27, lonely, never been in relationship...

Sin1981

Hi, I'm a 27 years old female, and these days I'm quite unhappy, lonely, and all in all a bit lost. Some would say I have a lot going for myself, plenty of education, good job etc, but I don't see the point in any of that when I feel the more personal side of my life is down. I was a very shy young girl, the entire way throughout school. I have gotten over that, it took me a long time. THese days if I say to people that I'm shy, or used to be shy, they laugh and say " what? you? no way! ha ha!!". I suppose that's good and I am happy that i've improved in that area.
I spent a few years abroad and returned a year ago. Over the past 2 years I think I might have been depressed, well I had some of the typical symtoms such as, constant sadness, worthlessness, and thoughts of death to name a few. It was a very gradual thing, and I never really knew I had a problem until maybe 2 years into it. I didn't have anyone close by who might have noticed. I never did anything about it, ie. see a doctor.
Since I've returned home, about a year ago, I have improved slowly. I am now working, but to be honest I have zero interest in it. I have no drive, motivation, or interest in doing it, or impressing anyone. I definitely think my manager is onto me, ie. he thinks I'm lazy and useless, as I think it's obvious I go to work, and show little enthusiasm. But I simply don't care at all. a few years ago (5/6 years ago) I would have been mortified at the thought of my boss thinking badly of me, but these days I am completely apathetic and I cannot snap out of that. I sometimes tell my friends that i'm not interested in work, and they laugh and say that I'm lazy and was too used to student life and that I have to get on with work like everyone else in the world. i'm not sure...
To add to that, I feel like my personal life is dead. I have never had a boyfriend & no exp with sex, and feel like I never will experience that. I've only ever been on 2 dates, one when i was 18, lasted over a summer, but wasn't serious at all. the second one was when i was 23, nothing came of it, but I really liked this guy. I am embarrassed to tell you that this is the height of my experiences. I am less experienced that most 14 year olds out there. I now think I have bad confidence issues, and self image. I have a good figure, hour glass as a lot of my friends would say. Face-wise I'd say I'm pretty average, but I totally understand that personality is everything. I have been complemented by friends' boyfriends and even workmates. One guy from work recently said "why dont' you have a man?!". I know that's a good compliment, and it was nice, but it also makes me a bit upset, becasue the whole men area seems like never improving. I would like nothing more than to be a normal 20-something, happy, busy, and experiences the things I should be experiencing. i know relationships aren't the B all and end all, but I really, really would like to get going in that area.
MAybe I need to speak to someone, or maybe I can get by as before, and hope that things will gradually improve. As regards work, I think I will NEVER enjoy it until the more personal side if my life is filled in, and that might take years. All in all I'm a bit lost.
Can anyone offer some advice on all of the above?
thanks:)

SueWho

Don't panic yet- it sounds like you have a lot going for you and you are still young! Losing interest in things in life that you used to like or feel ambitious about like your job and impressing your boss... these can also be signs of depression. It certainly wouldn't do any harm to visit your GP and tell them how you're feeling.

It sounds like you have a great ability to help youself and improve yourself (like you said you used to be shy but you worked on it). Maybe it's just a case of believing in yourself a bit more and getting youself out into social situations where you can meet people. And don't just focus on men- just making a new friend could cheer you up.

Feeling inexperienced is probably dominating your thoughts when you're socialising and trying get to know guys initially. But forget all that for now and when you do meet someone and the time is right, be open about it- if the guy is not kind and understanding then he's not worth the trouble anyway.

prinz

Sin1981 wrote: »

I have been complemented by friends' boyfriends and even workmates. One guy from work recently said "why dont' you have a man?!".

Relax and don't stress. First things first, see a counsellor about the depression. That definitely sounds like an issue tbh. Sort that out first before you think about relationships. Being in a relationship will not help you out of that, even if it does stem from that problem.

As regards meeting guys, see the comment above? Talk to him.... friends' boyfriends, workmates. Tell them you'd like to meet someone and ask them if they know a guy, or to set you up on a date with a friend.

As SueWho said, with the right time and the right guy, everything else will follow. Try not to force it, that never works out well.

jojobrad

Know exactly how you feel. I've been single for years and never seem to have any luck with men and dating in general. I've been told I'm very attractive/sexy/gorgeous etc and all the blokes who are married or in relationships are always like "if I was single, I'd be asking you out bla bla bla" Its so annoying ! Just last night I was supposed to go on a date. Ten minutes before we were supposed to meet he cancelled with some lame excuse.
Sometimes I think its better to be alone as most men (in my experience) are pigs and are only concerned about using women for sex. But then of course we were programmed to want to be in relationships and be loved and it seems we cant be happy unless this side of our lives are fulfilled. Its like nothing matters and life has no meaning or purpose without that special someone.
I dont really have any advice for you but to just let you know that there are people out there who know exactly what you're going through.
You're not alone.

prinz

jojobrad wrote: »

Sometimes I think its better to be alone as most men (in my experience) are pigs and are only concerned about using women for sex.

No offence, but that could be where you're going wrong. I wouldn't go near a girl with that attitude if I was a 10 foot bargepole.

petethebrick

jojobrad wrote: »

Sometimes I think its better to be alone as most men (in my experience) are pigs and are only concerned about using women for sex.

Don't listen to this nonsense. With men and women both you get some bad but most good. I think jojobrad must be bitter about some past experiences - don't let her bitterness affect your attitude towards men.

First thing i notice reading your post is that you say you're embarrassed about your lack of experience. You're old enough now to know that it's your own happiness that counts and not what others think of you right? Get out there and start enjoying yourself and don't be concerned about your inexperience.
Do you socialise much? Do you have some good girlfriends maybe that you could go out with on the pull? - not guaranteed to meet a life partner this way but you'll have some fun maybe!
Or why not try one of the singles/speed dating type events. I think there are loads of them on in dublin but I don't have the web links to them.
I hope things work out for you. Good luck^^^^

jojobrad

prinz wrote: »

No offence, but that could be where you're going wrong. I wouldn't go near a girl with that attitude if I was a 10 foot bargepole.

