[Article]3 preferred over eircom for broadband plan

mike65

from www.rte.ie/news

Communications Minister Eamon Ryan has announced that mobile company 3 has been selected as the preferred tenderer for the National Broadband Scheme.

The scheme is aimed at delivering broadband to those areas of the country currently unserved. 3 was up against Eircom for the contract.

The Department of Communications says that work will be finalised on the contract in the coming weeks, with a final announcement expected next month.
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'It is imperative that we have universal broadband coverage in Ireland, for foreign investment, for competitiveness and for our own businesses and householders,' said Minister Ryan.

The department estimates that about 10% of the country remains without a broadband service. It says the scheme, which involves a Government subsidy, will ensure that all reasonable requests for broadband in these areas are met.

3, owned by conglomerate Hutchison Whampoa, launched on the Irish market in 2005. It operates one of Ireland's 3G mobile phone licences under the 3 brand and has 300,000 customers, including 105,000 mobile broadband users.

Eircom said it was 'extremely disappointed' not to be awarded the contract, but remained committed to delivering broadband to as many parts of the country as possible. It said it would continue to support the Government in whatever way it could to deliver broadband

Good, bad or indifferent?

Mike

barnicles

Absolutly total bullsh*t

faoile@n

Absolutely ridiculous :eek:

Eamon Ryan should be banned from this forum.

Edit: It might not be such a bad thing that Eircom didn't get it but 3 ffs.

AlmightyCushion

Complete and utter joke. I can't believe the goverment are going to be subsidising 3 for this shoddy "broadband" service.

mike76

http://m.cnet.com.au/broadband/339287846.htm

In Oz a crowd of micky mouse operators got it, couldn't do it and the new govt took it away;

When it happens here all of the top Com reg and dept guys have to go

For the love of god just look at the megathread you moron ryan - they can't provide a decent service in balbriggan, never mind bohola!

Danno

Three is NOT broadband. IDSN is just as fast. Thank God I have choice of DSL and FWA. Pity the poor hoors that will only get this glorified ISDN service. I feel sorry for you as I am only 3 years old in the broadband way of life. Rural Ireland has truely died a death today.

Cabaal

I'm actually shocked at this, given that Eamon is actually registered on boards.ie and has actually posted on the broadband forum I find it shocking that he allowed this to be awarded to Three over eircom or anyone else given the sheer bad service three have been showen to offer to many of its users.

In addition to this Three Mobile Broadband is NOT proper Broadband and is totally unsuitable for such uses as on-line gaming and VoIP which is what makes Broadband so much fun and makes it useable in both a home and business enviroment (VoIP, video chats, conferencing etc)

Given that Eamon has so nicely posted on this forum in the past looking for views on Next Gen Broadband I'd suggest some people might want to drop him a kinda e-mail about there views on the outcome of this, his details are here - http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57361539&postcount=1

I would remind everyone to remain civil however when dealing with Eamon or anyone else on this board, while I can understand that the inability to get Broadband can be VERY frustrating it helps nobody if you get irate with people, remain civil and use a logical argument

Given Eircom's history I would be curious if they'll somehow appeal this, as much as I personally dislike Eircom as a company (history of problems getting DSL/PSTN lines installed on 4 different occasions over the years) I would rather the people of Ireland get Broadband via dsl then "mobile broadband" for the reasons outlined above and as discussed in so many other threads here on the Broadband froum,.

Finally I remind everyone that general boards rules apply here, Eamon is a user on boards and atleast he took the time to post here I don;'t want to see people slinging personal abuse at him, you can still obviously dislike whats happened

mike76

enough lets be nice just cause he posts here....this is a TERRIBLE and APPALLING Decision,

if it was mobile bb by O2 or Vodafone i might understand but 3 Ireland?!?!?!

It's like awarding the contract for Metro North to O'Casey "No job too big or small" Construction Drumcondra.

PogMoThoin

Eamon Ryan............I'm awaiting your resignation

The people of Ireland need REAL broadband

watty

No HSDPA service can ever be Broadband.

Now we know the 8% max Sat users is CAP to limit costs. They'll be the ones with a better service, fixed 800ms latency and always connected, vs maybe connect and 120ms to 2000ms variable latency and possibly worse speed.

Nick_oliveri

"With this small piece of hardware you can get connected to a crap network, and if that crap network doesn't have a good signal it will automatically switch over to the many inferior sub networks that can be sometimes compared to 56k and yes my friends, we shall call it broadband!"

GWAN IRELAND!!!

thebman

Words cannot express my disappointment at this decision. It actually blows my mind that the government could award this to 3.

I will never be voting for the greens or FF after this much delayed NBS project that has proven to be seen as a joke by these political parties.

