True or False

imeddyhobbs

Every time the Garda ERU attend a bank or cash in transit robbery someone dies?

galwayguy22

Well if they're dead they can't rob no more.

SoupyNorman

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Every time the Garda ERU attend a bank or cash in transit robbery someone dies?

Only two I can think of..today and the post office robbery in Lusk a few years ago.

truecrippler

And if it's true; you're saying it's a bad thing?

About time that scum like those that have been shot/killed get to know that if they play a risky game, someones gonna get shot/killed.

truecrippler

SoupyNorman wrote: »

Only two I can think of..today and the post office robbery in Lusk a few years ago.

Was the Lusk robbery not last year?

edit: Was 2005... jahsus that flew in lol xD.

imeddyhobbs

truecrippler wrote: »

And if it's true; you're saying it's a bad thing?

About time that scum like those that have been shot/killed get to know that if they play a risky game, someones gonna get shot/killed.

Ok,Lets make a long story short.

The state has a shoot to kill policy in these situations?

truecrippler

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Ok,Lets make a long story short.

The state has a shoot to kill policy in these situations?

Hmmm ok... Rapists, Murderers and other wrong doers alike get sh!t sentences in this country? I say shoot them.

The culprits in the shooting yesterday apparently had sawn-off shotguns. Shoot them, if they die, they die.

TheZohanS

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Every time the Garda ERU attend a bank or cash in transit robbery someone dies?

I would say false.

The ERU are only called in as a last resort.

The Pontiac

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Every time the Garda ERU attend a bank or cash in transit robbery someone dies?

False.

imeddyhobbs

Rapists,Murders,bankers Bla Bla Bla

The Garda were watching these people and this was a targeted operation by the state,The state autorities laid in wait for these jackasses to present themselfs and thats when the state fired the first shot.The state gets so near and it gets so far but it doesnt know where the lines are,Everything is mishandled.

Karoma

Nobody really gives a **** if scum get shot while the scum are being scumbags- true or false?

truecrippler

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Rapists,Murders,bankers Bla Bla Bla

The Garda were watching these people and this was stated by Paul Williams today on the RTE News at one today

Minister Ahern said: 'Today's incident is a reminder of the dangers faced by members of An Garda Síochána in carrying out their duties and their courage in confronting those dangers'.

Go on the Garda!!!

Sharpshooter

truecrippler wrote: »

Hmmm ok... Rapists, Murderers and other wrong doers alike get sh!t sentences in this country? I say shoot them.

The culprits in the shooting yesterday apparently had sawn-off shotguns. Shoot them, if they die, they die.

I agree, I know who I would want to come out unscathed.

TheZohan wrote: »

I would say false.

The ERU are only called in as a last resort.

Exactly, they are the last resort in an emergency and are trained in what they do.
Again if it came down to who should be still alive after a confrontation I want it to be one of the ERU team.

marcsignal

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Rapists,Murders,bankers Bla Bla Bla

The Garda were watching these people and this was a targeted operation by the state.

Go the State !! :pac:

seanybiker

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Every time the Garda ERU attend a bank or cash in transit robbery someone dies?

Jerry macabes family might disagree with that.

Pherekydes

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Every time the Garda ERU attend a bank or cash in transit robbery someone dies?

Maybe ask a question like, "Every time there's an armed robbery someone dies?"

Can we have a Pole?

5'12" and legs up to here, please.

Ghost Train

Well the global death rate is quite high... people around the world die every few seconds, so technically true, anytime anybody does anything somebody dies... but more usually than not the death and the action being done don't relate to each other.

Also if you're going to rob a bank there is a risk it might not end up well for you

marcsignal

if the police never arrived, and you or me were standing between these people and their getaway, they would shoot you like a fucking dog.:cool:

imeddyhobbs

seanybiker wrote: »

Jerry macabes family might disagree with that.

?

minidazzler

False simply because of your ignorance, Do you think this is only the second time they have led an operation like this? Usually arrests are made, sometimes the crims think they will be smart about it, because the cops here never shoot anyone. And then those scumbags realise that on a long enough timeline, survival rate is 0.

imeddyhobbs

Pherekydes wrote: »

Maybe ask a question like, "Every time there's an armed robbery someone dies?"

