 bay windows looking towards the sea, entrance on 1 side, small fireplace and square chimney on the roof. They were build on 82 places around the coast of Ireland.

There's and were only 8 of these posts from Arklow to Tramore:
- Kilmichael Point
- Cahore Point
- Ballyconnigar Hill
- Greenore Point
- Carnsore Point
- Forlorn Point
- Hook Head
- Brownstown Head

But there is a lot of structures from different eras, like WWI, Napoleonic wars...

Heisenberg.

This post has been deleted.

Mahatma coat

Thanks FiSe

that makes a bit of sense alright.

I did just lump a lot of structures I remember from my childhood into the one category.

RadioRetro

Hi guys, mind if I contribute a wee bit?

The structure in Rosslare Harbour is a pillbox built into the cliff face facing out over the harbour close to the current Coastguard hut (here; 52°15'0.07"N 6°20'7.30"W). As a youngster I crawled into it but it was empty. It's still there and I dare say it's full of detritus left by youngsters now though!

There is a pillbox/LOP on a rocky outcrop with a good view of the approach to Wexford town from the harbour at Kerlogue. There's a GE marker at 52°19'4.77" N 6°27'33.27"W.

chem

Morlar wrote: »

I went down to some of these a few weeks ago with some guys off another forum, found one straight away but the ones I could not find were the ones at the back of the battle of the boyne centre at oldbridge, does anyone have more specific directions to locating them ?

Hi Morlar, The pill box at the oldbridge enterance is found between the old Iron bridge and the stone bridge beside the enterance to oldbridge. Its not sunk into the ground. But has a doorway and rifle slits. If you drive over the old stone bridge from the Duleek side its straight infront of you.

Also another pillbox as you come into Drogheda from the collon road. Its down abit from lidal on your left after the 1st junction, after the roundabout. Its on the right hand side of the road before the pub. Hope this helps.

Morlar

chem wrote: »

Hi Morlar, The pill box at the oldbridge enterance is found between the old Iron bridge and the stone bridge beside the enterance to oldbridge. Its not sunk into the ground. But has a doorway and rifle slits. If you drive over the old stone bridge from the Duleek side its straight infront of you.

Also another pillbox as you come into Drogheda from the collon road. Its down abit from lidal on your left after the 1st junction, after the roundabout. Its on the right hand side of the road before the pub. Hope this helps.

Cheers - I think that is the one that I found the one just over an old stone bridge, about 40-50 feet up the road in to the left facing down to the bridge at a slight slope. You can still get into it as a matter of fact. Have some photos of it so must put them online when I get a chance. I was looking for a bunch of other ones up near the battle of the boyne visitor site as I saw on an internet site that there are supposed to be 4 or 5 right beside the b.o.b visitor site - right at the curve of the river there.

Morlar

Here is the one I am thinking of

chem

I was talking to a man from N.I he was saying that during the cold war there was underground nuclear bunkers built in almost every major town. They were just man hole covers to the public, but were stocked bunkers for important people who would be needed. He said most of them have been welded closed now. Just some interesting info

[quote=Fuinseog;62156358
there is another in the woods overlooking Blessington. not marked on any OS map.

I was at both 20 years ago. i would be surprised if they have been removed.[/quote]


Any idea where the Blessington one is, possibly with a vague Google Maps link? I'd be fascinated to see this.

drumaneen

There is a guy on WW2talk site that has an interest in Pillboxes in Eire so if anybody ahs any info, locations, photos etc I'm sure he'd love to hear from you.
See http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/barracks/20572-pillboxes-eire.html

FiSe

If you are on that forum, maybe it would be easier to post a link to this thread. As would be, probably, impossible to pour all the information from one forum to the other forum without loosing continuity and the information themselfs. Just a thought....

drumaneen

FiSe wrote: »

If you are on that forum, maybe it would be easier to post a link to this thread. As would be, probably, impossible to pour all the information from one forum to the other forum without loosing continuity and the information themselfs. Just a thought....

Good Idea .... done

bobby wade

There was one as you leave wexford to go to Rosslare on a rocky outcrop, don't know if it was world war II or even if it's still there. i remember being in it as a kid but havn't seen it in years (overgrown or tore down I don't know)

Morpheus

As posted on that thread on IMO....

There are a number of pillboxes at gormanston, one at the camps entrance, one situated directly on the railway bridge that leads to the farm style gate that opens onto the lane for the ranges - smelly and dirty but grateful to sit in it when doing security on rainy days.

Also if you go down to the beach that is situated UNDER the iron bridge over the delvin rivers mouth, and turn left and walk towards ben head (which is quite a distance from there) keep looking up on your left and you will see a concrete lookout point which looks out over the sea halway to ben head, there is usually a rope you can use to climb up the cliff face into it.

Finally in the fields around the range there are one or two more pill boxes discernable but i have not been in them.

BrianD

I recall that there's one or two around the Boyne in Co. Meath as well.

RadioRetro

bobby wade wrote: »

There was one as you leave wexford to go to Rosslare on a rocky outcrop

See post #36. It's still there.

bobby wade

RadioRetro wrote: »

See post #36. It's still there.

No this one wasn't in rosslare harbour It was above the nursing home as you turn of the rosslare road towards killinick

sickpuppy32

ttm wrote: »

Often seen that one and wondered why it was there, another is/was on the North side of the River bridge at Fidown (on the old road), but you can correct me on that as I havn't been on that road in a few years.

yeah thats still there, across from the bridge and the Morris oil depot

Morlar

BrianD wrote: »

I recall that there's one or two around the Boyne in Co. Meath as well.

You wouldn't happen to know where exactly in Boyne would you ?

I dug up some maps from the council site earlier in the thread and was down there behind the Battle of the Boyne site at oldbridge but either the bunkers were removed postwar or they were super secret bunkers that rise up out of the ground and submerge again when the danger is passed cos I couldn't bloody find them !