Selling a mass card could get you...

Tipsy Mac

a 10 year jail sentence or €300,000 fine :rolleyes:

The High Court is to be asked to block the part of the new Charities Act which outlaws the sale of Mass cards other than through an arrangement with the Catholic Church.

The Act becomes law on Tuesday next, September 1, and Mr Justice Patrick McCarthy was told today that sales of Mass cards, other than by agreement with a Bishop or Provincial of an order of priests, could lead to a 10 year jail sentence or €300,000 fine.



Read more: http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/court-asked-to-review-mass-card-provision-in-charities-act-424150.html#ixzz0PQaJpKMW

Jesus Wept

Anyone who buys mass cards should get a 10 year sentence.

The End Of Days

Makes sense when you delve a little deeper into the subject.

orestes

If you just say sorry to the church though they have to forgive you

K-9

The case seems to be looking for clarification more than anything else. Thought it was a bit mad initially, but it does make sense.

admiralofthefleet

my mothers partner used to get them without the signatures donkeys years ago and sign them himself and then go around selling them

bleg

But you spend 10 years less in purgatory so it evens out!

G_R

The-Rigger wrote: »

Anyone who buys mass cards should get a 10 year sentence.

could ya imagine all the old ladies in the joy:D

Jesus Wept

dannym08 wrote: »

could ya imagine all the old ladies in the joy:D

Bernie: What ya in for Agnes?

Agnes: Mass Cards

Bernie: Ah jaysus, it's a disgrace

Agnes: What are you in for?

Bernie: Murder 1

Agnes: Ah jaysus, it's a disgrace

brummytom

Mass cards are a fucking theft anyway.

Whatever happened to just saying, "I'll be praying for you"? Now the priest has to pre-sign a load of Allen-press cards, what's the point?

Dartz

It's blasphemy....

Diabhal Beag

My parents are getting a life sentence so :pac:

An Fear Aniar

The whole Mass card thing is such a racket. My mother has spent a fricking fortune on them - she would have been better off giving the money to Concern or Trócaire.

.

Jesus Wept

An Fear Aniar wrote: »

The whole Mass card thing is such a racket. My mother has spent a fricking fortune on them

Ah it's not a racket, if just one of them is lucky - you win a priest.

Namlub

I'm more or less sure this thread is breaking all sorts of blasphemy laws....

starbelgrade

Namlub wrote: »

I'm more or less sure this thread is breaking all sorts of blasphemy laws....

I don't believe in God, or Dermot Ahern, so I'm safe enough.

Namlub

Careful now

Biggins

As pointed out already by some, I also consider them to just be a money making racket.
Think about it.

Your actually paying someone to say a mass/prayer for you.
Are people so fcuking lazy that they can't say their own fcuking prayers for a person?
I mean come on... If someone came up to me and said "I prayed for you last night" I'd be very honored that they would do so.
If they came up to me and let me know "I paid someone to say a prayer/mass for you" - honestly - the question arises, thanks but jeaus you must be horrid busy that you actually have to bribe someone to do it for you!

There is more good intention directed to heaven within a single persons single prayer that a whole bunch of prayers bought by a bribe!
Heck, even Jesus had the good sense to thrown the money makers out! I guess the lads in Rome today are conveniently over looking that!
More hypocrisy from Rome.

Long Onion

They have an excellent place in western christian society, you can buy them for any radical fundamentalist muslims you may have taken a dislike to, apparently when the mass is said, their bottoms bleed.

Hagar

Technically you don't buy a mass or pay for anybody to pray for you.
Generally you make a donation for the upkeep of the church at the same time as you ask for the deceased to be remembered at a mass. There is absolutely no obligation to make any donation whatsoever. If you ask but make no donation the priest cannot refuse.

That's the official line folks, believe it or not.

The physical card is nothing to do with it at all, you may as well send a Hallmark card with a holy picture on it.

patrickc

in the local shop here there 3.50, in the parish centre there 12 euro

big difference

Sleipnir

Selling mass cards is the same as the Catholic Church telling the rich that they would only get into heaven if they left their money to the church a few centuries ago.

