The religious divide...part 2

Aodan83

While I am writing this there are 6 Jedis in that poll.
There are less Buddhists(2), Jews, Muslims(2), Hindus and Taoists if you add them all together. Just thought I'd throw that out there.
Although, I am one of those jedis (even though I only voted Jedi because I hardly consider myself Catholic, and I'm using the star wars skin thingy!!)

mud

Humanist, oh yeah.

God knows what god has to do with religion!*




It's to do with power!

pablomakaveli

The OP forgot Zoroastrianism. Freddie Mercury is gonna be pissed.

rainbow kirby

No Pastafarian option?

rainbow kirby

rainbow kirby wrote: »

No Pastafarian option?

That's with the rainbow spaghetti knitting circle

poindexter

Mena wrote: »

Bah, wanted to say Jedi but had to go with "religion... lol :pac: "

http://www.jedichurch.org/

i'm a christian but am thinking of taking the force with me and joining up with the Jedi

grenache

A bit silly and pointless giving the 'Christian' option, 95% of the population is Christian! Should have been broken down into Roman Catholic, Church of Ireland, Methodist, Presbyterian, etc

I'm a lapsed Catholic for what its worth.

seanybiker

grenache wrote: »

I'm a lapsed Catholic for what its worth.

Sorry for my ignorance but what is a lapsed catholic?

watna

Agnostic - but was a Methodist. I just only go to church on Christmas day now because I like the service. This year I was in NZ and the service was in four languages, English, Samoan, Tongan and Fijian. Lots of Methodists in them there Pacific Islands. It was the best Christmas service I've been to.

BlitzKrieg

agnostic (well rationalist) closest I have gotten to anyone putting my thinking into words without alot of alcohol and slurring over a bar table was this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N5zBgzHvHU&feature=channel_page I consider myself open to learning about faiths, but I expect all faiths to allow me to rationally discuss them and not chase me away if I ask uncomfortable questions. Equally I would not embrace Atheism without understanding the process, declaring atheism and supporting notions such as evolution without understanding how evolution works is the same as embracing christianity or other faiths without knowing their principles. I have a basic grasp of evolution, and because its only basic I cannot in good concious go around parading it as the answer if I dont fully understand it, I accept my own limitations, I will strive to understand it when I can, but for the time being I take the rational route and stay agnostic.

I considered other faiths briefly during college, but judaism only allows a convert go so far before being politely told no further, scientology p*ssed me off, Islam was difficult to comprehend with the mixed singles being created by the political climate and I kept misunderstanding Buddhism because I kept having basterdised versions of it thrown at me via hollywood.

before that I was Lyons Christian which in simple terms meant that I accepted the christian belief structure (freedoms, commandments, love thy neighbour etc) but the interpetation of the central text (the bible) was left to my own interpetation rather then dictated to me by some established order (the church) I held that belief for many years but it fell apart when I considered that as the central piece of one's faith the bible is a flawed doctrine purely because of history. Therefore my viewpoint flipped when originally I had a dislike of the structure but not the message (the church not the bible) I now felt that the message itself is flawed by time and has cause the collapse of the structure.

Before that I was Catholic but growing up the catholic church did little to nothing to embrace me or convince me beyond religion class at a christian brothers school so my childhood had no attachment to the institute but had an understanding

And thats my forey with religion in a short number of years, because it was a short number of years I expect Agnotism to be the rational choice, I rather understand what I am proclaiming as truth before I do so.

vibe666

grenache wrote: »

I'm a lapsed Catholic for what its worth.

much like most Irish Catholics under 40 I'd imagine. :pac:

won't make any difference come the apocalypse though, you'll be burning in hell with the rest of us heathens.

well, unless you happen to be walking past a church when it happens and you make it to confession before the very end.

Joey the lips

What does this poll tell you???? That the overwhelming majority of people are not religious. I find that amazing on 2 grounds.

1. I wonder how many of them believe in the occult or gools!

2. Why do we continue to analyise religious beliefs like"God" topic when its clear the poster majority have no belief so cannot comment. Its the equivilent of the majority talking about nuclear physics. We all now what it involves but would just fcuk up the world when we try to analyise a reaction

No doubt I will have a disagrement but try to explain why people who clearly have no religion should be able to comment on a bible they have clearly never been reading.

javaboy

Joey the lips wrote: »

No doubt I will have a disagrement but try to explain why people who clearly have no religion should be able to comment on a bible they have clearly never been reading.

I've seen countless examples on Boards alone of atheists knowing more about the Bible or some aspect of a religion than the follower themselves. Just recently some non-Catholics explained the difference between the virgin birth and the immaculate conception to a believer.

Just because someone doesn't follow Christianity, doesn't mean they haven't read the Bible. And just because they follow Christianity, doesn't mean they have read the Bible.

philologos

Sam Vimes: Being an atheist really isn't as simple as saying you have no answers (that would be an agnostic). Atheists go one step further and profess the belief that God doesn't exist. Whether we like this or not, this is one step further than what you are suggesting.

Current Objective Stance: "God may exist, or may not exist".
Atheist: I believe that God does not exist
Theist: I believe God exists.

vibe666

Joey the lips wrote: »

No doubt I will have a disagrement but try to explain why people who clearly have no religion should be able to comment on a bible they have clearly never been reading.

the pope and priests tell Catholics how you can and can't have sex. by your own rationale, since they don't do it (well, some of them) and no nothing about it, they should not be able to tell you how you should do it. :rolleyes:

Jakkass wrote: »

Sam Vimes: Being an atheist really isn't as simple as saying you have no answers (that would be an agnostic). Atheists go one step further and profess the belief that God doesn't exist. Whether we like this or not, this is one step further than what you are suggesting.