Our man in Havana

Jesus wept upon hearing the news.

long_b

I'm disgusted and very sickened by this decision.
I can't understand such a dreadful choice.
I would rather do without than to think that 3 will be being paid my hard earned tax money to deliver a woegeous service.

it's been all over the media -even the dog on the street can tell you how bad 3's service is.

Absolutely inept.

barnicles

brim4brim wrote: »

Words cannot express my disappointment at this decision. It actually blows my mind that the government could award this to 3.

I will never be voting for the greens or FF after this much delayed NBS project that has proven to be seen as a joke by these political parties.

Right, when are we going on Joe Duffy.:)
No, seriously this is one of the funniest jokes i've ever heard.

Kinetic^

O M F G!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Minister Ryan, GTFO!

barnicles

faoile@n wrote: »

Eamon Ryan should be banned from this forum.

He should be banned from this country and planet. He'd be shot If i had my way. I'm currently typing this on a mobile as I've no proper bb connection and dialup is just too slow.
Rant continuing in background.

barnicles

Get your angry mob supplies and take them over here!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/member.php?u=182424

PogMoThoin

barnicles wrote: »

Get your angry mob supplies and take them over here!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/member.php?u=182424

Dne

projectmayhem

This country never ceases to amaze me. If Ryan ever used a phone on 3 he'd realise they can't get their own network in order, let alone provide a broadband service to people around the country.

I'm no advocate of Eircom's, but they'd do a better job then the "dead horse" of the Irish mobiles market.

MunsterCycling

Maybe its time to help complete this so the NBS isn't left ot he idi0ts in 3

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055427255

long_b

Dear Minister Ryan,

I was extremely saddened to hear that you have awarded the contract for the NBS to Hutchison 3G.

As one of the many people who live outside the major towns I was forced to use their service when it was launched.

In my experience I have found that their service deteriorated to below dial up speeds in my area due to overloading of their network.

Despite criticism in the media and thousands of posts on forums 3 continue to make false claims as to the quality of their coverage and service and continue to show contempt for their Irish users.

I find it very hard to believe that you would choose to invest taxpayer's money with a company with 3's track record in Ireland, given that you yourself have posted on the boards.ie forum where the extent of the problem with their service came to light.

I urge you to reconsider your decision - if there is no viable alternative please consider funding the Irish owned and operated FWA operators.

At least we can let him know that we know that he's made a big mistake.

PogMoThoin

I posted my discust on Eamon Ryans profile, its been removed and I have recieved an infraction :mad:

barnicles

PogMoThoin wrote: »

I posted my discust on Eamon Ryans profile, its been removed and I have recieved an infraction :mad:

Same here:mad:
Drop your pitchforks and run!:)

Sully

Maybe this is a big joke? Maybe FF and the Greens will turn around over the next few days and say "Ha, lads did you HONESTLY think we would get these guys to do it?! We may have made poor decissions with the budget but we aint going to make the mistakes with the National Broadband Scheme! God lads, cant believe ye felt for it!".

If not... I am shocked and appaled at this most god awful decission. Was it all politics Eamonn came here looking for our opinion? Whatever respect I had for this shower has now gone down a lot further since hearing that 3 - a provider who is struggling offering decent service as it is according to reports online - has been given the go ahead.

Skatedude

I cannot possibly imagine what prompted his decision to offer the contract to 3, They are probably the worst posssible company to do this, the service they provide simply isnt broadband, no matter how much they like to think so.

However i do believe i know how they got the contract, he was giving a list of of possibles and picked 3 because the list was alphabetical, we could have had o2 excpet they used o instead of zero when typing it.

Mind you, i bet 3 said they could do it a lot cheaper then eircom,even if it dosent work

jor el

This is some sort of sick joke, right? I mean, as utterly inept as Ryan has proved himself to be, time and again, I refuse to believe that a man who can make it to the position that he has, can't even read. I knew he was obsessed with 3G mobile "broadband" as he has constantly referred to it as the way forward, and future of broadband in Ireland, but it has been pointed out to him numerous times that it just simply isn't a feasible solution.

I'm off to email him now, not that he actually reads them. He probably gets his internet access from 3, so hasn't received an email in the last two years. minister@dcmnr.gov.ie is one address you can use.

bealtine

Skatedude wrote: »

Mind you, i bet 3 said they could do it a lot cheaper then eircom,even if it dosent work

And there you have it..."doesn't work". I wonder will they enforce minimum requirements and what penalties will follow for non performance?

The DCENR says :
"The final product that consumers will receive from the NBS will be an always on service of at least 1Mbit/s down and 128kbits/s up. The minimum download capacity per connection will be 10 gigabits per month and the service must support Virtual Private Networks (VPN) for businesses and VoIP applications and devices for home business purposes. Latency must be sufficient in order to allow standard applications such as VoIP and online gaming to be run"

Will this be guaranteed for every single consumer that tries to connect?

