2.5% rise 1st September

In my opinion

Sorry I should have posted on Friday. I was at an INTO thing Thursday & Friday we were told our money will be paid in our Salary of Dec 11th.

Bonus for everyone protesting in Dublin on the Saturday!!!!

ytareh

I see on the ASTI site secondary teacher members of that union voted 80% in favour of the 'paydeal' (ie more work for less than inflation matching 'rises') AND the 'revised promotional' system (ie the Principal's favourites get all the posts ).I guess the fact the new system isnt being fully implemented till 2014 swayed some people .Many who voted will have retired by then or gotten their posts .I know there are a lot of staff who will be glad to get out of this profession in the next few years before it really goes to pot. Maybe its a sad reflection on the depth of the recession that people voted just to get their backdated 3%...what will it be worth a couple of hundred?

sitstill

I was told by someone from ASTI today that we're getting the money on December 4th.

Delphi91

ytareh wrote: »

...With the current seniority based system everybody gets their turn .Its the fairest by far...

In my opinion, it's the complete opposite.

I am aware of a young teacher who took a course in Educational Administration as a means to promotion. His reasoning - he had calculated that he would be 25 years in the school before he would even be entitled to get a Special Duties post. One could argue that he should move school, but in doing so, he goes back down the ladder again. Is that a system that is fair?

I've been on interview boards for promotional posts in voluntary secondary schools. In each case there was only one applicant. Coming from the VEC sector, I expressed my surprise at this to the Principal. His answer was quite simple - it is based on seniority, the most senior person on the staff applies and there is an unwritten rule that nobody else is allowed to apply. Now tell me how that promotes fairness and encourages enthusiastic teachers who want to get involved in administration from doing so???

ie the Principal's favourites get all the posts

That's a very sweeping comment to make - do you have proof of this???

ytareh

It doesnt take anything like 25 years to get a Special Duties post in the average Secondary School.I got mine in under half that .One of the many reasons against this new madness was that teachers would be forced to take administrative 'courses' over their Summer holidays to increase their chances of getting a post .Someone literally one or two posts above mentioned someone doing one such course.In my alas very extensive experience on the topic ,this type of 'course' is (95%?)facilitated by spoofers, chancers and failed ex teachers.
As for proof of Principals favouring teachers who dont 'rock the boat ' over more qualified/deserving colleagues well Im not going to air my school's dirty laundry in public here but suffice it to say that the sort of backstabbing that went on would make Caesar and Brutus look like kiddies playtime ...Staffrooms are absolute ravished by civil war type personality clashes with it remaining very hard to sit on the fence .Look Ive got my post already...I voted for the good of my profession and the good of teachers coming up through the system ...I accept the majority decision .Let the games begin !!!Principals will be delighted to see the Union loose yet another foothold in schools .

implausible

Oh here we go again - ytareh with his sweeping generalisations, conspiracy theories and seniority over merit mentality.... let the games begin indeed...:rolleyes:

ChowChow

deemark wrote: »

Gen Sec of TUI reckons the 2 main issues have been agreed in principle and we should get the money before xmas. If we don't, we're in bother as we'll not get it backdated-the money is only in the kitty for 2008!

Just to get back on topic here, I simply cannot believe how the TUI have entered additional negotiations for this final payment when we have already signed up for changes to our conditions of service on the last pay deal. I know for a fact other parts of the public service (such as the NRA) have been paid the 2.5%, on time, with no additional strings attached. I have heard rumours of what they have agreed to on behalf of (third-level) members for this payment - and I believe we are getting absolutely shafted here. The head honchos in the TUI are not acting in the best interests of their members and this has been the case for quite some time now. The only sane voices seem to be the local branch reps who are fighting a losing battle with head office. I think the time has come for TUI members to start withholding their subscriptions - head office needs a major wake up call :mad:

rainbowtrout

ytareh wrote: »

I see on the ASTI site secondary teacher members of that union voted 80% in favour of the 'paydeal' (ie more work for less than inflation matching 'rises')

Considering that most people in the country at the moment are worrying about hanging onto their jobs and/or taking paycuts, really a payrise isn't something to be complaining about. there isn't going to be much in the way of inflation for the next few years by the look of things. And it wasn't just a 2.5% backdated payrise, there are two more coming as well over the next two years. It will make a difference to most I reckon.



and i can't be bothered to multiquote but in some schools posts can come up very quickly and then nothing for years. my principal has said on several occasions that it was easier for him to gain promotion by becoming a principal rather than wait years and years for a possible special duties post. There were also a couple of teachers who taught in my school for almost 40 years and retired on B posts, never had the opportunity to get an A post because they never reached the top of the queue in seniority before they retired. since they've retired at least 6 assistant principals posts have come up. It can happen.

