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How Widespread is Steroid Use Thesedays ?

  • 26-01-2009 4:42pm
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭


    Just interested to know how widespread steroid
    use is in irish gyms thesedays

    I have a few friends who use steroids to help them with their goals and they are not professional athletes and are just using steroids as a shortcut to gaining muscle and strength and they find no problem with it

    I also have other friends who are dead against it

    I am not looking to start a pisssing contest about whether its right or wrong

    just wanted to hear from a few others on whether or not they either use themselves or know people who are using or have used

    (this includes hgh as well although its technically not a steroid)


«1

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,338 ✭✭✭the drifter


    can-of-worms.jpg


    i seriously doubt your going to get someone to come on here and say

    " hey hey look at me i take steroids "


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,338 ✭✭✭the drifter


    i suppose i better give a valid opionion too....

    I have no problem with people taking them its there choice...personally i never would..

    what i do have a problem with is people taking them and saying there not....


  • Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    i seriously doubt your going to get someone to come on here and say

    " hey hey look at me i take steroids "

    If people don't want to admit it because it's just private information that's fine, but if they don't want to admit for fear of people ridiculing them or thinking they are idiots then they shouldn't take them in the first place because they probably don't know enough about what they are taking or how it affects them to stand up to these people because the people who are prejudiced usually don't know a lot about it. I was prejudiced against people who took steroids as I heard it was a way of cheating and wasn't interested but it was only after it was explained to me that steroids aren't actually wonder drugs and seem to allow top athletes or people who need to train more for personal goals to recover quicker as opposed to giving them "magical" amounts of muscle did I start to change my thinking.

    From what I have overheard in gym changing rooms, it seems to be more popular in non commercial gyms i.e. not in your westwoods or crunch fitness etc. However, I have heard enough to suggest that it is definitely common enough. Could be wrong though, just hearsay afterall. I don't take them.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,397 ✭✭✭✭Degsy


    I'm curious about that myself.
    There seems to be a lot of big blokes in my gym who cant lift very much weight at all..


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,863 ✭✭✭kevpants


    Steroid "abuse" is pretty widespread. Interpretting "abuse" as mis-use rather than over-use.

    I don't really know many people into PL'ing, BB'ing, strongman or even mid to high level sport (man my friends are lazy) but combining my hobbies of training and peoplewatching I have come to observe/over-hear several fairly uninspiring physical specimens who perform fairly uninspiring acts in the gym discuss their varying "stacks".

    Furkin "stacks". They should have tried "steaks", they might have got somewhere.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,338 ✭✭✭the drifter


    ive had it said to me twice in the past week that im "on something" because of the gains ive made since early november...

    the absolute worst is when they try to "advise" you on what you should be taking supplment wise...

    you go back to your curls there buddy and leave me be..


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik




    i seriously doubt your going to get someone to come on here and say

    " hey hey look at me i take steroids "

    it is possible to post annonymously if your worried about privacy

    its also possible to give an opinion without admitting personal use


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,338 ✭✭✭the drifter


    madmik wrote: »
    it is possible to post annonymously if your worried about privacy

    its also possible to give an opinion without admitting personal use

    valid point...

    in light of these recent developments i retract my previous statment....:cool:


  • Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    madmik wrote: »
    it is possible to post annonymously if your worried about privacy

    You can't post anonymously. Well, at least I couldn't and I lurked for ages around here as I wasn't bothered registering.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik


    You can't post anonymously. Well, at least I couldn't and I lurked for ages around here as I wasn't bothered registering.

    your correct

    in some areas of boards its possible to post anonymouslly(like personal issues)
    but not in fitness

    although if someone is afraid of being identified they could post under another log in

    also you dont have to be using steroids yourself to know people who are using

    I believe there are a lot more people using than u would imagine


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,466 ✭✭✭COH


    I don't really care if someone is taking steroids or not, thats their business. But it does bother me the amount of people taking them who know nothing about what they're putting into their system.

    For example I spoke to a young guy last week who said he was taking primo. I asked him if he even knew what primo was, he said no but his mates said it was savage so he was doing a cycle, and that after that one he'd start hitting dianabol too, about which he knew nothing either. He didn't even know what dosage he was taking, or what exactly he expected it to do. And had never even heard of the concept of post-cycle therapy etc. I imagine that as well as the 'informed masses' there are ALOT of guys out there like him, and thats scary!


  • Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    That is just pure stupidity, what is he playing at? No wonder people assume that people who take steroids are cheaters or idiots, it's these blokes ruining it for all the genuine blokes/lasses(???) out there who know what they are doing.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik


    most of the guys i know are in their mid twenties and using the gear purely as a shortcut to results

    since theyre not competing in any tested event i dont have a huge problem with it

    it does make a hell of differnce though

    I saw 1 guy in particular who went from lean +skinny 67kg to muscular 83kg taking 500mg of test a week for 10 weeks on the fiirst cycle

    hes in good shape now but he plans to do another 10 week cycle to get to a ripped 90kg

    it makes the progress gained naturally look like a joke


  • Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    madmik wrote: »
    it does make a hell of differnce though

    I saw 1 guy in particular who went from lean +skinny 67kg to muscular 83kg taking 500mg of test a week for 10 weeks on the fiirst cycle

    hes in good shape now but he plans to do another 10 week cycle to get to a ripped 90kg

    it makes the progress gained naturally look like a joke

    This is what confuses me. Everyone who I have spoken to about steroids (basically know much much more than I do for a start) and have told me claims like that are BS.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik


    This is what confuses me. Everyone who I have spoken to about steroids (basically know much much more than I do for a start) and have told me claims like that are BS.

    honestly,i have trained with this lad and saw him gain the weight/strength

    he was 67kg on st patricks day and 10 weeks later he was 83kg


    it was ridiculous the speed he grew muscle at


    also ridiculous was the amount of food he comsumed at the time

    he was eating twice what a normal person eats per meal and said he was waking up at 3am starving having to have a sandwich and a weight gain drink

    theres no denying that steroids work

    heres a detailed but complicated study that proves
    strength/muscle mass was much increased in the group
    given test than the placebo group

    http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/335/1/1

    even the guys who didnt exercise in this study gained muscle mass
    when given a shot of test weekly for 8 weeks


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 50 ✭✭jethrodublin


    those type of gains usually happen first timers. maybe the second time if you have run the first course right.

    also good gains are made straight after a show, the food and drugs together really kick start your body and you seem to grow like a stem for about 3 weeks.

    as was pointed out earlier use-mis use-abuse


    i fall into the mis use group, but i understand the line that moves into abuse also.

    its a personal decision, i do it for compeditive reasons so have a goal. i can't understand the average gym rat just banging the stuff in blindly though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,234 ✭✭✭Malteaser!


    Degsy wrote: »
    I'm curious about that myself.
    There seems to be a lot of big blokes in my gym who cant lift very much weight at all..

    I know who you're talking about and your assumption is correct. ;)


    From talking to a couple of people about it in Total Fitness in Blanch, it seems to be way more widespread than I first imagined.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 50 ✭✭jethrodublin


    Degsy wrote: »
    I'm curious about that myself.
    There seems to be a lot of big blokes in my gym who cant lift very much weight at all..


    there's a big difference between a power lifter and a bodybuilder. it doesn't matter what weight is on the bar once its improving your appearence


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,297 ✭✭✭Reyman


    madmik wrote: »

    heres a detailed but complicated study that proves
    strength/muscle mass was much increased in the group
    given test than the placebo group

    http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/335/1/1

    even the guys who didnt exercise in this study gained muscle mass
    when given a shot of test weekly for 8 weeks

    That's a very interesting study Madmik. The guys who did no exercise but took Testerone got quite a bit stronger. I'd say they made more progress doing nothing than I would slaving (clean) for 10 weeks in the gym


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik


    Reyman wrote: »
    That's a very interesting study Madmik. The guys who did no exercise but took Testerone got quite a bit stronger. I'd say they made more progress doing nothing than I would slaving (clean) for 10 weeks in the gym

    theres another article about the same study somewhere online and its a bit easier to read than that one

    i cant find it now but i read it before and the guys in the group who only got a shot of test without exercise gained iirc 7kilos of muscle

    the ones who got a shot of test + exercise gained 12kg on average

    these gains are not all that surprising since steroids were designed to help people with muscle wasting diseases to gain weight

    anadrol 50 is an extremely potent steroid used by hiv patients and its very effective in preventing them wasting away even when they dont exercise


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,863 ✭✭✭kevpants


    there's a big difference between a power lifter and a bodybuilder.

