Nazi Statue !?!?

marcsignal

DamoDLK wrote: »

Correct parts of my town (Dundalk) got bombed also by the Germans.

off topic, but full list of bombing incidents in Ireland here

http://www.csn.ul.ie/~dan/war/bombings.html

list of crashed Aricraft here

http://www.csn.ul.ie/~dan/war/crashes.htm

and a Radio Programme about the North Strand Bombing here

http://www.liveireland.com/podcast/Goodbye_Blue_Sky24.mp3

edit

finally, a discussion on Ireland in WW2 over on the WW2 forum here

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055360095

DamoDLK

marcsignal wrote: »

http://www.csn.ul.ie/~dan/war/bombings.html

interesting read..

muffy

Adamcp898 wrote: »

and sure DeV guaranteed our support to Hitler too if he got as far as us

It's my understanding that he agreed to allow the Allies invade us should the Nazi's decide to attack our rather usefully located little island. In fact there was a policy of appeasment to all leaders, Allied or Axis, in the interest of appearing neutral.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Lucas Polite Preschool wrote: »

Anyway, let me know if you want me to post a photo of the new Irish army helmet.

.

Qouting myself!..

Here's the new Irish Defence Forces helmet.

asdasd

Someone should go to an IndyMedia office and draw a Nazi flag with the legend 1939-1941.

Alright they are not quite Stalinists but would have been back in the day. Marxist appeasers are their intellectual GodFathers.

asdasd

Of course any Soviet Flag should get the same moral revulsion from any normal people.

Nevertheless the Far Left has positioned itself as the bulwark against Fascism, but their intellectual antecendents - to a man and woman - were on the Axis side when democracy was at it's greatest peril from Fascism, until their favoured country was attacked.

If the Nazis had merely meant to carve up the West and give Russia the East they would have won the war, and Marxists would have supported the Nazi-Soviet Axis until the end of the war.

Dáibhí

Dáibhí wrote: »

Alternatively, their counterparts in retard land can go around Dublin placing Union Jacks on the remaining monuments to "collaborators" with British imperialism. Apparently there is an entire park in Islandbridge dedicated to honouring those people not for fighting for Irish freedom but rather for actually dying in defence of the British Empire as it asserted its domination over peoples across the world, including the Irish. Indeed many of these men were running the British concentration camps in South Africa where tens of thousands of women and children died. On this war alone, these counterparts will have to find a massive Union Jack to place over the Fusiliers' Arch on St Stephen's Green - "Traitors' Gate" - which is an explicit monument to Irish-born people who served the British Empire in that same Boer War and were involved in the massive scorched earth policies against the Boers.

It would be a nice surprise if the local Ballybough lads could be waiting for these losers in the bushes in Fairview Park the next night, with one of them recording it all for YouTube.

ah would you get out of it Tom Barry himself fought with the British in WW1 and many many others

marcsignal

asdasd wrote: »

Of course any Soviet Flag should get the same moral revulsion from any normal people.

+1 asdasd

unfortunately the people were talking about here, are only 'well read' in their own pamphlets, and not their own history. It's a classic case of "Don't bother me with the facts, they don't fit into my thesis" syndrome.

asdasd wrote: »

Nevertheless the Far Left has positioned itself as the bulwark against Fascism.......

The Far Left has positioned itself as the bulwark against everything as far as I can see. They proclaim themselves to be proud 'Anti-Fascists' on the basis of the racial persecution the Nazis meted out to the Jews, and they're usually the first group to congregate outside the Israeli embassy protesting every time Israel gets itself into hot water over the Palestinians.

It seems the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing half the time :rolleyes:

MikeC101

asdasd wrote: »

Of course any Soviet Flag should get the same moral revulsion from any normal people.

One would hope so, and yet it's ok to have a chain of restaurants called "Mao" with a nice little picture of said Chairman beside the name, a man responsible for far more deaths than the Nazis. (not that that excuses anything done by the Nazis of course.)

Can you imagine a "Hitler" restaurant lasting very long? (eh, in Korea yes)

marcsignal

MikeC101 wrote: »

Can you imagine a "Hitler" restaurant lasting very long? (eh, in Korea yes)

well we did have the Swastika Laundry

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/c/c7/Swastikalaundry.jpg/300px-Swastikalaundry.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/58/193597110_25cf3f3673.jpg?v=0

I should point out that it's no longer there, they closed in the 70's, just in case any indymedia viewers are thinking of protesting on Shelbourne road this weekend :pac:

dlofnep

Lucas Polite Preschool wrote: »

Qouting myself!..

Here's the new Irish Defence Forces helmet.

That looks like a kinky military style bra.

asdasd

Ah, if I had Photoshop skillz (hint!) I would get a picture of someone at an anti-Fascist rally and add some small text to his placard.

