[article] Bugger Rugger: Why I totally hate schools' rugby, totally

IIMII

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Bugger Rugger: Why I totally hate schools' rugby, totally

Pain, heartbreak and sorrow - that's what rugby has brought Tom Humphries. Now he says the sport should be banned and driven underground

From the Irish Times, 30 January 2001 and reprinted today

Rugby people. Can't live with them. Can't shoot them. Mainly can't live with them. Can't afford to live with them. Haven't the bloodlines to live with them. Haven't the patience to live with them. Haven't the language skills to live with them. Haven't the desire even. Rugby people have always been college scarves and jutting jaws and silly songs I don't know the words of. C-A-N-N-O-T live with them.
Now, a quick word before we start. Every time I write one of my patented, bitter and twisted chip on-the-shoulder social-cripple pieces about the rugby world, the same smug epistles hit the desk all the way from D4. They tell me (surprise!) that I have a chip on my shoulder about rugby. "You're like a little boy with his nose pressed up against the window - come on in and have a pinty for croying out loud." I know. I have a chip.
Actually I like having a chip on my shoulder about rugby. It is my inalienable right. I will not have a pinty. Thonks. I am happy as I am. I don't like rugby and I work for The Irish Times. It's like being a day trader and working for Pravda. Listen to this. I have tried. I have reached out to rugby. I have gone forth in a spirit of understanding and fellowship and attempted to break down the cultural barriers between rugby and myself. For my troubles, I've had nothing but heartache and sorrow. Let me tell you something I've never told anyone before.
Once, and I am disappearing into a witness protection programme after the next full stop, I played half a season of under-19 rugby with Suttonians. Next time, I'd choose to do my time in jail, as my co-accused did. Despite being a Gaelic player, and therefore able to do some things most rugby people cannot do - i.e. catch a ball, kick a ball, run etc - I was press-ganged into being a second-row forward. This is like choosing to do a heavy lifting job in your spare time. For a few months, I spent my time with my shoulder pushing the buttocks of other men and my arm reached up between their legs. Even after a lifetime in the Christian Brothers, I wasn't prepared for that. My ears were always red and sore and my shoulders ached, but sometimes, to take my mind off all that, the opposing hooker would kindly give me a kick in the face. That's how rugby people run the game and it's how they run the world.
I thrived only in lineouts, those strange Masonic rituals wherein everybody uniformly mistimes their jump for some reason I couldn't initially understand. Clarification wasn't long in coming. After two clean catches, the person opposing you in the lineout would just reach across and pull your hair. Beats gravity every time. Hair-pulling wasn't a very manly thing to do, but neither was weeping: "Ref! Ref! He's pulling my hair." I learned to mistime my jump like everyone else.
For a while, I tried to bring several different coloured pairs of shorts to games in the hope that having the same coloured shorts as the opposition might save my testicles from being squeezed and twisted as we lay in panting heaps somewhere on top of the ball. The biting and hair-pulling I could take. Ball-handling was a no no - even from teams we played regularly. (Note: In the GAA testicles don't actually exist - except as a metaphor for guts. If a sliotar should whicker à tout vitesse into your testicular area, causing the 29 other players on the field to wince and you to double over squealing like a stuck pig, somebody will run onto the field, pour some water down your neck, slap your buttock and say: "C'mon son you'll be grand in a minute." This at a time when you need a general anaesthetic.)
Anyway it all finished between Suttonians and me one weekend when we played in a triangular tournament alongside the giants of the southside, Lansdowne and Blackrock. Now most of the team I played with were actually quite good at rugby and had won the Harry Gale Cup (no less) the previous year. This didn't save us from being treated like bumpkins on our venture across the river. It started with our kits, which were the same colours as Easons bags, and it went on all afternoon, no matter who we played. As luck would have it, on this Saturday morning we endured the sniggering of the Lansdowne chaps and beat them on the back pitch - in Lansdowne. This rightly fouled up the tournament. The plan had been that we would lose to Lansdowne in the morning and then obligingly lose to Blackrock in the afternoon, ensuring a Lansdowne v Blackrock play-off in Stradbrook the next day. Now, we yoiks would be going to Stradbrook. The story has a sad end. We met at noon the next day under Clerys clock. Maybe two of us weren't hungover. The others were pukey or giggly or both. The thought of perhaps beating Blackrock hadn't even kept them in for Saturday night. Why would it? They didn't hate Blackrock the way normal people do. They admired them. So we got pushed around Stradbrook for the afternoon and were beaten by a margin in the region of 60 points. In the second row it felt as if we were going to have our scrawny necks snapped like royal pheasants. For this, I had given up on a junior B football match with St Vincents?
I was deeply ashamed. I never went back. Never told anybody except my spiritual advisor. He quit instantly.
I gave rugby one more chance. Arriving in UCD and not knowing a soul, I put my name down when some jut-jawed, scarf-wearing, acne-free, pinty-type, lady-killing bastard announced that there was to be a class rugby league "to break the old ice, loike". I too would be an icebreaker! I filled out one of the little forms he gave out. I waited. The teams sheets went up on the lecture theatre wall. I skipped across like a happy little puppy. No T J Humphries listed. My eyes welled up. My heart welled down. I sought out the jut-jawed, scarfwearing, acne-free, gout-ridden, Dublin 4, bestiality-is-best-boys, pinty-type, lady-killing bastard and explained my position. Shome mishtake shurley, I said. His brow furrowed. "What's your name?" he asked. "Tom Humphries," I replied frankly. "Where'd you go to school?" he asked. "Fairview," I said. "Where's that?" he asked. (I should point out that his geographical ignorance was no worse than mine. (I got off the bus at RTÉ on my first day in UCD.) "Where the park is," I said helpfully. The park was in the news regularly then for gay-bashing incidents. "Well that's it," he said breezily. "The teams have all the 'Rock guys together, the 'Nure guys with the Belvo' boys, 'Zaga in with Clongowes, Mero with 'Knock and and so on. Roight? So sorry, but you lose out Humpho." "Oh," I said. I'd scarcely understood a word, but realised I had come within an ace of being saddled with a dumb rugger nickname all my life. I went forth and never sinned against my class or my people again.
There were other sad days in rugby's spiteful jihad against me. I lied about rugby to get into sports journalism, pretended I loved it, but soon got found out. I misidentified Brendan Foley as Moss Keane at an old-farts charity game and didn't work again for three months. I described King's Hospital, who haven't once won a small in-bred provincial competition like the Leinster Senior Cup, as the "whipping boys" of the event and the switchboards were jammed for a week by people who wanted to twist my testicles and pull my hair. I was invited to a pre-match dinner for a fixture I was covering involving Lansdowne, but when I turned up and they realised I wasn't quite what they'd been expecting, I was banished to a broom cupboard and given a hot beef roll.
I know these stories may be very upsetting for some sensitive readers, and perhaps there should have been an appropriate warning at the top of the piece, but I can only hope that any distress caused will serve as a warning to others. There has been enough hurt already. Stay away from rugby. It is a plague, sent to us, like the potato famine, to undermine the fabric of our society. The depression-era justification for allowing rugby to prosper (i.e. it's the only way most of these oafs will ever get jobs) is no longer sustainable. The sport should be banned and driven underground.

