ASTI and TUI vote for Industrial Action

Alessandra

Teachers vote in favour of industrial action


The members of teacher unions the ASTI, INTO and TUI have voted to take industrial action, up to and including strike action, over the Government’s handling of the economic crisis.

In a joint statement tonight, the general secretaries of the three unions said the decision had been a difficult one for teachers who as well as facing difficult economic circumstances are well aware of the impact of the economic crisis on the communities in which they live and work.

The statement said the results showed clearly the anger of teachers at Government’s inequitable handling of the crisis.

Teachers want government to re-enter discussions to address the economic crisis with the ICTU on the basis that the burden must be shared by all sectors of society according to their means

The Irish Federation of University Teachers is expected to begin balloting its members on industrial action next week.

www.breakingnews.ie

Opinions? I am a sub and whilst I understand the need to strike don't want to lose another days pay:(
Don't know if the general public will be supportive?

DarkJager

I thought teachers were supposed to be intelligent. They will have zero support for this. What's the point in striking with the way things are at the moment? Patethic choice IMO.

Alessandra

Hmm teachers are unpopular with the general public. My colleagues are going to lose 500eu a month, kids in college, husbands lost jobs!! May not get anywhere but it's going to happen.

I reckon there will be 2 days, one the day of general public service strike day and another teachers strike day.

In my opinion

Strike one day last monday of the month. At least we will save the Gov a days wages!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Powerhouse

Like all those who do a very important job in this society teachers are, naturally in this little backwater, utterly reviled. If they became millionaires by selling you something you neither needed nor wanted, while paying a small number of people the minimum wage, they would be eulogised.

Striking is not really an option for them - if we assume they are worried about PR. Though at another level you'd be inclined to ask why should they be bothered about PR since the government generally has them over a barrel on most matters relating to their work so what good is popularity?

The teachers should withdraw support for various things instead, e.g. whole school evaluations and all that 'going through the motions' nonsense. This would have the benefit for teachers of stopping their seemingly inexorable moved towards primarily being paper-pushers.

It also seems reasonable that if they were expected to provide greater productivity when given rises that the converse is also the case and some of the silly stuff that was introduced because the Minister wanted to look hard could now be kicked to touch.

spurious

I would be surprised if we went on a full strike.
The fact is, if teachers just did what they are paid to do, the schools and exam system would grind to a halt.

TheDriver

I am waiting for the usual postings from the anti teacher brigade here! Nearly all teachers don't want strike action but we are being left with very little choice, I find all my classes have increased a lot this year in size and hence more work correcting etc yet money being taken off us, not an easy road for us at all

byhookorbycrook

The strike, if it comes to that, will be part of the ICTU day of action.

Toto Wolfcastle

I was under the impression that the vote was more of a message to the government as to how far we are willing to go rather than a vote to actually strike. I doubt it will happen.

Nead21

DarkJager wrote: »

I thought teachers were supposed to be intelligent....Patethic choice IMO.

We are intelligent, that's why we can see that paying 4.8% of a net salary of €35,000 and 4.9% of net salary of €100,000 is clearly unfair!

IMO patethic implies just sitting back, accepting things that are not fair and doing nothing about it. It was a very difficult decision to make and i very much doubt that any teacher took it lightly.

Delphi91

Nead21 wrote: »

We are intelligent, that's why we can see that paying 4.8% of a net salary of €35,000 and 4.9% of net salary of €100,000 is clearly unfair!..

You may want to check those figures again.

According to here, the percentage of net income being paid on a €35,000 salary is either 5.86% or 6.08% depending on whether you started post- or pre-1995.

On a €100,000 salary it is 8.01% or 7.09%, again depending on when you started.

Nead21

Delphi91 wrote: »

You may want to check those figures again.

they are figures according to the INTO based on net salary

Delphi91

Nead21 wrote: »

they are figures according to the INTO based on net salary

One would have thought that since the three unions sent out the same ballot paper and seem to be acting in unison that they would be issuing the same factual information.

Coolio

As a sub also, I was annoyed that the ballot papers had all action(work-to-rule/non-cooperation/strike) all wrapped up in the one question for yes or no. I was hoping that we could choose the lesser options and avoid striking.

I feel the ballots all-or-nothing approach pushed teachers into the position we're now in. It's disappointing that the unions have failed to show any real understanding of the futility of striking.