None taken. And I dont express that opinion very often. I'm forever hopeful in meeting someone who will prove me wrong and I give every man I meet the benefit of the doubt.

And if you do ever meet a girl who does express an opinion like that, you should stop to think that her opinion didn't fall out of the sky and maybe she's a really nice girl who's just sick of being treated like dirt.

LegacyUser

I never had a boyfriend through school. Uni I spent much of my time single with the odd few dates - I was very very inexperienced compared to some of my friends and it made me very self conscious so I can relate to what you're saying.
I think it did take me a while to find myself, I carry myself much better these days, i wear makeup(!) and spend more time looking after myself and it definitely gave me more confidence.
Because I had never really had a boyfriend until I was 22 I never really knew what I was missing, and because of that I was content being single and I was happy - although I was still hoping to find someone!!
It sounds a bit like you're hoping a man/relationship will fill this void in your life, but I think you should try and fill that yourself first, otherwise when you do start seeing someone you might find this emptiness still remains? Learn to love what you have and yourself and everything else will be a bonus!
I'm very inexperienced when it comes to men, my boyfriend of 2 years came to me out of the blue and it took me a while to finally commit to even seeing him! I suppose I'd spent a long time dreaming up my perfect guy but no man is perfect and I realised Im not either!! My boyfriend can be an absolute pain in the butt at times and we have had many blazing rows but he's definitely not a pig, he's the most perfect thing to have happened to me. And it all came about when I finally stopped looking

LegacyUser

jojobrad wrote: »

None taken. And I dont express that opinion very often. I'm forever hopeful in meeting someone who will prove me wrong and I give every man I meet the benefit of the doubt.

And if you do ever meet a girl who does express an opinion like that, you should stop to think that her opinion didn't fall out of the sky and maybe she's a really nice girl who's just sick of being treated like dirt.

You may not express that opinion often, but I bet it transpires a lot.
I join the group that wouldnt go anywhere near you, sorry.

Wibbs

prinz wrote: »

No offence, but that could be where you're going wrong. I wouldn't go near a girl with that attitude if I was a 10 foot bargepole.

I have to say I would be the same, or at least that defensiveness would put me right off. For a few reasons. In the first place I have found that I have to put in way more work to convince them and life is too short. I feel I'm trying to make up for the shortcomings of guys I haven't even met. It's bad enough dealing with my own shortcomings. In my experience it also means I'll be doing that a lot and that leaves me on tenterhooks. Not a comfortable way to live or love. Now I have been with two like that in the past. I could see why they felt like that about guys, but in both of those cases at least, their experience coloured who they went for and they fell into the self fulfilling prophecy lark. Even when things were fine they were actively looking for trouble, or even causing it to back up their worldview.

I suppose basically I refuse to prove myself to anyone but myself.

I think regardless how a woman looks, over defensiveness is an unattractive trait. Kinda like serious lack of confidence in a man is unattractive to most women.

I agree with Unregistered when she says there is no value in hoping a man will fill the void in your life. It won't. Way too many men and women think and act on this. I do think women hang onto that notion of being saved more than men though. Hiding to nothing. Work on yourself. Meet as many new people as possible. Be open and trusting until proven otherwise. Dress and look your best as men are visual creatures, even more than women. If you like a guy, don't be subtle. Most don't do subtle and it'll go right over their head. Don't wait around looking for a man. Be your own woman and they'll come looking for you. Half the worlds population are men so the odds are with you.

Gyalist

jojobrad wrote: »

And if you do ever meet a girl who does express an opinion like that, you should stop to think that her opinion didn't fall out of the sky and maybe she's a really nice girl who's just sick of being treated like dirt.

Have you ever considered why it is that you keep attracting that type of men?

Taltos

Unregistered wrote: »

It sounds a bit like you're hoping a man/relationship will fill this void in your life, but I think you should try and fill that yourself first, otherwise when you do start seeing someone you might find this emptiness still remains? Learn to love what you have and yourself and everything else will be a bonus!

I think this poster hit the nail on the head.
Seek counselling or help for the depression, once you learn to really be happy with yourself even a little bit that will show in everything else you are doing and will more than likely act as a signal to the right guy.
If you go into a relationship being this low about yourself it might be hard for the guy to feel any better - so you could end up with a wrong 'un.

Once you do feel better, try to mix more and just have fun, sometimes your future partner is right under your nose.

AARRRGH

Sin1981 wrote: »

I have a good figure, hour glass as a lot of my friends would say. Face-wise I'd say I'm pretty average, but I totally understand that personality is everything.

Sorry to pick up on this bit, but "you have an hour glass figure" is what I say to my fat friends when they fish for compliments.

And personality is definitely NOT everything when it comes to meeting someone - physical attraction is (at least initially) way more important.

You have to get the physical right if you want to increase your chance of meeting someone.

If you improve your physical - better diet, body, appearance - your mental health will follow.

AARRRGH

jojobrad wrote: »

I think its better to be alone as most men (in my experience) are pigs and are only concerned about using women for sex.

Eh no, the men YOU pick are only interested in using YOU for sex.

So -

a. You are picking bad men. This is not an accident. You are doing it on purpose for some psychological reason.
b. Why are you allowing men use you for sex?

Stop blaming others for your own mistakes.

Gyalist

AARRRGH wrote: »

Eh no, the men YOU pick are only interested in using YOU for sex.

So -

a. You are picking bad men. This is not an accident. You are doing it on purpose for some psychological reason.
b. Why are you allowing men use you for sex?

Stop blaming others for your own mistakes.

Which is what I was alluding to in my post above. Your response is more tactless direct.

