Getting Older

Puddleduck

I was just talking to my other half last night about this after the fourth or fifth ad for another anti aging remedy.
Do you think that in society today that theres a stigma attached to getting older? That we are all expected to stay youthful forever and ever? Or would you be of the opinion that today we are better equipped to deal with what comes with age, and why shouldnt we look our best all the time?

In my opinion, age scares the crap out of me. I know it shouldnt as my mother and grandmother are aging very gracefully. I also know that society in general seems to make out that old people are somehow disabled, something to be swept under the carpet and forgotten. I dont understand why though. Surely as you get older you get wiser and should be more valuable..

Opinions/discussion?

Dudess

Seeing as people get freaked about turning 22, yes, I'd agree there's a COLOSSAL stigma attached to getting older.

Ironically, people have never looked better though...

ciagr297

to be specific about it, getting older on my own scares me

and i don't know if its irish society or what, but we just don't seem to give much of a toss about the older generations

or maybe its still that we have the assumption everyone has family to look after them

joes girls

i always feels like im still young.......till i look in the mirror......:(:(:(

Crumble Froo

oh hell yeah, there's a stigma abotu getting older. look at tv, it's all about youth.

personally, im not too fussed about it myself, but then, my fella's 19years older than me, so beside him, ill always look young :pac:

and im not sure that i agree with dudess there about freaking out over turning 22... im still getting over turning 20, and im 21 now... it's not (imo) about getting older, it's just disbelief that so much time has passed. im 21, when the fcuk did that happen? 18 really wasnt that long ago, it's amazing to believe that my teens etc are over, but im not scared about actually getting older.

that said, my biggest fears include dementia and decreased mobility. ive worked with the elderly, some of hte most rewarding work ive done, and i have a huge amount of respect for many (note: not all) of the people ive worked with. my nana played a big part in bringing me up, and is my inspiration. if i can age like her, keep my sense of humour, a positive outlook and a fighting spirit ill be pretty damned happy.

Dudess

That's true. When people freak about being in their early 20s it's more to do with disbelief at how they've grown up and all the stuff that goes with it etc... but why do so many say "I'm getting so old"?

joes girls

joes girls wrote: »

i always feels like im still young.......till i look in the mirror......:(:(:(

Shush you! Your only a bairn yet!

Crumble Froo

Dudess wrote: »

That's true. When people freak about being in their early 20s it's more to do with disbelief at how they've grown up and all the stuff that goes with it etc... but why do so many say "I'm getting so old"?

cos we're doing mature stuff now! it's not so long ago it all seemed like a million years away, and something that'd probably not happen to us! i look at my mates now, one has a kid, anothers engaged, others have full honour degrees, others have emigrated, myself included. that's so many million miles away from worrying about leaving certs and being grounded! :pac:

i get what you're saying and all, and i guess i can only speak for myself, but there's times when i really don't feel 'old' enough, or mature enough to be where i am, i really don't feel all that much different from when i was 17 and finished school, but here i am, on the wrong side of the world, settled down in a long-term relationship and working an office job.

Look at all there is for the older generation at the moment. They own RTE, they have a much better social life around my neck of the woods than is possible for me and it is their vote that keeps FF in power.
Our generation will have even more pull, because we are the baby boomers in an ageing society.
Who is going to neglect the kingmakers.

Dudess

Dudess wrote: »

Ironically, people have never looked better though...

Have to disagree, we have never looked more flabby.
The other generations might have lacked teeth, but by god were they fit and vital.

ciagr297 wrote: »

to be specific about it, getting older on my own scares me

and i don't know if its irish society or what, but we just don't seem to give much of a toss about the older generations

or maybe its still that we have the assumption everyone has family to look after them

You'll never be lonely in this country if you have no obvious heirs.
It the people who are raising kids in the myself comes first tradition, that need to be worried.

Crumble Froo

Moonbaby wrote: »

Look at all there is for the older generation at the moment. They own RTE, they have a much better social life around my neck of the woods than is possible for me and it is their vote that keeps FF in power.
Our generation will have even more pull, because we are the baby boomers in an ageing society.
Who is going to neglect the kingmakers.

yet, there's ample evidence out there that the elderly have a lower quality of life in ireland than working age people. fear, immobility, loneliness, poor health.

ill never forget the nights i spent a couple of years ago staying with my nana after some piece of **** assaulted her and stole less than a tenner in money, she ended up in hospital and terrified to be in her own home, even more terrified to leave it.

many many other elderly live with similar fears, whether they've been direct victims of violence or intimidation themselves. anyway, that's getting a bit off topic, but i think your post is a bit... is the word blasé? dammit, it's a bit dismissive anyway, of how many elderly find today's society.

