Official Poll: Have debates on boards.ie influenced how you will vote on Lisbon II?

Stark

jhegarty wrote: »

In which direction ?

Well by "campaign", I mean a handful of saddos with nothing better to do: http://www.politics.ie/2043504-post14.html

Rb

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

Are you sure it's not that certain 'Yes' campaigners run contrary to your views on both democracy and republicanism, and that Lisbon maybe doesn't?

People are free to talk about the poll. Anyone starting to campaign in this thread or discussion campaign issues etc will have their posts deleted.

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PopeBuckfastXVI

Rb wrote: »

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<-- Report Post Button.

nesf

Less of the backseat moderating and less of the dragging the thread off-topic please.

Max Power1

was no, still no.

Wouldnt depend on a net forum to tell me how to vote tbh.

FutureTaoiseach

Was no - still no.

Stark

FutureTaoiseach wrote: »

Was no - still no.

Since 1973.

K-9

Good to see the undecided vote is veering Yes. That will be the key.

TD1980

Hi,

I wonder does anyone have a contact for those who organised the "yes" campaign on Grafton St. today?

I took some photos and want to send them on.

Cheers,

TD

ei.sdraob

Stark wrote: »

Since 1973.

may i ask why the infraction for that?

that pretty much sums up SF position to Europe since and before we joined the EU

PopeBuckfastXVI

ei.sdraob wrote: »

may i ask why the infraction for that?

that pretty much sums up SF position to Europe since and before we joined the EU

Helpdesk -> http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=30

FutureTaoiseach

This is going to be a very close referendum. Are we agreed on that?

PopeBuckfastXVI

FutureTaoiseach wrote: »

This is going to be a very close referendum. Are we agreed on that?

Aren't they all...

nesf

ei.sdraob wrote: »

may i ask why the infraction for that?

that pretty much sums up SF position to Europe since and before we joined the EU

This thread isn't meant to contain any debate or argument.

FutureTaoiseach

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

Aren't they all...

No not always.

nesf

FutureTaoiseach wrote: »

No not always.

Referenda on EU treaties do tend to be though. At least over the past decade.

Was no, now leaning to yes(undecided)

FutureTaoiseach

Why does this poll only only have 12% of the numbers voting in the other poll on Lisbon?

ei.sdraob

FutureTaoiseach wrote: »

Why does this poll only only have 12% of the numbers voting in the other poll on Lisbon?

because the other poll ran for alot longer

and because FreebornJohn must have registered at least under few dozen aliases in order to skew it

someoneok

There is so much fearmongering from the yes side saying there wont be any jobs but those people dont realise that the corpoartion taxes will be raised if it's ratified. Them yesmen are such liars and there is a deeper agenda with this treaty. Why would we want to have an oligarchy control us and have an EU constitution supercede our beautiful constitution. I read a great book the other day which shows the real literal translation of our constitution which is hidden from us in the fake blue book by micheal o cearuil a study of the irish text.I found it on some site and subsiquently found it has been taken out of print when i went to buy a hard copy in a law bookstore because i hate pdfs.

IrishSerf

someoneok wrote: »

There is so much fearmongering from the yes side saying there wont be any jobs but those people dont realise that the corpoartion taxes will be raised if it's ratified. Them yesmen are such liars and there is a deeper agenda with this treaty. Why would we want to have an oligarchy control us and have an EU constitution supercede our beautiful constitution. I read a great book the other day which shows the real literal translation of our constitution which is hidden from us in the fake blue book by micheal o cearuil a study of the irish text.I found it on some site and subsiquently found it has been taken out of print when i went to buy a hard copy in a law bookstore because i hate pdfs.