Sin1981

Sin1981 wrote: »

.
I spent a few years abroad and returned a year ago. Over the past 2 years I think I might have been depressed

How were things while you were abroad?
Do you have any male friends?
Do you get asked out much or chatted up?

Wibbs

OK folks lets stay on topic please.

AARRRGH

sunflower27 wrote: »

You are making a fool of yourself then....

read this
http://www.diet-blog.com/archives/2007/03/15/do_you_pursue_an_hourglass_figure.php

sunflower27 wrote: »

it is on topic, is it not?
The OP said she was happy that she had an hour-glass figure, only to be told very rudely that that means 'fat'. I was merely pointing out that that is absurd and in fact an hour-glass figure is one that many men prefer.

I think you've misunderstood what I said.

If you are fat, and you ask your friends if you are fat, what are they going to say?

Fat? I don't think so.
Slim? I don't think so.
Hour glass? Curvy? Probably.

The fact of the matter is the OP is 27 and can't attract men for some reason.

Attraction is mostly physical, so she should figure out if there is some physical issue at play here.

I was pointing out if she is indeed overweight, she should look into this as a potential cause. Yes, I know the odd man likes overweight women, but most don't.

I also accept she might genuinely be an hour glass figure. I never said she wasn't.

LegacyUser

Don't mind AARGh. I've noticed that body seems to be the only thing he cares about and gives advice on in terms of how to put yourself out there with men.

What you need is confidence. No matter what you look like, you will not attract men if you have low confidence.

Harness those compliments and keep repeating them in your head when you're on a night out to boost your self esteem and remind yourself that people do find you attractive.

I do think it sounds like you are suffering from depression though and suggest you see someone about it.

As other posters said, a man will not make you feel better about yourself. It will not fill a void. You have to be happy in your own skin and in your own company first.

Good luck.

AARRRGH

sunflower27 wrote: »

Curvy is curvy

Hourglass is hourglass -

they are 2 separate shapes.

Kelly Brook is considered a classic hour-glass figure

Your interpretation that hour-glass = curvy = fat is way off the mark, mate.

I'm sure you think your 'real honesty' here is endearing and helpful. it isnt. You just sound incredibly misinformed.

No, you're still misunderstanding.

I understand what curvy and hour glass mean.

They are not the same as fat.

So can we move on from that please?

If you read the OP's post it is her FRIENDS who told her she has an hour glass figure.

Hour glass is a known euphemism for fat.

No one is going to tell their friend she is fat. They will be kind and say you are curvy or have an hour glass figure.

So I am saying be sure your friends weren't just being kind.

I believe it is possible they were just being kind because -

a. They aren't going to say she's fat.
b. Hour glass is a known euphemism for fat.
c. She cannot attract men. Attraction is mostly physical.

So, can you see I am not simply saying fat is the same as hour glass? That's not what I'm saying. Re-read the above if you still think that's what I'm saying...

sunflower27

sunflower27 wrote: »

Curvy is curvy

Hourglass is hourglass -

they are 2 separate shapes.

Kelly Brook is considered a classic hour-glass figure

Your interpretation that hour-glass = curvy = fat is way off the mark, mate.

I'm sure you think your 'real honesty' here is endearing and helpful. it isnt. You just sound incredibly misinformed.

To be fair I think you have missed his point. Of course hourglass is sexy. He's saying a lot of people who are plain fat are told they have an hourglass figure to make them feel better. I know that sounds really mean, but I see it happening all the time.

I wouldn't assume it was a physical thing though. I think confidence is 100 times more important than physical beauty. I know some very unattractive people who have had a string of partners and some really goodlooking people who have never been on a date.

AARRRGH

sunflower27 wrote: »

Why do you presume when her friends tell her she is an hourglass it's because she is fat. Why cant she not be an hour-glass as they say she is?

I think you are personalising what I'm saying so it's going over your head a bit.

If you re-read my posts I never said the OP is fat. I said she should be open to the fact that IT IS POSSIBLE she is fat.

Being fat is a known reason why some women find it hard to meet men.

I am saying she should not take her friend's opinions as gospel, because it is unlikely they will tell her she is fat.

Yes, it is possible she has an hour glass figure, but it is also possible they were just being kind.

I believe people should always check and double check if there is a physical "problem", because even the biggest dick heads in the world get chatted up if they are physically ok looking.

LegacyUser

Arrrgh is not accusing anyone of being fat, Sunflower I understand what your saying "hourgalss is hourglass" but "hourglass is also a nicer way of saying fat" Listen, im a girl ok, if one of my friends had a larger physique and questioned me about what kind of body type she had I would say "Curvy" or "hourglass" as I wouldnt want to brand her as fat, however she would have eyes in her head and would know that shes fat with an "hourglass" shape. Anyways, thats not the point, OP I think you should really start to work on yourself before going down the road of meeting someone, you sound like your a bit down on yourself, and there is help out there, its nothing to be ashamed of, but this idea of a man or a "relationship" improving other areas of your life is something of a fantasy, trust me. If you get into a relationship now, chances are it wont work out because you really do have to love yourself before you love someone else, I know its said a lot, but its true, I have been in a few relationships and one in particular I got into for all the wrong reasons, I was down in myself I was thinking that a man would solve all my problems, but he didnt. It made it worse, I brought negativity to the relationship and I brought him down with me, and it didnt work out, so I sorted myself out now and I remind myself that I dont need a man to complete my life. Remember, you came into the world as a whole person, you dont need a man to make you one! best of luck!

AARRRGH

sunflower27 wrote: »

It isnt going over my head.... :rolleyes:

It is obvious that the OP has a lot of issues relating to self esteem etc that need to be dealt with.

I just found the hour-glass comment incredibly pointless. As i said - YOU DON'T HAVE TO BE THIN TO FIND A BOYFRIEND.

We are going over old ground here and it isn't helping the OP so let's drop it, eh. I am not going to agree that her weight is more than likely the reason she is 27 and single. It's just a quick and easy assumption to make...

