Proven Conspiracies and a general comment

Trev M

I pop in here every now and then to read what "all the nutters in internet land" are saying and what all the "ignorant blind fools cant see is really going on".

Personally Id love to buy into some of them for no other reason than it would make the world a more interesting place:D but generally Im skeptictical

Anyway I was wondering what the greatest all time proven conspiracies are...
I guess Watergate is up there? (maybe that doesnt count as a conspiracy)

Ive no interest in flaming anyone an all that crap my question is genuine...proven conspiracies...hit me.:)

dr.bollocko

I think there was one proven recently about the US getting shady information from a certain character who was tortured to indicate that there were definitely WMDs in Iraq, costing 5 million bucks or something? I saw it on the Daily show the other day. Cant remember a lot of the details though.

Trev M

Something just sprung to mind actually now you mention WMDs I was watching Nuclear Secrets recently .... how Pakistan got its bomb and teh guy went on to deal with Iran , Lybia .

Kernel

I'd say the best ones haven't been 'proven' yet. Conspiracies by their very nature can be hard to prove, there's a misconception that it's very hard to keep a secret, but with compartmentalisation, need to know etc. I would disagree. Watergate is probably the biggest one in the west. A new whistleblower like Deep Throat would have to surface in order to reveal other conspiracies.

I'd say next conspiracies to be exposed will be UFO and JFK. JFK one may never be exposed, but I put it in there since those involved or with knowledge would be getting on a bit at this stage, and deathbed revelations may surface.

Diogenes

Kernel wrote: »

I'd say the best ones haven't been 'proven' yet. Conspiracies by their very nature can be hard to prove, there's a misconception that it's very hard to keep a secret, but with compartmentalisation, need to know etc. I would disagree. Watergate is probably the biggest one in the west. A new whistleblower like Deep Throat would have to surface in order to reveal other conspiracies.

I'd say next conspiracies to be exposed will be UFO and JFK. JFK one may never be exposed, but I put it in there since those involved or with knowledge would be getting on a bit at this stage, and deathbed revelations may surface.

What exactly about the JFK assassination do you think is a conspiracy.

Mahatma coat

ah Diogeness, Do you think that Lee Harvey Oswald acted ALONE, without any assistance from any organisation?

Kernel

Mahatma coat wrote: »

ah Diogeness, Do you think that Lee Harvey Oswald acted ALONE, without any assistance from any organisation?

I'm sure he does, bless him. Probably thinks those shots could have been fired by one man too.. probably watching too much Penn & Teller.

amacachi

How could one man fire a gun?

Kernel

amacachi wrote: »

How could one man fire a gun?

How could one man fire a bolt action rifle scoring such hits on the moving target at an elevated position which senior Marine Corps & SWAT marksmen have stated is impossible indeed.

And then there's the Warren Commission report, ever hear of that pile of ****e? It's worse than the 911 commission report.

Sqaull20

Its proven, but people dont accept it as proven, how I dont know.

Anyway millions are starving to death/disease ravaged every year when the fact is that this situation exists because someone wants it to be that way/ has let it be that way...

There is no excuse for it really..

Throughout the world farmers are " paid " not to produce food!!

Massive food silos exist for surplus food and that the North Sea is a dumping ground EU food stuff.

If they/ we wanted to, we could stop it.But we wont.

The Vietnam war was started over an attack on a US ship that never took place.

Diogenes

Mahatma Coat wrote:

ah Diogeness, Do you think that Lee Harvey Oswald acted ALONE, without any assistance from any organisation?

Why yes I do. Do you think an organisation would use a delusional mediocre shot drummed out the military, armed with a dodgy mail order rifle?

Kernel wrote: »

I'm sure he does, bless him. Probably thinks those shots could have been fired by one man too.. probably watching too much Penn & Teller.

How could one man fire a bolt action rifle scoring such hits on the moving target at an elevated position which senior Marine Corps & SWAT marksmen have stated is impossible indeed.

Okay give us a giggle Kernel, point out these Marine Corps and SWAT marksman who think Oswalds marksmanship was impossible.

This will be most entertaining.

Kernel

Sqaull20 wrote: »

Its proven, but people dont accept it as proven, how I dont know.