Obvious answer is no

imeddyhobbs

The reason that i am interested in this is because in 1986 i was walking home from school and i came across the garda shooting bank robbers in Athy,I also had the misfortune of being in Portlaois hospital some years back when the ERU killed one of their own men in Abbeyleix,My sister was diagnosed with cancer that same day but i got to see another family ripped apart at the hands of the state ,They killed another innocent man,Thats the killing part..

No pun intended

Damo1174

truecrippler wrote: »

And if it's true; you're saying it's a bad thing?

About time that scum like those that have been shot/killed get to know that if they play a risky game, someones gonna get shot/killed.

Yeh your right. My cousin robbed a bank and killed a pig on the way out. If those cops want to act all tough letting rounds off at ordinary decent criminals who arent out to hurt people then they should be ready to pay the price when we shoot back. Truecrippler its bout time someone had the balls to get up and say that. Well done. +1

minidazzler

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

The reason that i am interested in this is because in 1986 i was walking home from school and i came across the garda shooting bank robbers in Athy,I also had the misfortune of being in Portlaois hospital some years back when the ERU killed one of their own men in Abbeyleix,My sister was diagnosed with cancer that same day but i got to see another family ripped apart at the hands of the state ,They killed another innocent man,Thats the killing part..

No pun intended

ERU or Armed Gardai, You do know there is a difference, don't you?

You seem to be the common denominator here, not the cops given it's different ones each time. Stay the fcuk away from me!!!!!

evogirl

Damo1174 wrote: »

Yeh your right. My cousin robbed a bank and killed a pig on the way out. If those cops want to act all tough letting rounds off at ordinary decent criminals who arent out to hurt people then they should be ready to pay the price when we shoot back. Truecrippler its bout time someone had the balls to get up and say that. Well done. +1

ordainary and decent are not words id use to descibe criminals

Armin_Tamzarian

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

The reason that i am interested in this is because in 1986 i was walking home from school and i came across the garda shooting bank robbers in Athy.

Well you should have walked back to school and asked them what year it was.
The Athy Bank Robbery you refer to occurred in 1990.

minidazzler

evogirl wrote: »

ordainary and decent are not words id use to descibe criminals

An ordinary decent criminal is a criminal who doesn't have any dealings with drugs. Just Robbery and such, but planned robberies where noone gets hurt. Which is fair enough, they are better crimes than shooting young damo for not paying for the gear he bought on tick.

Borneo Fnctn

True or false: every time a moron fires a weapon at the Gardai and gets shot dead the lefties assume it was the Guards fault.

minidazzler wrote: »

An ordinary decent criminal is a criminal who doesn't have any dealings with drugs. Just Robbery and such, but planned robberies where noone gets hurt. Which is fair enough, they are better crimes than shooting young damo for not paying for the gear he bought on tick.

I think you have a fairly romantic view of armed robbers. They are bad people and they don't give a toss about the people they traumatize. Being held at gunpoint can destroy your life. People do get physically hurt in armed robberies. There are no Butch Cassidys.

murfie

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

.........thats when the state fired the first shot............

Do you have a link or know this for sure that this was the case or are you assuming this happened. I would wait till the official report comes out to make your judgements

But in my opinion the gardai did a great job, the bad guys got shot with no innocent bystanders or gardai hurt. Job well done. The question on if they shot first or not is secondary.

Wertz

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Rapists,Murders,bankers Bla Bla Bla

The Garda were watching these people and this was a targeted operation by the state,The state autorities laid in wait for these jackasses to present themselfs and thats when the state fired the first shot.The state gets so near and it gets so far but it doesnt know where the lines are,Everything is mishandled.