Puddleduck

Crumble Froo wrote: »

yet, there's ample evidence out there that the elderly have a lower quality of life in ireland than working age people. fear, immobility, loneliness, poor health.

ill never forget the nights i spent a couple of years ago staying with my nana after some piece of **** assaulted her and stole less than a tenner in money, she ended up in hospital and terrified to be in her own home, even more terrified to leave it.

many many other elderly live with similar fears, whether they've been direct victims of violence or intimidation themselves. anyway, that's getting a bit off topic, but i think your post is a bit... is the word blasé? dammit, it's a bit dismissive anyway, of how many elderly find today's society.

I dont think its meant that way. I think what she means is that as a society its the younger baby boomers that make the rules. Which I both agree and disagree with, the youth are the ones that are in touch with the way things are NOW, but then again, the elderly have probably seen it all before.

Oryx

Everything we look at around us is centred on fresh faced youth. Even when you get the token (Jane Fonda) old person in an advert, its all about 'look at me, I dont even look old!'. Nowhere is it ever said that getting on in years is actually ok. Youth is where its at, and anything with wrinkles (even on men these days) is past it.

I reckon its cos were all scared sh!tless of death itself, which is an inevitable consequence of getting old. So in a way, with all our creams and facelifts and oap jogging, were trying to deny death his pound of flesh for as long as possible, while also showing everyone else its simply not happening.

Whyever its happening, its a crying shame. Because the message is not getting through that the benefit of age is experience. All people focus on is decrepitude, not the smart savvy thats been built from years of dealing with stuff. (Ok not all oaps are smart, but you know what Im saying). Sexually Ill take an older guy who knows the ropes before an overzealous 17yo anyday. Ill sit in the pub with a gang of old guys telling yarns everytime, Ill avoid the younger guys getting lagered up. Im still, to this day, having to phone my mum to say 'howd you do this'. Wed do well not to let the advert agencies brainwash us completely into writing off the aged... or we will face the wrath of what weve done when we get there ourselves.

Phew. Didnt know I was gonna rant there.

Puddleduck

I have to say, Im not scared of death, just age. I think thats because, as you said Oryx, thats how the meedja portray old people, as decrepid and useless.
I remember reading somewhere that although the youth of today bitches and moans about the elderly being useless, senile etc, they themselves are partially to blame for it. If someone tells you repeatedly that you are something/a certain way eventually you will start to believe it.
If we reversed things and the media constantly delivered the message that young people are incapable of looking after themselves or making any kind of decision then I think eventually people would buy it.

Dudess

Crumble Froo wrote: »

cos we're doing mature stuff now! it's not so long ago it all seemed like a million years away, and something that'd probably not happen to us! i look at my mates now, one has a kid, anothers engaged, others have full honour degrees, others have emigrated, myself included. that's so many million miles away from worrying about leaving certs and being grounded! :pac:

Granted, but that's not the same as "old". Someone on After Hours said recently "I can't believe it's 2009 already - I feel so old (I just turned 19)". :rolleyes: Disbelief at it being 2009 already is very understandable but how does being old come into that equation? It's a use of language I find bizarre. And it's not a "youngsters don't value their youth" thing with me, I've always been like that - I remember when I was 20/21 I was the one telling my brother and his friends to cop on when they said they were freaking about turning 24/25. I remember my friend saying "we're getting old!" when we hit our 20s and I was just looking at her thinking "what the fuk?!"
Maybe people should put things into perspective - scary as facing up to adulthood may seem (and it's actually not scary at all - it's more the thought of it that's scary than the reality), nothing is going to be like the actual problems people face when they really DO become elderly - like failing health, desertion, vulnerability, discrimination.
Although people moaning about getting old from their early 20s onwards is the kind of thinking that will surely compound some of the above issues faced by elderly people (in terms of being insignificant, worthless etc).

there's times when i really don't feel 'old' enough, or mature enough to be where i am, i really don't feel all that much different from when i was 17 and finished school, but here i am, on the wrong side of the world, settled down in a long-term relationship and working an office job.