Anyway millions are starving to death/disease ravaged every year when the fact is that this situation exists because someone wants it to be that way/ has let it be that way...

There is no excuse for it really..

Throughout the world farmers are " paid " not to produce food!!

Massive food silos exist for surplus food and that the North Sea is a dumping ground EU food stuff.

If they/ we wanted to, we could stop it.But we wont.

The Vietnam war was started over an attack on a US ship that never took place.

Gulf of Tonkin was a sweet one alright. Every US war needs a spurious reason to garner public (ignorance) support. As for the other stuff, that my friend is the capitalist system we live in. A system whereby those who have the paper can generate more paper by doing nothing, and those who need the paper have to become wage slaves.

Mahatma coat

I believe the word you are looking for is
PATSY

Kernel

Diogenes wrote: »

Why yes I do. Do you think an organisation would use a delusional mediocre shot drummed out the military, armed with a dodgy mail order rifle?

LOL! Delusional is right! :pac:

Kernel

Some reading on LHO's shooting ability or lack thereof:

http://karws.gso.uri.edu/JFK/the_critics/griffith/Oswald_poor_shot.html

Anyone who has fired scoped rifles (as I have) will understand how difficult this would be.

Moriarty

Kernel wrote: »

As for the other stuff, that my friend is the capitalist system we live in. A system whereby those who have the paper can generate more paper by doing nothing, and those who need the paper have to become wage slaves.

Can you explain to me how "food mountains" are a byproduct of capitalism please?

/pulls up a seat

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

be careful kernel, Moriarty is just a shill for the NWO.

Kernel

Moriarty wrote: »

Can you explain to me how "food mountains" are a byproduct of capitalism please?

/pulls up a seat

To control the agricultural markets. Supply and demand is circumvented and food is purchased by the EU and then left to waste. If all the food were let onto the market, the prices would collapse. If the food was given away to the starving, it would also affect exports.

Moriarty

Hang on, isn't capitalism the antithesis of government intervention? Markets left to regulate themselves, supply and demand and all that..

You're not talking about capitalism.

amacachi

There's a difference between politics and economics.

Trev M

So proven conspiracies are thin on the ground then:eek:

Économiste Monétaire

In the truest definition of capitalism, it is the antithesis of government intervention.

"an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods, by investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods that are determined mainly by competition in a free market."

However, as in life, nothing follows its purest form.

bonkey

Kernel wrote: »

Some reading on LHO's shooting ability or lack thereof:

http://karws.gso.uri.edu/JFK/the_critics/griffith/Oswald_poor_shot.html

Interesting to see how conclusions are drawn:

No "Oswald" rifle test has ever included all of these conditions. On this basis alone it can be said that no rifleman, no matter how skilled, has ever duplicated Oswald's supposed shooting feat.

If no test has ever included all conditions, it would be more accurate to say that no rifleman, no matter how skilled has ever attempted to duplicate Oswald's supposed shooting feat.

justcallmetex

I suppose one proven conspiracy would be the Nazis burning the Reichstag in order to stir nationalistic ferver in Germany against the supposed arsonists (the Jews) as wiki puts it "seen as the pivotal event in the establishment of Nazi Germany."

justcallmetex

As wild as it seems LHO made the shot watched a great reconstruction of the events of the day thought I'd be able to find it on google vids but no joy. I'll keep looking.

Trev M

justcallmetex wrote: »

I suppose one proven conspiracy would be the Nazis burning the Reichstag in order to stir nationalistic ferver in Germany against the supposed arsonists (the Jews) as wiki puts it "seen as the pivotal event in the establishment of Nazi Germany."

Thumbs up , good one!

justcallmetex

Thanks

foxhoundone

:cool: heres one for ya guys
At the time of the good friday agrement was being implimented STORMONT was being refurbished for the upcoming elections for MLAs.
their was an electrical fire in the main chambers gutting the intire chamber
their was the rumour that it was a deliberit fire as all fire systems where disabled, and the water butt out the back of the estate had been drained[30,000. CAPACITY} for repairs 3/4 days previously, the fire brigade had to pump from about 2ks away using relayed tenders{time consuming?} hence delays in putting the blaze out.
the main conspiracey at the time was this was a deliberat fire because the main chamber was decked out in royal blue and every where you looked their was referance to unionist/loyalist/HM, crown symbols and artifacts relating to north irish aristoricy, the CT being the nationalist partys woundnt sit in the chamber, strange but true

conceited

The Gleiwitz incident was a staged attack on 31 August 1939 against the German radio station Sender Gleiwitz in Gleiwitz, Upper Silesia, Germany (since 1945: Gliwice, Poland) on the eve of World War II in Europe.
This provocation was one of several actions in Operation Himmler, a Nazi Germany SS project to create the appearance of Polish aggression against Germany, which would be used to justify the subsequent invasion of Poland.

