It turns out Nissans claim that the GTr is faster than the Porsche GT2 is rubbish

samsemtex

Drivers republic did a very comprehensive test of which car is actually faster. Porsche claimed their driver couldnt get it close to what Nissan claim in standard spec. And this test would appear to back that up that the GTR is indeed nowhere near as close in performance to the GT2 as they claim.

http://magazines.drivers-republic.com/driversrepublic/thetruth030/

The article does go to great lengths though to state that it is only faster around the nurburgring and are not claiming it will always be the case in all conditions. But Nissan did make the claim about the 'Ring track times so this seems pretty fair to me.

LolaDub

The GTR is animal, who cares about porsches pms with nissan or visa versa

samsemtex

LolaDub wrote: »

The GTR is animal, who cares about porsches pms with nissan or visa versa

They are making untrue claims about their product with the aim of diminishing Porsches reputation by making specific reference to its ability. I think Porsche care about it and with good reason really.

unkel

Interesting article. I'm still a lot more surprised that Porsche actually went out and called Nissan a liar in public than the latter actually being found out

Wishbone Ash

How many GTR's are there in the country? I've heard that there are only 3 but I find it difficult to believe.

LolaDub

LolaDub wrote: »

The GTR is animal, who cares about porsches pms with nissan or visa versa

+1

The GT-R is a brilliant machine and I wouldnt say for sure that Nissan's claims are false. No doubt Nissan will make another attempt and show if it can do the time. Either way I would have the GT-R any day before the Porsche even if the prices were closer but the Porsche is about 70k more. Nissan's original aim was to be faster than the 911 turbo which it is and even if its only nearly as fast as the GT2 its still some achievement by Nissan imo.

unkel

Frances Kind Salsa wrote: »

its still some achievement by Nissan imo.

Agreed!

CyberGhost

From what I recall, didn't Nissan make claims that GT-R is faster than a 997 Turbo? I haven't heard of GT2 claims.

Anyways, here's a nice vid of GT-R vs GT2 vs ZR1 vs 599 drag race, GT2 is indeed faster.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZlGMX8G3B4


I don't care though, GT2 is not THAT fast, and it's like 70k more expansive, if I was rich but not a billionaire, I'd get a GT-R.

Mr.David

Nah....the GT-R is amazing dont get me wrong but its soul-less. It just doesnt feel special.

Id have an Alfa 8C :cool:

Plug

Jesus nissan carrying on like that, clowns. Delighted the porsche went faster.

oh guess what BMW lovers....... The M3CSL is faster than the GTR, it got a 7.50.

AugustusMaximus

I get the feeling there's a lot of crap being talked about in regards to the GT-R's speed.

Its one ugly car too IMO.

Mr.David

Plug wrote: »

Jesus nissan carrying on like that, clowns. Delighted the porsche went faster.

oh guess what BMW lovers....... The M3CSL is faster than the GTR, it got a 7.50.

That the E46 CSL? Or have i wrongly thought that there will be no E90 CSL?

Blitzkrieger

Wasn't there a video of the GT-R lap? Nissan are claiming that the Porsche driver needs more training. Porsche are claiming Nissan used racing slick tyres. Who gives a....

In the real world, the average driver will get more out of the Nissan for a lot less money. There's also a lighter, faster V-Spec GT-R on the way.

Biro

The GTR is an animal. The GT2 is an animal. Lets just be thankful that we have plenty of savage cars around to argue over for the next few years!
If I had the choice, I'd have both. The Nissan for it's ability and the Porsche for it's crisp turn-in and somehow unbalanced balance! And a 599 cause neither countries can make a supercar quite like the Italians can!

Yakult

Blitzkrieger wrote: »

In the real world, the average driver will get more out of the Nissan for a lot less money. There's also a lighter, faster V-Spec GT-R on the way.

+1

But I would say the average driver would end up writing it off too

samsemtex

R_H_C_P wrote: »

+1

But I would say the average driver would end up writing it off too

According to the review it was the GT2 that is easier to push and feel comfortable on the limit.

LIGHTNING

LIGHTNING wrote: »

apparently using launch control voids the cars warranty. Its supposed to be in the small print in the manual, which in my view is silly if you advertise a car which does 0-60 in a certain time and the only way to get this time is to void the warranty.

I doubt very much if they would get away with that when its not an after market modification.

Rowley Birkin QC

Good article, cheers OP.

samsemtex

LIGHTNING wrote: »

No I kid you not, Ill find the link and post it. Two or three lads have been given a bill for 20k to fix the sequental box. Its written in small print in the users manual.

Ive read that too. Pretty shocking stuff really. You cant claim a 0-60 time if it basically equates to the same thing as an after market modification that isnt covered by warranty. Apparantly the launch control is very brittle as well although im sure it does get abused.

Biro

samsemtex wrote: »

Ive read that too. Pretty shocking stuff really. You cant claim a 0-60 time if it basically equates to the same thing as an after market modification that isnt covered by warranty. Apparantly the launch control is very brittle as well although im sure it does get abused.

Well, it's like saying a max speed. But if you buy a brand new fiesta tomorrow and take it around the millbrook banked track at it's top speed, it's very doubtful it'll last for the 60,000 mile warranty!

samsemtex

Biro wrote: »

Well, it's like saying a max speed. But if you buy a brand new fiesta tomorrow and take it around the millbrook banked track at it's top speed, it's very doubtful it'll last for the 60,000 mile warranty!

