Send in the Clowns - BAC 10K Challenge

Krusty_Clown

BeepBeep67 wrote: »

We're in Shanganagh on Thurs @ 6:15 for a 10k trot with a few strides thrown in as the majority are running the BHAA, Ballycotton or Galbally at the WE - if it suits pop over.

Cheers. Will keep an ear out for ye. When's the half marathon?

BeepBeep67

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

When's the half marathon?

May 9th (Kildare), some days it seems very close, others it feels like it will never come

Krusty_Clown

BeepBeep67 wrote: »

May 9th (Kildare), some days it seems very close, others it feels like it will never come

I know how you feel. It's already beginning to bug me that I have to wait a few months before I can begin my next marathon training program!

Today: Superb run, o'er vales and hills. Recovery schedule called for 8 miles aerobic, which can only mean hills, right? I had planned to stick to the roads, but the weather was too nice, so as soon as I hit the first trail, my feet pointed uphill, and I stayed off-road for the next 5 or 6 miles, stopping only briefly to enjoy the views at the top of Carrigologan (my hill!) and the Scalp. With hills and trails like these, who needs intervals, tempo runs, weights or core exercises? It's all looked after, by the uphills, twisty trails and fun-packed leaping from rock to rock. Lots more of this please for the next few months. In an auspicious co-incidence, I also hit 500 miles for the year, on this, Ireland's most celebrated day. The trails are all very dry, so if it stays like this, it'll be running shoes instead of trail shoes for the WW Trail race on Saturday week.

Summary: 8.5 joyous miles, in 1:07 @7:59/mile.

donothoponpop

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Carrigologan (my hill!)

One of the benefits of hillrunning is the ownership of a scaled peak! Sounds like a great run, must try it some time- <tugs imaginary forelock> acceptin' yer lordships permission, that is:)

Krusty_Clown

As long as you're not a hill poacher <nestles imaginary shotgun under arm>, you're more than welcome. Give me some advance notice, and I'll show you around my estate. Have you done The Scalp race before? The scenery is definitely more impressive at a less frenetic pace.

Krusty_Clown

Tonight: decided to run tomorrow's run today, to see if I could catch-up with the Bray guys, and also take a day off tomorrow. Unfortunately, I left work way too late, and the Bray guys are all so fast, they had all but gone by the time I arrived.

So after a little warm-up, I hit the grass in Shangannagh, and ran nice and comfortably. Thankfully the shin didn't bother me too much today. I got my replacement heart rate monitor today too, and it's a lot more comfortable than the old design, but still suffers from the same HR spikes that plagued the old model. Only met one other runner, similarly decked out with head torch, but despite the usual warning coughs, I think I might have given him a fright as I ran past him. :eek:

Summary: 8 miles in 58 mins, @7:19/mile, HR=141

Krusty_Clown

Today: 5 mile recovery run. Bit of a hangover, so it wasn't the most pleasant of runs, but a 5 mile run in the sunshine with a cool breeze is one of the best cures. Time to start knuckling down for Connemara.

Summary: 5 miles in 38 mins, @7:22/mile

Krusty_Clown

Today: 14 miles with some nice uphills

A real wave of self mutilation today. I had left the car in Rathfarnam yesterday, so planned to run the 10+ miles to pick it up today. On the way I decided to take in some hills, including the climb up towards where Ticknock Forest begins. I was tired starting the run, and had a pretty good idea that I would be running out of energy pretty quickly, but decided to run lean anyway and face my demons. There's going to be some tough times in the ultra in a few weeks time, so I might as well start facing them now. By the time I got to the car, I was wiped out. Into the petrol station for a handful of junk, and everything was right with the world again.

Summary: 14 miles in 1:40, @7:08 min/mile, HR=145

T runner

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Today: 9 Miles, with 6.2 Mile tempo run
Taper time - A nice relaxing three week rest period full of tasty carbohydrates, in the lead up to a nice sun holiday. What could be better? Then....BAM.... Sucker punch.