Pay us, and we'll say a few prayers for you. As a priest, my prayers go further to get you there! but you do have to pay for that.
Disgusting.

ejmaztec

patrickc wrote: »

in the local shop here there 3.50, in the parish centre there 12 euro

big difference

I suppose that most people would draw the line at having mass said in a store-room in amongst boxes of Mars Bars and Taytos.

Heisenberg.

This post has been deleted.

Biggins

Hagar wrote: »

Technically you don't buy a mass or pay for anybody to pray for you.
Generally you make a donation for the upkeep of the church at the same time as you ask for the deceased to be remembered at a mass. There is absolutely no obligation to make any donation whatsoever. If you ask but make no donation the priest cannot refuse.

That's the official line folks, believe it or not.

The physical card is nothing to do with it at all, you may as well send a Hallmark card with a holy picture on it.

100% true. Sadly however in the real down to earth, every day world they don't operate like that.
I've no problem making donations for donations sake to an upkeep for a building... however, who here knows of any person who has gone up to a priests door and asked their priest to pray for someone and then just left without having handed over anything of monetary value?

You want a mass said for someone? - You have to hand over money.
You want a priest to offer up "good intentions?" - You have to hand over money.

If they want money for "A" "B" or "C" and they request donations, fine, people will give what they can but to sell mass cards which IS by further action of the priest at the subsequent later alter, the buying of prayers, is hypocritical of what Jesus actaully advocated with his preachings.

ejmaztec

Scien wrote: »

As far as i'm aware RC Priests in Ireland don't get a Salary so they rely on contributions from Parishiners and their Congregation.
Mass Cards is one of the ways they sustain themselves & their Church financially.

It's a pity that todays generation are quick to frown upon RC Priests today.
The vast majority of them a good people who've done a lot of good work within their Communities.

I met that priest a few years ago, but he got moved to another parish because he was too good at his job.

halfinch

Personally I think the families of the deceased appreciate a prayer being said in different chrches around the country. In saying that the mass cards in my local church are €2, charging €12 is crazy and taking full advantage of the situation

Also its tradition in this country

BaconZombie

Was there not a story a few years ago about them out-source most the a praying to Africa?

Hagar wrote: »

Technically you don't buy a mass or pay for anybody to pray for you.
Generally you make a donation for the upkeep of the church at the same time as you ask for the deceased to be remembered at a mass. There is absolutely no obligation to make any donation whatsoever. If you ask but make no donation the priest cannot refuse.

That's the official line folks, believe it or not.

The physical card is nothing to do with it at all, you may as well send a Hallmark card with a holy picture on it.

Heisenberg.

This post has been deleted.

Biggins

Scien wrote: »

As far as i'm aware RC Priests in Ireland don't get a Salary so they rely on contributions from Parishiners and their Congregation...

They get a considerable weekly allowance from Rome, whatever also they get on the collection plate is theirs also I'm told by church collection officials. Non-accountable by the way. They also get a housekeeping allowance. Then they get another an allowance for transport.

I also know of another very good priest that was too good at his job (he spoke the plain truth of the problems within the community, etc), he too was moved to the back of nowhere!
The reason - he was too honest and forthcoming. If you were to ask him of how things were done in the church, he would honestly tell you plain and simple. Even to the extent of not lying upon your asking direct questions about specific areas.
He didn't go out of his way to "reveal all" but if someone asked a question, he would give an accurate honest answer - so he was shifted to the arsehole of nowhere - and for the record, he was much loved by the whole town, even the non-believers who had a great deal of grown respect for him.

I can name one monseigneur who took a public building (kept two sets of accounts books - one real - one factious for the public) and used it for his own revenue lock stock and barrel (a relative of mine was his accountant till they resigned in absolute disgust at the actions of the collared man, illegal and immoral), he then sold the building - kept the money and now still drives an up to date merc, has a girlfriend in another town who has had their son, got rid of the housekeeper that had been around for years and moved his girlfriend in under the guise of the new official "housekeeper". He's still operating quite successfully at fleecing the Irish people to this day from his high office.