themont85

Tom Humphrey's, a extremely talented writer, his hatred of rugby is well documented. Not everyone has to like a sport, who cares?

Wreck

Quite a funny article, however I played rugby for 15 or so years and never once did I have my testicles squeezed or twisted, I feel like I missed out :pac:

Stev_o

Complete and utter trimp, most of it sounds made up and just awful journalism. Think there might be a competition in the media to see who can produce the worse article/commentary to do with rugby at the moment.

And btw that whole ball twisting thing is complete rubbish i have never in my whole life had that done to me or heard of it from any other of my team mates. Hairpulling happens now and again but what the hell if your complaining about that your a wimp and shouldn't be playing in the first place. Maybe you should go to the Emerald Warriors id say they might be a bit gentle with him.

themont85

Stev_o wrote: »

Complete and utter trimp, most of it sounds made up and just awful journalism. Think there might be a competition in the media to see who can produce the worse article/commentary to do with rugby at the moment.

And btw that whole ball twisting thing is complete rubbish i have never in my whole life had that done to me or heard of it from any other of my team mates. Hairpulling happens now and again but what the hell if your complaining about that your a wimp and shouldn't be playing in the first place. Maybe you should go to the Emerald Warriors id say they might be a bit gentle with him.

I would hasard a guess that he is completely exaggerating on purpose. Its a style he has used in his Locker Room pieces before and many journalists do, the ridiculous hyperbole. Despite the fact that i completely disagree with him i still got sucked into his piece. The article isn't supposed to be informative but is taking a assways look at a sport and telling a story to keep the readers hooked.

AlphaMale 3OO

Tom Humphries wrote:

(Note: In the GAA testicles don't actually exist

Tell Paul Galvin that.

Sparky14

Reasonably entertaining, if most of it comes straight from Humphos imagination. Did enjoy the line about the "The teams have all the 'Rock guys together, the 'Nure guys with the Belvo' boys,..." and describing a schools team as the whipping boys of the competition. They should get Gerry Thornley to do a similar piece about GAA.

Ceartgoleor

The annoying thing about Humphreys is that he always brings his class warfare style into his talk about disliking rugby, and when he says he dislikes rugby its never for any proper reasons regarding the game itself, but usually this sort of rubbish criticising the people involved.

That said I did go to, and play rugby for, one of these schools.

Podge_irl

I'm almost certain I read that exact same article a number of years ago. He's entitled to his opinion, but by christ does it get dull after a while.

irishbucsfan

Have to admit I laughed. "Humpho" is a legend.

And Stevo, to call it awful journalism is pretty silly, it's clearly a light-hearted jab at D4 rugby fans, and some of them definitely deserve it.

