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Extension - are we dreaming?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 52 ✭✭f9710145


    another query here - we're considering purchasing a house that comes with pp for a first floor extension, house (typical 4 bed semi in north dub) already built out to the side so building over that. Basically 2 new rooms, 1 window in each, staircase that turns to the right a few steps from top will now also turn to the left to a landing big enough for the doors into the new rooms. Bathroom will be moved so that it's now where a small room exists and the window will need to be realigned. Also an interior, non-load bearing wall to be moved a couple of feet. Also the roof would need to be extended over the new bit.
    Could anyone hazard a guess at an approximate price? That price will determine whether we go for the house or not.
    Also, the plans that are in for the house are not what we'd like to do so we'll need to reapply. However in terms of external work the only difference is that we won't require a window at the side as we don't want the en-suite in the plans. Internally we'll have the to be moved non-load bearing wall maybe a foot from where it is in the plans and we'll have the bathroom wall/door further back, again just non-load bearing walls. Also the plans have the removal of a load bearing wall that we would leave where it is. Does anyone know what an architect would charge to just make these small changes to the plans, it's literally moving a couple of lines on the paper? Would our best bet be to go back to the original architect?

    Thanks for any advice,
    T


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,389 ✭✭✭Carlow52


    f9710145 wrote: »
    another query here - we're considering purchasing a house that comes with pp for a first floor extension, house (typical 4 bed semi in north dub) already built out to the side so building over that. Basically 2 new rooms, 1 window in each, staircase that turns to the right a few steps from top will now also turn to the left to a landing big enough for the doors into the new rooms. Bathroom will be moved so that it's now where a small room exists and the window will need to be realigned. Also an interior, non-load bearing wall to be moved a couple of feet. Also the roof would need to be extended over the new bit.
    Could anyone hazard a guess at an approximate price? That price will determine whether we go for the house or not.
    Also, the plans that are in for the house are not what we'd like to do so we'll need to reapply. However in terms of external work the only difference is that we won't require a window at the side as we don't want the en-suite in the plans. Internally we'll have the to be moved non-load bearing wall maybe a foot from where it is in the plans and we'll have the bathroom wall/door further back, again just non-load bearing walls. Also the plans have the removal of a load bearing wall that we would leave where it is. Does anyone know what an architect would charge to just make these small changes to the plans, it's literally moving a couple of lines on the paper? Would our best bet be to go back to the original architect?

    Thanks for any advice,
    T

    2 questions,
    can u give us some idea of the size of the ext as well as current roof vs new roof.

    What comfort have u that the walls of the existing extn will carry the load of new extn, does planning say anything about light weight block to be used etc?


  • Registered Users Posts: 52 ✭✭f9710145


    Carlow - thanks for replying
    The overall extension is 28sqm. The roof is pitched (or hipped or whatever the correct phrase is) on front, back and unattached side, the new elevations keep the same pitch, with the roof just longer along the straight than it was before - hope you get what I mean by that, not easy to describe 3d, kinda like it was just stretched along the straight.
    I haven't read about types of block used so can't answer that. I do know that one of the planning docs includes details about the existing foundations and they're the same as what is under the main house so for now am assuming that they are sufficient to support what's detailed in the plans. Also same family put in the original extension and pp for the new one so I figure they had future extension in mind. But will hopefully have surveyor confirm all that, assuming surveyor can do that.

    T


  • Registered Users Posts: 38 rural_red


    kfc1 wrote: »
    Thanks to all who replied - just thought I'd post a quick update. Builders have completed and pulled out today, 5 weeks from start to finish, extension ended up being 330 sq feet, price 25,000 (cash) this included adding a window & new rad in the old kitchen, blocking up window & doorway so we could put double doors in a diffent location and installing new fitted kitchen. We are absolutely delighted with how things have gone and are yet to find fault with anything.

    As someone else has stated, this arrangement has no comebacks. While you are happy now, bear in mind that problems with the construction (if there are any) are now covered up. You are coming into summer and probably won't see issues ( if there are any) arise until the winter extremes of rain and frost by which time your builder may not be reachable. I hope that this is not the case but 25000 sounds dangerously cheap.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,004 ✭✭✭coolemon


    Hi. Excellent thread here btw.

    We are looking to get a kitchen extension of about 18ft by 6ft - so 102sqft altogether. It will require the knocking out of the entire ground floor rear wall of the house and the insertion of an rsj structure for support. It will also require two load bearing walls knocked through inside the house, and rsj beams put in place.

    We have an engineer drawing plans for the beams at the moment - but how much would we be looking at for this sort of job?