Now the above crook priest is the exception I'm glad to say but to say they don't get paid, sorry but they indeed do get "paid", an allowance as Rome re-terms it.

biko

Until now, there was nothing to prevent commercial companies from selling signed Catholic Mass cards in shops or petrol stations which promised to say offerings for the dead.

But the priests who were supposed to say the Remembrance Masses were often either dead or untraceable.

The new Charities Bill, which is due to be passed by the Dail and Seanad this month, will make it an offence to sell such bogus Mass cards.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/end-to-bogus-mass-cards-1639915.html

brummytom

Scien wrote: »

As far as i'm aware RC Priests in Ireland don't get a Salary so they rely on contributions from Parishiners and their Congregation.
Mass Cards is one of the ways they sustain themselves & their Church financially.

It's a pity that todays generation are quick to frown upon RC Priests today.
The vast majority of them are good people who've done a lot of good work within their Communities.

As one of 'today's generation'; I most certainly don't have a problem with RC Priests - both of our Parish priests are excellent men, and have always been on hand to help. I truly respect them for devoting their lives to God.

Whar I do have hesitations about, however, is the fact that, as Biggins said, people just buy the mass card for someone - do they actually say a prayer? Personally, (and I know others I've spoke to feel the same), I'd feel much more honoured had someone said "I'll be praying for you", rather than a card saying "From all the family, Signed Fr Maguire".
'I'll pray for you' shows that you actually intend to do something yourself, and, as such, (for me anyway) it shows that you care a bit more.

Obviously not everyone agrees, but I'd sooner tell someone I'd pray for them than just buy a naff card

ejmaztec

Scien wrote: »

What has that got to do with this discussion?

If your post, which I quoted, has something to do with this discussion, it must naturally follow that my sarcastic response to it, also has something to do with this discussion.

Handsome Bob

brummytom wrote: »

Mass cards are a fucking theft anyway.

Whatever happened to just saying, "I'll be praying for you"? Now the priest has to pre-sign a load of Allen-press cards, what's the point?

I always saw mass cards as one's way of saying "I know you're having a tough day so I won't disturb you, but here's a card just to show that I'm thinking of you."

Flamed Diving

The End Of Days wrote: »

Makes sense when you delve a little deeper into the subject.

I'm sure it would to a person with your username.

Long Onion

LZ5by5 wrote: »

I always saw mass cards as one's way of saying "I know you're having a tough day so I won't disturb you, but here's a card just to show that I'm thinking of you."

Well then just send them a fcukin' card. Why get all massy about it? Look, is is a money making racket. Allen-press makes money, the priest makes money, the Bishop in Africa makes money. If you have to pay someone to pray for you in their time of need do you really want them praying for you at all?

The sooner we realise that a priest can't actually save you from eternal damnation/cure leposy/whatever, the sooner we can evolve as a human race.

Interceptor

Namlub wrote: »

more or less

Well, which is it?

In before the Pope shuts us down:pac:

'cptr

Handsome Bob

Long Onion wrote: »

Well then just send them a fcukin' card. Why get all massy about it? Look, is is a money making racket. Allen-press makes money, the priest makes money, the Bishop in Africa makes money. If you have to pay someone to pray for you in their time of need do you really want them praying for you at all?

The sooner we realise that a priest can't actually save you from eternal damnation/cure leposy/whatever, the sooner we can evolve as a human race.

Maybe people think that mass cards have a more personal touch in times such as bereavement than just an ordinary card? I don't see the big deal really, if people want to pay more money for a mass card over an ordinary card then that is their perogative.

charliesboots

The idea of the section of the act is to stop mass cards being used a business tool by non religous.

Our legislators are happy enough to allow the church to continue ripping people off if they like but not joe soap.