A 10k time trial, where half way through, you just want to give up running. You just want to stop moving your feet and lie down in the shady grass for a while. You can taste the blood in your mouth, and feel the lactate leaking through your system, poisoning your mind and weakening your muscles. You've loosely planned a route, but you're not really going anywhere. What's the point? Stop..Give up. It's a meaningless run anyway. A race against no-one. Call it a Tempo run instead, and pull up after four miles. Nobody will know or care. Nearly at five miles. It would be a PB for five miles. I'll stop at 5. Even P&D would be happy with that. I'm running by the sea, the music's good, I'll struggle on for another bit. I wanna stop, I wanna stop, I wanna stop... Must keep going.. Struggle on. Beep.

It's a mental battle, not a physical one. Not an indicator of a potential 10k time, but instead, an indication of progress. A barometer to let you know that you're training has been of value. That you may be running faster, and you might be mentally stronger. It was a tough run before Berlin, and it was a tough run today. A net downhill run (30m) over a route that suited me (uphill start), so not a realistic 10k emulation, but 1:30 faster than when I covered a similar route before Berlin.

A two mile warm-down, an ice bath (like it's not cold enough outside!) to treat a sore right achilles and it's time to rest.

Summary: 9 Miles in 58 mins, @6:29, HR=162, (including 10k@ 5:55/mile, HR=169).

Hi Krusty

Im in the same boat as you were: Im following P and Ds taper and have no race to fill the 8-15k tune up race slot.
Your 10k time trial was all out effort. Im still unsure of my exact race pace. I know the race is for fitness but do you think its useful for predicting a marathon time?

Krusty_Clown

T runner wrote: »

Hi Krusty

Im in the same boat as you were: Im following P and Ds taper and have no race to fill the 8-15k tune up race slot.
Your 10k time trial was all out effort. Im still unsure of my exact race pace. I know the race is for fitness but do you think its useful for predicting a marathon time?

No, I don't think it's really useful at all for predicting a marathon time, but is really only useful as a confidence booster, particularly if (like me) the time you run is a good clip faster than a previous 10k race (suggesting you can run a marathon faster than a previous marathon). I knew my marathon pace before I started the training program. I had previously run 3:00, so set myself a target of 2:55, and trained to meet that goal. I do think I could've run faster in the marathon, but sure I wasn't to know that until near the end of the race, at which point it's too difficult to make any sizable difference.

The race/time trial is also handy, as you have to do a semi-long run (17-18 miles) the next day, on what should be sore and tired legs, which gives you the last physiological endurance kick. The handiest sessions for predicting marathon pace were the longs runs that I finished at PMP pace (which felt comfortable) and the sessions at half-marathon pace.

There's one last session, a 7 mile run with 2 miles at pmp (a couple of days before the race), and it's a last chance to see just how comfortable your planned race pace is (and you'll also be a couple of weeks into your taper). I found the two miles at pmp very comfortable, almost easy, and my HR stayed around 144. Sorry for the very long answer to a short question (It's Sunday night and there's feic all on tv!).

Sosa

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

No, I don't think it's really useful at all for predicting a marathon time, but is really only useful as a confidence booster, particularly if (like me) the time you run is a good clip faster than a previous 10k race (suggesting you can run a marathon faster than a previous marathon). I knew my marathon pace before I started the training program. I had previously run 3:00, so set myself a target of 2:55, and trained to meet that goal. I do think I could've run faster in the marathon, but sure I wasn't to know that until near the end of the race, at which point it's too difficult to make any sizable difference.

The race/time trial is also handy, as you have to do a semi-long run (17-18 miles) the next day, on what should be sore and tired legs, which gives you the last physiological endurance kick. The handiest sessions for predicting marathon pace were the longs runs that I finished at PMP pace (which felt comfortable) and the sessions at half-marathon pace.

There's one last session, a 7 mile run with 2 miles at pmp (a couple of days before the race), and it's a last chance to see just how comfortable your planned race pace is (and you'll also be a couple of weeks into your taper). I found the two miles at pmp very comfortable, almost easy, and my HR stayed around 144. Sorry for the very long answer to a short question (It's Sunday night and there's feic all on tv!).

We like long answers,Krusty....