RuggieBear

Podge_irl wrote: »

I'm almost certain I read that exact same article a number of years ago. He's entitled to his opinion, but by christ does it get dull after a while.

erm...it is a reprint from 2001...!

Podge_irl

RuggieBear wrote: »

erm...it is a reprint from 2001...!

Shush you.


(I'll try and pay more attention to these things in future )

thebaz

I like most competetive sport, and schools rugby is that, yes its mainly played by private schools , in leinster anyway, but its still a formiddable battle, which is the attraction for me - I also used to love priemiership football, but when wages went over 100k a week, i just couldn't relate to it, particularly as a game for the people - I loved playing Gaelic football , never enjoyed watching it though - throw away the chip tom, his kids may very well attend private Dublin schools, and if they are lucky eneogh to play rugby and get picked, humble pie might be on the menu ...

Downtime

thebaz wrote: »

...yes its mainly played by private schools , in leinster anyway...

No it's not. It's mainly played well by private schools (or they have the higher success rate in competitions) but less than 20% of the rugby playing schools in Leinster are private.

Serenity Now!

RuggieBear wrote: »

erm...it is a reprint from 2001...!

I couldn't give two stuffs about schools rugby union either. It gets way too much exposure in the media and is a block to age grade players playing in the club system that they should be in by the age of 16.
People sometimes boast of the crowds at the games. This also is shash. Its not like the kids who go generally have a choice in the first place anyway, is it?

Having said all that, a Humphries article slating the game in general is nothing new. He whallops on about GAA and soccer like Colm Tóibín talks about the wheat and the chaff of Wexford. The irony is that he comments on discipline in rugby. Given that police have had to escort refs off for women's club hurling before, I tend to laugh at the chump who writes this bilge.

Like Stephen Jones, Ciaran Cronin or George Hook, I don't pay any attention to silly jibe articles like the one that was reprinted in yesterday's Irish Times.

luckat

Stev_o wrote: »

Complete and utter trimp, most of it sounds made up and just awful journalism. Think there might be a competition in the media to see who can produce the worse article/commentary to do with rugby at the moment.

Oo, saucer of milk for Table 13.

Ceartgoleor

Serenity Now! wrote: »

I couldn't give two stuffs about schools rugby union either. It gets way too much exposure in the media and is a block to age grade players playing in the club system that they should be in by the age of 16.

Who decides the club system is better preparation for players? The very best Irish players have always come through the schools system, some of them, like Kearney, Fitzgerald & d'Arcy directly from school into international rugby almost.

Our schools system is of an exceptionally high standard internationally, (look at the success of the U-20's teams in the last couple of seasons) and the fact that in recent years 'Rock, Belvo and St. Michael's have all accounted for their counterparts in the UK who have won the Daily Mail Schools Cup in the same year.

Serenity Now!

Ceartgoleor wrote: »

Who decides the club system is better preparation for players?

Well, for starters, the U20s coach, Allan Clarke who has also helped established the Academies throughout the provinces

Ceartgoleor wrote: »

The very best Irish players have always come through the schools system, some of them, like Kearney, Fitzgerald & d'Arcy directly from school into international rugby almost

Kearney and Fitzgerald were brought through the Academy system in conjunction with the High Performance Dept of the IRFU. You can add Heaslip, Healy and Earls to that also.
d'Arcy didn't have the most auspicious of starts and virtually had to restart his career after partying up for two years in Australia. I'd give the provincial system and in particular Matt Williams the credit for re-discovering him myself.

Ceartgoleor wrote: »

Our schools system is of an exceptionally high standard internationally, (look at the success of the U-20's teams in the last couple of seasons) and the fact that in recent years 'Rock, Belvo and St. Michael's have all accounted for their counterparts in the UK who have won the Daily Mail Schools Cup in the same year.

For U20s see quote above. As for the schools winning the comp you mention erm....they played other schools. How did they do against the Welsh club age teams? What about English clubs? They didn't play them, did they...
Reliance on the schools system is what is damaging the likes of Scottish and Australian rugby union. It thins out the playerbase. When the playerbase is smaller than other countries such as England, France or even Wales, the talent it delivers should be introduced to the competitive game earlier. Effing around in schools competition and being kept out of the harder competitive element is what had limited, before the present system was established, depth of choices for positions like prop or no.10.

All in my opinion, of course.

Ceartgoleor

Serenity Now! wrote: »

Well, for starters, the U20s coach, Allan Clarke who has also helped established the Academies throughout the provinces

It's ridiculous to attempt to give the academies the credit for producing these players, they've only been there for about a year, and all learn the bulk of their formative rugby at school. Especially in the case of Luke Fitzgerald, who played for Ireland before he'd even played for Leinster.

Allen Clarke picks players from the Academies because they're at an age where they've finished school for the most part, it still doesn't change the fact that that is where they've learned their rugby.

