Yellow reg, cant hit back

Leo Demidov

Just wondering how its possible for a businessman to run a fleet of vans around the south east, all on british plates, some of them in the country a few years, some of them sign written with his address etc.

There could be no way that he forgot or didnt have time to attend to vrt, which i believe is cheap for such vehicles. He also has at least one passenger jeep, bringing them in and selling them on every few months.

I presume that he has exempted himself from DOE and road tax also. Is there a special club or something.

pa990

title is confusing.. what do you mean by "..can't hit back" ??

Shield

Moved from ES with redirect.

Leo Demidov

My apologies, its a throw back to a childhood game where you hit your siblings when you saw a yellow reg and they couldnt hit you back, great on a long journey or in the border counties. You havent lived.

tdc

wexfjord wrote: »

My apologies, its a throw back to a childhood game where you hit your siblings when you saw a yellow reg and they couldnt hit you back, great on a long journey or in the border counties. You havent lived.

**** ive been missing out!!! :rolleyes:

who cares, if hes been doing it for a few years its probably legal - if not, well, its not as if its directly affecting you so i think you should mind your own business rather than interfering in your neighbours

Bluefoam

tdc wrote: »

**** ive been missing out!!! :rolleyes:

who cares, if hes been doing it for a few years its probably legal - if not, well, its not as if its directly affecting you so i think you should mind your own business rather than interfering in your neighbours

Why should I pay vrt and tax while this guy benefits from dodgy activity. He should be reported and have to deal with the full extent of the law

tdc

Bluefoam wrote: »

Why should I pay vrt and tax while this guy benefits from dodgy activity. He should be reported and have to deal with the full extent of the law

well (assuming he is doing it illegally) he's taking the risk and he knows that if he gets caught he's fcuked. if paying the vrt/tax bothers you that much then be like him and dont pay. several of my neighbours are driving uk red'd cars but im not losing any sleep over it. im driving my irish reg'd car with the up to date tax but why would i ring the gaurds/revenue office? because i have nothing better to do than worry about what money my neighbours are spending? ill look after my money and my neighbours can look after theirs, thanks.

Drummerboy08

OP why not just report it to the Gardai? He'll be caught sooner or later either way.

pa990

Report it to the Gardai or Customs.

either of them can take action

Wishbone Ash

wexfjord wrote: »

some of them in the country a few years, some of them sign written with his address etc.

Is the business address in the ROI?

(The VRT for a commercial vehicle is usually a flat rate of €50 (unless it exempted) so it's not really depriving the state of much income).

bladebrew

there are loads of people driving around on yellow plates who "forget" the vrt,i have seen a car on english plates with a munster sticker in the back window,thats asking for trouble:)

JHMEG

VRT is 13.3% on most commercials, ie vans derived from cars.

budda15c

tdc wrote: »

**** ive been missing out!!! :rolleyes:

who cares, if hes been doing it for a few years its probably legal - if not, well, its not as if its directly affecting you so i think you should mind your own business rather than interfering in your neighbours

Well really it does effect the OP, if the VRT isn't paid and it's not registered in the Republic, the vehicle can't be taxed. Why should the rest of us pay tax on our cars to use the roads and some people not a cent.. Just call the Revenue or Customs.

Leo Demidov

In reply to several posts, he has panel vans and rigid trucks, Irish registered business and i dont like him so i'm making it my business, that and civic duty obviously. His brother in law is a garda so customs might be the way to go. The only thing holding me back is karma.

ant043

i voted for mind your own business. I know alot of people i don't like driving uk reg cars but i'd never report them. It's not my business what they get up to and i have better things to be doing. Don't be a snitch.

stevie.enright

Not saying you are lying or anything like but if he has a fleet of veichles I really and truly could not imagine him getting away without re-registering the vehicles in the Republic for too long. I meet Gardai checkpoints often enough whether it is daytime or night time and I am just me, myself and I! I know that An Gardai and customs are clamping down on this very heavily of late. Perhaps his business is registered in Northern Ireland or he has a Northern Ireland postal address or some other means which exonorates him from VRT'n the vehicles. It may perhaps be immoral but he may/ (may not) be operating on the correct side of the law all the same?

ninty9er

Like has already been mentioned, if they're proper vans it's only €50 per vehicle so not that much, all the same it is your moral obligation to make sure that he is contributing the same as anyone else. However, I can't help but feel that you know SFA about the business end and that this is actually an Irish subsidiary of a UK business with one owning vehicles and the other operating the drivers.