Yes, but that would amount to unreasonable use of the vehicle and would fall outside the terms of the warranty. The Fiesta isnt billed as the ultimate high speed cruising machine. Using the launch control on a car that is basing its name almost exclusively on its phenomenal performance figures should not fall outside of its warranty. Ive read reports of it failing after only a handful of uses.

unkel

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Its supposed to be in the small print in the manual, which in my view is silly if you advertise a car which does 0-60 in a certain time and the only way to get this time is to void the warranty.

That is shocking. It would be great if you could dig up that link, LIGHTNING

Biro

samsemtex wrote: »

Yes, but that would amount to unreasonable use of the vehicle and would fall outside the terms of the warranty. The Fiesta isnt billed as the ultimate high speed cruising machine. Using the launch control on a car that is basing its name almost exclusively on its phenomenal performance figures should not fall outside of its warranty. Ive read reports of it failing after only a handful of uses.

I know what you're saying alright, but even the Enzo has only 4 maximum ability standing starts before it needs a full gearbox service, or something like that, doesn't it?
At the end of the day moving a 1.7 ton car from rest to 60 in 4 seconds is physically phenominally demanding, and though the car can do it, actually loading the gearbox that much would go a long way to helping destroy it.
I suppose you'd think it would take up to 50, but still - 0-60 driving is typically only used for hooliganism. A rolling start from around 20mph would eliminate a massive proportion of the load on the gearbox while being equally as demonstrative of the cars ability.

towel401

wait isn't the GTR the one with the silly GPS-based speed limiter?

Biro

towel401 wrote: »

wait isn't the GTR the one with the silly GPS-based speed limiter?

Jap spec ones so far. What's your point?

unkel

Biro wrote: »

even the Enzo has only 4 maximum ability standing starts before it needs a full gearbox service, or something like that, doesn't it?

That's pathetic. I bet no Porsche has issues like that. Hell, I bet even a Veyron doesn't have this problem and they eat Enzos for breakfast (and GT-Rs as light snacks)

towel401

Biro wrote: »

Jap spec ones so far. What's your point?

so ones in the civilised world don't have any?

Biro

towel401 wrote: »

so ones in the civilised world don't have any?

We won't know that till there's a UK spec one. Late next year I think. Doubtful. In Japan they've been regulating their performance cars to 180kph for years.

Biro

unkel wrote: »

That's pathetic. I bet no Porsche has issues like that. Hell, I bet even a Veyron doesn't have this problem and they eat Enzos for breakfast (and GT-Rs as light snacks)

Don't know, but who's willing to try it to their brand new turbo?

unkel

Biro wrote: »

In Japan they've been regulating their performance cars to 180kph for years.

Yeah that's what I remember as well. This limit obviously applies only in the JDM. Even if the car is shipped with the limiter in situ, I'm sure the distributor will have them removed before the car hits the dealer in other countries

Biro wrote: »

who's willing to try it to their brand new turbo?

If I was after buying a brand new supercar, I'd sure want to use it to its full potential. If the car can't handle being driven from 0-100km/h in the time specified by the manufacturer, the sales contract is void imo and the car can be returned to the vendor for a full refund

cashmni1

unkel wrote: »

Yeah that's what I remember as well. This limit obviously applies only in the JDM. Even if the car is shipped with the limiter in situ, I'm sure the distributor will have them removed before the car hits the dealer in other countries



If I was after buying a brand new supercar, I'd sure want to use it to its full potential. If the car can't handle being driven from 0-100km/h in the time specified by the manufacturer, the sales contract is void imo and the car can be returned to the vendor for a full refund

Yip, get her on the rolling road. If I pay the bucks, I want to see results !!
BHP on a cert please!
Too right, when you purchase a "record breaking" exotic sports car.

Well a friend of mine has a 200sx with a confirmed 340bhp and 430nm of torque and I have done more than 10 5.5ish seconds 0-60's in it never mind him and its his daily drive so I can see why a car designed from day one to be less than 2 seconds faster to 60 cannot handle the power! I for 1 doubt very much that the GT-R is that delicate especially when it appears in UK spec with a proper European warranty which will no doubt cover the gear box despite use of the launch control.

samsemtex

Frances Kind Salsa wrote: »

Well a friend of mine has a 200sx with a confirmed 340bhp and 430nm of torque and I have done more than 10 5.5ish seconds 0-60's in it never mind him and its his daily drive so I can see why a car designed from day one to be less than 2 seconds faster to 60 cannot handle the power! I for 1 doubt very much that the GT-R is that delicate especially when it appears in UK spec with a proper European warranty which will no doubt cover the gear box despite use of the launch control.

you obviously have very little understanding of what it takes to make a car go that fast. 3.5 seconds to 60 was unheard of by any car other than the McLaren F1/kit cars 10 years ago. there is huge stress on a transmission to put that kind of power down.

Plug

Its the E46 with 360hp. There isn't an E92 CSL yet but it has been spied at the ring.

samsemtex

samsemtex wrote: »

you obviously have very little understanding of what it takes to make a car go that fast. 3.5 seconds to 60 was unheard of by any car other than the McLaren F1/kit cars 10 years ago. there is huge stress on a transmission to put that kind of power down.

I know very well how hard it is on the clutch and gearbox getting big power to the wheels but no matter how hard it is its possible to do so with modern clutch and gearbox configurations without eating them. The point I was making is if an almost 10 year old car can put 340bhp to the wheels with an after market clutch and a standard gear box(designed for 200 bhp) then Nissan with the massive investment which they no doubt have put into the car have managed to come up with a system capable of doing what its supposed to with out falling apart.

I do understand how much more difficult it is getting 3.5sec to 60 rather than say 5+ seconds but thats where new developments, investment and very strong(and expensive) materials come in.