A quick glance at the most recent Ireland U-20's team throws up Dave Kearney, Ian McKinley, Michael Keating, Ian Madigan, Thomas Sexton, Jack McGrath & Dominic Ryan all from the Leinster schools system, and those are just the lads I know, not including the Ulster or Munster boys.

There is a club set up, and club representative international sides, it's just not as strong as the schools.

Your questions about beating schools like Wellington College or Colston's when we were in 'Rock and comparing it to club sides? We did routinely play Welsh touring club sides, including Carmarthen Athletic who included current Scarlets Rhys Priestland and Kenny Owens, and other strong English club sides on tour also, and found we got a tougher game from their school counterparts.

thebaz

Downtime wrote: »

No it's not. It's mainly played well by private schools (or they have the higher success rate in competitions) but less than 20% of the rugby playing schools in Leinster are private.

ok so, the article was geared at that 80 % then , with a massive picture of one of the 20 % - if that was the case why would he have written the article - if you are that particular about facts

Serenity Now!

Ceartgoleor wrote: »

It's ridiculous to attempt to give the academies the credit for producing these players, they've only been there for about a year, and all learn the bulk of their formative rugby at school. Especially in the case of Luke Fitzgerald, who played for Ireland before he'd even played for Leinster.

Allen Clarke picks players from the Academies because they're at an age where they've finished school for the most part, it still doesn't change the fact that that is where they've learned their rugby

:rolleyes:
It and the high performance unit has been in place for the last three years. Read his interview in one of the main daily newspapers. It sums up perfectly the state of grade rugby.

Ceartgoleor wrote: »

There is a club set up, and club representative international sides, it's just not as strong as the schools

And people like yourself will make sure of that.

Ceartgoleor wrote: »

Your questions about beating schools like Wellington College or Colston's when we were in 'Rock and comparing it to club sides? We did routinely play Welsh touring club sides, including Carmarthen Athletic who included current Scarlets Rhys Priestland and Kenny Owens, and other strong English club sides on tour also, and found we got a tougher game from their school counterparts.

Have a look at the Wales U18 side this year then (one of last year's being poached by Ireland in fact).

Orizio

Funnily enough, I have had my balls squeezed at least three times over the years playing GAA, so I am inclined to think Tom is a little bit off.

Spore

I played my rugby DNS, something Humphries fails to pick up on - Rugby aint always a posho sport. I'd say at least 50-60% of rugby is played outside the posh confines of private schools and prawn and cocktails clubs. The likes of Keith Earls is a mascot for the way forward - came from the Hood, literally, that was no hamper on him, just a great athlete playing a great sport.

irishbucsfan

Spore wrote: »

I played my rugby DNS, something Humphries fails to pick up on - Rugby aint always a posho sport. I'd say at least 50-60% of rugby is played outside the posh confines of private schools and prawn and cocktails clubs.

Too right. I always love coming into the city on a good sunny afternoon with a light wind on my back and smashing around a few posh kids.

In Leinster, you can look at G.Darcy R.Kearney J.Heaslip G.Murphy B.Jackman and even Tony Buckley, who all started playing rugby in Kildare. Not Dublin. Horgan's a Meath man and I think Dempsey's a Wicklownian at heart. Leo Cullen is a wicklow man as well. Sean O'Brien is from feckin Tullow of all places. Im not saying these guys arent posh (Kearney really turned his back on Louth when he went to Clongowes...!) but they're not exactly D4s.

Schools rugby is the best underage rugby competition in Ireland. It has to be said. But it is also true that it places a huge block in front of U16/U18s who want to get involved in rugby and can't afford a private school. Good underage schools players are pushed into the limelight by national papers. Good underage club rugby players get absolutely no exposure and its ridiculous. A perfect example at the moment is Sean Kelly, the young outhalf at Newbridge RFC, he's been playing Under 20s rugby (Newbridge U-20s, unlike their seniors, are an extremely competitive team. fed by Newbridge College for the most part) since he was 16 and he's started for the Senior team at the tender age of 18. He goes to a public school so all his education has come through the club, yet he still can control a game against strong South Dublin U-20s teams full of schools rugby products, If a 16 year old was starting at OH for one of the big private schools in the SC he'd be hailed as a messiah by Thornley and the like. There's players just like that across the country, who are shunned by the provincial academies for schools players becuse of their supposed superiority.

There is definitely a problem there and hopefully someone see that and proposes a solution.

Off the top of my head, with the changes supposedly coming in which will change U18 rugby to U19, that puts the clubs in the same age-group as the schools, so I don't see why clubs should be prevented from competing in the Senior Cup. The IRFU already prevent players playing both schools rugby and club rugby, so dual-registration wouldn't be an issure.

anonymous_joe

Schools get far more visibility than clubs, hence their superiority - schools rugby has glory (think back to when you were 12 :P ) club doesn't, so people commit to their school, and that exacerabates the divide.

Letting the clubs in really wouldn't hurt.

