The M50 Barrier Free Tolling Thread

*becky*

All this about ignoring solicitors letters is very silly unless you are %100 sure you paid up

Our man in Havana

If you have paid and can prove it, ignoring them is not silly.

How are all in Listowel by the way?

*becky*

Also any time i have to phone which i admit is v often, the staff in the call centre are very helpful and do their best for you, i think that the fault lies behind the scenes in the so called head office, but the poor ppl answering phones are getting the brunt of it all.

*becky*

listowel??

Traumadoc

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2009/0416/breaking70.htm

Our man in Havana

I don't think that will fix anything. The problem is with the toll operator.

*becky*

I agree

Sizzler

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/complaints-soar-over-toll-blunders-1711713.html?from=dailynews

wrote:

OVER 10,000 motorists have complained about poor customer service after being incorrectly charged for using the barrier-free M50.

And yesterday it emerged that a second customer care agent has been employed by the company operating the tolling system in an effort to placate angry motorists.

Bet Eireflow, the company operating the barrier-free tolling system, was told to review customer care by the National Roads Authority.

Customers who cannot get through to Teleperformance in Newry will now be transferred to Abtran in Cork who will handle their query.

"There's customer service competition between both. There will be no more calls dropped for at least the next two months," a source said.

A review of both operations to be concluded in the coming months could lead to Abtran taking control of customer relations, they added.

The move comes after complaints from the National Roads Authority and National Consumer Agency about the standard of service being provided by Bet Eireflow to the 100,000 motorists who use the M50 every day.

On another note I used the M50 last week and just didnt get a chance to pay for it within the 48 hours. Have just checked their site and they have the toll penalty closed already Free trips, I wont complain

Seth Brundle

*becky* wrote: »

Thats because they have your address which they get from the nvdf data base.

So how do they manage to bill people who weren't near the M50 at the time of the journey?

*becky* wrote: »

Also any time i have to phone which i admit is v often, the staff in the call centre are very helpful and do their best for you, i think that the fault lies behind the scenes in the so called head office, but the poor ppl answering phones are getting the brunt of it all.

Incidentally why do you need to ring them so often?

boarddotie

Eeek, I still owe €146 to the solicitors and I am very near to paying. I have held out this long but Im getting kinda scared...just a bit of background to my situation:

boarddotie wrote: »

Hi everyone,

I have just read the full 1,000 and whatever posts in this thread and its interesting that the first many hundered are all about teething problems etc and the last few are more 'serious' solicitor type querys. So can I add one and look for some advice:

I took two trips on M50 (first and last) in December and didnt pay my toll within the 48hours. When I remembered I went to website and imputted my reg in (what I thought was) the main/only casual use payment section. 2 trips. It quoted me €6. Pefect and I paid. Thought no more.

About a week later got 2 letters for the trips saying I owe €6 for each for unpaid tolls. I had heard about the teething problems so (stupidly) assumed the payment hadnt been processed by the time the letter was issued so I ignored them. (I would say I stupidly ignored them but a lot of poepl seem to be doing that!).

Two weeks or so later I got another two relating to my trips saying I owed €46 each. That spurred me into action and I ranf e-flow, told them my stroy and girl in the call centre and when I said I have the transaction on my Lasercard statement she said sorry there was/must have been a problem. She then said she would 'put a note with these UTNs' to say that I had rang up to sort it out and it was cleared. I made her promise to do this as I didnt want more letters..

So low and behold, a week ago I got the 2 dreaded solicitors letters from our Kerry friends saying the usual: you owe €146 (times2), non payment will be taken to court, found guilty, stubbs gazette, never be able to get some credit again! So I didnt freak out because I have my trusty payment done and on my Lasercard.