I wonder if 3 can possibly deliver anything remotely like this based on the current capabilities of HSDPA, only time will tell.

watty

But if you accept it as broadband it makes our penetration figures look good and any real broadband is much more expensive. There isn't any NBS money for a real rollout.

HSDPA inherently can't deliver. It's not "3"s fault.

Skatedude

bealtine wrote: »

The DCENR says :
"The final product that consumers will receive from the NBS will be an always on service of at least 1Mbit/s down and 128kbits/s up. The minimum download capacity per connection will be 10 gigabits per month and the service must support Virtual Private Networks (VPN) for businesses and VoIP applications and devices for home business purposes. Latency must be sufficient in order to allow standard applications such as VoIP and online gaming to be run"

Will this be guaranteed for every single consumer that tries to connect?

I wonder if 3 can possibly deliver anything remotely like this based on the current capabilities of HSDPA, only time will tell.

10 gigabit cap? so 1.25 gigabytes? actually, if 3 are involved, then i doubt you will be able to reach that cap

97i9y3941

its the usual ****e lads unfortantly,pass the buck to someone else,probably same reason we dont have speed cameras in this country

Cabaal

PogMoThoin wrote: »

I posted my discust on Eamon Ryans profile, its been removed and I have recieved an infraction :mad:

As I have advised already, Eamon is still a user on boards and personal abuse is against boards rules, you can express dissatisfaction but calling names doesn't help anyone!

This is my second warning to anybody else that feels personal abuse is needed

Cabaal,

Onikage

watty wrote: »

But if you accept it as broadband it makes our penetration figures look good and any real broadband is much more expensive. There isn't any NBS money for a real rollout.

HSDPA inherently can't deliver. It's not "3"s fault.

Ok, now we're getting somewhere. You can deliver HSDPA to 98% of the country for less money than any other technology. Hurray! Targets achieved! Nevermind the fact that's it's not a patch on 512k DSL! So even if I don't like it, I can understand HSPDA being selected.

But 3? 3? They've been deservedly dragged through the mud online, on the radio, in the papers... and they're not even the cheapest anymore? Why compound an unsuitable technology with an unsuitable provider?

Cabaal

Onikage wrote: »

But 3? 3? They've been deservedly dragged through the mud online, on the radio, in the papers... and they're not even the cheapest anymore? Why compound an unsuitable technology with an unsuitable provider?

Perhaps because they offered to do the job at the cheapest price (when compared to Eircom)

Onikage

Cabaal wrote: »

Perhaps because they offered to do the job at the cheapest price (when compared to Eircom)

Ah, the basis of all good government decisions.

Sam Vimes

i don't know where to begin with this one but let's try anyway.

I don't see how eamonn could have considered anything in his decision besides the broadband penetration figures and the cost.

A well run HSDPA network would be completely unsuitable as a national broadband provider and 3 compound the problems inherent in HSDPA with their own stupidity. One simple example would be the sharing of a few ip addresses. 3 customers often find they can't access major sites such as google because their ip has been blocked

And not only have they introduced many unnecessary technical problems due to incompetence and penny pinching, they have the worst customer care i have ever encountered, who will never acknowledge that there might be a problem on their end and will blame every single problem on the customer's modem or computer.

I could provide a better broadband service through the use of cups and string

Anti

No words needed for this retarded decission.

Falconire

:mad:I have just read about Minister Eammon Ryan's crazy decision to pick 3Ireland as the preferred provider for the National Broadband Scheme:mad:.

How could he make such a stupid decision especial as he is a user on Boards so he has no excuse for not having the facts about 3Ireland's very poor service.

I have to use 3 on my laptop for work but it is not a proper broadband replacement for use in an office or home as you can use Viop and other services. It is only usable for getting e-mails very slowly usually at dialup speeds I have just read about Minister Eammon Ryan crazy decision to pick 3Ireland as the preferred provider for the National Broadband Scheme.

How could he make such a stupid decision especial as he is a user on Boards, he has no excuse for not having the facts about 3Ireland's very poor service

watty

Onikage wrote: »

But 3? 3? They've been deservedly dragged through the mud online, on the radio, in the papers... and they're not even the cheapest anymore? Why compound an unsuitable technology with an unsuitable provider?

Because only "3" and eircom tendered.

They can't choose people that didn't enter or withdrew.

Sam Vimes

i just thought of a benefit of my cup and string plan over 3: it won't stop working in the rain :rolleyes:

Nick_oliveri

Yall seem to think that he could be arsed reading through the megathread when he originally only posted to get seats for an event and has two posts.