I agree with you about finishing the long runs with some pmp thrown in.
Its a real confidence booster.
Example,i did 18 last friday and felt flogged after it,then i did 18 this friday with the last mile at 6:45 and felt fantastic,i put it down to watching yourslef for 17 knowing that you had to be ok to bang out a pmp mile at the end,then when its done,your blood is pumping and your saying to yourself...jesus...i could have done another few of those !

Playing tricks on your mind really...its amazing how powerful it is....

T runner

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

No, I don't think it's really useful at all for predicting a marathon time, but is really only useful as a confidence booster, particularly if (like me) the time you run is a good clip faster than a previous 10k race (suggesting you can run a marathon faster than a previous marathon). I knew my marathon pace before I started the training program. I had previously run 3:00, so set myself a target of 2:55, and trained to meet that goal. I do think I could've run faster in the marathon, but sure I wasn't to know that until near the end of the race, at which point it's too difficult to make any sizable difference.

The race/time trial is also handy, as you have to do a semi-long run (17-18 miles) the next day, on what should be sore and tired legs, which gives you the last physiological endurance kick. The handiest sessions for predicting marathon pace were the longs runs that I finished at PMP pace (which felt comfortable) and the sessions at half-marathon pace.

There's one last session, a 7 mile run with 2 miles at pmp (a couple of days before the race), and it's a last chance to see just how comfortable your planned race pace is (and you'll also be a couple of weeks into your taper). I found the two miles at pmp very comfortable, almost easy, and my HR stayed around 144. Sorry for the very long answer to a short question (It's Sunday night and there's feic all on tv!).

Thanks Krusty. Had planned too but have no work done at PMP unfortunately.
Just spotted there s a splashworld 10k in Tramore on sunday so migt do that and do the 17 miler on monday.
If I run a good time in tramore Ill go out at 81 mins for buy some SIS gels in Dublin do you know?

I tried an awful concoction of stuff for my long run yesterday. High5 gels. Diuraltye with my mouth as mixing cup-took me ages to get the water bottle open as I was gagging with the powder! Forgot I had caffeine tablets luckily enough.

Krusty_Clown

T runner wrote: »

Thanks Krusty. Had planned too but have no work done at PMP unfortunately.
Just spotted there s a splashworld 10k in Tramore on sunday so migt do that and do the 17 miler on monday.
If I run a good time in tramore Ill go out at 81 mins for buy some SIS gels in Dublin do you know?

I tried an awful concoction of stuff for my long run yesterday. High5 gels. Diuraltye with my mouth as mixing cup-took me ages to get the water bottle open as I was gagging with the powder! Forgot I had caffeine tablets luckily enough.

I usually buy them in boxes of 30, from wiggle.co.uk (works out at around €1 each). The new Irish site http://www.sub4.ie also sells them individually, and in boxes, and the price isn't bad. I've also seen them in snow and rock in Dundrum Shopping Centre and in Irishfit in Dun Laoghaire (I think!).

Make sure you try them during your long runs, as while I kind of like the taste, others have found them disgusting, and the last thing you want to do is find out that they give you the trotskies when you're running. I've only tried the tropical flavour. If you get stuck, let me know. I have a few lying around.

Krusty_Clown

Yesterday: 1 Hour length swimming, with occasional breaks for drills like 'who can keep their head under water for the longest' and 'who can swim the furthest underwater' and 'which of these two back-flips is the prettiest'.

Tonight: 7 mile aerobic run, along Bray Esplanade out to just past Bray Head, and back again, bumping briefly into Wally Runs who managed to recognize me, despite my head to toe luminous lycra. Not the most enjoyable of runs for some reason, probably down to tiredness.
Summary: 7 miles in 53 mins, @7:39/mile, HR=138

Krusty_Clown

Tonight: 13.1 miles in 1:37:15
The plan was to run at around 7:45/mile. I tried. I tried so hard, but I just can't do it. I can't hold that pace for more than 10 seconds, before the mind wanders and the pace is back up again. On a plus side, the HR was low, the hills felt easy, and I felt like I could have gone on forever. Connemara is going to be a disaster! A good training run for Connemara, but probably not so good for the Trail race this weekend.

