Printing company with Publisher 2007?

mick.fr

Hi there,

I have a writen a manual and now need to get it professionaly printed as it is gonna be sold.
I am looking for the best value possible, but has to be good quality.
Also the format used is Microsoft Publisher 2007.

Would anyone know somebody/a company who would be suitable to get the work done?

Cheers in advance

Hank_Scorpio

To be honest most printing places won't like a Microsoft Publisher file for printing, not any that I know of really. It is not a generally accepted file format for printing purposes and is regarded as one of the worst files to receive for printing. You may end up being charged extra for origination as the prepress will have to do extra work on the file to get it as close as possible to "press-ready".

Your best bet is to make it into a PDF - but images and the likes will not be print quality I'm afraid.

Microsoft Publisher and basically the MS Office package is really aimed at the home user where the desktop printer has a native resolution that is nowhere near as good as professional printing.

But sending the guys a PDF will be better for you.

Make sure the manual is in pages of a multiple of 4 - i.e., 4 pages, 8 pages, 12 pages, 16 pages etc.


In all honesty you would have been better off getting it designed in InDesign or Quark.

Hank_Scorpio

Just like to add - also send them the Publisher file - so they can make sure that the PDF is ok and matches what you expect.

Weird things happen in printers where images go into black holes, and text disappears into the nether regions and things like that.

So send them a hard copy mockup of the final look, the pdf, a soft copy of the publisher file.

Any fonts you have used - any images you have used.

If you're worried about colour then you may want to go the printers and pick out colours - as they have colour charts that they can show you and it's close to what is printed. So it will help you pick vibrant nice colours. Or they could even show you swatches of the colours you have used, so you may decide that the printed version of that colour is too dull, too bright, too blue or not blue enough - etc.

I think most printers will take a publisher file, but as I say they may charge you an arm and leg to make it "press" ready.

Pixelcraft

have to agree here, don't know of any printers who'll touch it. What will most likely happen is you will not be happy with the quality of the work, professional print can only take it so far, you need professional artwork too.

Hank_Scorpio

Not being funny here - but there's a thing that printers/designers/prepress go by and that's called GIGO.

It stands for Garbage in Garbage out. It's not having a go at you - it's just that there is no way to process what is considered "garbage" and that's MS Publisher, not you, and exepect anything other than "garbage" to come out the other end.

And that's nothing to do with yourself, it's MS Publisher that is the garbage in terms of professional design and print.

But you can still do it - don't expect any wonders - you may be disappointed by the result but talk with your printers and they will guide you through it - help you out etc.

The best bet is to contact as many printers in your locale as you can (golden pages etc.) and just call them up and ask for a sales rep or the Prepress Manager.

mick.fr

Cheers guys for the feedbacks

Since I have no other software to edit this, I started with Word and Excel because the format of this manual is a bit specific (Half of A4), but it was a nightmare, and in light of what you are saying, it might be easier to actually take high quality screenshots of the pages and send them no?

Alternatively if anyone has access to a high quality printer with a machine to cut the paper and assemble the book, like this example below, I might be interrested.

Not my book...

Hank_Scorpio

mick.fr wrote: »

1. it might be easier to actually take high quality screenshots of the pages and send them no?

2. Alternatively if anyone has access to a high quality printer with a machine to cut the paper and assemble the book

1. Mick - under no circumstances will you get high-res screen shots - your screen is roughly 72 - 100 ppi/dpi - and you need above 225 dpi to print high quality. Not only that but when you make the screen shots all your text will become fuzzy and hard to read espically at a smaller size, this is because text is vector and screenshots are raster - meaning pixels, meaning jagged edges.

Send the guys the Publisher file but ring around a few printing places. You will be charged extra for the origination and prepping it for press - but what you supply the printers is what will be printed.


2. Any printers can cut the paper and fold it into any shape or size you want. The more elaborate the book and folds the more expensive it is.


What you should start doing is ringing printing companies, email them - tell them what files you have.

You'll find somewhere to help you.

mick.fr

Alright cheers

Do you guys have some good printing companies to recommend? I have seen a few names here and here, but I only dealt with Snap in the past, for biz cards, and my experience has not been extremelly positive.

Hank_Scorpio

Mick,

Where are you based? I'd be surprised if a company turned down the job, given the current climate.

I don't want to recommend anyone simply because they may not be able to handle your files.

I still say you should ring places around you, or even drop in with your files.