Leo Demidov

stevie.enright wrote: »

Not saying you are lying or anything like but if he has a fleet of veichles I really and truly could not imagine him getting away without re-registering the vehicles in the Republic for too long. I meet Gardai checkpoints often enough whether it is daytime or night time and I am just me, myself and I! I know that An Gardai and customs are clamping down on this very heavily of late. Perhaps his business is registered in Northern Ireland or he has a Northern Ireland postal address or some other means which exonorates him from VRT'n the vehicles. It may perhaps be immoral but he may/ (may not) be operating on the correct side of the law all the same?

While I'm quite sure the business is registered in ireland, I'd presume that any non-national companies would have to re-register their vehicles if they are permenantly used on Irish roads

Leo Demidov

ninty9er wrote: »

Like has already been mentioned, if they're proper vans it's only €50 per vehicle so not that much, all the same it is your moral obligation to make sure that he is contributing the same as anyone else. However, I can't help but feel that you know SFA about the business end and that this is actually an Irish subsidiary of a UK business with one owning vehicles and the other operating the drivers.

The CRO offer a great service to anyone with a valid credit card.

stevie.enright

wexfjord wrote: »

if they are permenantly used on Irish roads

Are they though?

Leo Demidov

stevie.enright wrote: »

Are they though?

Some vehicles are parked up outside his business premises at night, others at the homes of his employees who live locally. None of them venture over the border after dark. In any event its an irish registered company so your question was based on the hypothetical notion of a company based outside the state with vehicles operating within the state on a long term/permanent basis.

tdc

wexfjord wrote: »

The only thing holding me back is karma.

so get on with yourself and let it catch up with him!

guess which one i voted for :pac:

wexfjord wrote: »

some vehicles are parked up outside his business premises at night, others at the homes of his employees who live locally.

im not too up on this so correct me if im wrong but if he is using uk plated cars for his business and using them as company cars (for his employees) would that mean he wouldnt be able to put them down as a business expense? maybe he is paying, one way or another?!

Leo Demidov

For the sake of clarity I should state that I assume the vehicles do not traverse the border overnight, based on the random times I have seen them parked up, and in any event that is irrelevant based on my previous post.

I have a certain sympathy for those who find themselves working outside the letter of the law but not for someone who seeks to gain unfair advantage over others in business by engaging in unscrupulous practices.

The gentleman in question is widely acknowledged as a gangster and will ultimately engage with justice. This thread was originally posted in Emergency Services and should probably have been posted in Law.

Realistically I'm very unlikely to report him, the intention of my post is to determine whether the contempt I hold for such a person is justified. Given our current economic status is it just that someone in a position to contribute to society should be permitted to shirk his social responsibility, give two fingers to those of us who play largely by the rules.

Currently the poll sems to agree with my sentiments, well done to those who think its okay to turn a blind eye to transgressions of the law. Is it only certain laws you like to see broken or only the victimless ones like revenue etc.

L1011

If he's legit, Revenue will back off; if he's conning us he's doing everyone out of money in some regard - the vehicles will be taxed and properly insured out of the state also. Shop him. Revenue in Burnfoot (Donegal) used to be where you reported to.

Leo Demidov

tdc wrote: »

so get on with yourself and let it catch up with him!

guess which one i voted for :pac:



im not too up on this so correct me if im wrong but if he is using uk plated cars for his business and using them as company cars (for his employees) would that mean he wouldnt be able to put them down as a business expense? maybe he is paying, one way or another?!

Fair point and you may well be correct, my knowledge of the law might be similar to your own. In this instance though he is , for the most part using these vehicles personally, as are his staff. They are large, panel vans so no BIK and I'm sure that when he does sell them on there is no loss to him, regardless of how long he kept them. If he can hold onto a vehicle for a certain period of time, pay no VRT, no tax or doe and then sell it on, even in the current climate he might just break even.

Allowing that he has been doing this for years I'm certain that its for his benefit and not ours, as per my original post, I am bemused as to how he is geting away with this.