    There's also a pretty big difference between a bodybuilder who assimilates powerlifting principles into his training and one who doesn't. Usually 6 or 7 places.
    it doesn't matter what weight is on the bar once its improving your appearence

    Man you are actually the anti-kevpants. I imagine you as looking just like me but you have a moustache and if I'm wearing a blue t-shirt you're wearing a red one.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 21,981 ✭✭✭✭Hanley


    kevpants wrote: »
    There's also a pretty big difference between a bodybuilder who assimilates powerlifting principles into his training and one who doesn't. Usually 6 or 7 places.

    I lol'd. HARD.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,448 ✭✭✭Roper


    kevpants wrote: »
    Man you are actually the anti-kevpants. I imagine you as looking just like me but you have a moustache and if I'm wearing a blue t-shirt you're wearing a red one.
    Like the guy who drove KAR in Knight Rider? Or the twin when you played two player in Double Dragon?

    Y'know, I think about test abuse in the average 20 or 30 something and I think "you're a knob, get some willpower you pussy", But then again I think about me as a 70 year old man, getting the odd jab once a month, running up stairs, not taking a cart on the golf course, able to do the bold thing with the missus, or, as I've informed her, her 19 year old replacement. I'm doing it as soon as I hit 60. I can't wait.

    Thinking about taking roids to look good? Just get the pec and calf implants metrosexuals. They're permanent and you won't risk liver damage. Probably cheaper in the long run. Either that or just man up and do some harder, smarter training.


  • Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    So come on, someone fill me in, are steroids a way to cheat? If they just aid with recovery to allow people to train more, what's the issue?

    *I'm not trying to come across as pro-steroids. I'm just trying to understand it better. I've always been told these outlandish claims of people putting on so much kg of muscle with roids is BS and that hard work and good diet is no substitute.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,388 ✭✭✭delllat


    Roper wrote: »

    Thinking about taking roids to look good? Just get the pec and calf implants metrosexuals. They're permanent and you won't risk liver damage. Probably cheaper in the long run. Either that or just man up and do some harder, smarter training.

    not exactly natural though!

    injectable steroids cause minimal to no liver damage

    at least if you use a bit of test the muscles u grow will be a part of your body and not made of plastic or silicon


  • Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Do steroids primarily increase strength or just create muscular hypertrophy?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,388 ✭✭✭delllat


    So come on, someone fill me in, are steroids a way to cheat? If they just aid with recovery to allow people to train more, what's the issue?

    *I'm not trying to come across as pro-steroids. I'm just trying to understand it better. I've always been told these outlandish claims of people putting on so much kg of muscle with roids is BS and that hard work and good diet is no substitute.

    when you say cheat how do you mean that?

    steroids will increase your body weight and lean muscle mass in a short period of time

    thats a fact

    theres a myriad of bs surrounding steriods but most of it is bs

    i am not a doctor but from what i have seen steroids can be used sparingly for incredible results by informed adults

    being used by idiot kids is another story alltogether

    someone asked is it possible to gain that much mass in 10 weeks

    to answer that yes its very possible but only if there is a surplus of calories+nutrients +adequate stimulation+rest

    I have witnessed similar gains but they were by knowledgeable people

    Side effects are minimal to non-existant if steroids are used responsibly

    Im my opinion they should not be used before the age of 21 since they can prevent you growing taller

    although no amount of steroids will make up for bad nutrition (a lotta people arent eating enough to gain and instead of fixing this problem they decide to increase the dose of steroids-this is what brings the crazy side effcets and health problems )


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 21,981 ✭✭✭✭Hanley


    delllat wrote: »
    Im my opinion they should not be used before the age of 21 since they can prevent you growing taller

    Don;t men keep growing til their 23-25 tho??

    I've never heard that being said about steroids. Got any back up?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,297 ✭✭✭Reyman


    Hanley wrote: »

    I've never heard that being said about steroids. Got any back up?

    Steroids are supposed to 'fuse' your growth plates. It's mentioned here:
    http://www.steroidology.com/forum/anabolic-steroid-forum/21756-steroids-height.html


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,448 ✭✭✭Roper


    delllat wrote: »
    not exactly natural though!

    injectable steroids cause minimal to no liver damage

    at least if you use a bit of test the muscles u grow will be a part of your body and not made of plastic or silicon

    If someone is ****tardy, vain and lazy enough to use steroids because they want to look a bit better for the ladeez/mirror then I don't think they can be trusted with a sharp object like a syringe. They should be kept on the top shelf out of reach or perhaps hidden in a book where they definitely won't be found.