But the first step is to get quotes. Even with everyone recommending places you will find that prices vary drastically from place to place depending. As for quality of printing, well I'd say most printing places will produce similar quality.

If you drop me a PM of where you're located I can probably recommend some printers from around your way.

It would be best to stay local though so you can drop in and have a chat with them.

Communication with printers is a key element here.

mick.fr

Yep I am based in D15, but can travel around, Tallaght etc.

Cheers

mick.fr

Just got myself a copy of InDesign CS3, nice software.

I have been able to export a PDF from CS3 and Publisher 2007, and I see no difference really in terms of resolution and quality.

Will stick to CS3 anyway as advised here. Cheers guys.

rockbeer

mick.fr wrote: »

I have been able to export a PDF from CS3 and Publisher 2007, and I see no difference really in terms of resolution and quality.

It's the printer who may have problems. What you see on screen is only half the story. The trouble starts when the printer begins setting up the job to print and finds that the PDF is lacking the information he or she needs for that task.

It's all about workflow really. Printers are used to working with certain types of files and the more you can deliver what they're used to the the greater the chances of you getting back what you expect.

You did the right thing getting InDesign. It means you and the printer will be able to speak the same language. However, I would still examine swatches and be sure to get color-correct proofs before committing to a large print run as what you see on screen may be quite different from what emerges from the press. You don't want any nasty surprises - especially not ten thousand of them in a large, expensive pile of waste paper on the print room floor.

Good luck, let us know how it goes.

mick.fr

I have emailed 7 printing companies yesterday, through their online contact forms to get a quote for printing (for a small book in color, sizes, etc....)
I was expecting some sort of reply today, even one at least.

Not a single one replied.

Well whatever I am not surprised really after all

Pixelcraft

a lot of print companies actually closed today, and are opening tomorrow, just incase that had any bearing.

Hank_Scorpio

Give

e-print
fineprint
brunswickpress
colorman.ie

etc. a ring or send them an email.

mick.fr

Pixelcraft wrote: »

a lot of print companies actually closed today, and are opening tomorrow, just incase that had any bearing.

Ah ok so they close during non bank holiday day, and they open during a bank holiday day.
Makes sense alright :-)

Vista print actually just replied to me a 17:52 to say they don't print manuals.

Hank_Scorpio

mick.fr wrote: »

Ah ok so they close during non bank holiday day, and they open during a bank holiday day.
Makes sense alright :-)

Vista print actually just replied to me a 17:52 to say they don't print manuals.

Well they have to clean up the machine on friday to get the ink out and tidy up - then if they were to come in on monday they'd have to clean up again so Tuesday won't be there and the ink will mess up the machines.

So rather than having to clean up twice they will clean up on Friday, take monday off and then work from Tuesday to Friday. Which is good because anyone coming in a full day on tuesday will get overtime for that day. Handy.

mick.fr

Ok so not a single company I have emailed has ever replied to me...

Now I got a quote today from a company in Dublin, they do some good job apparently, but they quoted me 12 euro per manual for 200 copies.
This is far to be what I was expected to pay for this.

Now here is the specs of my manual, along with a sample.

If anyone is able to do it a lot cheaper, you just got yourself a new deal

Dimensions are:
Width: 210mm
Height: 160mm

Must be made as a book (Either glue or else, like spirales?)
Pages: 60.
Quality paper to be used on internal pages but must be writable, since this is a logbook (150g/m2 maybe?)
Cover must strong/heavy paper with glass/gloss effect (300g/m2 maybe?)

Need 200 copies

Sample here:
http://www.bmw-planet.com/lib/sample.pdf

Cheers guys

mountain

pm sent with pricing details.

ztoical

mick.fr wrote: »

Ok so not a single company I have emailed has ever replied to me...

Now I got a quote today from a company in Dublin, they do some good job apparently, but they quoted me 12 euro per manual for 200 copies.
This is far to be what I was expected to pay for this.

Now here is the specs of my manual, along with a sample.

If anyone is able to do it a lot cheaper, you just got yourself a new deal

Dimensions are:
Width: 210mm
Height: 160mm

Must be made as a book (Either glue or else, like spirales?)
Pages: 60.
Quality paper to be used on internal pages but must be writable, since this is a logbook (150g/m2 maybe?)
Cover must strong/heavy paper with glass/gloss effect (300g/m2 maybe?)