Leo Demidov

tdc wrote: »

guess which one i voted for :pac:


I'm still guessing.

Leo Demidov

MYOB wrote: »

If he's legit, Revenue will back off; if he's conning us he's doing everyone out of money in some regard - the vehicles will be taxed and properly insured out of the state also. Shop him. Revenue in Burnfoot (Donegal) used to be where you reported to.

While I accept what you say, does MYOB not stand for Mind Your Own Business as per my poll on page 1. Signed Pedantic Pat.;)

L1011

wexfjord wrote: »

While I accept what you say, does MYOB not stand for Mind Your Own Business as per my poll on page 1. Signed Pedantic Pat.;)

I've been meaning to stump up the cash for a subscription to change that for *years*....

There is BIK on vans, btw - just sod all. I pay less for mine than I did in petrol when I didn't have one.

Leo Demidov

MYOB wrote: »

I've been meaning to stump up the cash for a subscription to change that for *years*....

There is BIK on vans, btw - just sod all. I pay less for mine than I did in petrol when I didn't have one.

That is why I fear karma. I did not know that there was BIK on vans. Looks like I'm the real criminal here with my BIK free Transit. I fear I may go to hell.

seanybiker

wexfjord wrote: »

My apologies, its a throw back to a childhood game where you hit your siblings when you saw a yellow reg and they couldnt hit you back, great on a long journey or in the border counties. You havent lived.

Dont forget if ya see a reg with two numbers the same ya can hit the person also. Cant remember what 3 numbers the same was.

Dave147

Bluefoam wrote: »

Why should I pay vrt and tax while this guy benefits from dodgy activity. He should be reported and have to deal with the full extent of the law

Because you're a pushover who does whatever he's told? Or was that a rhetorical question. Mind your own business, if he's caught he's caught, if not fair play to him for taking a risk.

tdc

wexfjord wrote: »

I'm still guessing.

based on my original post its fairly obvious :pac:

Eru

tdc wrote: »

**** ive been missing out!!! :rolleyes:

who cares, if hes been doing it for a few years its probably legal - if not, well, its not as if its directly affecting you so i think you should mind your own business rather than interfering in your neighbours

It will effect him when some fcker driving like a lunatic smashes into him then flees the scene all on a UK reg plate which means he cant be traced, cant get penalty points and guess who ends up paying to repair the damage? Legally registered and insured drivers is who.

So no, the OP shouldnt mind his own business because people minding their own business is what allows cases like the Christian brothers and domestic violence or child abuse to continue because everyone 'minds their own business'.

Bluefoam

Dave147 wrote: »

Because you're a pushover who does whatever he's told? Or was that a rhetorical question. Mind your own business, if he's caught he's caught, if not fair play to him for taking a risk.

Does the same apply for a hit and run driver? Should I let him away once he gets away with it, or does your opinion only relate.to certain laws? If so please give me a list of which ones should be obeyed or not...

tdc

Eru wrote: »

It will effect him when some fcker driving like a lunatic smashes into him then flees the scene all on a UK reg plate which means he cant be traced, cant get penalty points and guess who ends up paying to repair the damage? Legally registered and insured drivers is who.

They dont have to give their name or address for insurance in the UK?

ScouseMouse

JHMEG wrote: »

VRT is 13.3% on most commercials, ie vans derived from cars.

Its 50 euro VRT to bring a commercial in from the UK.

rebel.ranter

superscouse wrote: »

Its 50 euro VRT to bring a commercial in from the UK.

No previous poster is correct, 13.5% for car/jeep derived vans. It is €50 for larger commercial vehicles over 3.5 tonnes.

bonzodog2

As far as i remember, Bus Eirrean operate the coaches to UK on the ferries, under the Eurolines name; I think they're all UK registered

ION08

Eru wrote: »

So no, the OP shouldnt mind his own business because people minding their own business is what allows cases like the Christian brothers and domestic violence or child abuse to continue because everyone 'minds their own business'.