    As I've said before, I have a degree of sympathy for a guy .005 seconds off an Olympic qualifying time, who has one last shot at reaching the games and decides a ped is the answer, and of course they're used to great effect with sick people (HIV, burns etc.). But everything, EVERYTHING, has side effects and risks. Taking test in younger life slows down your own test production for example, so where does it end? You gonna be sticking a needle in your arse for the rest of your life?

    Steroids aren't the devil. But the way some of the pro-steroids camp portray Life on Roids you'd swear it was all rosy in the garden, little injecting parties with frosted syringes and doylies and tea for afterwards and most importantly no come uppance.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,057 ✭✭✭amazingemmet


    Reyman wrote: »
    Steroids are supposed to 'fuse' your growth plates. It's mentioned here:
    http://www.steroidology.com/forum/anabolic-steroid-forum/21756-steroids-height.html

    Its actually estrogen which fuses the growth plates, which is why non-aromatising, don't convert to estrogen, are ok to use in children


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik


    Roper wrote: »
    Steroids aren't the devil. But the way some of the pro-steroids camp portray Life on Roids you'd swear it was all rosy in the garden, little injecting parties with frosted syringes and doylies and tea for afterwards and most importantly no come uppance.

    steroids arent the devil
    although they have an unfairly bad image for the amount of people who have actually died or been harmed with them

    nobody is saying they dont need to be treated with respect but lots of things are dangerous and we have no problems letting idiots make up their minds to use them or not

    fine examples are
    alcohol
    cigarettes
    diet pills
    stimulants
    pain killers
    anti-depressants
    valium
    sleeping tablets
    hash
    excstacy
    gambling

    all these things are either legal or so widely and easily available they may as well be legal
    I think they are equally or more dangerous than steroids
    most easy to get,a google search will bring up maybe 50,000 places to buy without a prescription or id


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,270 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    madmik wrote: »
    steroids arent the devil
    although they have an unfairly bad image for the amount of people who have actually died or been harmed with them

    nobody is saying they dont need to be treated with respect but lots of things are dangerous and we have no problems letting idiots make up their minds to use them or not

    fine examples are
    alcohol
    cigarettes
    diet pills
    stimulants
    pain killers
    anti-depressants
    valium
    sleeping tablets
    hash
    excstacy
    gambling

    all these things are either legal or so widely and easily available they may as well be legal
    I think they are equally or more dangerous than steroids
    most easy to get,a google search will bring up maybe 50,000 places to buy without a prescription or id

    I want to go to the same parties you do if all of your list is easily available

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik


    I want to go to the same parties you do if all of your list is easily available

    do u live in a cave or something?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,448 ✭✭✭Roper


    From your list:

    alcohol- legal, regulated, and restricted to over 18s
    cigarettes- legal, regulated, and restricted to over 18s
    diet pills- legal
    stimulants- legal and only available by prescription
    pain killers- legal and many only available by prescription
    anti-depressants- legal and only available by prescription
    valium- legal and only available by prescription
    sleeping tablets- legal and only available by prescription
    hash- illegal and not all that widely available
    excstacy- illegal and not widely available
    gambling - Legal
    madmik wrote:
    I think they are equally or more dangerous than steroids
    Ridiculous. I mean, you may have a point regarding their danger as compared to excessive alcohol or cigarettes, but to imply that somehow a totally unregulated drug industry is the equivalent of say, sleeping pills or anti-depressants is just plain silly.

    Do you use steroids? I'm not trying to call you out but let's face it, it's a valid question because to be frank, your pro-roids arguments are pretty weak.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik


    I have never used a steroid in my life

    just the amount of bs surrounding them is incredible


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,270 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    madmik wrote: »
    do u live in a cave or something?

    No, I don't. I just know I would have a hard time getting my hands on most of the drugs you listed. Some I could get a doctor to prescribe me I suppose, but others are illegal and I would say very difficult to come by.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,397 ✭✭✭✭Degsy


    I wonder would a doctor prescribe you roids,test for example if you went to him and said "I'm gonna either buy them on the black market or you can give them to me legally"....


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik


    a google search will bring up everything listed and more

    i assume u have google?