That's very understandable. Here's the thing: you'll probably always feel like that so don't take any notice of it and relax.
People never tend to feel the age they are... apart from those who seem to WANT to go on about how old they are (usually aged under 25 ).

Moonbaby wrote: »

Have to disagree, we have never looked more flabby.
The other generations might have lacked teeth, but by god were they fit and vital.

I agree - increasing obesity is a scary reality, yet at the same time, people's "prime" seems to be lasting a lot longer than it used to. There was a time when 40 was pipe and slippers time (I'm only focusing on the looks aspect here in the context of all those anti-ageing ads). Life expectancy has increased quite dramatically.

But yeah, I'm not exactly looking forward to being elderly and frail/vulnerable with it. Nothing I can do about it either though so best not to waste energy worrying and concentrate on being as healthy as I can.

Crumble Froo

Crumble Froo wrote: »

yet, there's ample evidence out there that the elderly have a lower quality of life in ireland than working age people. fear, immobility, loneliness, poor health.

ill never forget the nights i spent a couple of years ago staying with my nana after some piece of **** assaulted her and stole less than a tenner in money, she ended up in hospital and terrified to be in her own home, even more terrified to leave it.

many many other elderly live with similar fears, whether they've been direct victims of violence or intimidation themselves. anyway, that's getting a bit off topic, but i think your post is a bit... is the word blasé? dammit, it's a bit dismissive anyway, of how many elderly find today's society.

I'm not trying to be dismissive at all.
I was just trying to point out that is not all Doom and Gloom to be elderly.
They impact our society, and it does in return cater for them.

Dudess

Oryx wrote: »

Everything we look at around us is centred on fresh faced youth. Even when you get the token (Jane Fonda) old person in an advert, its all about 'look at me, I dont even look old!'. Nowhere is it ever said that getting on in years is actually ok. Youth is where its at, and anything with wrinkles (even on men these days) is past it.

I reckon its cos were all scared sh!tless of death itself, which is an inevitable consequence of getting old. So in a way, with all our creams and facelifts and oap jogging, were trying to deny death his pound of flesh for as long as possible, while also showing everyone else its simply not happening.

While I agree with you, I also think there is reality in the notion we are looking better, living longer etc. But yes, not to the point where we can deny ageing/slowing down will actually happen.

Dudess

Dudess wrote: »

I agree - increasing obesity is a scary reality, yet at the same time, people's "prime" seems to be lasting a lot longer than it used to. There was a time when 40 was pipe and slippers time (I'm only focusing on the looks aspect here in the context of all those anti-ageing ads).

I dunno I think alot of Irish women, have always had that type of skin that ages gracefully.
Although certainly the mental attitude has changed. No way am I growing up a day before I hit 30.

getz

Puddleduck wrote: »

I was just talking to my other half last night about this after the fourth or fifth ad for another anti aging remedy.
Do you think that in society today that theres a stigma attached to getting older? That we are all expected to stay youthful forever and ever? Or would you be of the opinion that today we are better equipped to deal with what comes with age, and why shouldnt we look our best all the time?

In my opinion, age scares the crap out of me. I know it shouldnt as my mother and grandmother are aging very gracefully. I also know that society in general seems to make out that old people are somehow disabled, something to be swept under the carpet and forgotten. I dont understand why though. Surely as you get older you get wiser and should be more valuable..

Opinions/discussion?

ladies when you get older you get wiser,when i now look at my wife she is 56 i dont see a older woman all i see is a very sexy classy lady,and i know then how lucky i am

allabouteve

Puddleduck wrote: »

I was just talking to my other half last night about this after the fourth or fifth ad for another anti aging remedy.
Do you think that in society today that theres a stigma attached to getting older? That we are all expected to stay youthful forever and ever? Or would you be of the opinion that today we are better equipped to deal with what comes with age, and why shouldnt we look our best all the time?

Theres a couple of points this raises with me. Personally I don't have a problem with growing older, but I do have a problem with being expected to want to look younger.

When I think about dealing with aging, I think about staying healthy, and while I do want to look good, I'm not interested in looking 'young'.