You're still misunderstanding. It doesn't matter though.

This is where my advice is coming from:

Humans delude themselves all the time. It's part of being human.

Without meaning to pick on overweight people, I see it all the time with overweight people wondering why the opposite sex aren't attracted to them. The only explanation for this is denial or/and delusion.

I don't see any point in advising people that everything is ok and not to worry. That, in my opinion, isn't useful. It just reinforces the denial that the problem isn't them.

I am of the opinion that we should face our problems head on. I try to do that with myself - I regularly fail - but I accept the vast majority of problems I have ever encountered have been due to me, or at least partly due to me.

For example, if I try to chat up a girl and she is horrible to me, well maybe I shouldn't have been bothering someone who was having a bad day. They didn't ask me to chat them up. It was my decision, my choice, so I should be open to rejection. I certainly wouldn't start thinking "she's a ****" or "all women are bitches". No, I would be thinking "I need a better chat up technique" or "I need to pick my 'targets' better".

I could delude myself into thinking the problem is them, but it's not. I interrupted their day.

If you take a long look at your life, you will see you are in denial about all sorts of things. I guess it's some sort of coping mechanism that has evolved over time.

So when someone comes here saying they are 27 and can't meet men and have never really been able to meet men, then there is obviously something odd going on.

I know personality is important, but if we are brutally honest we know it's only sort of important. Physical looks are way more important - everywhere in life you will see good looking people being more successful than those less fortunate, regardless of their personality. That's just the way the world works.

So I believe if the OP really was nice looking, then she would have more sexual experience than (her words) a 14 year old. Yes, maybe she is nice looking and maybe she's just been incredibly unlucky, but she needs to be brutally honest with her looks to rule them out as the cause of her problem. I don't see what's so scary about that. And that's all I'm trying to say.

/Sorry for rant

AARRRGH

sunflower27 wrote: »

AAAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGHHHHH - and I am not saying your name here.

The OP said she has less experience than a 14-year old, do you not think if she was obese or overweight she'd have said that? Do we really need our friends to tell us we are overweight? We would know ourselves. It is quite obvious to me that the OP's issues go a lot deeper than 'weight'.

The whole jumping on the hour-glass-curvy-fat assumption is laughable. Sorry, but you are putting so much emphasis on the reason she has not had a relationship on something you don't even actually know.

And even if she is size 16-18 why would that stop men approaching her?

People delude themselves all the time.

It is part of being human.

Maybe she has the nicest body in the world.

TBH I am surprised you've never heard of people being kind by saying "you have an hour glass figure" or "you are curvy" when really what they are thinking is "you are overweight".

By your reaction to my posts, I guess this is something you are worried about.

Anyway, all I am saying is she needs to be sure she is being honest with herself. After all, she wants to solve her problem, so she should explore every possible explanation.

I don't see any point in ignoring potential reasons for her problem.

Anyway, please PM me if you want to continue disagreeing with what I am saying. I don't want to make this thread about you and me.

Wibbs

sunflower27 wrote: »

it is on topic, is it not?
The OP said she was happy that she had an hour-glass figure, only to be told very rudely that that means 'fat'. I was merely pointing out that that is absurd and in fact an hour-glass figure is one that many men prefer.

Oh one or maybe two posts on the topic of maybe some part of her physical aspect is putting men off is on topic, getting into a back and forth debate between yourself and AARRRGH, re what is an hourglass or not isn't(which I could see thats where it was going). Take it to fashion and appearance if you must. In any case I know more men who dig heavy women than skinny so it's unlikely to be that so as I say lets steer a better course for the OP here. Thank you.

LegacyUser

Im a 28yr old male in more or less the same situation as you, maybe more of a history regarding flings but none the less very little relationship experience..

I't can get you down sometimes, so just to let you know you are totally not alone in that, and it doesnt make you a freak or anything negative, beautiful & ugly, big or slim, tall or small all types of people can experience problems connecting with others (in fact some people in LTR's don't actually make any sort of proper connection at all & often are only there 'cos they're not brave enough to not be)

IMO all this talk of looks and personality is rubbish, everybody has something going for them, its more about being open to connect with other people, being prepared to be vulnerable with another, taking the risk to put yourself out there and say, "i would like to meet someone"..

For instance do you talk about this stuff with your friends? Ask them to set you up, or do you just put a brave face on always and pretend everythings grand, when inside it's not - it's about being able to share that what's inside that constitutes a real relationship, and often it takes along time of getting to know someone before you can do it for real - And also do not be afraid to have high standards and turn away guys that you feel like are only out for selfish reasons, while at the same time don't be too quick to dismiss the idea of other guys without stopping and really considering if they've something to offer..

(people may say i dont have a right to give that advice with so little relationship experience, but that's just my account of slowly opening up to others - i actually find it's a case of changing how you approach everybody & the whole world and not just potential partners! And most importantly how you approach yourself!)

AARRRGH

Unregcra wrote: »

IMO all this talk of looks and personality is rubbish, everybody has something going for them...

This is terrible advice.

Even if you do have something - apart from your looks and personality - going for you, for example, you have lots of money, don't you realise you are making it so much harder to meet someone by ignoring the two most basic elements of attraction?

And even on a human level, don't you want to have a nice personality, and appear somewhat physically attractive?

Fol20

Wibbs wrote: »

In any case I know more men who dig heavy women than skinny so it's unlikely to be that so as I say lets steer a better course for the OP here. Thank you.

I dunno if id agree with that now..I think moderation is best.Not too skinny,not too fat.Everything is best in moderation..

Btw Arrrgh,from one of your above comment you seem to come across as a bit shallow.You say your appearance is everything in life and more good looking people are successful.This is true to a degree but again if you have a good personality,you can also be successful.Again moderation is best.Sunflower,its like your defending overweight people immensely,although arrgh is enphasising the physical appearence a bit much,the hourglass thing is true.No one will outright say to a person that they are fat,but rather change it in a way to sound nice to the person.Personally im just average in everything and am happy with that.