    Other things need to be done in the house aswell like new boiler/plumbing/rads, roof, fuseboard, windows, external wall drylinging etc.

    In South Dublin City


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,627 ✭✭✭Sgt Pepper 64


    coolemon wrote: »
    Hi. Excellent thread here btw.

    We are looking to get a kitchen extension of about 18ft by 6ft - so 102sqft altogether. It will require the knocking out of the entire ground floor rear wall of the house and the insertion of an rsj structure for support. It will also require two load bearing walls knocked through inside the house, and rsj beams put in place.

    We have an engineer drawing plans for the beams at the moment - but how much would we be looking at for this sort of job?

    Other things need to be done in the house aswell like new boiler/plumbing/rads, roof, fuseboard, windows, external wall drylinging etc.

    In South Dublin City

    My advice - Get an architect in for a proper job

    Very, very roughly €100/sq.ft

    and look here for advice

    <SNIP>


    Mod edit: Please dont post links to other discussion forums.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,588 ✭✭✭karlitob


    f9710145 wrote: »
    Carlow - thanks for replying
    The overall extension is 28sqm. The roof is pitched (or hipped or whatever the correct phrase is) on front, back and unattached side, the new elevations keep the same pitch, with the roof just longer along the straight than it was before - hope you get what I mean by that, not easy to describe 3d, kinda like it was just stretched along the straight.
    I haven't read about types of block used so can't answer that. I do know that one of the planning docs includes details about the existing foundations and they're the same as what is under the main house so for now am assuming that they are sufficient to support what's detailed in the plans. Also same family put in the original extension and pp for the new one so I figure they had future extension in mind. But will hopefully have surveyor confirm all that, assuming surveyor can do that.

    T


    Hey there,

    Thinking of doing something similar. Could you give advice on general cost on extension over garage please.


  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭Brazzer


    kfc1 wrote: »
    Thanks to all who replied - just thought I'd post a quick update. Builders have completed and pulled out today, 5 weeks from start to finish, extension ended up being 330 sq feet, price 25,000 (cash) this included adding a window & new rad in the old kitchen, blocking up window & doorway so we could put double doors in a diffent location and installing new fitted kitchen. We are absolutely delighted with how things have gone and are yet to find fault with anything.

    Hiya, just wondering if you could PM me the name of the builder you used and also, 2 years on how are you getting on with the work, are there any problems? How much was the value of the kitchen included in the 25k total?

    Many thanks :-)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,820 ✭✭✭smelly sock


    Hello,

    Any help on the below would be great. I'm starting to save and budget for an extension. I know people in the window trade and would be happy enough to get brother and cousin in to do flooring etc. I also know a plumber.

    64sq metre extension. Structural work only. Will be looking after wiring , Windows , flooring and kitchen myself.

    It's a 2 story extension to an existing 3 bed semi detached. 32 square metres being added to ground floor. This will consist of 1 room which will be an extra living room. The kitchen will also be extended. The top floor of the exention will be a bedroom with ensuite bathroom.

    For the structural work + insulation I'm hoping for a budget of around 30-35,000 euro.

    Can this be done?

    Secondly If I were toget extension done with builders finish how much extra would this cost?

    Any helo would be great.

    I'm in the north kildare area.


  • Registered Users Posts: 738 ✭✭✭focus_mad


    Hello,

    Any help on the below would be great. I'm starting to save and budget for an extension. I know people in the window trade and would be happy enough to get brother and cousin in to do flooring etc. I also know a plumber.

    64sq metre extension. Structural work only. Will be looking after wiring , Windows , flooring and kitchen myself.

    It's a 2 story extension to an existing 3 bed semi detached. 32 square metres being added to ground floor. This will consist of 1 room which will be an extra living room. The kitchen will also be extended. The top floor of the exention will be a bedroom with ensuite bathroom.

    You will also have to include in the budget an amount for the planning permission application as it is over the exempt sizing.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,546 ✭✭✭✭Poor Uncle Tom


    Hello,

    Any help on the below would be great. I'm starting to save and budget for an extension. I know people in the window trade and would be happy enough to get brother and cousin in to do flooring etc. I also know a plumber.

    64sq metre extension. Structural work only. Will be looking after wiring , Windows , flooring and kitchen myself.

    It's a 2 story extension to an existing 3 bed semi detached. 32 square metres being added to ground floor. This will consist of 1 room which will be an extra living room. The kitchen will also be extended. The top floor of the exention will be a bedroom with ensuite bathroom.