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,270 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    madmik wrote: »
    a google search will bring up everything listed and more

    i assume u have google?


    I know this is nit picking, but Google me up some ecstasy or hash. I can't do it.

    I can't see what your point is by the way.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,032 ✭✭✭dave80


    Degsy wrote: »
    I wonder would a doctor prescribe you roids,test for example if you went to him and said "I'm gonna either buy them on the black market or you can give them to me legally"....


    only if your test levels where below normal levels (HRT), and the amount he'd give you would be small


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 773 ✭✭✭#Smokey#


    Degsy wrote: »
    I wonder would a doctor prescribe you roids,test for example if you went to him and said "I'm gonna either buy them on the black market or you can give them to me legally"....

    TRT is the way doctors prescribe it as far as i know but that's mainly for guys over 40 or those who had legitimate problems with testosterone production be it steroid shut down or natural hypogonadism(sp?).

    As for how widespread steroids use is i can say westpoint in blanch has a good few users on steroids.There's no stigma attached to doing them in there its seen as a part of training.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭madmik


    I know this is nit picking, but Google me up some ecstasy or hash. I can't do it.

    I can't see what your point is by the way.

    your right ,this is knit picking but here u go

    http://onlinecoffeeshop247.com/

    im not posting again on this thread

    people feel so strongly about it its getting out of control

    it started as a question about steroid use but has turned in to thw whole right or wrong debate which i didnt want


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,306 ✭✭✭Zamboni


    #Smokey# wrote: »
    As for how widespread steroids use is i can say westpoint in blanch has a good few users on steroids.There's no stigma attached to doing them in there its seen as a part of training.

    Really? I'm there quite a lot and never noticed.
    I suppose I am just oblivious to this stuff.
    Now that I am thinking about it though, I think if steroid use was prevalent in a gym it would put me off going there at all.


  • Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    It's very hard to get straight answers in a thread on steroids. Is that because hardly anyone knows a lot about them?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,306 ✭✭✭Zamboni


    It's very hard to get straight answers in a thread on steroids. Is that because hardly anyone knows a lot about them?

    In fairness, the only people who should know a lot about them are trained medical professionals.
    Not the average poster on a fitness forum.


  • Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    That's true and what I believe, but with it being so common nowadays, I thought there would be lads who would be able to give me a medical lesson on Roids better than any doctor ever could. :)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,819 ✭✭✭✭g'em


    I thought there would be lads who would be able to give me a medical lesson on Roids better than any doctor ever could. :)
    You won't find those guys on this board - they're out there, but boards.ie would be a little... soft for their needs.

    Medical professionals can be surprisingly ignorant about these issues too and it was only a few weeks ago that a Dr. told my bf to be careful, that all his muscle mass would turn to fat as he got older and he might want to ease up on the training. As for steroid use, the general consensus among users I know would be that GPs know very little (and don't want to). There's a few clued in doctors out there, but they're far and few between.


  • Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    g'em wrote: »
    You won't find those guys on this board - they're out there, but boards.ie would be a little... soft for their needs.

    Medical professionals can be surprisingly ignorant about these issues too and it was only a few weeks ago that a Dr. told my bf to be careful, that all his muscle mass would turn to fat as he got older and he might want to ease up on the training. As for steroid use, the general consensus among users I know would be that GPs know very little (and don't want to). There's a few clued in doctors out there, but they're far and few between.

    That's insane about the doctor telling your BF that. That is the most basic myth in fitness. Any medical professional should know that but then again, I have seen so many doctors and nutritionists (and physios and other therapists etc) who would (should) know exactly how to eat well and they are overweight and ( I assume ) don't exercise or look after their cholesterol levels judging by their belly!!!

    Doctors fix people, strength and conditioning coaches teach you how to squat. :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,306 ✭✭✭Zamboni


    g'em wrote: »
    Medical professionals can be surprisingly ignorant about these issues too and it was only a few weeks ago that a Dr. told my bf to be careful, that all his muscle mass would turn to fat as he got older and he might want to ease up on the training. As for steroid use, the general consensus among users I know would be that GPs know very little (and don't want to). There's a few clued in doctors out there, but they're far and few between.

    Again, in fairness, a GP is exactly that, a GP. Limted knowledge on a lot of subjects rather than lots of knowledge on limited subjects.
    They should have no need to specialise in steroid use outside of the ability to refer someone to a specialist should they think it is required.


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