Anyway,back to the op.I know you have probably heard it a million times but why dont you join clubs that your interested in.Youl talk with likeminded people and who knows where it could go from there.I suppose if you want to overcome your shyness or whatever it is,you could go to a councillor or a confidence coach.I wish you the best of luck in your quest to find a man

LegacyUser

AAArgh.. of course i don't mean they're completly irrelevant, it is possible to read too deep into posts. I'm not some hunk but at the same time ive gotten into things with girls more often than not with them doing the running, so in my case it was not the looks or personality but me putting up barriers - i just wanted to share this perspective with the OP

IMO if she is able to open up and connect more then her personality will shine out so thats one out of two sorted

of course anybody will get rewards from taking up sports and looking after themselves, eating well, dressing nicely and being well groomed but any more than that is too much IMO, & anyone who put's too much stock in the looks department brings adverse effects on their personality

there are many people who sail by on their looks, having what appear to be great lives when in reality they are lonely and insecure, so it could be a curse as much as an advantage if your mammy never taught how to use them properly

Hourglass sounds hot to me, regardless if it comes with a little bit of extra weight

AARRRGH

Fol20 wrote: »

Arrrgh,from one of your above comment you seem to come across as a bit shallow.

What I'm trying to say is looks are very important, whether we like it or not.

I don't see any point in pretending looks mean nothing, or that fat is beautiful.

Yes, there are exceptions to every rule, but in general, if you notice the opposite sex are disinterested in you, maybe, just maybe, it's because you are physically unattractive. That would be an extremely common reason.

sunflower27 wrote:

am i the only one that hour-glass didnt jump out as the big problem in attracting a man?

You're still ignoring the very possiblity that her friends were just being polite.

I don't understand why you refuse to believe people are rarely honest when asked to rate their friends appearance.

It is pointless believing the problem must be her personality only.

I can give an example from boards. A few years ago someone posted something similar to the OP saying how they can't meet men and how they are at least average looking and her friends agree she is at least average looking. Well, I saw a picture of her and I can tell you I immediately could see what the problem was. It wasn't her personality.

I believe if you have a long term problem and you want to solve it, you need to be brutally honest and brutal with your self-analysis. Pussy footing around will just drag the problem on for a few more years.

Fol20

sunflower27 wrote: »

We dont even know the OP is overweight - hence why I think this whole 'if she's been called hour-glass then she's probably really just 'fat' (cos no-one ever tells it as it is) and that is why she cant get a boyfriend' thing is just stupid.

PLENTY OF WOMEN THAT ARENT SIZE 6-8 MEET MEN. reading the original post, am i the only one that hour-glass didnt jump out as the big problem in attracting a man?


Even if the OP is overweight, why would that stop her meeting a man?

It's all got a bit ridiculous. We dont know what size she is - is fat anything above a size 14? or is it a 16? Maybe a 12?

I never said being overweight stops someone from meeting a bf or gf.All i was saying is that your defending it immensely,which you are already doing again,lol.

I have to admit though that being overweight(not that im saying the op is overweight as you have already cleared that up) will be a small initial barrier for some people.Not all but some.Everyoneone is different,some like it big,some like it skinny,whatever floats your boat like

Taltos

Op

just in case you missed it - pls work on your self esteem and self worth.
Find a way to be happier in yourself and you will draw in the right person and not some shallow idiot looking for a quick lay.

There are others out there like you, but to focus right now on just meeting someone without first resolving your own worth issues will just come back to haunt you.

In the meantime go and find some new activity to get involved in, where you can meet folk and get some sense of achievement.
eg - orienteering; kayaking; self-defence; would steer clear of classes as they are normally for folk looking to improve a skill - activities are more for a change in life - broadening your horizons. In my case with the activity I have met loads of folk from different walks of life.

BOL and fingers crossed for you - remember focus on the positive and look for new things to do. Nothing better than tryihg something new - scared maybe and a few months later realising you now love it....

Fol20

AARRRGH wrote: »

What I'm trying to say is looks are very important, whether we like it or not.

I don't see any point in pretending looks mean nothing, or that fat is beautiful.

Yes, there are exceptions to every rule, but in general, if you are finding the opposite sex are disinterested in you, maybe, just maybe, it's because you are physically unattractive.

Actually now that you bring that up,if your fat and want to find a man,go over to mauritania,where being attractive in that culture is being obese,lol.No joke,google it sure to read about it more.

Weight is initially important if its a stranger your trying to hook up with.If its someone you know for a few years etc,looks arent everything like.as iv said moderation is best.Or if your lucky good looks and good personality.

AARRRGH

Fol20 wrote: »

Weight is initially important if its a stranger your trying to hook up with.If its someone you know for a few years etc,looks arent everything like.as iv said moderation is best.Or if your lucky good looks and good personality.

Yep, I agree.

All my comments should be read in the context of meeting new people.

AARRRGH

sunflower27 wrote: »

I think the comments by Aaarrghh were incredibly unhelpful to the OP. It obviously took a lot for her to post her feelings and he just sums it up with - well, your friends are just being kind, you are obviously fat so men dont fancy you.

I think you need to re-read my posts.

I can tell by your writing style that you are feeling a bit emotional, but I never said the OP is fat.

Please, go back and re-read my posts without assuming I am attacking you or the OP.

I am saying - because there is obviously a major issue at play here - she should analyse everything, and assume nothing. She is currently assuming she is alright looking - this may not be reality. The evidence suggests this.

Fol20

sunflower27 wrote: »

Exactly what I am saying. Of course I'll defend it.

I think the comments by Aaarrghh were incredibly unhelpful to the OP. It obviously took a lot for her to post her feelings and he just sums it up with - well, your friends are just being kind, you are obviously fat so men dont fancy you.