.

Kernel

Interesting how all these proven conspiracies are from vanquished foes eh? Apart from the minor stuff like watergate for example...

Teddi

"bowling for columbine".....enough said.

I believe that americans are kept under a constant state of fear, allowing the government to keep there big thumb pinned down on them 24/7, alot of subliminal messages and hidden ploys executed through the media, which I believe their government controls 100%, letting the public view what they want them to view...although my views are far from unique....

when the pentagon was hit a few years ago, they said a plane hit it...yet, there was no plane debris, no wings salvaged, air traffic control never detected planes in that area at that given time, but a much much smaller object, flying at nearly three times the normal speed that planes fly at, coming to the conclusion that It was a cruise missile that impacted upon a brand new reburbished area of the building, distroying foreign relation offices, which cost in excess of 15 billion, just for that section of the building alone....(there have been countless radio show's on this....alot are viewable on youtube)

Not wanting to harp on about 9/11...as its been talked to death, but watched a program on it the other day....where this man had his face obscurred, and voice altered..saying that, on the day that the incident happened....he saw something missile like hitting the passenger plane before it hit the towers, having witnessed this....government officials came to his home and threatened him with dire consequences if he is to share any of this information with anyone.....

Its still hard to believe either side of the story, as its all 'here say' until there are solid facts..but...I believe in the above...

my 2 cents...

Smudgeyboy

Micheal Moore is a NWO puppet, that's why he made it to the cinema, he said nothing but made it seem that everyone got the 'real story'. Where is he now?

It's very common for people to believe in whatevers in his films, and nothing else, despite his lack of evidence and the amount of evidence there is out there on other, more important conspiracys.

I simply cant see how someone can not 'believe' in a New World Order of some form.

The Pope has said it, Tony Blair, Gordon Brown, Bushes, Kissinger, Sarkozy, Clinton...
Even if it doesnt mean RFID chips and slavery, it's some kind of new world order. If it wasnt, then why would the world leaders be saying it?

Im basing it being a world order based around fear of terrorism/child abductions/etc. just because of how it's going, the personal views of these world leaders and their past actions. Add in the secret societys they are in and what they are into and we have a clear picture. And if any of ye were in any doubt, read Revelations.

Im not a christian, but it's the same system that gave us that book that are putting this New World Order to us. And whats to be learned from it? Prison or death, dont worry you'll go to heaven. It's blindingly obvious!

humanji

Doesn't Revelations tell us about false prophets pretending to be warning us and acting in our best interests, etc? Kind if ironic you'd bring it up...

PullMyFinger!

Teddi wrote: »

Not wanting to harp on about 9/11...as its been talked to death, but watched a program on it the other day....where this man had his face obscurred, and voice altered..saying that, on the day that the incident happened....he saw something missile like hitting the passenger plane before it hit the towers, having witnessed this....government officials came to his home and threatened him with dire consequences if he is to share any of this information with anyone.....

What was the title of the documentary?

Smudgeyboy

humanji wrote: »

Doesn't Revelations tell us about false prophets pretending to be warning us and acting in our best interests, etc? Kind if ironic you'd bring it up...

Yes it does, I believe Barack Obama is playing the part of the wolf in sheeps clothing, and I mean 'playing the part'.

Mahatma coat

Revalations!!!!! FFS
the stoned ramblings of a 2nd Century Priest.

Seriously, are you talkin about the KJ Bible?

ever since man foirs realised that the world would end one day there have been people claimin that its tomorrow.