    For the structural work + insulation I'm hoping for a budget of around 30-35,000 euro.

    Can this be done?

    Secondly If I were toget extension done with builders finish how much extra would this cost?

    Any helo would be great.

    I'm in the north kildare area.

    We don't know anything about your existing type of construction, site conditions, etc., to be able to comment accurately, but I would hazard a guess that you would need more like €55k than €35k to do the works properly.

    As focus_mad said you will also need planning permission.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5 chessbase


    Hi all
    Just a quick enquiry. I live in tipperary and I am looking to build a single story extension to the rear of my 3 bed room semi. I will need to block up my existing utility window, but I can use the opening where my existing patio doors are as an entry into the new extension. I also want to knock down the existing timber stud partition wall between my kitchen and utility.
    Have a seen a house similar to mine and the extension they put on. However they built extension in height of the building boom, so hoping building costs have fallen.
    Can anyone give me a guideline on how much this might cost. Neither I or my partner are from a building background so we will need someone who can take over and complete it from beginning to end. We could just about manage flooring, and painting and thats about it!
    Also, If I alredy have very clear ideas of what I want, do I really need an architect. Would a quantity surveyor be able to do the plans detailed enough, and perhaps keep things on budget.
    I know I ask alot of questions, so thanks in advance:-)


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭archtech


    chessbase wrote: »
    Hi all
    Just a quick enquiry. I live in tipperary and I am looking to build a single story extension to the rear of my 3 bed room semi. I will need to block up my existing utility window, but I can use the opening where my existing patio doors are as an entry into the new extension. I also want to knock down the existing timber stud partition wall between my kitchen and utility.
    Have a seen a house similar to mine and the extension they put on. However they built extension in height of the building boom, so hoping building costs have fallen.
    Can anyone give me a guideline on how much this might cost. Neither I or my partner are from a building background so we will need someone who can take over and complete it from beginning to end. We could just about manage flooring, and painting and thats about it!
    Also, If I alredy have very clear ideas of what I want, do I really need an architect. Would a quantity surveyor be able to do the plans detailed enough, and perhaps keep things on budget.
    I know I ask alot of questions, so thanks in advance:-)

    Its hard to determine without knowing the size of the extension and what's it going to be used for. I would recommend that you should engage an Architectural Technologist/Technician or architect to prepare the drawings.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,546 ✭✭✭✭Poor Uncle Tom


    archtech wrote: »
    Its hard to determine without knowing the size of the extension and what's it going to be used for. I would recommend that you should engage an Architectural Technologist/Technician or architect to prepare the drawings.
    +1 to this....

    That's bread and butter work designing the different elements, connections, detailing to building regs, etc.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5 chessbase


    Thanks Arch Tech and poor uncle tom. I asked because i dont really know the difference. Alot of people have told me a Quantity surveyor can do plans too, but I dont want to hire a QS if it is really an architect I need. What is difference between Architect technician and architect?
    The purpose of the extension is as a play room, with a downstairs toilet and utility room to the rear.
    Any ideas of price guys? My sister built an amazing house at 78 per sq foot. The size I hope to build is 30 sq meter or 322 sq foot.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭archtech


    chessbase wrote: »
    Thanks Arch Tech and poor uncle tom. I asked because i dont really know the difference. Alot of people have told me a Quantity surveyor can do plans too, but I dont want to hire a QS if it is really an architect I need. What is difference between Architect technician and architect?
    The purpose of the extension is as a play room, with a downstairs toilet and utility room to the rear.
    Any ideas of price guys? My sister built an amazing house at 78 per sq foot. The size I hope to build is 30 sq meter or 322 sq foot.
    Around Clonmel typically that size of extension to a semi d is costing 100€/sq foot allowing for some minimal alterations to the existing including painting but not floor finishes, assuming its fairly typical construction. Either professional would be good for the job make sure whoever you engage has PI insurance.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5 chessbase


    Thanks Arch tech. Wow, was hoping it would be less:(. How come extending costs more than new build? I totally understand if it was a renovation project as you could unearth some major problems but surely adding on an extension would be rather easy. Although I must, as much as i hate to, plead ignorance when it comes to these kinda issues. I am one of those old style girls who just about knows the differance between a flat head and a Phillips head screwdriver. And thats only from watching Handy Manny with my kids:D