I'd defend anyone if I thought someone was being needlessly harsh on them (and without any true facts) - fat, thin, tall, short - whatever.

I think your over reading it here.He just said that some people when asked how do i look will lie.hes not saying shes fat,just thats its human behavior to hide the ugly truth about someone they don't want to hurt.I have to admit i prefer hour glass figures myself as well.

AARRRGH

sunflower27 wrote: »

I've read your posts Aaarrgghhh. You said that 'hourglass is a term you call YOUR friends that are fat'. Nice. What a charming person you are :rolleyes:

Are you for real?

I said if a fat person asks my opinion on their looks, I won't want to hurt their feelings, so I will say something kind like they are curvy or they have an hour glass figure.

This, believe it or not, is being nice.

You're not making sense.

beks101

I know lots of slightly chubby, overweight and quite fat women who are in healthy and happy relationships, and have never had any problem attracting men. And in fact the woman I would consider to be the most successful with men that I know is a size 16 and ridiculously sexy.

And is a size 16 fat? What constitutes 'fat', anyway?

This is a pointless argument with no definite 'right' or 'wrong' because ultimately what it boils down to is how the OP feels about herself.

There's no point arguing that looks aren't important, and sure, men are more visual creatures than women, but without an iota of self confidence as a foundation those looks are futile when looking for a healthy and happy relationship or at least the attention of decent, respectful men.

From my reading of your post OP, low self esteem and depression are the reasons why you are having trouble in this area.

You're clearly an intelligent, articulate, well educated, and successful (having a job at the moment is successful, I don't care what anyone says) woman who doesn't believe in herself. And this self doubt is doing you a serious injustice.

I think you owe it to yourself to get to the root of your low self esteem and depression and come to appreciate your self worth, before the positive things can happen for you, like meeting someone special.

Wibbs

OK there have been enough warning to sunflower27 and AARRRGH, to take this to PM(indeed you said you would), or simply stop hogging this thread with your personal spat. The next reply by either of these posters on this gets a week off from this forum. Final warning.

Latchy

beks101 wrote: »

I know lots of slightly chubby, overweight and quite fat women who are in healthy and happy relationships, and have never had any problem attracting men. And in fact the woman I would consider to be the most successful with men that I know is a size 16 and ridiculously sexy.

And is a size 16 fat? What constitutes 'fat', anyway?

This is a pointless argument with no definite 'right' or 'wrong' because ultimately what it boils down to is how the OP feels about herself.

There's no point arguing that looks aren't important, and sure, men are more visual creatures than women, but without an iota of self confidence as a foundation those looks are futile when looking for a healthy and happy relationship or at least the attention of decent, respectful men.

From my reading of your post OP, low self esteem and depression are the reasons why you are having trouble in this area.

You're clearly an intelligent, articulate, well educated, and successful (having a job at the moment is successful, I don't care what anyone says) woman who doesn't believe in herself. And this self doubt is doing you a serious injustice.

I think you owe it to yourself to get to the root of your low self esteem and depression and come to appreciate your self worth, before the positive things can happen for you, like meeting someone special.

Have to say this post sums it up in words for me .

I think the problem is most likely the fact OP said she had a problem with being depressed and feeling worthless. That gets projected outward a lot more than people realise. I know for years I went around kind of in a cloud, being afraid to express my emotions properly and always feeling like I was on the edge of things. I was 21 having never had a boyfriend. I made a conscious affort to deal with that and try to be a bit more friendly and chatty in general and not care what people thought of me and I literally got asked out by my ex a few weeks later.

Also, I am absolutely useless at telling when I guy is interested. Apparently it's been obvious to other people billions of times over the years and I was totally oblivious. The poor guys were trying to flirt with me and I was there making polite conversation thinking they were just being friendly. Just wanted to throw that out there as well.

Bettee

Sin1981; you sound like you're totally stuck in limbo!!! First off, you shouldn't have to just get by. Everybody deserves happiness and contentment, cliche and all as that may be, but if you can't be happy why is it ok for others to be successful in their lives?! You do sound like you've had to battle some aspects of depression, so please talk to someone about that, be it a friend,family member or doctor,whatever. I have some experience in dealing with close family members who have become depressed, and its not an easy thing for someone to have to deal with on their own. Depression is an illness, its not just about being sad, and if you have depression it is something that needs to be treated,however you choose. You talk of how quiet and shy you were when you were young but you've overcome it and thats fantastic. If anything it should show you your own worth in dealing with things. My friends think I have a romantic outlook on life and that I look through rose-tinted windows, but really I don't. I have had so much badness happen in my life that I've learned it goes on regardless, so its my responsibility to make myself happy and achieve things. I know what it feels like to be unmotivated, for a while I found just being able to get up in the morning an achievement. I had no purpose and like you, no motivation. Work obviously isn't challenging you, you either don't like it or you've jst become side-tracked because you are down. Try and figure this out and act on it. Its hard for friends to realise what you are going through unless they have gone through a slump themselves. Also, gurrrrrl do not worry about relationship experience and all that jazz! You are not in competition with ever other female on the planet but if you are not happy in yourself, in your own life, then that radiates. Insecurity isn't necessarily unattractive, but it can be misread. I'm not exactly flush in relationship and sex experience but I'm happy to say at the moment I'm comfortable with myself and I'm working on becoming happy with work, and as a result I feel like I'm attracting more attention, not just male attention, but I'm making more friends aswell. I', sorry this as turned into a bit of a rant, but basically my point is your personal life begins with you the person. Please try filling that in before becoming too consumed with the rest.

Dudess

Sin1981 wrote: »

Hi, I'm a 27 years old female, and these days I'm quite unhappy, lonely, and all in all a bit lost. Some would say I have a lot going for myself, plenty of education, good job etc, but I don't see the point in any of that when I feel the more personal side of my life is down.