Hardly an applicable example in a scenario of VRT evasion - which is an illegal tax to begin with anyway :rolleyes: (thats a different story tho)


I voted mind your own business. IF, what he is doing is illegal .. it's a risk he is assuming onto himself, and if he gets caught he gets caught. If you want to take the same risk of vrt evasion, for whatever reasons you may have then that's your own business too , not mine or anybody elses here

L1011

ION08 wrote: »

Hardly an applicable example in a scenario of VRT evasion - which is an illegal tax to begin with anyway :rolleyes: (thats a different story tho)

Except its not. Its against the spirit but *entirely* within the letter of the law. And we're not the only country in the EU with an identical system.

"VRT is illegal!" is the most commonly used incorrect statement / lie on the motors forum.

Cuddlesworth

He's not paying tax, he's not getting a DOE to say his vans are up to Irish road standards, he most likely is not paying tolls on the M50.

He's ripping off the state and by proxy he is ripping off every person in this country who is paying their way. Vrt, road tax, tolls etc are all there for a reason. To pay for needed services which the state funds, hospitals, schools, road maintenance all of which are having their budgets slashed due to lack of necessary funds.

Report him and let him deal with his ignorance. I would.

Dave147

Bluefoam wrote: »

Does the same apply for a hit and run driver? Should I let him away once he gets away with it, or does your opinion only relate.to certain laws? If so please give me a list of which ones should be obeyed or not...

Great comparison.

Matt Simis

Eru wrote: »

It will effect him when some fcker driving like a lunatic smashes into him then flees the scene all on a UK reg plate which means he cant be traced, cant get penalty points and guess who ends up paying to repair the damage? Legally registered and insured drivers is who.

So no, the OP shouldnt mind his own business because people minding their own business is what allows cases like the Christian brothers and domestic violence or child abuse to continue because everyone 'minds their own business'.

Thats a baseless accusation on top of an invented scenario mixed in with an incorrect notion that a Yellow Reg means "no reg".


Be warned Dave147, the VRT Stasi are a powerful and whiny force that patrol these waters.

They report Jay-Walkers, dogs with no leads and horses with no diapers too as its the right thing to do..
Report on glorious comrades.

Eru

tdc wrote: »

They dont have to give their name or address for insurance in the UK?

Last time I checked the Republic of Ireland and An Garda Siochana were not part of the UK and had no jurisdiction outside the Republic of Ireland. Nor do we have an automatic system for recording the registration details of foriegn registered vehicles. Perhaps Im wrong and its common to see Gardai arresting people in England and mainland europe while our tax system contains all the information on the worlds cars.

Matt Simis wrote: »

Thats a baseless accusation on top of an invented scenario mixed in with an incorrect notion that a Yellow Reg means "no reg".

Nope, its history. People knew crime was being commited but ignored it as it was 'none of their business'. Many witnesses have stated this as why they didnt speak out at the time. As for yellow reg as you call it, it is no reg within the Republic. Its not insured, its not taxed, he doesnt pay toll's and as pointed out already, if he smashes into you and flees the scene there is no way for your insurance company or the Gardai to trace him as we do not contain registration details for foreign vehicles (which are probable old or incorrect anyway) anymore than a French authority will know who owns your car.

Yes, the information can be obtained via interpol or europpol but it cant be acted on and as said, is more than likely old or incorrect.

Matt Simis

Eru wrote: »

Nope, its history. People knew crime was being commited but ignored it as it was 'none of their business'. Many witnesses have stated this as why they didnt speak out at the time. As for yellow reg as you call it, it is no reg within the Republic. Its not insured, its not taxed, he doesnt pay toll's and as pointed out already, if he smashes into you and flees the scene there is no way for your insurance company or the Gardai to trace him as we do not contain registration details for foreign vehicles (which are probable old or incorrect anyway) anymore than a French authority will know who owns your car.

Yes, the information can be obtained via interpol or europpol but it cant be acted on and as said, is more than likely old or incorrect.

History?
So you are saying this "business mans" vehicles specifically have been in accidents and fled the scene or are you just saying, like I stated, what could happen, not what did happen?

Not Insured?
Ive driven 3 cars recently, all Yellow regs and all insured, what are you on about? There is no connection to the UK Reg and Insurance. All my cars were insured by IRISH INSURANCE companies.