Who I am is written all over me, in my expressions, the way I carry myself and express myself. For me to want to look younger is to deny all that I've experienced and learned.

The very term anti-aging is offensive, since its not something there's any real sense in being 'anti'. Its going to happen, get used to it, embrace the natural progression instead of fruitlessly trying to hold back the tide of time and remain forever 22. How on earth can having a 22 year old face be appropriate to a woman of say, 42, given all the experience and life wisdom she's gained in the meantime? Why deny it? Why reject it?

I'm only 31, but I've worked in a very appearance based industry, and the fruitlessness of trying to halt the inevitable is ridiculous in its futility. And it makes people - women - miserable, as they realise they ultimately cannot stop the clock.

And all this at a time when you should have so much self knowledge that you're comfortable with yourself? No, thank you, I'll just get older and happier, and skip the pointless effort to retain youth when its gone.

brianthebard

Oryx wrote: »

Everything we look at around us is centred on fresh faced youth. Even when you get the token (Jane Fonda) old person in an advert, its all about 'look at me, I dont even look old!'. Nowhere is it ever said that getting on in years is actually ok. Youth is where its at, and anything with wrinkles (even on men these days) is past it.

I think my hairline is receding, I hate it.

Oryx

Moonbaby wrote: »

No way am I growing up a day before I hit 30.

Why then? Im way beyond 30 and Ive yet to consider growing up. (Which is very different to growing old).

brianthebard wrote:

I think my hairline is receding, I hate it.

Weve all got something we hate about ourselves. I bet before your hairline started going north, it was something else.

The very term anti-aging is offensive, since its not something there's any real sense in being 'anti'. Its going to happen, get used to it, embrace the natural progression instead of fruitlessly trying to hold back the tide of time and remain forever 22. How on earth can having a 22 year old face be appropriate to a woman of say, 42, given all the experience and life wisdom she's gained in the meantime? Why deny it? Why reject it?

This may be because of my perspective as slightly older , but I think women as they age do mostly improve. They loose some of that puppyfat look and seem to fit their features better. I think maybe some of it has to do with gaining confidence and poise, and knowing what works for them. Theres nothing more abhorrent to me than a woman with a face all puffed up and false from too much 'work'. God, I hope that doesnt become the norm. I find it mildly scary.

This being the most extreme example!

Dudess

allabouteve wrote: »

Theres a couple of points this raises with me. Personally I don't have a problem with growing older, but I do have a problem with being expected to want to look younger.

When I think about dealing with aging, I think about staying healthy, and while I do want to look good, I'm not interested in looking 'young'.

Indeed. At the same time though, when people (men and women) say sh1t like "women lose their looks as soon as they hit 30" I defend women - not out of a sense of altruism, not out of an inability to face up to ageing... but simply because I can identify so many examples of this being untrue. And I'm not talking about famous women over 30, I'm talking about women I know personally.

The very term anti-aging is offensive, since its not something there's any real sense in being 'anti'. Its going to happen, get used to it, embrace the natural progression instead of fruitlessly trying to hold back the tide of time and remain forever 22. How on earth can having a 22 year old face be appropriate to a woman of say, 42, given all the experience and life wisdom she's gained in the meantime? Why deny it? Why reject it?

I'll still use a good moisturiser every day though, I'll still eat well, drink plenty of water, not go out in the blazing sun, limit my alcohol consumption to just one night a week etc... not to hold back the years, but to look my best. And I will wear what the **** I want if it looks good on me instead of being "careful how I dress for my age" :rolleyes:
But yes, I know what you mean too about women actually denying ageing.

Oryx wrote: »

Why then? Im way beyond 30 and Ive yet to consider growing up. (Which is very different to growing old).

Yeah, this isn't the first time I've seen 30 as the age when we magically become settled - get to 30 and come back to me...

This may be because of my perspective as slightly older , but I think women as they age do mostly improve. They loose some of that puppyfat look and seem to fit their features better.

How well the woman looks after herself plays a major role in that too though.

Latchy

The question might also be asked as to why some people age quicker than others ? It's being well documented over the years that bad diet ,smoking and excessive boozing will age you that much quicker .People are now more educated about looking after themselfs and some will have good genes which means they wont age as qucik as others.I do think there is a stigma about getting older in Ireland and society in general but it's how you fill in those advancing years that's important . Their are some stunning looking men and womon in their 30s 40s 50s and a happy state of mind on the inside goes a long way to showing a healthier ,younger looking you on the outside to .