Change your perspective there - honestly, I'm not going all "be thankful for what you've got" on your ass, but really, as a person who used to be very negative, I can promise you positive thinking is amazing!
Your thinking doesn't change overnight in this respect - you have to work on it - but oh my god, I can't emphasise how rewarding it is. I now focus on the good things in my life rather than what I'm not happy about, and feel so grateful for them. So remember: good job, good education - these are superb things to have at the moment. And take it from there when working on the rest. Well done on having those things by the way.
Thing is, if you find you CAN'T focus on the good though, then that could be a symptom of what seems like depression, going by your other comments (I'm not making a diagnosis obviously but do visit the doc/a counsellor - these are good things to do even if you DON'T have depression).

I was a very shy young girl, the entire way throughout school. I have gotten over that, it took me a long time. THese days if I say to people that I'm shy, or used to be shy, they laugh and say " what? you? no way! ha ha!!". I suppose that's good and I am happy that i've improved in that area.

Yep, stick with that thinking. Your childhood is long over - don't let it define you, and focus on now. And you have a circle of friends it seems - not so alone are you? Treasure them - and open up to them more. Your friends are heaven-sent when you're going through bad times.

Over the past 2 years I think I might have been depressed, well I had some of the typical symtoms such as, constant sadness, worthlessness, and thoughts of death to name a few. It was a very gradual thing, and I never really knew I had a problem until maybe 2 years into it. I didn't have anyone close by who might have noticed. I never did anything about it, ie. see a doctor.
Since I've returned home, about a year ago, I have improved slowly. I am now working, but to be honest I have zero interest in it. I have no drive, motivation, or interest in doing it, or impressing anyone. I definitely think my manager is onto me, ie. he thinks I'm lazy and useless, as I think it's obvious I go to work, and show little enthusiasm. But I simply don't care at all. a few years ago (5/6 years ago) I would have been mortified at the thought of my boss thinking badly of me, but these days I am completely apathetic and I cannot snap out of that.

Seems like more symptoms of depression - apathy, lethargy, difficulty getting motivated... classic signs. Depression isn't all about sadness, suicidal thoughts etc - its symptoms can be far more benign.

To add to that, I feel like my personal life is dead.

What about your circle of friends? These seem like a given, but they're not. If you saw all the threads started by people here who have little or no friends...

I have never had a boyfriend & no exp with sex, and feel like I never will experience that. I've only ever been on 2 dates, one when i was 18, lasted over a summer, but wasn't serious at all. the second one was when i was 23, nothing came of it, but I really liked this guy. I am embarrassed to tell you that this is the height of my experiences. I am less experienced that most 14 year olds out there.

Don't believe "most" 14-year-olds are more experienced than you - they're not. Yeah, some probably are, but not most. And so what? Sex is about the individual, not what everyone else is doing (despite the signals being sent out to the contrary). Sorry if this may seem probing, but here goes: do you have sexual fantasies/desires? Do you self pleasure? Have you tried using a vibrator? Get to know yourself physically and this may help you feel more confident sexually.

I now think I have bad confidence issues, and self image. I have a good figure, hour glass as a lot of my friends would say. Face-wise I'd say I'm pretty average, but I totally understand that personality is everything. I have been complemented by friends' boyfriends and even workmates. One guy from work recently said "why dont' you have a man?!"

Well hotten yourself up as much as possible, because appearance gets you noticed initially: use a good moisturiser, focus on areas of yourself that you like - your eyes maybe? Mouth? And accentuate them. Wear clothes that celebrate parts of your body you're really happy with. And exercise, eat well, drink lots of water (if you don't already) - these benefit the body AND mental health.
Also, even though you'd love to meet someone, I have a strong suspicion that your lack of confidence and poor self image are actually causing you to subconsciously push away men - "keep away from me" signals are often very prominent to those on the outside, even if a person doesn't realise they're making them. And also, because of thinking little of yourself, maybe you're not using your attractiveness to its full potential, due to a feeling of "not deserving" it?
Confidence is indeed very important - lack of self esteem is not attractive. I think the advice of others to work on your own happiness before going out with anyone is absolutely spot-on.

AARRRGH wrote:

Sorry to pick up on this bit, but "you have an hour glass figure" is what I say to my fat friends when they fish for compliments.

While I understand what you're saying, you could have phrased that in a far more sensitive way.

AARRRGH wrote: »

I know personality is important, but if we are brutally honest we know it's only sort of important. Physical looks are way more important - everywhere in life you will see good looking people being more successful than those less fortunate, regardless of their personality. That's just the way the world works.

But in relationships specifically, personality is far more than "sort of" important. Yes, initially it's physical appearance that gets a person noticed, that draws people to them, but ultimately, in terms of being together long-term, it's more about personality. If a woman/man is stunning but with the personality of a dishcloth, then they're not relationship material for anyone interested in being with more than just a trophy. That's not to say you should "let yourself go" once you're in a relationship though.

sunflower27 wrote: »

do you not think if she was obese or overweight she'd have said that?

Well actually, some people can be a bit overweight and not realise it... or be in denial.

sunflower27 wrote: »

Lo blow

Agreed. Presumptuousness, based on posts to a message forum, is unnecessary.

sunflower27 wrote: »

We dont even know the OP is overweight - hence why I think this whole 'if she's been called hour-glass then she's probably really just 'fat' (cos no-one ever tells it as it is) and that is why she cant get a boyfriend' thing is just stupid.

He's not saying it's a given, but that it might be a possibility - and while his phrasing was too blunt, I don't believe his point is invalid. "Hourglass" means tiny waist, voluptuous hips, large breasts, but it can also be a "code word" for "fat" or "chubby" - the way "curvy" is, to spare a person's feelings. He isn't saying she is fat, but putting the possibility out there as one of the reasons she doesn't meet men.

PLENTY OF WOMEN THAT ARENT SIZE 6-8 MEET MEN.

In fairness, nobody but you is suggesting anything other than size 6-8 would be considered large here.