Got onto the people working for/with the solicitors/e-flow (dunno what the combination is at this stage) and lady said she would look into it. Perfect. Then she rang back 2 days later (takes 48 hours for e-flow to release the details even though the people at e-flow said that once its handed to the solicitors they dont 'own' that info anymore) to say that by the time I had paid this €6 I actually owed €12 as it was beyond the 48 hour deadline and that I had paid the toll in the wrong section (should have been under pay a penalty tab). Frick. So I calmly said I had rang the e-flow centre to query the letters alright and that the girl didnt bring any problem to my attention at that time. Off to investigate that. No record of that on my 'profile' or whatever. I told her the exact time/date and call duration of this call from my online call history but said I couldnt remember the girls name and I (stupidly) didnt ask for written confirmation that I was in the clear. Rings back to day there is no evidence of this call happening and when I tell ehr I have it in my call history she says that I could have been on hold that entire time, that proves nothing. Each tim, at the end of the voicemail that the leave me (im always the one ringing them back) they end the call with 'so your notices still stand'. Never missing an opportnity to mention that I will be brought to court, stubbs gazette, credit rating kaput. This last call happned on Friday when I was out foreign on hols and I was getting angry. I said I had paid that €6 in good faith and assuming if the system tells me €6 when I put in my reg number. Said I had tried and in my opinion suceeded in rectifying the situation and just because e-flow cant find a record of my call, does not mean it didnt happen. She said I have to prove myself innocent, thats not e-flows problem. I asked her by the way what happened to that €6 I did pay-it seems to have just gone into thin air and be related to no trups at all. he cheeky mare said they would refund me that €6 but the fines still stand. I told her I am not letting it lie, no way. And she said ring back today which I didnt do yet.

Since then I have been freaking the bean that I will be taken to court! I can see now what I did wrong when paying originally but is it my fault the system doesnt connect the reg imputted in one section to the pay a penalty section (probably)? But only the letters alerted me to the problem but the subsequent phonecall to the centre didnt and she said I was ok. It has really upset me. Im young and while I can scrounge up the €146*2 Im now feeling so bullied and threatened Im considering legal advice and going to court (if they take me).

I have read a few previous posts who have argued with the solicitors but what has happened? ANy outcomes? ANd I know people have said 'ignore the letters' but that hsant helped me. The FoI idea is interesting and I would do that, how is this possible.

Its bullyboy tactics and im sure many people have succumed regardless of their innosence when the words 'court' and 'credit rating' are mentioned.

All advice and reality checks are welcome and needed!

I have sent them a letter like I was advised to do with all my details, receipts and the sequence of communications that I have had with both e-flow and the solicitors. I have told them I made a genuine mistake when originally paying for my trips but that when i contacted e-flow they said it was sorted. I got a letter back saying I still owe one €146 regardless (I got the other €146 cancelled out) and the whole case still stands.

I know people are saying I will never go to court but it would be just my luck that it would! I am studying abroad for the Summer and dont want to have to come home early to face a court session. My Ma is up the walls as the letters go to my home hom first (and of course she opens them :rolleyes:) and says she will ring them up and pay it just to get it sorted and I am beginning to feel that way now too...

Sizzler

boarddotie wrote: »

Eeek, I still owe €146 to the solicitors and I am very near to paying. I have held out this long but Im getting kinda scared...just a bit of background to my situation:



I have sent them a letter like I was advised to do with all my details, receipts and the sequence of communications that I have had with both e-flow and the solicitors. I have told them I made a genuine mistake when originally paying for my trips but that when i contacted e-flow they said it was sorted. I got a letter back saying I still owe one €146 regardless (I got the other €146 cancelled out) and the whole case still stands.

I know people are saying I will never go to court but it would be just my luck that it would! I am studying abroad for the Summer and dont want to have to come home early to face a court session. My Ma is up the walls as the letters go to my home hom first (and of course she opens them :rolleyes:) and says she will ring them up and pay it just to get it sorted and I am beginning to feel that way now too...

Simple - Call Sean O'Neill (The NRA's PRO) Explain your situation and I would be very surprised if its not sorted by Monday.

http://www.nra.ie/AboutUs/ContactInformation/#d.en.2330

Carawaystick

boarddotie wrote: »

I know people are saying I will never go to court but it would be just my luck that it would! I am studying abroad for the Summer and dont want to have to come home early to face a court session. My Ma is up the walls as the letters go to my home hom first (and of course she opens them :rolleyes:) and says she will ring them up and pay it just to get it sorted and I am beginning to feel that way now too...