Like

Never Again!
unless there is a Molotov-Ribbentrop pact

Nodin

marcsignal wrote: »

I should point out that it's no longer there, they closed in the 70's, just in case any indymedia viewers are thinking of protesting on Shelbourne road this weekend :pac:

In fairness, any shower can and do use indymedia. We'd need a specific term for these statue obsessed arse holes....other than 'Gobshites'

asdasd

staurophobes!

asdasd

In fairness, any shower can and do use indymedia

Yes, I was looking for somewhere to hang my nazi flag from 1939-1941 on, and that was the best option. But Indymedia is a broad church so I guess we cant be too sweeping.

The SWP would say they are trots and Trotsky was good on Nazzism.

Kipperhell

This is the same statue that was vandalised by a pro nazi group before being repeatedly attacked by anti-nazi groups. As far as I know it is the only statue to be attacked by both groups claiming he was a traitor.

General Zod

marcsignal wrote: »

+1 asdasd

unfortunately the people were talking about here, are only 'well read' in their own pamphlets, and not their own history. It's a classic case of "Don't bother me with the facts, they don't fit into my thesis" syndrome.




The Far Left has positioned itself as the bulwark against everything as far as I can see. They proclaim themselves to be proud 'Anti-Fascists' on the basis of the racial persecution the Nazis meted out to the Jews, and they're usually the first group to congregate outside the Israeli embassy protesting every time Israel gets itself into hot water over the Palestinians.

It seems the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing half the time :rolleyes:

Actually the revulsion of the left of the Nazis has as more roots in the Spanish civil war and the rise of the far right in europe in the 30's than it has against the holocaust, which also they were against. You seem to forget that the holocaust wasn't jsut against the Jews. Any opponent of the Hitler Government as well as the handicapped, Roma/Sinti/Dom, Trade Unionists, Gays, were targets of the Nazi extermination.

marcsignal

Kipperhell wrote: »

This is the same statue that was vandalised by a pro nazi group before being repeatedly attacked by anti-nazi groups. As far as I know it is the only statue to be attacked by both groups claiming he was a traitor.

exactly, know wonder Russel fucked off to Germany in a U-Boat, at least he knew where he stood there

chezzer

People need to get of their high horses...

i wonder were the people who vandalised the statue ever effected by fascism ?

i'm guessing not ...

marcsignal

General Zod wrote: »

Actually the revulsion of the left of the Nazis Fascists has as more roots in the Spanish civil war..........

fixed that for you there, 'Nazi' and 'Fascist' aren't strictly the same thing.

General Zod wrote: »

and the rise of the far right in europe in the 30's than it has against the holocaust, which also they were against.

when did they have this epiphany exactly ?? what year were they enlightened ?? the average irish person (man on the street) wasn't fully aware of the intricies of the holocaust until the early 50's.

General Zod wrote: »

You seem to forget that the holocaust wasn't jsut against the Jews. Any opponent of the Hitler Government as well as the handicapped, Roma/Sinti/Dom, Trade Unionists, Gays, were targets of the Nazi extermination.

No i didn't forget, i'm fully aware of all of the above, and the fact that in 27 states in the US, from the 1920s, habitual criminals, sufferers of manic depression, alcoholics, and the disabled were not only being sterilized, but were also subjected to medical experiments, primarily to develop a drug to fight malaria.
Were you aware of that ??

eugenics was all the rage in many places back then, not just in Nazi Germany.

asdasd

The Never Againers are not moralists. The are egoists. The principle of Public Moralism is the publicity, the self-serving feeling of been better than thou, while proper morality is generally private. Public ego-driven acts of moraliyr is historically a religious thing, but religion is not around no more, so we are left with the Left.

The actions of RAR, for instance; the claim that any mention of immigration is akin to Nazzism and the holocaust is in the same intellectual fever-swamp as claims that any attempt at socialism or social provision will lead to communism, and the gulags. However it makes them feel better about themselves.

Moreover any real morality would add up the killings of Nazzism and Communism and find them equally repulsive. I think that killing a People is more egregious than wiping out a class - the individuals suffer the same of course - but Marxists believe that both Ethnicity and Class are equally social constructs. So why not Never Again ( for the Kulaks) outside their own meeting halls.

And it is always worth pointing out to the Far Left who exactly was on the side on Nazzism in the West from 1939-1941.

ilkhanid

rez wrote: »

On the subject of the statue itself I think it's a disgrace. Ok he wasn't an all out Nazi but he was happy to conspire with them to fight Britain who at the time were the only nation standing between us and a full on German invasion. Maybe he was too stupid to realise what he was doing, but I don't think you can say he was doing anything patriotic for this country by trying to allign us with one of the most despicable regiemes in history.