Tim Robbins

Spore wrote: »

I played my rugby DNS, something Humphries fails to pick up on - Rugby aint always a posho sport. I'd say at least 50-60% of rugby is played outside the posh confines of private schools and prawn and cocktails clubs. The likes of Keith Earls is a mascot for the way forward - came from the Hood, literally, that was no hamper on him, just a great athlete playing a great sport.

Sean O'Brien is hardly a posho either.

I think the system just needs a little tweaking. One way would be to make U17 / colts a big thing for the clubs. It would mean that the clubs and schools don't clash. That's what they do in England.

Rock, Nure etc are all fielding youth teams now which contain players many players who are not on the schools 1st team.

That's a big step forward from my day when once you went to a Rugby school you were not allowed play for your club even if you couldn't make your school first team.

irishbucsfan

irishbucsfan wrote: »

(Kearney really turned his back on Louth when he went to Clongowes...!) but they're not exactly D4s.

What do you mean turned his back?

Why,because he got a good education and developed his rugby skills in a private boarding school.

FYI the only rugby school in D4 is ST Michaels and Clongowes would be considered equally as upper class as rock,nure,michaels etc.

So this D4 steriotype unless aimed at Michaels,doesnt make any sense,unless you class any school near the southside dartline D4.

And basically all the players you mentioned went to private schools in leinster,so its the same "posho" schools that keep producing some of the best players in the country.

So this steriotype does not count if your not from dublin,cause Leo Cullen went to Rock but he is a wicklow man and not a D4 head,yet Fitzgerald lived in Dublin went to Rock and is??

anonymous_joe

Solomon Breezy Stockade wrote: »

What do you mean turned his back?

Why,because he got a good education and developed his rugby skills in a private boarding school.

FYI the only rugby school in D4 is ST Michaels and Clongowes would be considered equally as upper class as rock,nure,michaels etc.

So this D4 steriotype unless aimed at Michaels,doesnt make any sense,unless you class any school near the southside dartline D4.

And basically all the players you mentioned went to private schools in leinster,so its the same "posho" schools that keep producing some of the best players in the country.

Ah there's a few more schools in D4 than Michaels. None are really rugby schools though.

And yeah, come on, we all know D4's a state of mind, etc. lads from Michaels, Rock, Belvedere, CLongowes, etc aren't very different.

RuggieBear

Marian College, St Conleiths College, John Scottus (?) are three schools in D4 that also play Leinster Schools rugby( Section A..when i was playing) but not in the top divsion

Spore

Yeah thats what I meant,they are the only prominent rugby school in D4,although im open to correction.

It just annoys me that people talk such ****e about schools rugby.
Like if you are from wicklow or meath and attend a private school you are exempt from the D4 steriotype yet if you live in Dublin and go to the same school your classed as D4.

Also people dont seem to understand that Clongowes is probably the top 2 most prestigious schools in ireland,so anyone who went there could certainly be labeled D4 if a person seems to generalise,as many here are doing,mostly from Munster I would assume.

Spore wrote: »

I played my rugby DNS, something Humphries fails to pick up on - Rugby aint always a posho sport. I'd say at least 50-60% of rugby is played outside the posh confines of private schools and prawn and cocktails clubs. The likes of Keith Earls is a mascot for the way forward - came from the Hood, literally, that was no hamper on him, just a great athlete playing a great sport.

Why is it a mascot for the way foward???

Is it a bad thing to go to a private school and play rugby?
I could have sworn my parents were just trying to get me the best education they could,like everyone else who goes to a private school.

You say Earls is a great athlete playing a great sport.
What are luke Fitzgerald and Bod?
jumped up poshos holding others back from playing rugby?

Also a mascot for the way foward??
I could have sworn the best players in the country are majority from fee paying schools as will always be the case.

I have also never seen anyone eating a prawn sandwhich in my life.
The ignorance from some people is sickening,it was confined to munsterfans.com but now here.

Serenity Now! wrote: »

Kearney and Fitzgerald were brought through the Academy system in conjunction with the High Performance Dept of the IRFU. You can add Heaslip, Healy and Earls to that also.

Fitzgerald played his first international 6 months after he left rock but you credit the academy with that?

I dont know if are involved or watch Leinster senior cup rugby but I can assure you,they are as good as they are because of the coaching they get in school,not the academys.

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Too right. I always love coming into the city on a good sunny afternoon with a light wind on my back and smashing around a few posh kids.

In Leinster, you can look at G.Darcy R.Kearney J.Heaslip G.Murphy B.Jackman and even Tony Buckley, who all started playing rugby in Kildare. Not Dublin. Horgan's a Meath man and I think Dempsey's a Wicklownian at heart. Leo Cullen is a wicklow man as well. Sean O'Brien is from feckin Tullow of all places. Im not saying these guys arent posh (Kearney really turned his back on Louth when he went to Clongowes...!) but they're not exactly D4s.

You love beating up people because of their background.What a nice person.

Also all the players you mentioned learned their rugby in a private school,not a club.
Except for O'Brien and possibly Horgan.