Kama

It was Zizek I think who said it was peculiar that we find it far easier to imagine the utter and complete destruction of everything than to conceive of a modest change on our socioeconomic system...

aidan24326

Kernel wrote: »

I'd say next conspiracies to be exposed will be UFO and JFK. JFK one may never be exposed, but I put it in there since those involved or with knowledge would be getting on a bit at this stage, and deathbed revelations may surface.

Someone apparently has made some revelations, a former CIA agent by the name of E.Howard Hunt. though there's no way to know for sure if he's telling the truth.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/13893143/the_last_confessions_of_e_howard_hunt/print

E. Howard scribbled the initials "LBJ," standing for Kennedy's ambitious vice president, Lyndon Johnson. Under "LBJ," connected by a line, he wrote the name Cord Meyer. Meyer was a CIA agent whose wife had an affair with JFK; later she was murdered, a case that's never been solved. Next his father connected to Meyer's name the name Bill Harvey, another CIA agent; also connected to Meyer's name was the name David Morales, yet another CIA man and a well-known, particularly vicious black-op specialist. And then his father connected to Morales' name, with a line, the framed words "French Gunman Grassy Knoll."

So there it was, according to E. Howard Hunt. LBJ had Kennedy killed. It had long been speculated upon. But now E. Howard was saying that's the way it was. And that Lee Harvey Oswald wasn't the only shooter in Dallas. There was also, on the grassy knoll, a French gunman, presumably the Corsican Mafia assassin Lucien Sarti, who has figured prominently in other assassination theories.

"By the time he handed me the paper, I was in a state of shock," Saint says. "His whole life, to me and everybody else, he'd always professed to not know anything about any of it. But I knew this had to be the truth. If my dad was going to make anything up, he would have made something up about the Mafia, or Castro, or Khrushchev. He didn't like Johnson. But you don't falsely implicate your own country, for Christ's sake. My father is old-school, a dyed-in-the-wool patriot, and that's the last thing he would do."

Teddi wrote: »

when the pentagon was hit a few years ago, they said a plane hit it...yet, there was no plane debris, no wings salvaged, air traffic control never detected planes in that area at that given time, but a much much smaller object, flying at nearly three times the normal speed that planes fly at, coming to the conclusion that It was a cruise missile that impacted upon a brand new reburbished area of the building

A plane did hit the pentagon, that's what all known evidence points to. There are undoubtedly some question marks surrounding certain aspects of what happened that day, but this isn't one of them.

SkepticOne

I suppose the Iran-Contra affair would be another fairly well established conspiracy.

SkepticOne

Kernel wrote: »

Interesting how all these proven conspiracies are from vanquished foes eh? Apart from the minor stuff like watergate for example...

Obviously things are going to come out when an enemy is defeated that would otherwise remain secret. Governments do have secrets particularly in wartime. Much of Britain's activity during WWII only emerged decades after the war ended.

Kernel

SkepticOne wrote: »

Obviously things are going to come out when an enemy is defeated that would otherwise remain secret. Governments do have secrets particularly in wartime. Much of Britain's activity during WWII only emerged decades after the war ended.

My point exactly. Of course, a successful black op would never come to light.

Wishbone Ash

Kernel wrote: »

JFK one may never be exposed

Because there is nothing to expose.

Diogenes wrote: »

What exactly about the JFK assassination do you think is a conspiracy.

+1

Mahatma coat wrote: »

ah Diogeness, Do you think that Lee Harvey Oswald acted ALONE, without any assistance from any organisation?

One small question:

Do you really think that, if any organisation was behind the biggest murder in history, they would have selected an unstable and unreliable person like LHO to do it and provide him with a mediocre mail order rifle, and then insist that he gets a bus and taxi to make his getaway?

Kernel wrote: »

How could one man fire a bolt action rifle scoring such hits on the moving target at an elevated position which senior Marine Corps & SWAT marksmen have stated is impossible indeed

Because of people like Oliver Stone and his tissue of lies (JFK 1991) it's a common myth that no one could match LHO's feat. It has been surpassed by marksmen, one of which, using Oswald's actual rifle, exceeded it 47 times in one day and on one occasion, exceeded it by over 1 second.

Kernel wrote:

And then there's the Warren Commission report, ever hear of that pile of ****e?

Which part of it do you have a problem with?

It's been 45 years since the assination and not one of the conspiracy theorists has been able to provide any credible evidence other than that LHO acted alone.