It only works if there is public support for it (see Cork hurlers) or if you are capable of building sympathy with your stance(see pensioners).

Teachers have little support and certainly no sympathy!

Nead21

Coolio wrote: »

Teachers have little support and certainly no sympathy!

why do teachers get such a hard time in this country? there are other areas of the public service that have also voted for strike action if necessary.

i have been teaching for just 2 years and already im sick of justifying my job to people. It's these negative attitudes that make the education sector an easy target for the government to strip funds from.

(sorry about rant! )

sitstill

They've set a date for a one day strike - March 30th:

Press Statement - ASTI agrees on industrial action

The ASTI Standing Committee today decided to join with the other public service unions in taking strike action on March 30th. ASTI members recently voted to take strike action of up to two days.

The purpose of this action is to express the anger of ASTI members at the inequitable and unfair way in which the government is addressing the economic crisis.

Second-level schools are already reeling from the cutbacks announced in the budget which will mean loss of subjects in schools, larger class sizes, and the loss of up to 1,000 jobs in second-level schools. ASTI will also be discussing with the other teachers unions the implementation of a work to rule in schools in the short term.

As an expression of our solidarity with young teachers, the ASTI will be calling special branch meetings and will be holding a special national conference of young teachers in May.

Ends

wingnut

Am I right in saying you don't get paid for strike days? How does it work if you are not in a union? Our P and DP are in the ASTI so they will be striking. . As the school is closed there will be no kids to teach. So I presume with no one to keep track non union teachers will get paid?

Trotter

Looks like we're in too. How will this actually work? Will there be a designated point in a city for teachers to gather, or what actually happens?

rainbowtrout

wingnut wrote: »

Am I right in saying you don't get paid for strike days? How does it work if you are not in a union? Our P and DP are in the ASTI so they will be striking. . As the school is closed there will be no kids to teach. So I presume with no one to keep track non union teachers will get paid?

I would have thought that non union teachers should not get docked pay as they are not officially striking but effectively their workplace is shut down.

As far as I know, TUI have some sort of bursary to reimburse striking members, not the full whack but a small part of it. ASTI members get nothing.

Trotter wrote: »

Looks like we're in too. How will this actually work? Will there be a designated point in a city for teachers to gather, or what actually happens?

I would have thought teachers would strike outside their own school. There's only one secondary school in the town I work in so I thought for us it would be the logical choice.

DarkJager

I've said it before and I'll say it again, this is a pointless excercise. I'm not sure what teachers are hoping to achieve with this, but I would highly doubt there will be any support from the public. Whats needed in times like this is reasonable level headed discussion, not throwing your toys out of the pram like a bunch of spoilt children.

gaeilgegrinds

The two teachers in our school not in any union have decided to call in sick, not sure what other option they had but said they had not option.

wingnut

Well I'll be away on an ECA activity with students on that day. Not an option to cancel as it falls in the middle of a two week trip abroad. So technically I will be working, just not in school. Unless I leave the kids to their own devices that day!

spurious

I'll be in Poland with a group of kids on the 30th.

Powerhouse

DarkJager wrote: »

I've said it before and I'll say it again, this is a pointless excercise. I'm not sure what teachers are hoping to achieve with this, but I would highly doubt there will be any support from the public. Whats needed in times like this is reasonable level headed discussion, not throwing your toys out of the pram like a bunch of spoilt children.

Without knowing what they are trying to achieve it is difficult to say that it's a pointless exercise.

Presumably what they are trying to achieve is to exert political pressure on the government parties not to sink their teeth into the profession any more than they already have done. If they appear to be a soft target they will be detroyed by giddy politicians in the coming year when the real pressure comes on.

As for public support, there are - according to the national newspapers -60,000 teachers, so I'd say that in itself qualifies as "public support" to enough of a degree to discommode a few politicians, even if you'll always have the stiff upper-lipped few in all industries who will always be against any protest, and dimiss it as pointless because the benefits are not immediately tangible.

It is fine to say that "what's needed in times like this is reasonable level headed discussion" but this ignores the fact that teachers have been handed a fair accompli and have never been invited to take part in any discussion never mind a reasonable level-headed one. I have no doubt that teachers would be absolutely interested in a reasonable level-headed discussion were that option available.