Wheres D4 lad?
And point to the schools you class as D4.

irishbucsfan

<snip>I will not say anything mean and degrading and defamatory about any players</snip>

Solomon Breezy Stockade wrote: »

The ignorance from some people is sickening,not only is it confined to munsterfans.com but now here.

I'm not from munster. I went to a private school in Leinster, and played rugby, and suffered the insults any "D4" student does. And I hated it and I called it a useless stereotype and I called everyone ignorant...

But then one day I realised it was spot on. You're right though, D4 is completely incorrect, it's more a class thing than a geographical thing.

I went to Newbridge College by the way, and we were always called scumbridge by all the "good" schools like 'Nure and 'Rock. They even use to wave their wallets at our team bus as we drove in... just to make sure we understood that we were playing a sport that was too good for us.

It's just unfortunate that, when it comes to rugby, strength in character has an inverse ratio to one's proximity to Donnybrook

Real FM

RuggieBear wrote: »

Marian College, St Conleiths College, John Scottus (?) are three schools in D4 that also play Leinster Schools rugby( Section A..when i was playing) but not in the top divsion

Oh how I laughed.

So according to some the Irish rugby community is made up of Michaels and 3 schools who have a better chance of squeezing milk out of Jackie Chans nipple than ever winning something!

Ceartgoleor

irishbucsfan wrote: »

<SNIP>


I'm not from munster. I went to a private school in Leinster, and played rugby, and suffered the insults any "D4" student does. And I hated it and I called it a useless stereotype and I called everyone ignorant...

But then one day I realised it was spot on. You're right though, D4 is completely incorrect, it's more a class thing than a geographical thing.

I went to Newbridge College by the way, and we were always called scumbridge by all the "good" schools like 'Nure and 'Rock. They even use to wave their wallets at our team bus as we drove in... just to make sure we understood that we were playing a sport that was too good for us.

It's just unfortunate that, when it comes to rugby, strength in character has an inverse ratio to one's proximity to Donnybrook

Most of that is complete horse****. You got taunted by Rock and Nure cause you went to Newbridge? So what? Rock have plenty to say to Nure, Belvo, Mary's etc too and vice versa!

And re the comment about Drico and Luke Fitzgerald, can't say a lot about O'Driscoll, but Luke is actually a totally copped on, down to earth guy so why you, who probably never met him in your life would refer to him as a prick I dunno. Probably because, like everything else you've commented on here so far, you haven't a clue what you're talking about

irishbucsfan

irishbucsfan wrote: »

<SNIP>


I'm not from munster. I went to a private school in Leinster, and played rugby, and suffered the insults any "D4" student does. And I hated it and I called it a useless stereotype and I called everyone ignorant...

But then one day I realised it was spot on. You're right though, D4 is completely incorrect, it's more a class thing than a geographical thing.

I went to Newbridge College by the way, and we were always called scumbridge by all the "good" schools like 'Nure and 'Rock. They even use to wave their wallets at our team bus as we drove in... just to make sure we understood that we were playing a sport that was too good for us.

It's just unfortunate that, when it comes to rugby, strength in character has an inverse ratio to one's proximity to Donnybrook

You cant steriotype everyone from the main rugby schools in dublin because you had wallets waved at you.
I went to CBC and we got abuse and that aswell,but I know loads of people that went to rock etc and they are bang on.

Your confusing immaturity and ignorance.

<SNIP>

I think you just have a chip on your shoulder tbh but dont let that stand in the way of your point lol

irishbucsfan

Solomon Breezy Stockade wrote: »

Fitzgerald played his first international 6 months after he left rock but you credit the academy with that?

I dont know if are involved or watch Leinster senior cup rugby but I can assure you,they are as good as they are because of the coaching they get in school,not the academys.

Thats true. The coaching our players get at schools level has to be among the best in the world for players their age

Solomon Breezy Stockade wrote: »

You love beating up people because of their background.What a nice person.

Also all the players you mentioned learned their rugby in a private school,not a club.
Except for O'Brien and possibly Horgan.

Yeah, I'm a really horrible person, sue me.

I know, all those players did learn their rugby in private schools, mostly Clongowes and Newbridge. I was just trying to make the point that they aren't "D4s"

And I was joking about Kearney and Louth, I mean, listen to the guy talk, and then listen to Steve Staunton...

Crash

There will be no personal comments about players on this thread. Those references will be removed. Its degrading, pathetic, and not something we'll be having on this forum. Irishbucsfan if you do something like that again you'll be on a week or twos ban.

irishbucsfan

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Thats true. The coaching our



Yeah, I'm a really horrible person, sue me.

I know, all those players did learn their rugby in private schools, mostly Clongowes and Newbridge. I was just trying to make the point that they aren't "D4s"

And I was joking about Kearney and Louth, I mean, listen to the guy talk, and then listen to Steve Staunton...

So what do you class as D4,cause Newbridge is as D4 as Rock or Belvo and youl find students there will come out with a similar accent to their counterparts in the "D4" schools

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Yeah, I'm a really horrible person

Judging by the ignorant tripe you have been spouting,I wouldnt disagree.