Last Activity: 10-11-2008 16:44

Lad probably doesnt even remember his logon details.

godskitchen

This is bad for everyone, not just the poor people that cant get Broadband right now.

It is bad because with Three, there will be no competition. HSDPA is not broadband and will never be able to compete with DSL/Cable/FWA. It is just going to be for the people that can get nothing at the moment and they will be told "Ah sure whats the problem, we have got ye broadband now havnt we, we did our best".

What I cant understand is how they came to this decision, echoing the thoughts of other users on this forum, how is Mr Ryan not aware of the problems with Three.........

I wonder if this can be challenged on the grounds that HSDPA is not classed as broadband by the EU? Unless you have a fixed antenna if I recall correctly?

Broadband is a major utility, and it needs to be seen that way. I can not believe we are in 2008 and some of us still have to explain why Broadband is so important to future growth and prosperity of this country.

Can you imagine when rural electrification happened in this country, if they let someone who had once wired a plug take the contract.......thats what has happened here with Three. True broadband coverage is just as important, in the context of the 21st century.

If there were no other tenders for the contract Mr Ryan, then have the balls to come out and say you are not happy to go ahead, tell the public why you have stalled and that you will not be going ahead until it is the best possible use of Irish tax payers money.

What you have done here is reward a company that have, without exaggerating, lied to its Irish customers over and over again. Provided a service that would not be acceptable in a third world country. Given customer service so bad it has taken years of peoples lives.

I expect we will be in buzz word city over the coming weeks, as people pat each other on the back for a job well done. I for one will be telling everyone I know of what a bad job is being done, as I am sure the rest of boards.ie will.

Our man in Havana

I am currently not in coverage according to the big map. I used to have 3 and had to get rid of it as it was totally unusable. I am currently on a EDGE 256kb/s connection. I do not want 3 under any circumstances.

The future is bleak tbh.

97i9y3941

i sympatise with alot of you there,live in rural ireland myself,was with eircom for years,but could never get broadband off them cause,well in their eyes there woundnt be a return in what they invest in,even do the village down the road had eircom bb,in the end,i was one of the lucky people,i could get digiweb bb,in end got rid of eircom so digiweb is my phone and bb provider now

adm

I was using three this past 2 weeks in dublin and frankly it is useless.
BUT ... I brought it down to my parents in Mayo and it worked inside. This is the first "Broadband" (not really of course) that they have ever been able to get down there and I have tried everything short of a satellite dish. I even tried three last xmas and it didn't work then.
Frankly they were delighted so i gave it to them and got a landline in my house.
My two weeks with three was hell but now at least my folks have something. I know this is not good enough but, honestly, something is better than nothing (thats a very Irish attitude I suppose!)

p.s. eircom are pure liquid evil.

97i9y3941

adm wrote: »

p.s. eircom are pure liquid evil.

so true,i often suggest to eircom,could they not give a flat rate to customers who can only get dial up,i know there are already packages that are offered by eircom but there is too much ifs and buts in the contract,i tried it before at time when was with them and the bill actually went up instead of down,but then its maybe the dial up people that are paying for the laying of the optic cables anyway

Onikage

watty wrote: »

Because only "3" and eircom tendered.

They can't choose people that didn't enter or withdrew.

From Basis:

Contracting Authorities

Contracting Authorities, in deciding which bid to accept, may do so on the basis of either

• the lowest price only

or

• the most economically advantageous tender (using various criteria such as price, period for completion, running costs, profitability, technical merit).

I'm no eircom lover but even I acknowledge the vast gulf in the quality of services the two companies can provide. At twice the cost of "3"s offering it would be a bargain.

On a side note, aren't the government obliged to get a minimum of three quotes for any purchase over €1500? :rolleyes: Guess it doesn't apply when you are flushing away huge chunks of money.

godskitchen

adm wrote: »

something is better than nothing (thats a very Irish attitude I suppose!)

p.s. eircom are pure liquid evil.

Yes something is better than nothing, the problem is there are other options available to the government that they have ignored......

Iago

Onikage wrote: »

On a side note, aren't the government obliged to get a minimum of three quotes for any purchase over €1500? :rolleyes: Guess it doesn't apply when you are flushing away huge chunks of money.

they did get 3 quotes, but BT subsequently pulled out of the process.

Praetorian

This is the best news ever. 3 are great. 3G is great & fast and super!

NOT

Iago

3 are a fantastic network, HSDPA will work smoothly and without issues for all customers lucky enough to have it. I myself have gamed online extensively with 3, while talking to my brother on VoIP and downloading movies with a premier league match streaming in the background.

We will soon be at the top of the European broadband charts with this incredible new service!