Diogenes

Kernel wrote: »

My point exactly. Of course, a successful black op would never come to light.

Ah so the absence of evidence is in fact evidence of the conspiracy.

Jesus Kernel doesn't the sheer level of cognitive dissonance in the under utilised organ that sits on your shoulders give you a headache?

Kernel wrote:

How could one man fire a bolt action rifle scoring such hits on the moving target at an elevated position which senior Marine Corps & SWAT marksmen have stated is impossible indeed

Seriously mate I finished "Case closed" a few weeks ago. Which specific Marine Corps and SWAT marksmen claimed it was impossible?

And then there's the Warren Commission report, ever hear of that pile of ****e?

Yes I have would you care to get into a detailed specific point by point rebuttal of what it got wrong?

Incidently while I'm not about to get into a gun ho defense of the warren commission, perhaps for ****s and giggles you could lay out;

A) your biggest issues with the Warren Commission.

and

Your theory as to what happened that day in November.

aidan wrote:

Someone apparently has made some revelations, a former CIA agent by the name of E.Howard Hunt. though there's no way to know for sure if he's telling the truth.

The "confession" Of E. Howard Hunt, comes from his estranged coke addled son. We have only his son's word as to his fathers dying confession.

Kernel

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Do you really think that, if any organisation was behind the biggest murder in history, they would have selected an unstable and unreliable person like LHO to do it and provide him with a mediocre mail order rifle, and then insist that he gets a bus and taxi to make his getaway?

That's because, as he himself said, he was a patsy. A screw-up. Who was promptly shot dead by a mobster. Don't you find that a little... convenient? Incidentally, the murder of Archduke Franz Ferdinand by the Black Hand (a proven conspiracy) would be what I consider the biggest murder in history, since it sparked off WWI.

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Because of people like Oliver Stone and his tissue of lies (JFK 1991) it's a common myth that no one could match LHO's feat. It has been surpassed by marksmen, one of which, using Oswald's actual rifle, exceeded it 47 times in one day and on one occasion, exceeded it by over 1 second.

Have you got a link to that information?

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Which part of it do you have a problem with?

The part where they claim LHO was acting alone and killed JFK!

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

It's been 45 years since the assination and not one of the conspiracy theorists has been able to provide any credible evidence other than that LHO acted alone.

There has been plenty of evidence. You chose to disregard it obviously. Have you read Jim Marrs' book on the assasination? It would take me more time than I have to go through the JFK assassination at the moment. What do you think of this deathbed confession:

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/13893143/the_last_confessions_of_e_howard_hunt/print

pauldiv

About 20 years ago there was a documentary on one of the UK channels that gave a lot of attention to the evidence in the JFK assasination.
Some interesting points they made -

The car slowed down and stopped after the shot(s) rang out.
Every chaffeur in the world who is driving important people around is trained to speed off and prevent any more damage to the passengers.

The president's brain was removed from his corpse and has never been found.
The said brain would have given the forensics team a clue as to the direction from which the fatal shot was fired.

An the amateur movie that was shot - pardon the pun - from the side of the passing car shows the presidents head goes back on impact. This means the shot was fired from somewhere in front of the car and not from the back, namely the direction of the book depository.

The rifle was a WW2 vintage Italian army carbine which is known to be cheap and inaccurate.

The presidents coffin was disposed of. Instead of being buried it was dumped into the ocean from a US military plane.

We will never know the truth because the Kennedy assasination was a coup that was carried out by some of the most cunning s.o.b's on the planet.
Some say it was Mossad, CIA and Myer Lansky.

JFK and Bobby were no angels. They were different though and they had plans that the bankers did not like one little bit, such as, printing low interest greenbacks. Lincoln wanted to do the same and release the US from their debt prison and he was eliminated also.

The guys we are talking about here are thought to be part of a small clique of families that have been assasinating people for years. There is no evidence because there are forces at work who can do just about anything they want and dont answer to anyone.

When the Queen of England says that there forces working without any form of control whatsoever then maybe we should listen. I think she was talking about "god's banker" Roberto Calvi who was found hanging from a bridge in London in 1982.

So even the Queen does not know who holds the real power because world power has a structure like corporate workplaces where everything is done on a need to know basis and run by gangsters in suits.