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭archtech


    chessbase wrote: »
    Thanks Arch tech. Wow, was hoping it would be less:(. How come extending costs more than new build? I totally understand if it was a renovation project as you could unearth some major problems but surely adding on an extension would be rather easy. Although I must, as much as i hate to, plead ignorance when it comes to these kinda issues. I am one of those old style girls who just about knows the differance between a flat head and a Phillips head screwdriver. And thats only from watching Handy Manny with my kids:D
    Extensions by their very nature have hidden costs that add that bit extra to the price. Moving a drain or something. Also you have to bear in mind very often materials require more manual handling and are bought in smaller quantities which means they work out a little more expensive . 100€/sq foot is only a general guide individual sites and proposals will determined the actual price


  • Registered Users Posts: 194 ✭✭BrianHal


    Hello,

    I'm looking to build a sunroom/playroom extension to the back of my three-bed semi and was looking for opinions on prices. Area is about 120sq/ft, remove current east facing external sliding door, north half all wall (no windows etc), south half with your usual sunroom windows/double doors etc. I also wanted two skylights, not necessarily velux as they dont need to open.

    I will do the timber flooring & skirting myself.

    Optional, considering underfloor heating in sunroom connecting to my standard gas central heating. Depending on cost.

    Can anyone give me rough €/sq ft pricing for this and any extra costs from what I have listed... eg. underfloor extra etc.

    Thanks in advance.


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 10,140 Mod ✭✭✭✭BryanF


    BrianHal wrote: »
    Hello,

    I'm looking to build a sunroom/playroom extension to the back of my three-bed semi and was looking for opinions on prices. Area is about 120sq/ft, remove current east facing external sliding door, north half all wall (no windows etc), south half with your usual sunroom windows/double doors etc. I also wanted two skylights, not necessarily velux as they dont need to open.

    I will do the timber flooring & skirting myself.

    Optional, considering underfloor heating in sunroom connecting to my standard gas central heating. Depending on cost.

    Can anyone give me rough €/sq ft pricing for this and any extra costs from what I have listed... eg. underfloor extra etc.

    Thanks in advance.
    spend your money on windows, walls, floor & roof rather than on UFH. cost could be circa 1000m2 depending on chosen wall and roof type, structural spans, finishing specification (from tiles to furniture), ground conditions, access etc.. where this type of living/dinning/kitchen extension is proposed I recommend you spend carefully on windows and building fabric as its essentially creating a larger living area that will need to be heated for regular use. if this is a sunroom, i presume its south facing? are roof lights necessary?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 194 ✭✭BrianHal


    Thanks for replying BryanF. The back wall of my house is E/SE facing.

    This "sunroom" would be 13ft x 9ft approx, have the north-ish half (13x4) solid wall and the south-ish half (13x5) mainly windows with maybe 50cm high wall at the bottom and a double door.

    I was going to put the floor containing 60mm Thermafloor insulation. The walls would be 100mm block with the cavity filled with that beaded wall insulation stuff. The rest of the house already has it. For the roof, I was going to have a steel bean at ridge with rafters with 150mm rafterlock fireproof insulation with min 75mm ventilation gap to the breathable roofing felt. (I know a QS who has advised me, these names and numbers didn't just fall from the head).

    Could you advise on window insulation and anything which you may see missing from what I've listed?

    Oh, and the cost you mentioned above, was that e1,000/sq.m, ya?


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 10,140 Mod ✭✭✭✭BryanF


    BrianHal wrote: »
    Thanks for replying BryanF. The back wall of my house is E/SE facing.

    This "sunroom" would be 13ft x 9ft approx, have the north-ish half (13x4) solid wall and the south-ish half (13x5) mainly windows with maybe 50cm high wall at the bottom and a double door.

    I was going to put the floor containing 60mm Thermafloor insulation. The walls would be 100mm block with the cavity filled with that beaded wall insulation stuff. The rest of the house already has it. For the roof, I was going to have a steel bean at ridge with rafters with 150mm rafterlock fireproof insulation with min 75mm ventilation gap to the breathable roofing felt. (I know a QS who has advised me, these names and numbers didn't just fall from the head).

    Could you advise on window insulation and anything which you may see missing from what I've listed?