JohnJericho

I have been lucky enough to have met most of the Leinster in the bar after one of their games and all of them are absolute bang on. I have to say Luke and Drico are two of the nicest blokes you'll encounter.

irishbucsfan

Ceartgoleor wrote: »

Most of that is complete horse****. You got taunted by Rock and Nure cause you went to Newbridge? So what? Rock have plenty to say to Nure, Belvo, Mary's etc too and vice versa!

So you think there's nothing wrong with 17/18 year old kids, most of whom've never worked a day in their lives to taunt other lads their own age because theyr'e supposedly worse off than them? Honestly, the fact that these guys think they're superior just because their parents are wealthy is sick.

Ceartgoleor wrote: »

And re the comment about Drico and Luke Fitzgerald, can't say a lot about O'Driscoll, but Luke is actually a totally copped on, down to earth guy so why you, who probably never met him in your life would refer to him as a prick I dunno. Probably because, like everything else you've commented on here so far, you haven't a clue what you're talking about

OK, no personal comments, but I do know what Im talking about.

Im sure theyre nice guys, Ive never met anyone in rugby who isnt.

irishbucsfan

irishbucsfan wrote: »

So you think there's nothing wrong with 17/18 year old kids, most of whom've never worked a day in their lives to taunt other lads their own age because theyr'e supposedly worse off than them?

Its called being a bloody child,do you go out at all?

have you met any people who went to the "D4" schools recently.

You will find once people hit 19 or 20 they get a bit of cop on and are perfectly nice people.

You should also note its a minority that would have done that.
The way you are making it out,the parents,teachers and whole school waved your bus off to a rendition of "povos" waiving Dunhill wallets at your bus,while tossing 50's.

twinytwo

rugby is for men.. soccer is for bitchs... enough said:pac:

irishbucsfan

Solomon Breezy Stockade wrote: »

So what do you class as D4,cause Newbridge is as D4 as Rock or Belvo and youl find students there will come out with a similar accent to their counterparts in the "D4" schools

They really don't come out with similar accents at all, thanks to the fact they socialise in Naas and Newbridge, but thats completely irrelevant.

I dont like classing it as D4, I don't know how to class it. There is definitely a level of snobbery in Leinster rugby though. Maybe it's one of those things that can only be seen from the outised.

Solomon Breezy Stockade wrote: »

Judging by the ignorant tripe you have been spouting,I wouldnt disagree.

Hey look, Im not ignorant, and im not a bad person. I didn't always go to Newbridge, I also went to a "posh" Dublin school*. I play at a decently high level and with people who went to schools like 'Nure and Blackrock etc. and some of them are the best friends I have. But they also see exactly what I'm talking about. The private schools who are synonymous with success in schools rugby (and Newbridge is included, even if theyve been less than successful recently!) are also schools with reputations for being snobs and for being rude. I don't know if that's the case with Munster Schools rugby or with Ulster, but it's certainly the case in Leinster.

Ill always support Leinster rugby and I hope the Blackrocks etc. keep producing the Fitz's and BOD's of Irish rugby, but I'd be delighted if they were a bit more down-to-earth about it. Then maybe we might see more people take up rugby in the province

*When I left Dublin to go to school in Newbridge I was told they were all scumbags in Newbrige, and I got the shock of my life when they turned out to be just the same! I think people in prestigious private schools dont realise that the reputation they have, whilst it is exaggerated, is deserved in most cases.

Ceartgoleor

irishbucsfan wrote: »

So you think there's nothing wrong with 17/18 year old kids, most of whom've never worked a day in their lives to taunt other lads their own age because theyr'e supposedly worse off than them? Honestly, the fact that these guys think they're superior just because their parents are wealthy is sick.

I went to Rock, and I know exactly the stuff you're referring to, and no its not great. But we similarly faced abuse when we travelled to other schools. The most important word in your post in relation to the incident is that the perpetrators were kids who don't really know any better at the time.

The whole tread has gone way off point now anyway.

themont85

Solomon Breezy Stockade wrote: »

You cant steriotype everyone from the main rugby schools in dublin because you had wallets waved at you.
I went to CBC and we got abuse and that aswell,but I know loads of people that went to rock etc and they are bang on.

Your confusing immaturity and ignorance.

<SNIP>

I think you just have a chip on your shoulder tbh but dont let that stand in the way of your point lol

Ah another former CBC man, i was looking for back up when i was getting fierce abuse in the schools rugby thread.

irishbucsfan, it would be slightly ironic if lads from Rock/Nure waived wallets at Newbridge students. I mean firstly Newbridge is fee paying too and secondly a lot of Newbridge pupils would be far wealthier than your average Rock boy given that in the past a lot of pupils in Newbridge would have been borders.

Also i have never heard anyone anyone refer to Newbridge as 'scumbridge' and i am friends with people from a great many of the schools you refer to.