I enjoyed reading all the other posts but I think these days people are too scared to say what they really think.

Who knows? maybe they have been bombarding us for years with low frequency electro-magnetic waves and turning us into remote controlled zombies :-) and what passes for television 'news' and 'culture' is clogging up people brain cells.

Y'awl have a super nice day now.:D

pauldiv

About 20 years ago there was a documentary on one of the UK channels that gave a lot of attention to the evidence in the JFK assasination.
Some interesting points they made -

The car slowed down and stopped after the shot(s) rang out.
Every chaffeur in the world who is driving important people around is trained to speed off and prevent any more damage to the passengers.

The president's brain was removed from his corpse and has never been found.
The said brain would have given the forensics team a clue as to the direction from which the fatal shot was fired.

An the amateur movie that was shot - pardon the pun - from the side of the passing car shows the presidents head goes back on impact. This means the shot was fired from somewhere in front of the car and not from the back, namely the direction of the book depository.

The rifle was a WW2 vintage Italian army carbine which is known to be cheap and inaccurate.

The presidents coffin was disposed of. Instead of being buried it was dumped into the ocean from a US military plane.

We will never know the truth because the Kennedy assasination was a coup that was carried out by some of the most cunning s.o.b's on the planet.
Some say it was Mossad, CIA and Myer Lansky.

JFK and Bobby were no angels. They were different though and they had plans that the bankers did not like one little bit, such as, printing low interest greenbacks. Lincoln wanted to do the same and release the US from their debt prison and he was eliminated also.

The guys we are talking about here are thought to be part of a small clique of families that have been assasinating people for years. There is no evidence because there are forces at work who can do just about anything they want and dont answer to anyone.

When the Queen of England says that there forces working without any form of control whatsoever then maybe we should listen. I think she was talking about "god's banker" Roberto Calvi who was found hanging from a bridge in London in 1982.

So even the Queen does not know who holds the real power because world power has a structure like corporate workplaces where everything is done on a need to know basis and run by gangsters in suits.

I enjoyed reading all the other posts but I think these days people are too scared to say what they really think.

Who knows? maybe they have been bombarding us for years with low frequency electro-magnetic waves and turning us into remote controlled zombies :-) and what passes for television 'news' and 'culture' is clogging up people brain cells.

Y'awl have a super nice day now.:D

Wishbone Ash

Kernel wrote: »

That's because, as he himself said, he was a patsy

One has to be innocent to be a 'patsy'. Are you seriously suggesting that LHO didn't shoot the president?

Kernel wrote:

A screw-up. Who was promptly shot dead by a mobster.

Oswald was a nobody who wanted to be a somebody. Two days later, he was killed by another nobody who wanted to be a somebody.

Kernel wrote:

Don't you find that a little... convenient?

The safety of Oswald was of huge concern to the Dallas Police and had originally organised a CIT van to transfer him to the County jail. If Ruby hadn't shot him, thete was a good chance that others would have done so.

(When he was arrested outside the Texas theatre, over 200 people had gathered outside, some of whom pleaded with the police to release him so that they could kill him).

Kernel wrote:

Have you got a link to that information?

Among others, it was presented by the 'prosecution' in the large budget 1986 21 hour mock trial using real witnesses from the Kennedy assination.

Kernal wrote:

The part where they claim LHO was acting alone and killed JFK!

Do you seriously think that the 7 Commissioners, all distinguished gentlemen, many at the peak of their careers, as well as the 14 Assistant Counsels, and all the staff members of the Commission were 'in' on this supposed conspiracy. Even if one member believed it, do you think he convinced all the others to share his view and how would he know that they would go along with it. And do you not think it strange that noone would have shouted 'stop' and made their excuses. It's impossible to keep a secret between 3 people never mind hundreds (and that's only within the Warren Commission). The idea that the Warren Commission was part of the supposed 'conspiracy' is just preposterous.

Kernal wrote:

There has been plenty of evidence. You chose to disregard it obviously

What evidence? All the credible evidence points to LHO and that he acted alone. It is the conspiracy people who choose to disregard all the solid evidence and believe the myths peddled by Groden, Lane et al.

Kernal wrote:

Have you read Jim Marrs' book on the assasination?