Trotter

1. The generalisations in this thread are irritating me. Stick to facts. 95% of courses are not given by chancers. Thats fabricated and false, and I'm not having it here.

2. If someone disagrees with someone else, follow the rule - Attack the post, Not the poster.

Thats all folks...

rainbowtrout

deemark wrote: »

Gen Sec of TUI reckons the 2 main issues have been agreed in principle and we should get the money before xmas. If we don't, we're in bother as we'll not get it backdated-the money is only in the kitty for 2008!

yep, as of 24th November, it should be backdated and we'll get it before the end of the year

http://www.tui.ie/_fileupload/Image/Second%20Level%20GS.pdf

Delphi91

ytareh wrote: »

It doesnt take anything like 25 years to get a Special Duties post in the average Secondary School.I got mine in under half that

I never said anything about the average school - I said that I knew of someone in a specific school. Take a school near me with over 1100 pupils which has only been in existence for 6-7 years. It probably has something like 70 staff(maybe more), all young teachers. They already have a large quota of posts filled. How long will it take for the last person who joined the staff to be senior enough to get a post under the present unfair system?

One of the many reasons against this new madness was that teachers would be forced to take administrative 'courses' over their Summer holidays to increase their chances of getting a post .Someone literally one or two posts above mentioned someone doing one such course.In my alas very extensive experience on the topic ,this type of 'course' is (95%?)facilitated by spoofers, chancers and failed ex teachers.

I am all in favour of teachers doing administrative courses. I put myself through two years of driving from Limerick to Cork to gain such a course. Nobody "forced" me to do the course, I chose to do it on the grounds that I needed to upskill myself. I find your comment about the "spoofers, chancers and failed teachers" facilitating these courses to be highly insulting to the excellent lecturers who taught on the course, a number of whom were practicing Principals. One has to wonder why, having made such a comment, you also state that you have extensive experience of such courses. Why do them if that's your opinion?

As for proof of Principals favouring teachers who dont 'rock the boat ' over more qualified/deserving colleagues well Im not going to air my school's dirty laundry in public here but suffice it to say that the sort of backstabbing that went on would make Caesar and Brutus look like kiddies playtime

So, once again the situation in your school is the situation in all schools???

Principals will be delighted to see the Union loose yet another foothold in schools .

As I stated in my previous post, this scenario has only pertained in voluntary secondary schools. It does not exist in the VEC sector, so your last statement is again incorrect.

A number of my colleagues will be attending interviews for PORs in my school in the coming week or two. Each applicant had to fill out a 4-5 page application form which will form part of the interview. I have sat on three interview panels in voluntary secondary schools for PORs and not once was I shown an application form. In each case, I was told that the "interview" was only happening so that the process followed procedures - the only applicant in each case was getting the post.

This whole seniority farce only came about as a "reward" system for dedicated years of service by a teacher so that their salary could be bumped up before retirement thereby giving a bigger pension. There was no discussion as to whether the teacher actually was "dedicated" or not. Posts were "created" so that teachers could get PORs. They were rarely based on the actual needs of the school. Thank god this system is changing - it's about time.

loveroflight

In my experience, those who work outside the classroom often don't pay much attention to the work in the classroom. Seems the oldfashioned 'Good Teacher' has no chance of promotion

Fast_Mover

I believe we (primary teachers anyway!) got it today!!!:)
One of the teachers in my school got her post/paycheck before she left for school this morning and said it was included!
My paycheck never arrived today..grrr!

Trotter

Yep! I got mine today anyway. Every cent extra at this time of year is important!

In my opinion

In my opinion wrote: »

Is our payrise of two and a half percent coming soon? I got my increment last Thursday but is the pay agreement still on course? I'm a primary school teacher!

I too got mine today. Nice to see the thread closed at last!!:D:D:D

TheDriver

was it backpaid?

Trotter

TheDriver wrote: »

was it backpaid?

Yes, to September when it was supposed to be paid originally.