Current Objective Stance: "God may exist, or may not exist".
Atheist: I believe that God does not exist
Theist: I believe God exists.

lets not start this again, it's been done to death and it never gets us anywhere and just ends up spoiling otherwise interesting threads.

philologos

javaboy wrote: »

I've seen countless examples on Boards alone of atheists knowing more about the Bible or some aspect of a religion than the follower themselves. Just recently some non-Catholics explained the difference between the virgin birth and the immaculate conception to a believer.

I'd easily concede that many atheists have a great knowledge of the Bible and that has helped a lot in discussions we've had between the Christianity forum and the A&A section. However it isn't knowledege that is ultimately going to count in the end.

javaboy wrote: »

Just because someone doesn't follow Christianity, doesn't mean they haven't read the Bible. And just because they follow Christianity, doesn't mean they have read the Bible.

Yes, again I'd easily concede this point too. However, it's highly ignorant to sign yourself up to something that you don't know anything about. I'd actually openly encourage people who are considering Christianity to read the Bible, and to seek truth. Although, I will say this, once you read the Bible once you aren't going to remember much of the main concepts, it's only through reading multiple times that the ideas tend to form a part of your Christian lifestyle. So if these people haven't read the Bible they are at a serious loss in their faith. This is probably the main reason why I think the churches in Ireland need to promote Biblical knowledge at confirmation stage so that these people know what they are committing themselves to.

Dave!

Jakkass wrote: »

However it isn't knowledege that is ultimately going to count in the end.

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

thelordofcheese

Jakkass wrote: »

However it isn't knowledege that is ultimately going to count in the end.

it's guns right? Lots of guns.

Sam Vimes

Jakkass wrote: »

Sam Vimes: Being an atheist really isn't as simple as saying you have no answers (that would be an agnostic). Atheists go one step further and profess the belief that God doesn't exist. Whether we like this or not, this is one step further than what you are suggesting.

Current Objective Stance: "God may exist, or may not exist".
Atheist: I believe that God does not exist
Theist: I believe God exists.

I deleted my post so you look like you're talking to yourself

But anyway, we've had this conversation before and despite it being explained you insisted you knew more about atheist beliefs than the atheists you were talking to. Short version: atheists don't say they have the answers, they just say you don't have them. I don't have to know everything to dismiss your theory, just like I don't have to know what causes earthquakes to dismiss someone who says they're caused by caterpillars because, regardless of what does cause them I know it's not caterpillars. You could say I'm an a-caterpillarist. Dismissing the christian god as described in the bible does not automatically translate to believing that the universe was entirely naturally created and popped out of nothing. Nobody can say that with any certainty because we just don't know. Your view of atheists is an overly simplistic one that you like because it makes it easier to dismiss them

Edit: also you say that atheists profess the belief that god doesn't exist but I don't profess any belief. Having a lack of belief in something is not a belief in itself. There are an infinite number of things that I lack belief in

Sam Vimes

I suppose you could define agnostic as "I don't know who has the answers" and atheist as "I don't have the answers and neither do you"

And yes that was the short version :P

philologos

I'd consider both of those examples to be agnostics, atheists go further. Anyhow, javaboy has explicitly mentioned that we shouldn't be getting into a discussion about this. I'm not really convinced with your argument.

thelordofcheese: Ultimately membership of the NRA and advocacy of Second Amendment rights will count?

galwayrush

The results are quite divisive.:rolleyes:

Sam Vimes

Jakkass wrote: »

I'd consider both of those examples to be agnostics, atheists go further. Anyhow, javaboy has explicitly mentioned that we shouldn't be getting into a discussion about this. I'm not really convinced with your argument.

thelordofcheese: Ultimately membership of the NRA and advocacy of Second Amendment rights will count?

This is an atheist telling you what he and most of the people he has talked to or seen talk on the matter believes, including Richard Dawkins. You can go on believing your straw man version of atheism if you want but you're telling atheists you know more about what's going on inside their heads than they do themselves

Professey Chin

The medichlorians in my system have determined my religion

Fcuk you George Lucas

galwayrush

Ultimate Chin wrote: »

The medichlorians in my system have determined my religion

Fcuk you George Lucas

I had to google that:o

philologos

Sam Vimes: You don't represent all atheists, and I know many atheists who have outright even told me that they believe that God doesn't exist. So how do we deal with this contradiction of views. I'm not going to accept that my version of what atheists believe is a strawman if I know that atheists actually do hold this view in many cases. Anyhow, I'm really not interested in going down a pedantic line of discussion with you.

galwayrush

Stop being serious, it's Religion and it's in AH ffs.:D

Sam Vimes

Jakkass wrote: »

Sam Vimes: You don't represent all atheists, and I know many atheists who have outright even told me that they believe that God doesn't exist. So how do we deal with this contradiction of views. I'm not going to accept that my version of what atheists believe is a strawman if I know that atheists actually do hold this view in many cases. Anyhow, I'm really not interested in going down a pedantic line of discussion with you.

and the people you talked to don't represent all atheists either. There's a misunderstanding here between your god and the god of stephen hawking and einstein. Their god is an impersonal god who may or may not have created the universe and nothing more. I can reject outright the existence of the christian version and still hold out some possibility that there was something because we can't rule that out. Look at the chapter of The God Delusion called "Why God almost certainly doesn't exist". Even Dawkins doesn't entirely rule out the possibility and he goes to great pains to point out that the god he is referring to is only the personal type that answers prayers etc and not the type of Einstein and Hawking

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNf-P_5u_Hw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qc-mrJf45Hg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjAegPhQOUg

if ye have an opinion on religion, watch the videos. even if you think it's all conspiracy crap, there's more reliable content in zeitgeist than the bible in my opinion.