Presumably you are referring to 'Crossfire'?

You'll be telling us next that you believe the deaf chap (Hoffman?).

Kernal wrote:

It would take me more time than I have to go through the JFK assassination at the moment.

I totally agree!

Kernal wrote:

What do you think of this deathbed confession:

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/13893143/the_last_confessions_of_e_howard_hunt/print

I wouldn't believe a word of it. Sensationalism sells. People like to make money from their supposed family connections to the assassination.

I prefer to concentrate of the contemporaneous evidence/testimonies.

pauldiv wrote: »

About 20 years ago there was a documentary on one of the UK channels that gave a lot of attention to the evidence in the JFK assasination

Presumably you are referring to "The men who killed Kennedy" brought out for the 25th anniversary. Another tissue of lies and half truths aimed at causing sensation and high ratings which wheeled out a few odd balls and, like all the others, ignored the actual evidence.

Sofa_King Good

Trev M wrote: »

I pop in here every now and then to read what "all the nutters in internet land" are saying and what all the "ignorant blind fools cant see is really going on".

Personally Id love to buy into some of them for no other reason than it would make the world a more interesting place:D but generally Im skeptictical

Anyway I was wondering what the greatest all time proven conspiracies are...
I guess Watergate is up there? (maybe that doesnt count as a conspiracy)

Ive no interest in flaming anyone an all that crap my question is genuine...proven conspiracies...hit me.:)

It was on the eircom.net website this morning (strangely it is down now and not available anywhere else I can find), that in 1956 with Egypt having just Nationalised the Suez Canal, Israel, France, and Great Britain conspired together...What came about was Israel attacking Egypt, with GB and the French stepping in to "preserve peace" and control the area, a plan which ultimately was succesful and refuted in the house of commons at the time. Was in the previously unreleased diary of a some secretary in the British parliament at the time,

aidan24326

Diogenes wrote:

The "confession" Of E. Howard Hunt, comes from his estranged coke addled son. We have only his son's word as to his fathers dying confession.

Yeah I wasn't saying I believed it, just thought it was interesting, as it was the first time I'd come across even an alleged confession.

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

One has to be innocent to be a 'patsy'. Are you seriously suggesting that LHO didn't shoot the president?

And are you seriously suggesting you can prove that he did? Now I'm not saying I buy into the conspiracy theories, but by professing to know for certain that LHO shot Kennedy and acted entirely alone you are nearly as bad as the conspiracy theorists, because there's no way you can know that for certain. The only man who could have answered that question was murdered, rather conveniently, very soon after his alleged crime.

I think the problem nowadays is that everything is seen as a bloody conspiracy, and all it does is muddy the waters.

The likes of wishbone ash and diogenes here take the opposite extreme though, and seem to think that governments and powerful organisations are all entirely honest and don't do anything wrong.

Smudgeyboy

I cant believe a JFK debate still goes on this long after the CIA assasinated him

d0gb0y

Gulf of Tonkin, which i'm sure in its day was a conspiracy theory. This event led to the US stepping up its operations in South Vietnam. Of course this event probably would not have been allowed had JFK not been assassinated.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_of_Tonkin_Incident

Pearl Harbour, Well the US knew it was coming and actually encouraged it to happen. The dutch had cracked the IJN code and a dutch sub tracked the taskforce. The Russians through their top spy in Japan warned the US of impending Japanese attacks, this allowed the Russians to pull their Siberian divisions to the area around Moscow. Australia & the UK had cracked the IJN code & warned their non combatant(USN was actually engaging with the boats in the Atlantic) ally about it. The americans had cracked the japanese diplomatic codes prior to PH & then almost straight after the attack on PH they cracked the IJN code & where able to launch the doolittle raid & pull off midway.

Lusitania, it sank while carrying munitions making it a valid target for the Germans. There where hundreds of warning to the american public about travelling at this time & travelling on a ship that was known to have carried munitions before. The captain went of course & was warned about u boat activity in the area(other ships recently attacked). He also failed to follow procedure when there was uboat activity...he did not adopt a zigzag pattern. In the end it was a propaganda ploy by the US & the entente to sway american public opinion to enter the war. Even though Woodrow Wilson in his 1916 campaign, his slogan was "He kept us out of the war"