Untracable reg plates... Interpol? Lol, bless.
Granted, finding out the ownership of a foreign reg isnt something a Garda can do on the side of the road (easily), but its very doable. Do you really think all that it takes to be some untouchable, invisible criminal mastermind is to pop over and back to Holyhead? Lets hope you dont put this outside the box law breaking genius of yours to work or we are all screwed hmm?
And to illustrate the ease of finding out UK Reg plates and Irish Insurance companies; I called out the reg number of one of the cars to them incorrectly accidentally, they rang me back within 2hrs saying they couldnt find the reg I gave them on their system.. ie the system of UK registration plates they seemingly have access to. This is just the Customer Support rep in XS Direct btw, not some Super Intendant in Interpol you like to portray.

Jesus, just stop digging already, you dont have a case here. The begrudgery and outright naivety on this forum regarding VRT and foreign cars is embarrassing.

Cuddlesworth

Matt Simis wrote: »

Untracable reg plates... Interpol? Lol, bless.
Granted, finding out the ownership of a foreign reg isnt something a Garda can do on the side of the road (easily), but its very doable. Do you really think all that it takes to be some untouchable, invisible criminal mastermind is to pop over and back to Holyhead? Lets hope you dont put this outside the box law breaking genius of yours to work or we are all screwed hmm?
And to illustrate the ease of finding out UK Reg plates and Irish Insurance companies; I called out the reg number of one of the cars to them incorrectly accidentally, they rang me back within 2hrs saying they couldnt find the reg I gave them on their system.. ie the system of UK registration plates they seemingly have access to. This is just the Customer Support rep in XS Direct btw, not some Super Intendant in Interpol you like to portray.

Jesus, just stop digging already, you dont have a case here. The begrudgery and outright naivety on this forum regarding VRT and foreign cars is embarrassing.

I sincerely doubt that the majority of English regged cars are still registered to anybody besides their previous English owner. So once again, no trace back to the Irish owner. Except from the insurance company who to my belief do not share details with the gardai unless requested. Must be nice to have to go through the hundreds of insurance company's for the remote possibility its insured.

Matt Simis

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

I sincerely doubt that the majority of English regged cars are still registered to anybody besides their previous English owner. So once again, no trace back to the Irish owner. Except from the insurance company who to my belief do not share details with the gardai unless requested. Must be nice to have to go through the hundreds of insurance company's for the remote possibility its insured.

Well then you dont know how to import a car then. When you export a car from the UK it very much doesnt remain registered in the previous owners name (otherwise they would be stung for tax etc).
Every time I exported a car from the UK my name and address were sent to the DVLA along with the of permanent UK Export section of the V5C. On top of that, the previous owner/seller likely knows who they sold the car to, a bit of detective work (if only we employed some sort of civil servant to do this detective work) would be all that is required. There also arent 100s of independent insurers in Ireland.

All completely irrelevant to this thread as the OP knows the Business owner, marked vans in question.

This all comes down to one thing; people dont like to see other people doing better or not doing as bad as themselves in Ireland.
Its not about running over schoolchildren and racing away, its not over no insurance, its not about large, sweeping Interpol investigations for invisible cars. They are excuses from those that wont acknowledge their socially indoctrinated begrugrery. And thats why the more BS "facts" are thrown up, the easier it gets to pick them apart.

stealthyspeeder

I have a yellow reg on my car and I live in Dublin, because I am down here with work and I regularly go home. I am excempt from the VRT (special excemption for this purpose).

If some busy body reported me becasue they thought I was evading VRT, I would be pissed off! I have all the documentaion to prove that I am excempt according to the exception, and would show customs this on being asked. However if I somebody reported me, and I knew who it was, I would be going out of my way to find the slightest thing illegal about them and I would be putting them in it at the first oppertuinity.

So by all means, if your cleaner than clean and want to act in the tax payers interest, go for it.

My advice would be mind you own business, its better to have friends than enemies.

Cuddlesworth

Matt Simis wrote: »

Well then you dont know how to import a car then. When you export a car from the UK it very much doesnt remain registered in the previous owners name (otherwise they would be stung for tax etc).
Every time I exported a car from the UK my name and address were sent to the DVLA along with the of permanent UK Export section of the V5C. On top of that, the previous owner/seller likely knows who they sold the car to, a bit of detective work (if only we employed some sort of civil servant to do this detective work) would be all that is required. There also arent 100s of independent insurers in Ireland.

No I have never imported a car.Who confirms the name and address you gave are correct?