Exactly. He was like a man with a grudge against a branch of a tree sawing it while sitting on it. With Britain gone,there would be nothing to stand between us and any demands the Germans would have made on us. It's typical of the short-sightedness of so many Irish "Republicans" for whom the grudge against the old enemy came before anything else, and over-rode all caution and common sense.
I wonder if the Nazis had conquered Ireland and had offered an United Ireland in exchange for collaboration, how Russell's scruples would have fared..had he lived?

Kipperhell

chezzer wrote: »

People need to get of their high horses...

i wonder were the people who vandalised the statue ever effected by fascism ?

i'm guessing not ...

We were all effected by fascism I think this country's independence was heavily influenced by events in Europe. Your guessing is way off the reality but I guess it seemed witty to you to only see things in a simple way:p

asdasd

eugenics was all the rage in many places back then, not just in Nazi Germany.

As was actually racist laws, or discrimination - by which I mean real laws - against people based on religion. Norn Iron, for instance. Not great for Catholics. Southern States of the US. Racist laws against blacks. A segregated Army fighing Nazzism.

I could go on, suffice to say that WWII was not a war by racists against anti-racists.

asdasd

I think this country's independence was heavily influenced by events in Europe.

Um, maybe, but not by Fascism. Long before that.

PrivateEye

Stalinists who held the party line were all effectively pro-Nazi's.

So there's a target for the far-left.

Beat up an old Commie statue.

Most people on the left refer to the Communist Party as the 'tankies' for the parties heavy supression of any uprising in the USSR (Even the occasional uprising by libertarian socialists ) and I've no doubt if there was (somehow, lets use our imaginations a bit) a statue of Uncle Joe sitting in Fairview Park they'd be cleaning it up pretty regularly too.


edit: There were also socialists active from the get-go in the resistance movements, not least Spanish anarchists within the French Resistance. Its wrong to suggest the actions of the USSR are a fair way to judge 'the left' or socialists in Europe at the time of the second world war. Enough socialists died while Stalin was making friends with the Germans.

asdasd

ts wrong to suggest the actions of the USSR are a fair way to judge 'the left' or socialists in Europe at the time of the second world war. Enough socialists died while Stalin was making friends with the Germans.

These sectarian distinctions are meaningless to the rest of us. Stalinism has only gone of of fashion since the breakup of the Soviet Union.

The antecedents of the Far Left were the party line followers of Moscow, the rest were miniscule sectarians. Those sectarians may be all that's left, but so what? Most of todays anarchists would have been communists wer they alive in the 30's, since most Far Leftists were.

Anarchism was a minority sport, and the anarchists were attacked - as fascists - by the majority Leftist believers at the time, until Stalinism made it's pact with Nazzism.

So most of todays angry anti-Capitalists would clearly have been full on Stalinists back then.

monkeyfudge

I've cleared this with the mods...

The radio station I'm involved in, Near 90 fm, is issuing a challenge to the protagonists involved.

To the invisible (anti-fascist) opposition we are offering an opportunity to have your views of Russell heard and perhaps even vindicated.

To the National Graves Association, we are affording an opportunity to demonstrate why Séan Russell should be commerated as a national hero and not villified as a Nazi collaborator.

To the area's public representatives we are offering an opportunity propose solutions to this long-running and increasingly bitter dispute.

More info here:
http://near.ie/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=120

marcsignal

Right lads, I wanted to get to the bottom of all these Nazi rumours, so I went on a little fact finding tour this afternoon, and as you'd expect, I found absolutely NO EVIDENCE to suggest there are Nazis operating in Dublin.

My first port of call was the German Embassy in Booterstown, where I'd made an appointment to see the German Ambassador himself Christian Pauls. I explained what I wanted to know, and to my surprise he was killing himself laughing ??? So obviously nothing to see there.

I went from Booterstown to the site of the old Swastika Laundry in Ballsbridge. Much to my disappiontment, I found they'd built a block of apartments called The Oval on the site, and that the only trace of the laundry left was the Chimney. Other than that everything seemed to be in order.

Not to be disgouraged in my quest, I went to a mate of mine in Weston Aerodrome and took a spin with him in his chopper, to view from the air, the fameous Nazi House in Templeogue thats supposed to be shaped like a Swastika. I was gutted to find out this urban legend was also bollocks, and found no other evidence of Nazi activity there either.

At this point, frustrated and angry I nipped into This, rather aptly named pub, in Terenure to reflect on my wild goose chase. Mulling over everything with a pint, I resigned to myself, that all of these things must have just been in my imagination, and that in fact there was no Nazi conspiracy, poised in wait to befall the unsuspecting Irish populous.

However, on my way home, dejected and disillusioned, and just when I thought my quest was groundless I spotted This Car parked down the road.

Well there you go !! Surely that's all the evidence you need !!

We're Fucked !! :eek::eek:

BlitzKrieg

i'm more confused why you are looking for them?

(also on the house urban legend, wasnt it torn down years ago and its always mistaken for the castle house you have pictured.)