Delphi91

Nead21 wrote: »

why do teachers get such a hard time in this country? there are other areas of the public service that have also voted for strike action if necessary...

Simple - all people see is a 22 hour week, 3 months off in the summer, two weeks at Easter/Christmas and 167 days of work throughout the year. And dare we protest about anything given the above scenario.

They also think that standing up in front of a class of 25-30 kids is a doddle.

And whatever we do, we should never inconvenience parents by going on strike or taking half days, etc because for a number of parents (and I'm going to get flak for this but 22 years at the chalkface has convinced me of this) we are the childminding service.

Coolio

It's a bit regrettable that our unions asked us to vote on a range of options with the end-game being a strike.

We are now portrayed in the media as being strike-happy. What happened to the work-to-rule/ non-co-operation? Why the need to jump straight in at the deep-end? It was asked of us to approve action up to and including strike, not only strike. Having seen the ballot paper, I felt all along that all the unions wanted was to strike.

I've said it already, it's completely pointless. All it will do is take more money out of teachers pockets for their strike day.

What's this lark about a special convention for young teachers? What? All the unemployed ones? What are they going to do for us? A PR exercise is all that'll be.

positivenote

speaking as a TUI member, i for one dont believe that this strike will achieve anything at all. Its difficult enough as it is getting the syllabus covered in the 12 week semester without having to cancel classes for another day. The students are ultimately losing out here, why not hold back the marking/writing of exams or something else other than striking?

Nead21

ok i just got my payslip.....and i can only describe it as being savaged!!

tbh honest i am finding it very hard to keep up the motivation when our wages are being cut and the ministers are giving themselves €2000 and €3000 pay increases!

the atmosphere in my school this morning is notably depressed.

Delphi91

Nead21 wrote: »

..tbh honest i am finding it very hard to keep up the motivation when our wages are being cut and the ministers are giving themselves €2000 and €3000 pay increases!..

I'm not trying to defend them, but they got service increments after so many years in the Dail (7 I think). Teachers will still be getting their annual increments as I understand it, just not pay rises under pay agreements - someone correct me if I'm wrong on this.

Powerhouse

Coolio wrote: »

It's a bit regrettable that our unions asked us to vote on a range of options with the end-game being a strike.

We are now portrayed in the media as being strike-happy. What happened to the work-to-rule/ non-co-operation? Why the need to jump straight in at the deep-end? It was asked of us to approve action up to and including strike, not only strike. Having seen the ballot paper, I felt all along that all the unions wanted was to strike.

I've said it already, it's completely pointless. All it will do is take more money out of teachers pockets for their strike day.

What's this lark about a special convention for young teachers? What? All the unemployed ones? What are they going to do for us? A PR exercise is all that'll be.

I think this is being a bit short-sighted. Worrying about taking a day's pay from teachers is small beer compared to what might be in store if it is clear that the unions are easy pickings for the government.

That is probably why the unions do not propose work to rule or non-cooperation initiatives as it would give the government a good PR position to be able to tear into what appears to be one of the most reviled groups in Irish society, while on the moral high-ground. Don't think for a moment that this would be kept as a little in-house victimless feud - the government's spin-doctors would see to that.

For teachers, quite frankly, the whole business is PR neutral. What happens of you get some bad PR? People stop buying your product? Or move to a competitor? I don't get why some teachers are so worried about public support. The "company" teachers work for (Dept of Ed) has a monopoly on provision of education - so why is public support so important?

What happens even if teachers get good PR? The salaries increase? Permanent contracts emerge where they wouldn't have been expected to? Let's get real here - you still have three months holidays and shorter hours than any other group.......how good is the PR actually going to get?

What the unions are doing is like a defender in a GAA match doing his job............they might not get much credit because things that are prevented don't show up on the scoresheet but it might be important to keep doing it nonetheless.

nesf

Seriously why strike. The country's screwed financially and we need to cut spending and unfortunately that'll include salaries for public servants. Haven't you people been paying attention to the tax receipts since the New Year? Without cuts we'll be down over 20 billion Euro. Our entire expenditure will be 60 billion. An dthuigeann sibh?

Zero support from me and serious dislike of the strain you people will be putting on working parents and the loss of a day for any students sitting a State exam this year.