Matt Simis wrote: »

This all comes down to one thing; people dont like to see other people doing better or not doing as bad as themselves in Ireland.

No, it comes down to seeing people not paying their way in life. And the fact that there abuses are mindlessly ignored. I have no doubt that you would be top of the queue screaming that FAS wasted your money, the government gets paid too much etc. Where do you think this money comes from? What right have you to complain if you don't believe people should have to pay towards it?

Matt Simis wrote: »

Its not about running over schoolchildren and racing away, its not over no insurance, its not about large, sweeping Interpol investigations for invisible cars. They are excuses from those that wont acknowledge their socially indoctrinated begrugrery. And thats why the more BS "facts" are thrown up, the easier it gets to pick them apart.

No its about spongers. The ones who rip off hard working tax paying members of our country. If you don't like the idea of road tax, VRT, DOE or any other tax's then feel free to find a country which doesn't have them in some form or other.

Matt Simis

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

No I have never imported a car.Who confirms the name and address you gave are correct?

I had to provide my Passport each time to the seller. But yeah, I could have had a fake passport, fake Bank Draft (Sterling Drafts are hand written by Bank personal, so Id have to fake all that too) etc too right? Gimmie a break, if you and rest here dont know then stop frick'en commenting as if you do!

No, it comes down to seeing people not paying their way in life. And the fact that there abuses are mindlessly ignored. I have no doubt that you would be top of the queue screaming that FAS wasted your money, the government gets paid too much etc. Where do you think this money comes from? What right have you to complain if you don't believe people should have to pay towards it?

Having heard again on the radio about a certain Minister spending 10s of thousands on Limo rides to the airport, I really think if people were a bit more considerate and intelligent with their tax money (as opposed to paying it then bitching about neighbours, then voting in the same people again and again) we would infact have a better run country. Regardless, if someone doesnt pay VRT to then get squandered by our government, I really just cant get upset over that. Im not on for doing things out of principle or tradition if they are moronic or wasteful. So Im not going to be won over by such a weak argument.

No its about spongers. The ones who rip off hard working tax paying members of our country. If you don't like the idea of road tax, VRT, DOE or any other tax's then feel free to find a country which doesn't have them in some form or other.

Well, you see here you have made another false assumption, or at the very least alluded to, that I dont pay VRT or Tax. I do indeed and infact I have personally handed over EUR36,000 to our government in the last 4.5years as VRT plus about EUR8000 as Motor Tax. Which I dare say is a lot more than the vast majority of people on this thread or on the road. So there.
I think Im very entitled to have an opinion on how this money was spent (wasted) and how I feel about those that didnt pay it (I dont care, I dont spy on neighbours).

Eru

OK then so, if your all driving on UK plates (not just the colour yellow as is clear from the OP) how does An Garda Siochana find out who in the Republic of Ireland owns this vehicle? The PULSE system wont have any record of the car unless its previously been stopped for some reason. Now we can get the information but yes believe it or not its through Interpol or Europol. You cant just ring the UK and get this information however were assuming that the information is accurate. What is the person moved her with the vehicle? All we have then is an old name and an old UK address with no follow on.

Secondly, if and when you import a vehicle into the Republic of Ireland you are required to register it which means you obtain an Irish reg plate (99D123456 or whatever as apposed to abc123)

People are exempt under the circumstances that the vehicle will not be in the state longer than 1 year. If you are or intend to remain in the state longer than 1 year you have 24 hours to register the vehicle. Noe this doesnt mean leaving and returning every so often, if you actually live in the republic then you have to register the vehicle. Also, Yellow reg plates are illegal in the Republic regardless of what number they show so anyone driving on yellow plates is commiting an offence.

Theres a case even where people are insured. Most policies will only allow you to drive abroad for 1 month so if your company finds out you actually live abroad they wont honour your policy. Then of course we have to consider that not all countries insurance requirements meet our own standards (personal injury is not covered in all eu countries for example) soi even if you do get details it may be off to court for a few years while you try and sue the driver.

As for all the rest being exempt, etc etc. Theres the genuine of course and the many not so genuine and if you think all the UK, Polish, Lithuanian, etc registered vehicles here are legit well I guess you may want to buy some magic beans as well.

Just dont cry here when said foreign car hits you and leaves the scene which despite belief here is common enough