Far be it from me to defend the Gardaí, but I have to think that this highly trained unit would have a set list of rules for engagement of suspects, as regards shouting repeated warnings and such before they turn around and open up on gun-toting mebers of the public.
The shoot to kill policy is neither here nor there...as has been mentioned in many threads on Abbeyleix, the gardaí do not have a shoot to wound policy, they will aim for centre mass/torso to make sure of at least disabling the target, rather than shooting to wound and any subsequent miss (that might lead to return fire and or death/injury).

I can see where you're coming from here and I view the actions of gardaí in these situations with some suspicion myself...but I also have to think that if these guys were confronted too early (ie before the robbery), you've got them on few to no charges (none of any consequence) and if the ERU waited, someone may have been shot (them included). In the event of a garda or a bystander being killed, the forum today would be full of "Scum out now" threads and the like.

Suspects are confronted and told to drop their weapons...any further move to the contrary is going to get you shot and rightly so. Chances are these guys are too stupid or gung-ho to drop the gun and they get shot. Once those rules of engagement have been followed, I can't see a problem. It's up the ombudsman now to see if they were. Of course in a situation like this, officers will close ranks and everyone will sing from the same hymn sheet, and any of the other members of the gang won't be believed if they make claims to the contrary of what the ERU members say.

You live by the gun, you die by the gun.
Now if only someone in the force would start shooting bank CEOs...

minidazzler

jackpalance wrote: »

I think you have a fairly romantic view of armed robbers. They are bad people and they don't give a toss about the people they traumatize. Being held at gunpoint can destroy your life. People do get physically hurt in armed robberies. There are no Butch Cassidys.

Not a romantic view, but I do think it is a bit better than Drug Dealers. Just an opinion.

Wertz

You realise of course that it's usually the same people involved in the drug trade that are going out and doing these audacious cash in transit robberies, right?
These aren't some bunch of modern day Robin Hoods, nicking from the Brinks Allied to give to the council estate...these guys use the proceeds of these crimes to buy more cocaine to sell on for more profit or to replace the stuff that's been seized in the past.
I find it utterly bewilldering that you differentitate between armed robbers and drug dealers or would hold one above the other...

FabulousGirl

minidazzler wrote: »

Not a romantic view, but I do think it is a bit better than Drug Dealers. Just an opinion.

My mother used to work as a receptionist in a hotel. One night 2 men came in, jumped over the counter and attacked her with a screwdriver and a hammer. They were self proclaimed "Ordinary Decent Criminals" who just wanted to rob the hotel. My mother was traumatised after the ordeal and could never face going to work again so had to leave a job she loved. The physical scars healed but the mental ones were always there.
Fast forward a few years later and my mother is dying in hospital from a brain tumour. She thinks she's back in the hotel being attacked and is crying and screaming for help and telling me to hide so I don't get hurt.

Yeah, they're much better lads than drug dealers.

kumate_champ07

perhaps your thinking of jessica fletcher the crime novelist?
shes a distant cousin of mine. she wanted to visit me last summer to see her irish ancestors but i didnt want any of my friends to die so i made my excuses

partyatmygaff

truecrippler wrote: »

Minister Ahern said: 'Today's incident is a reminder of the dangers faced by members of An Garda Síochána in carrying out their duties and their courage in confronting those dangers'.

Go on the Garda!!!

They are doing the job they're paid to do.
No one says "Go on the Chef" when they get a meal, Do they?

minidazzler

FabulousGirl wrote: »

My mother used to work as a receptionist in a hotel. One night 2 men came in, jumped over the counter and attacked her with a screwdriver and a hammer. They were self proclaimed "Ordinary Decent Criminals" who just wanted to rob the hotel. My mother was traumatised after the ordeal and could never face going to work again so had to leave a job she loved. The physical scars healed but the mental ones were always there.
Fast forward a few years later and my mother is dying in hospital from a brain tumour. She thinks she's back in the hotel being attacked and is crying and screaming for help and telling me to hide so I don't get hurt.

Yeah, they're much better lads than drug dealers.

If you read my post, it says where noone gets hurt. I am not defending criminals, but a guy who breaks into a warehouse at 2 in the morning and steals a bunch of IPods is more decent than a drug dealer, or indeed the lads you mentioned.