Even if the OP is overweight, why would that stop her meeting a man?

Because they'd be less likely to be attracted to her. If you're overweight but confident, you'll be attractive to plenty of people. If you're overweight but lacking in confidence and this exudes outwards, your chances of attracting people diminish greatly.

It's all got a bit ridiculous. We dont know what size she is

Indeed we don't - and nobody said she was overweight. The possibility was suggested though.

is fat anything above a size 14? or is it a 16? Maybe a 12?

On a woman of average height, the general consensus would be over size 14. These cut-off points exist - no point pretending they don't.

beks101 wrote: »

I know lots of slightly chubby, overweight and quite fat women who are in healthy and happy relationships, and have never had any problem attracting men.

Exactly. Because they are confident.

And is a size 16 fat?

On a woman of average height, yes. Men are more likely to be attracted to a slim woman - not a skinny one who's size 6-8, and most of the time they'd go for a shapely, curvy woman... but far less so an overweight woman. Not my opinion - just a reality.

What constitutes 'fat', anyway?

Oh come on, beks!

You're clearly an intelligent, articulate, well educated, and successful (having a job at the moment is successful

Agreed. Focus on these things OP - focus focus focus!
And not being a prophet of doom or anything here, but try not to take your job for granted in the current climate. I know, when you're lacking in motivation, even a recession won't give you that get-up-and-go... but try, for your own sake. It would be dodgy not to right now.

LegacyUser

Can I ask what area you work in? it sounds office based? is it accountancy by any
chance? just that perhaps its the job thats contributing to your overall unhappiness, maybe its just not you... did you ever consider other jobs/careers..

Dudess

Just another thing OP: while you should go to your doctor/a counsellor, chat to your friends, maybe family members - definitely have a support network... ultimately this lies in your hands. Get the help you need to prop you up, but take responsibility for yourself and your happiness thereafter. Be proactive. And believe in yourself - don't make the mistake of thinking you're less worthy of happiness and a loving relationship and being considered beautiful than anyone else. You're absolutely not (less worthy) - why would you be?

Resist the temptation to blame factors outside of you - sure, maybe some are the reason for your lack of confidence, but there comes a point when you just have to lay them to rest and focus totally on what you can do yourself to remedy things.

AARRRGH

Dudess wrote:

in relationships specifically, personality is far more than "sort of" important. Yes, initially it's physical appearance that gets a person noticed, that draws people to them, but ultimately, in terms of being together long-term, it's more about personality. If a woman/man is stunning but with the personality of a dishcloth, then they're not relationship material for anyone interested in being with more than just a trophy.

In fairness, the context of my posts (and the majority of this thread) is about meeting new people. I also said this:

AARRRGH wrote:

All my comments should be read in the context of meeting new people.

Obviously I know personality is the most important thing in a healthy relationship.

Dudess wrote:

Agreed. Presumptuousness, based on posts to a message forum, is unnecessary.

I disagree. People only react as strongly as sunflower27 did when something touches a nerve. In her case, she has great problems with the concept of hourglass being linked to weight issues, hence why I said:

AARRRGH wrote:

I am surprised you've never heard of people being kind by saying "you have an hour glass figure" or "you are curvy" when really what they are thinking is "you are overweight".

By your reaction to my posts, I guess this is something you are worried about.

It is reasonable to assume she does worry about this as she passionately refused to accept this and tried to dismiss it in numerous posts. I would be of the opinion that she greatly overreacted to what I said.

It is not wrong to form conclusions based on people's posts.

Dudess wrote:

Be proactive.

That's some advice you gave the OP. I completely agree. So many people are unhappy with some aspect of their life and sort of hope it will go away by itself. It won't. You have to make change happen.

Dudess

AARRRGH wrote: »

I disagree. People only react as strongly as sunflower27 did when something touches a nerve.

Not necessarily. Maybe she just thought you were unnecessarily harsh on the OP, which I agree you were initially.

In her case, she has great problems with the concept of hourglass being linked to weight issues, hence why I said:



It is reasonable to assume she does worry about this as she passionately refused to accept this and tried to dismiss it in numerous posts. I would be of the opinion that she greatly overreacted to what I said.

It is not wrong to form conclusions based on people's posts.

... while bearing in mind you could be wrong.

Salome

I really hope the OP hasn't been scared away because of some posters negativity.

I think the OP should work on feeling better about herself -confidence is half the battle here. If she isn't happy within herself, she won't exude the confidence and happiness that will attract people to her.

LegacyUser

What AARRGH says is complete utter rubbish!!

I am a "curvy" girl and have had no problem meeting and dating men over the years.


And yes i have a confident personality, but do guys know this when they see me in a pub and approach me first?? No, they are going on pure physical appearance. Not everyone wants a skinny girl,or even an average girl. Just cos it's your preference AARRGH, don't put that on OP as a reason why she's single.

For people to say anything over a size 14 is fat, remember that Marilyn Monroe was a size 16....with a real HOURGLASS figure. I don't think too many men would kick her out of bed!

OP, you have to love yourself before you can let anyone else love you. A man can add to your happiness in life, but he can't MAKE you happy. You need to talk to your GP about depression-it seems to be going on too long to be just a phase. They can help u through either medication or counselling. Don't be embarrassed about mental health-look after it.
Or at the very least, buy a self-help book or two. Just be pro-active in changing your situation.

All the best

AARRRGH

Unregistered wrote: »

What AARRGH says is complete utter rubbish!!

I am a "curvy" girl and have had no problem meeting and dating men over the years.

Will you stop with the straw man nonsense.

I never said curvy women have problems meeting men.
I never said I don't like curvy women.

If you are going to comment on what I say, you should make an effort to read what I wrote before jumping to distorted conclusions.

In fact, your incorrect argument has actually backed up my point - real "curvy" women get approached in bars. The problem is the OP is not getting approached. Hence why I said she should be sure she isn't fooling herself into thinking fat = curvy.