SeekUp

Puddleduck wrote: »

I remember reading somewhere that although the youth of today bitches and moans about the elderly being useless, senile etc, they themselves are partially to blame for it. If someone tells you repeatedly that you are something/a certain way eventually you will start to believe it.

That's true -- I mean, you see the same thing with kids whose teachers and parents tell them they'll never amount to anything and they learn to believe it. But in terms of the elderly, this is particularly ridiculous, especially since most of us know senior citizens who are the furthest thing from useless!! Many of them put my lazy a** to shame!

Puddleduck wrote: »

I was just talking to my other half last night about this after the fourth or fifth ad for another anti aging remedy.
Do you think that in society today that theres a stigma attached to getting older? That we are all expected to stay youthful forever and ever? Or would you be of the opinion that today we are better equipped to deal with what comes with age, and why shouldnt we look our best all the time?

Aging doesn't scare me . . . death doesn't really scare me either. In terms of looks, I'm happy with how I am now, but I actually think people look much better when they care for their bodies as they are, as opposed to trying to stop/reverse the aging process. I get there are a lot of industries that are focused on the youthful image and that for many people, their livelihood depends heavily on their appearance. I'm lucky that isn't the case for me -- but then again, I've never been the type to look my absolute best at every possible minute of the day. How exhausting!

I hope that I'll be able to garden and care for my grandkids well into my golden years, and when my health starts to fail, I hope that I'll have someone to help care for me. I don't think I'll mind getting smile lines and laugh lines and silvery hair . . . I hope I'll be able to keep everything in perspective.

my grandparents aren't the frail sitting in a corner types by a long shot into all gadgets and have their laptops and phones etc, and my gmother still teaches (they beg her to keep coming back ) despite being mid 70s and well able to handle the kids!
I'm proud of the grey hairs I see popping up on my skull and damned if I ever fall for this "anti-aging" crap when I'm older!

Have to say I'm torn between amusement and "wtf" when I see anyone at all in their 20s or early 30s complaining about being old

I remember living in spain on my year off and seeing ads where the older people were totally go-get-em, as well as men happily doing the housework...

Dudess

Oh dying white/grey hairs - that's another thing I do to "defy the ageing process"... Nah, I just don't like the look of them. They're way too prominent against my black hair. Not totally a sigh of ageing either - I've been getting them since I was 17.

brianthebard

brianthebard wrote: »

I think my hairline is receding, I hate it.

I feel your pain, other person who also defines themselves by their glorious mane. I confirmed my first silver hair this week. :eek:

I am hoping it is a one off freak incident.

Dudess

I'd happily take hair dye before a wig any day...

Dudess

Dudess wrote: »

I'd happily take hair dye before a wig any day...

Are you purposely trying to make Brian feel worse?

It is the loss of gingerness more so than the going grey.
Although last yearmy hair started getting darker, and people started accusing me of being a brunette.:eek:
So I've dealt with most of that trauma already, and it wasnt really as depressing.

Oryx....I randomly picked 30 because I figure if I start then I should have being a grown up figured for my 40's.
I don't want to miss out on that stage in case it is fun

joes girls

im 36.......dont feel old,but its the way others treat me,like i need to grow up.I want to have fun with everything in life for as long as i can,sometimes i do think i should grow up.......but not often.

Squiggle

Am I the only one happy to be getting older? Do some people prefer the alternative!

GirlInterrupted

Moonbaby wrote: »

I feel your pain, other person who also defines themselves by their glorious mane. I confirmed my first silver hair this week. :eek:

I am hoping it is a one off freak incident.

Poor you, but you've got (glorious!) red hair, and you've escaped the grey until now.

I've got black hair and I've pulled out silver ones since I was about 15. One sign of aging I will be fighting tooth and nail is grey hair, as soon as there's more than I can yank out, it's to the hairdresser I go.

Interestingly, in Italy older women are much more likely to be appreciated than in Ireland, and theres a saying that 'all young girls are pretty, but only a woman can be beautiful'. The emphasis on youth is far less there, and elegant older women are openly admired.