Also, I said NO dealings with Drugs, as in they don't even do drugs themselves. Just in it for the money, without hurting innocent people.

partyatmygaff

minidazzler wrote: »

If you read my post, it says where noone gets hurt. I am not defending criminals, but a guy who breaks into a warehouse at 2 in the morning and steals a bunch of IPods is more decent than a drug dealer, or indeed the lads you mentioned.


Also, I said NO dealings with Drugs, as in they don't even do drugs themselves. Just in it for the money, without hurting innocent people.

Yes because breaking into a warehouse and stealing a bunch of iPods is more decent than a drug dealer.
Scum are Scum, these so called "decent" robbers would not hesitate to kill or maim a security guard who gets in their way.

Borneo Fnctn

minidazzler wrote: »

If you read my post, it says where noone gets hurt. I am not defending criminals, but a guy who breaks into a warehouse at 2 in the morning and steals a bunch of IPods is more decent than a drug dealer, or indeed the lads you mentioned.

Burglary and theft are not the same as robbery. Robbery is where violence or the threat of violence are used. If a person has the intent to rob from you, he'll hurt you if he has to.

Sharpshooter

partyatmygaff wrote: »

They are doing the job they're paid to do.
No one says "Go on the Chef" when they get a meal, Do they?

Uh yeah, if their meals are provided by our very own madchef.;)
"Go on the Chef"

partyatmygaff

jackpalance wrote: »

Burglary and theft are not the same as robbery. Robbery is where violence or the threat of violence are used. If a person has the intent to rob from you, he'll hurt you if he has to.

Ok, Sorry a "burgular" breaks in to a warehouse to steal. Are they the type who likely gives a f*ck if they kill or injure someone else?

Borneo Fnctn

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Ok, Sorry a "burgular" breaks in to a warehouse to steal. Are they the type who likely gives a f*ck if they kill or injure someone else?

That's another story. I'm not defending thieves here. I'm merely saying that stealing ipods from a warehouse is not comparable to armed robbery where violence or the threat of violence is used.

minidazzler

jackpalance wrote: »

That's another story. I'm not defending thieves here. I'm merely saying that stealing ipods from a warehouse is not comparable to armed robbery where violence or the threat of violence is used.

That's what I was trying to say.


Saying they are the same is similar to saying Raping a 15 year old is the same as having consentual sex with them. When it clearly isn't,

Damo1174

FabulousGirl wrote: »

My mother used to work as a receptionist in a hotel. One night 2 men came in, jumped over the counter and attacked her with a screwdriver and a hammer. They were self proclaimed "Ordinary Decent Criminals" who just wanted to rob the hotel. My mother was traumatised after the ordeal and could never face going to work again so had to leave a job she loved. The physical scars healed but the mental ones were always there.
Fast forward a few years later and my mother is dying in hospital from a brain tumour. She thinks she's back in the hotel being attacked and is crying and screaming for help and telling me to hide so I don't get hurt.

Yeah, they're much better lads than drug dealers.

Thats bad. It is thieves like that who get everybody a bad name.

Ok heres how I see it. Ok if you walk into a bank and start demanding money (without a gun) then there not going to take you seriously and you might even find yourself getting taken down by a few of the bigger men in the que.

So you take a gun (it doesnt even have to be real or be loaded). Now the person behind the counter will take you seriously and nobody in the que is going to try to mess wit you.

However you dont have to go in there like a mad man. If you go in there and stay calm and tell people your not going to hurt anybody.. your just there for the money and if they pass it along then there will be no problems. Trust me. It can be done in a decent fashion that nobody is scarred for life physcially or emotionally. They might be a bit shook-up but its nothing they wont get over.

And you know what... not that yall probably care what i think. But bank robberies are definitely becomming a thing of the past. If you want to be a bank robber these days you better learn how to work computers.

kraggy

imeddyhobbs wrote: »

Every time the Garda ERU attend a bank or cash in transit robbery someone dies?

That's some state to be in, wha?

Seriously though, a good day for law-abiding citizens.

Delighted.