So I'll put you down for a " was no, still no" then?

meglome

someoneok wrote: »

There is so much fearmongering from the yes side saying there wont be any jobs but those people dont realise that the corpoartion taxes will be raised if it's ratified. Them yesmen are such liars and there is a deeper agenda with this treaty. Why would we want to have an oligarchy control us and have an EU constitution supercede our beautiful constitution. I read a great book the other day which shows the real literal translation of our constitution which is hidden from us in the fake blue book by micheal o cearuil a study of the irish text.I found it on some site and subsiquently found it has been taken out of print when i went to buy a hard copy in a law bookstore because i hate pdfs.

Here's the link to the consolidated treaty or in Irish here. It's a pdf and is completely searchable.

It's fairly easy to show that most No campaigners are telling a pack of lies.

And just to we're clear the EU cannot change our corporation tax rate.

Sam Vimes

someoneok wrote: »

There is so much fearmongering from the yes side saying there wont be any jobs but those people dont realise that the corpoartion taxes will be raised if it's ratified. Them yesmen are such liars and there is a deeper agenda with this treaty.

Yes you are absolutely right that there is a lot of fearmongering but I'm afraid you're on the wrong side mate. This is a legally binding guarantee from the European union:

SECTION B: TAXATION wrote:

Nothing in the Treaty of Lisbon makes any change of any kind, for any Member State, to the extent or operation of the competence of the European Union in relation to taxation.

The people who say that our corporation tax will be raised are lying to you. Pretty much every negative thing you have ever heard about this treaty is a lie from a number of groups who would love nothing more than to see the EU collapse

someoneok

meglome wrote: »

Here's the link to the consolidated treaty or in Irish here. It's a pdf and is completely searchable.

It's fairly easy to show that most No campaigners are telling a pack of lies.

And just to we're clear the EU cannot change our corporation tax rate.

ok show me exactly where you refer to? You are obviously an expert and can prove your claim. By the way I was referring to the Irish constitution literal translation as opposed to the EU one.

Hitman Actual

someoneok wrote: »

ok show me exactly where you refer to? You are obviously an expert and can prove your claim. By the way I was referring to the Irish constitution literal translation as opposed to the EU one.

The Nice Treaty base for direct taxation (e.g. corporation tax) stems from the section on Approximation of Laws. Article 94 states:

Article 94 Nice wrote:

APPROXIMATION OF LAWS
Article 94
The Council shall, acting unanimously on a proposal from the Commission and after consulting the European Parliament and the Economic and Social Committee, issue directives for the approximation of such laws, regulations or administrative provisions of the Member States as directly affect the establishment or functioning of the common market.

In Lisbon, this is changed to Article 115, as follows:

Article 115 Lisbon wrote:

(ex Article 94 TEC)
Without prejudice to Article 114, the Council shall, acting unanimously in accordance with a special legislative procedure and after consulting the European Parliament and the Economic and Social Committee, issue directives for the approximation of such laws, regulations or administrative provisions of the Member States as directly affect the establishment or functioning of the internal market.

There's a bit more to it than that, but basically unanimity of all member states is required for the EU to legislate in areas of direct taxation. And nothing changes between Nice and Lisbon, apart from some (inconsequential) wording changes and renumbering of the Articles.

Coriolanus

Was yes, still yes.

chikimonki

Is there a reason why people are engaging in a decision that will not be made in Ireland, it's all in fiction anyways. The ones in control whether by name or no, for me I learn how can I get ahead of them, so how would I do that?

ei.sdraob

chikimonki wrote: »

Is there a reason why people are engaging in a decision that will not be made in Ireland, it's all in fiction anyways. The ones in control whether by name or no, for me I learn how can I get ahead of them, so how would I do that?

English is not your first language? its hard to understand you


if its all fiction the why bother voting you say?


who is control?

Tarobot

Didn't vote last time. Was leaning Yes and became a hard Yes, especially after reading Scofflaw and oscarBravo's posts (among others) - rare beacons of common sense in a sea of gibberish.

IrelandSpirit

‘A government big enough to give you everything you want,
is big enough to take away everything you have.’

Jefferson