In saying that, the Joe Soap in question seems to be getting used to courts - http://www.tribune.ie/news/home-news/article/2009/jul/12/mass-card-salesman-to-fight-child-pornography-char/

An Fear Aniar

Sleipnir wrote: »

Selling mass cards is the same as the Catholic Church telling the rich that they would only get into heaven if they left their money to the church a few centuries ago.

Pay us, and we'll say a few prayers for you. As a priest, my prayers go further to get you there! but you do have to pay for that.
Disgusting.

Yeah, they're a lot like the medieval Indulgences. They're sort of like religious lottery tickets, the more you buy the more chance you have of winning.

.

ShooterSF

LZ5by5 wrote: »

Maybe people think that mass cards have a more personal touch in times such as bereavement than just an ordinary card? I don't see the big deal really, if people want to pay more money for a mass card over an ordinary card then that is their perogative.

I agree. People waste their money on plenty of stuff. You can tell them they are but after that leave them too it. Sure look at homoeopathy. It's their money and their choice at the end of the day.
Shops should be allowed sell them though as long as they don't claim to be endorsed by any church and they have a little mass in the store room for the person. They could even make up their own religion to fit around it.

pikachucheeks

Biggins wrote: »

Your actually paying someone to say a mass/prayer for you.
Are people so fcuking lazy that they can't say their own fcuking prayers for a person?
I mean come on... If someone came up to me and said "I prayed for you last night" I'd be very honored that they would do so.
If they came up to me and let me know "I paid someone to say a prayer/mass for you" - honestly - the question arises, thanks but jeaus you must be horrid busy that you actually have to bribe someone to do it for you!

Totally agree with you!
Mass Cards are just another way for the Catholic Church to scam money out of people.

If you want to pray for someone, pray for them! Don't feel you have to pay. Just because it's cost you money, doesn't mean the prayer will be any better!

No offence to anyone who likes Mass Cards, or indeed the sentiment of them, but when I see them, I just find them so ... tacky.

People claim that Scientology is wrong, for charging people to be members of the cult religion, but in this way, Catholicism is the exact same.

jester77

What's a mass card, is that the equivalent of a sick note if you can't make it on a Sunday

Snowie

whats a mass card, I've only been in a church twice...

TwoShedsJackson

Catholic Church is a money-making organisation and preys on the weak/vulnerable. News at 11.

brummytom

Snow-Monkey wrote: »

whats a mass card, I've only been in a church twice...

It's a card that you buy from the church, they normally look something like this: http://www.catholicprayercards.org/i/MISC%20ART/LC088.JPG

You buy it already signed by the priest and write your intention inside (who you want to pray for). Then you give it to said person/their family.

Yes, it's as pointless as it sounds

Handsome Bob

pikachucheeks wrote: »

People claim that Scientology is wrong, for charging people to be members of the cult religion, but in this way, Catholicism is the exact same.

Not really. How much does a mass card cost, like €8 or something? It is also entirely down to one's own choice in regards to whether they want to buy a mass card, and it has no bearing on your "rank" within the church. All followers are seen as equal really.

Scientology on the other hand doesn't see its' followers as equal and indeed, will swindle thousands of dollars out of people who want to increase their "rank" within the "church".

admiralofthefleet

patrickc wrote: »

in the local shop here there 3.50, in the parish centre there 12 euro

big difference

i wonder what cut the priest gets out of that towards his steak dinner every friday

pikachucheeks

12 euro!? My God!

I'm going to get my dad to set up Protestant Mass cards, I'll have that Chanel bag in no time!

:pac:

Snowie

brummytom wrote: »

It's a card that you buy from the church, they normally look something like this: http://www.catholicprayercards.org/i/MISC%20ART/LC088.JPG

You buy it already signed by the priest and write your intention inside (who you want to pray for). Then you give it to said person/their family.

Yes, it's as pointless as it sounds

:rolleyes: humans are stoopid

brummytom

pikachucheeks wrote: »

12 euro!? My God!

I'm going to get my dad to set up Protestant Mass cards, I'll have that Chanel bag in no time!

:pac:

Protestants don't have masses, they have services.


/pedanticness