Your image of the wallet did make me laugh though as did Solomon Breezy Stockade's extension of it, like a scene straight out of Ross O'Carroll Kelly!

Oh and btw Kearney's accent is a weird one. Its a Clongowes one mixed with a harder Louth undertone.

irishbucsfan

Solomon Breezy Stockade wrote: »

Its called being a bloody child,do you go out at all?

have you met any people who went to the "D4" schools recently.

Hey calm it down, this is a discussion not an argument.

I meet them 3 nights a week. Ill be in the gym with them tonight and on the pitch with them tomorrow night. And then Saturday, I'll be playing beside them and against them. They're fine. Im not saying everyone who went to a private school in Leinster and plays rugby is a stuck up arrogant snob.

Im sure you must have gone to one of those schools, Im sure you're a good person. But you must admit that level of snobbery (doesn't seem like the right word) exists.

Solomon Breezy Stockade wrote: »

You should also note its a minority that would have done that.
The way you are making it out,the parents,teachers and whole school waved your bus off to a rendition of "povos" waiving Dunhill wallets at your bus,while tossing 50's.

Minority (10 or so iirc) or not, they let their school down. They weren't disciplined for it (I know that) despite the fact it was witnessed by teachers from both schools. Anyways I have no evidence for any of that so it's pointless talking about it. Its just an example.

When a first year arrives in Rock,he is given a starter kit.

It includes





and a megaphone to make sure the cries of "povos" are heard.

anonymous_joe

irishbucsfan wrote: »

So you think there's nothing wrong with 17/18 year old kids, most of whom've never worked a day in their lives to taunt other lads their own age because theyr'e supposedly worse off than them? Honestly, the fact that these guys think they're superior just because their parents are wealthy is sick.


OK, no personal comments, but I do know what Im talking about.

Im sure theyre nice guys, Ive never met anyone in rugby who isnt.

Look, I've been to sports matches in three continents, I've been to rugby matches at school, club and national level, I've been to football at club and national level matches.

Fans everywhere insult players and opposition fans. In every sport. Rugby is fairly tame in that regard. It does happen, because the fans are often kids, and they;re enthusiastic and tribal and immature.

And I don't see the point of this degenerating into bashing either schools, people or provinces.

irishbucsfan

themont85 wrote: »

Ah another former CBC man, i was looking for back up when i was getting fierce abuse in the schools rugby thread.

irishbucsfan, it would be slightly ironic if lads from Rock/Nure waived wallets at Newbridge students. I mean firstly Newbridge is fee paying too and secondly a lot of Newbridge pupils would be far wealthier than your average Rock boy given that in the past a lot of pupils in Newbridge would have been borders.

Also i have never heard anyone anyone refer to Newbridge as 'scumbridge' and i am friends with people from a great many of the schools you refer to.
Your image of the wallet did make me laugh though as did Solomon Breezy Stockade's extension of it, like a scene straight out of Ross O'Carroll Kelly!

Oh and btw Kearney's accent is a weird one. Its a Clongowes one mixed with a harder Louth undertone.

I think the whole "Scumbridge" thing was short lived. It was infuriating though, let me tell you, going to a school when everyone who went to school locally decided you were too posh to hang around with and everyone in Dublin decided you were too much of a knacker! We were all stuck right in the middle. Made for one tight-knit rugby squad though.

And you're right, Newbridge students are generally most of the wealthy families from the area, which did make it ironic. I couldn't believe what I was seeing with the wallet-waving. We lost that day as well, so we were fierce bitter on the drive home...

irishbucsfan

anonymous_joe wrote: »

Look, I've been to sports matches in three continents, I've been to rugby matches at school, club and national level, I've been to football at club and national level matches.

Fans everywhere insult players and opposition fans. In every sport. Rugby is fairly tame in that regard. It does happen, because the fans are often kids, and they;re enthusiastic and tribal and immature.

And I don't see the point of this degenerating into bashing either schools, people or provinces.

Im not saying that the kids were worse fans than the fans at other schools, Im not saying that rugby fans are worse than fans of other sports.

Im just giving an example of that "D4" (until another term is found) mindset which is what gives Leinster rugby such a poor reputation. It doesn't matter which school it was, just that it happened.

Im not "bashing" any school or anyone. And in relation to the OP, If Tom Humphries had taken up rugby in Munster or if he'd gone to UCC or UL, I bet he'd have a different view of it. And I'm a Leinster Season ticket holder who plays rugby here and loves abusing Munster men.

IIMII

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I went to Newbridge College by the way, and we were always called scumbridge by all the "good" schools like 'Nure and 'Rock. They even use to wave their wallets at our team bus as we drove in... just to make sure we understood that we were playing a sport that was too good for us.

:eek::D:rolleyes:

Chucky the tree

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I went to Newbridge College by the way, and we were always called scumbridge by all the "good" schools like 'Nure and 'Rock. They even use to wave their wallets at our team bus as we drove in... just to make sure we understood that we were playing a sport that was too good for us.

Disgraceful carry on from the gick.