    Oh, and the cost you mentioned above, was that e1,000/sq.m, ya?
    ya, 1g per msq rough figure, but hold on there a second, why didn't you ask your QS??
    no offence to your QS but I would suggest you get an arch or arch tech to give you a more upto date specification that complies to current regs ( and generally current practices) . also why not get a few details prepared before work starts, so that builders and glazing guys have something to work to (in the name of limiting thermal bridging:).. but mainly so there are no misunderstandings on site).. http://www.environ.ie/en/Publications/DevelopmentandHousing/BuildingStandards/FileDownLoad,27316,en.pdf
    2.1.2.3 For extensions, reasonable provision
    would also be achieved if the total heat loss
    through all the opaque elements did not
    exceed that which would be the case if each
    of the area-weighted average U-value (Um)
    set out in Table 1 were achieved individually.
    Where this approach is chosen, the values
    for individual elements or sections of
    elements given in Table 1 Column 3 apply to
    each relevant element. For ground floors or
    exposed floors incorporating underfloor
    heating, the guidance in paragraph 2.1.2.2
    applies.
    2.1.2.4 For extensions, the maximum area weighted
    average U-value for doors, windows
    and rooflights of 1.60 W/m2K given in Table 1
    applies when the combined area of external
    door, window and rooflight openings equals
    25% of floor area. However, both the
    permitted combined area of external door,
    window and rooflight openings and the
    maximum area-weighted average U-value of
    these elements may be varied as set out in
    Table 6.
    so the window u-value (insulation as you call it) depends on window area relative to floor area - the stated 1.6w/m2k will hardly apply given that this is a sun space and as such will have extra glazing.

    minimum 110mm theremafloor (0.029 W/mk ) will give you 0.25w/2k
    and don't forget the Vapour barrier (taped and sealed) on warm side of roof insulation especially when using poly based insulations!


  • Registered Users Posts: 194 ✭✭BrianHal


    Thanks for the link, I thought I was understanding what was needed until I flicked through it. I know my QS socially so I wasn't using him as a paid service or anything. Don't worry, no offence taken.

    A few of the items you mentioned seemed to be increased values of what he said (I didn't include the whole two pages of specs that he gave me).

    Do you know a rough cost of what I'd expect to pay an arch/arch tech to draw up plans for something like this and do whatever else they're supposed to do? I've never had to use the services of one so I wouldnt know if I was getting a good deal or being ripped off or what to even expect from them apart from a nice AutoCad drawing.


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 10,140 Mod ✭✭✭✭BryanF


    BrianHal wrote: »
    Thanks for the link, I thought I was understanding what was needed until I flicked through it. I know my QS socially so I wasn't using him as a paid service or anything. Don't worry, no offence taken.

    A few of the items you mentioned seemed to be increased values of what he said (I didn't include the whole two pages of specs that he gave me).
    caveat: I have given you the minimum values for extensions NOT NEW BUILD and many would look increase these levels further
    Do you know a rough cost of what I'd expect to pay an arch/arch tech to draw up plans for something like this and do whatever else they're supposed to do? I've never had to use the services of one so I wouldnt know if I was getting a good deal or being ripped off or what to even expect from them apart from a nice AutoCad drawing.
    simply put there are vastly different levels of service. for drawing, spec and details depending on whats required might take 2-3 days. for instance exemption certs from planning authority may be required, through to answering the phone everytime someone has a question and being on site to decide on a roof detail.. go get three quotes thats the best way of selecting any service or product. if nothing else the cost will be covered by you having a clear set of tender drawings for your list of builders to price to


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,482 ✭✭✭harr


    Currently pricing a extension and would like to know before i start a rough guide price,it will be a 208qf extension and the current back wall will be coming down no fancy stuff.We will be using our current sliding door and back window and i will be putting down floor myself.I am in the naas area,would anyone have a very rough overall guide price.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭archtech


    harr wrote: »
    Currently pricing a extension and would like to know before i start a rough guide price,it will be a 208qf extension and the current back wall will be coming down no fancy stuff.We will be using our current sliding door and back window and i will be putting down floor myself.I am in the naas area,would anyone have a very rough overall guide price.

    In the order of €100/sq foot give or take 20% depending on access, finishes etc.


  • Registered Users Posts: 194 ✭✭BrianHal


    archtech wrote: »
    In the order of €100/sq foot give or take 20% depending on access, finishes etc.

    You quoting €100/sq ft +/- 20% for Naas region or further afield?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,046 ✭✭✭archtech


    BrianHal wrote: »
    You quoting €100/sq ft +/- 20% for Naas region or further afield?
    Generally there's very little variation in prices across the country for similar specification and quality of work.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,482 ✭✭✭harr


    another quick question how long should it take for a standard 208sq foot extension,i know the weather would play a part but i have one builder telling me 7-8 weeks with everything done and another one telling me 12-14 weeks the builder with the shortest time is the cheapest by a fair few euro (5,000),it just rang a few alarm bells but he has good references. :confused:


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  • Registered Users Posts: 194 ✭✭BrianHal


    Is the 12-14 week guy running two jobs at the same time so won't be on you job 100% of the time?


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