Summary: 13.1 miles in 1:37:15, @7:25/mile, HR=145

Peckham

You seem to be getting some good mileage done post-Barcelona. It normally takes me a while post-marathon to psychologically build back up to longish runs.

Krusty_Clown

Yeah, with the ultra just 2.5 weeks away, I'm very much under the cosh, and need to get back to big mileage pretty quickly (though technically I should be tapering already), while at the same time being aware of this is pretty much the same circumstances (same races!) that led to injury last year. I'm hoping to hit around 59 miles this week including a race on Saturday, before tapering for the remaining two weeks.

Thankfully Connemara is a 'just for fun' race, so I feel no time based pressure. The onus is on enjoying the experience, and surviving (and of course beating the OH across the finish line, during her pursuit of her second half marathon <evil cackle>).

Sosa

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Yeah, with the ultra just 2.5 weeks away, I'm very much under the cosh, and need to get back to big mileage pretty quickly (though technically I should be tapering already), while at the same time being aware of this is pretty much the same circumstances (same races!) that led to injury last year. I'm hoping to hit around 59 miles this week including a race on Saturday, before tapering for the remaining two weeks.

Thankfully Connemara is a 'just for fun' race, so I feel no time based pressure. The onus is on enjoying the experience, and surviving (and of course beating the OH across the finish line, during her pursuit of her second half marathon <evil cackle>).

What race have you the w/e ?

Krusty_Clown

The wonderful IMRA Wicklow Way Trail race. Approximatively 15 miles, up and down mountains (small exaggeration!) with fantastic views and a wide mixture of terrain. It's a fab race.

claralara

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

. It's a fab race.

You mean to watch of course?!! Someday...:eek:

Best of luck!

Sosa

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

The wonderful IMRA Wicklow Way Trail race. Approximatively 15 miles, up and down mountains (small exaggeration!) with fantastic views and a wide mixture of terrain. It's a fab race.

Enjoy...i would like to do something like that sometime.
The closest imra to me is a 10k up the comeragh mountains...dont know exactly where it starts but it cant be further that 30/40 mins away.
Its 2 weeks before Cork though,so not this year.

Are you racing or enjoying ?

Krusty_Clown

I think all of these races are a mixture of pleasure and pain. Pain on the way up, and pleasure on the way back down again.

I'm not sure how to measure myself for this race. Times are all relative (as it's not flat, and a slightly different course to last year). I wouldn't mind improving on my position from last year (21st) but that really depends on who turns up on the day. A stronger field will mean a lower position for me. I guess a better indicator would be to improve on my % of the winner's time, but again, it depends less on my time, and more on the speed of the winner!

I finished within 12 minutes of the very much 'in-form' Slogger_Jogger last year. So maybe trying to get within 10 minutes of his finish time would be a worthy goal.

Slogger Jogger

Hey. You're the sub 3 hr guy. Your time gap should be the other way around

In fairness though this kind of race is a good 'un for us guys in marathon training. Looking forward to it.

donothoponpop

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

I finished within 12 minutes of the very much 'in-form' Slogger_Jogger last year. So maybe trying to get within 10 minutes of his finish time would be a worthy goal.

Slogger Jogger wrote: »

Hey. You're the sub 3 hr guy. Your time gap should be the other way around

In fairness though this kind of race is a good 'un for us guys in marathon training. Looking forward to it.

"Mr. 2:55" vs "Mr. Mountain Half marathon champ"... too close to call...

Sosa

donothoponpop wrote: »

"Mr. 2:55" vs "Mr. Mountain Half marathon champ"... too close to call...

Sorry Krusty...i have to go with Slogger on this one....
This mountain running is a different animal altogether....

Krusty_Clown

Unless they bulldozed a couple of tunnels, and built a 15 mile tarmac road along the Wicklow Way, I'll be delighted with SJ's time +10 minutes.

Tonight: 4 mile recovery run that felt hard ?! Pissing rain, but I had psyched myself up for it, so I quite enjoyed it. Just me, the local fox, and a couple of ships out in Dublin Bay for company.

Summary: 4 Miles in 32 mins, @8min/mile, HR=127.

donothoponpop

Sosa wrote: »

Sorry Krusty...i have to go with Slogger on this one....
This mountain running is a different animal altogether....