Need 200 copies

Sample here:
http://www.bmw-planet.com/lib/sample.pdf

Cheers guys

If you only need 200 copies have you thought about using a print on demand service like Lulu.com? Would work out around $4.20 per book plus shipping with comixpress.com thought they mainly print just comics, Lulu would be a couple cents more. Some of the printers you emailed might be off-set printers who wouldn't print a run as small as 200 which might be way they didn't reply.

mick.fr

ztoical wrote: »

If you only need 200 copies have you thought about using a print on demand service like Lulu.com? Would work out around $4.20 per book plus shipping with comixpress.com thought they mainly print just comics, Lulu would be a couple cents more. Some of the printers you emailed might be off-set printers who wouldn't print a run as small as 200 which might be way they didn't reply.

Great stuff alright thanks mate

minikin

Hi Mick, you haven't really done yourself any favours by laying it out yourself - a trim size of 210x160 means you can't get four up on a sheet particularly if you've bleed. If you had set them up as A5 pages you would have found that printing would have been a lot cheaper.

Advice to anyone doing something similar: don't do it yourself, there are plenty of print houses around the country that do this day in and day out.
Going to them at the start of your project will save you a lot of time, money and heartache.

We take in publisher files but we charge accordingly for preparing the files for print.

mountain

minikin wrote: »

Hi Mick, you haven't really done yourself any favours by laying it out yourself - a trim size of 210x160 means you can't get four up on a sheet particularly if you've bleed. If you had set them up as A5 pages you would have found that printing would have been a lot cheaper.

Dont you do B sizes then?????

:rolleyes:

Hank_Scorpio

mountain wrote: »

Dont you do B sizes then?????

:rolleyes:

Not for digital runs - up to a3 sizes or anywhere in between

To get it 2 up that is

It's only a short run so litho would cost more on setup and digital at that size costs more because printing single pages instead of stepping up, more paper, more time, more cutting, more more more

minikin

Dont you do B sizes then?????

No, SRA3 on a digital press... as if you'd run such a small job on litho (would love to see how the publisher files would separate for plates... duh)

mountain

minikin wrote: »

No, SRA3 on a digital press... as if you'd run such a small job on litho (would love to see how the publisher files would separate for plates... duh)

shorter runs have become much more cost effective on litho with the advent of faster make readies on new presses, longer runs are becoming more economical on digital, just as shorter ones are on litho, the gap has become much closer.

barry737

send email to eprint at books@eprint.ie
They will reply within a few hours

minikin

shorter runs have become much more cost effective on litho with the advent of faster make readies on new presses, longer runs are becoming more economical on digital, just as shorter ones are on litho, the gap has become much closer.

your first point is only partially true if you possess a di press like a presstek (damn expensive machine in the first place)... you still have the cost of sixty plates (presuming it's f.c. throughout) on a job like this.
your second point isn't true at all... ever hear of click charges?

this job would only be run on a digital press (unless the production manager loves losing money on a job)

Hank_Scorpio

Digital and litho runs even out on prices between about 500 - 1000 copies. The cost for doing it litho gets cheaper per print after around 1000, in my experience. Depending on the amount pages of the printed material.

What you need to do is get quoted for both litho and digital runs and see which ones come back the cheapest.

Recently I had 3 companies come back to me with digital print costs which varied by, to keep it simple, 100, 200 and 400 euro - all printed digital.

So it depends where you get the quote from, some are cheaper than others, others won't want the business unless they get 400 for it so give the dearer quote. It's no loss to them if you go somewhere else because they didn't want the job, and if you do go with them on the price they'll print it for you for 400 quid, as it's not worth their while unless they get that minimum amount.

If that makes sense.

mountain

minikin wrote: »

your first point is only partially true if you possess a di press like a presstek (damn expensive machine in the first place)... you still have the cost of sixty plates (presuming it's f.c. throughout) on a job like this.
your second point isn't true at all... ever hear of click charges?

this job would only be run on a digital press (unless the production manager loves losing money on a job)

single colour job, 4 B1 plates, make ready and print in 1 hour tops, for the text,
cover 4 B2 plates, make ready and print in 30 mins.

mick.fr

My bad the format is actually A5, not B5. Don't know why I had this figure in mind.
Anyway I am sorted out at this stage.

I actually used Publisher 2007 with their "Publish as PDF" plugin. It is fully compliant (High res, embedded fonts etc, sizable to 300-1200 DPI) and stricly nothing needed to be changed by the publisher. Ready to go. Publisher 2007 can also create files with exported fonts, pictures etc. A real pro

And Publisher 2007 is very nice, very easy to use and can get great results quickly.

Thanks for your help and support guys, I appreciate