<<dons "knows-it-all" punters cap>>;


I'd say SJ has the edge too, but any margin will be a lot less than 10 minutes! If theres one thing KC does well in the hills its leeching off others climbing effort bravely ascending steadily towards a summit, while SJ laughs as he whips low branches back into your face effortlessly copes with all enviroments.

But then who knows, Krusty has youth on his side...;) No pressure lads!

Krusty_Clown

Tonight: 4 Mile recovery run with 5 x strides
Probably should have taken the day off, but it was in the schedule, and it's nice way to finish off a tough day in work with a couple of miles. Still, I felt tired after two miles, and it didn't get any easier. Hopefully a good night's sleep will fix that.

Summary: 4 miles in 29 mins, @7:18/mile, HR=142

Slogger Jogger

Great great picture!

http://www.imra.ie/photos/view/id/37695/

Krusty_Clown

Today: IMRA trail Race - 15.8 Miles (Final position unknown).
Give me a marathon at 6:36/mile. Give me mile intervals at 5:40/mile. Hell, give me 400s at 5:20/mile. Just don't make me race 16 miles over hills at 8 min/mile anytime soon. It is so tough. I am absolutely shattered.

I did well in this race. I did very well. In fact, I think I may have managed to get my highest ever finish in a race, which is great (I'm not speculating until I see the results posted!). But I can't get over the feeling that I've cheated. IMRA stands for Irish Mountain Running Association, yet, for sections of this race, I didn't run. I didn't jog. I didn't even shuffle. I walked. Perhaps if I didn't still have a marathon lingering in my legs. Perhaps if I didn't run a half marathon distance on Wednesday. Perhaps a lot of things. I've come to terms with the fact that I'm not a good hill runner. I'm a pretty solid hill race finisher (as recent results have show), but when it comes to going up steep hills, I don't think I've made any progress.

The Race started well. After a few hundred metres of gentle ascent, I caught up with Slogger_Jogger and enjoyed what felt more like a training run than a race. A bit of banter, and the odd bit of encouragement to some of the Ultra guys (the real men and women of the day) who we encountered on our climb, then up to where the race started last year, on the boardwalk section. As we finished the climb on the boardwalk, I was still behind SJ, and I was wondering if this was really a good idea, or should I start to drop off the pace a little. It's a long race. As we headed around the side of DJouce the pack ahead of me pulled away anyway, and I let them go. It's one of my favourite areas in the Wicklow Mountains, and I was determined to enjoy it. Descending down the mountain, I had a clear view ahead of me and could see that I hadn't lost touch with the guys ahead. Through Crone and along the Dargle I was beginning to feel tired, but managed to pass a few runners.

Onto the climb, and this is where I had my first of a number of walks. I went with a walk/run strategy until we hit the section near prince William's seat, where I opened up the legs again. Passed a couple of runners on the swift down-hill, though they may have been ultra runners. With three miles to go, I caught a fellow trail runner on the downhill who had previously passed me on the last climb. We had a bit of tit-for-tat over the last few miles, as he would fly past me on the uphills (as I slowed to a walk) and then I would pick it up on the flats, and regain the lead. Had we finished on an uphill, there would be little doubt he would have finished before me, but fortunately for me, and my marathon legs, it was a flat 1.5 miles to the finish line. I put in an extra kick over the last 200 metres, just in case there was a final challenge, but thankfully I crossed the finish line alone, exhausted, but happy to be done.

I definitely achieved a few of the targets I set myself. I was well within the 10 mins of SJ's most excellent run. I improved on my overall position (to be verified, but I think it's safe). Not sure what the winner's time was, but I may have improved my overall % too, unless they ran an astounding run. So overall, I'm happy with the results, but less happy with the performance.

Great to meet so many of the boards runners: Gohard, Magnet, Ultraman, Hunnymonster (if only on her descent), earlyevening, Enduro, Dunebuggy, and everybody else on this painful journey!

Summary: 15.8 Miles in 2:06, @7:57/mile, HR=163 (30 seconds a mile faster than last year!).