If you are going to live in another country, just let the NRA know your new address! and don't bother telling them when you move back here.

tell yer ma that opening letters not addressed to her is a criminal offence not a civil offence like non-payment of the toll....

L1011

Bond-007 wrote: »

I don't think that will fix anything. The problem is with the toll operator.

Depends how much is outsourced - these outsourcing firms can sometimes cover everything up to billing and some IT systems. The Abtran crowd seem to offer some of those services as it happens. But if eFlow are doing that I doubt they *can* run parallel systems though.

Carawaystick

remember Eflow is not a company, "Eflow Barrier free tolling" is only a business name of the NRA. Just because they want you to ring people in the north doesn't mean you need to deal with them. ring the NRA. look up he contact details for them on their website.

this is probably the link you need
http://www.nra.ie/AboutUs/CustomerService/

but there are also:
a customer charter
http://www.nra.ie/Publications/DownloadableDocumentation/NRAPolicyDocuments/file,11159,en.pdf

and a customer action plan
http://www.nra.ie/Publications/DownloadableDocumentation/NRAPolicyDocuments/file,11160,en.pdf

Lenny

HI,
I'd like ot add to this also.
I paid my toll late (1 day) paid the 6euro..
anyways thought everything was grand ecept I didn't get my post and it had been put down somewere and nobody told me. and I saw all the fines then(for two trips)
andway rang them up, got talking to a lad called "johnny" with an english accent
said I got the letters, he said there was an error on the system and I had to pay a further 6 euro.
grand I thought, btw i had also appeaded the fine by accdient on the site before I rang him. then last week i get a letter saying my appeal had been declined.
rang again, got talking to a girl told her the suitation again, that I had paid 6euro twice now... as I was ringing on someone's behalf I was not able to set up an account with them, if the registered owner did they would clear the fines.(she put a note on the system) great I thought. this was last wednesday i was talking to them. told the gf about it to ring them and she only got around to it today. rings them up and they say they can't help her as she is being prosaccuted by there solictors it was sent out last wednesday!

gf rings the solictors directly and the girl tells them they have not received anyhting yet but it will be investigated when they do..
So assuming she is gonna get two €146 fines in post
where do I stand now?
I only have receipt of one payment on the cc(the second one)
this is going on months now at this stage(more than 2)
help appreacted

Telgere

Finally after 6 or so months got back the 200€ they overcharged us for two trips in the same day. After 20 odd calls faxing cc statements etc. Joke of an operation they have running.

DrumSteve

was on the phone to them there. apparently i have to pay 91€ cos there system is a joke. i used the toll three times and paid nine euro. but on there system they only have me down as using it twice and the €9 payment never actually went towards anything because no €9 trip had been made! haha ****in shambles of an organisation i told the girl there was no way in hell i was payin that amount of money they can get the boat.

why should i have to pay for their shambles of a system? :mad:

L1011

Carawaystick wrote: »

remember Eflow is not a company, "Eflow Barrier free tolling" is only a business name of the NRA. Just because they want you to ring people in the north doesn't mean you need to deal with them. ring the NRA. look up he contact details for them on their website.

this is probably the link you need
http://www.nra.ie/AboutUs/CustomerService/

but there are also:
a customer charter
http://www.nra.ie/Publications/DownloadableDocumentation/NRAPolicyDocuments/file,11159,en.pdf

and a customer action plan
http://www.nra.ie/Publications/DownloadableDocumentation/NRAPolicyDocuments/file,11160,en.pdf

Its run by a firm called Bet Eire Flow, not the NRA themselves.

Our man in Havana

Sounds like a bookies.

*becky*

does anyone know if any cases have went to court yet??

Our man in Havana

None yet.

I am sure that the NRA will be crowing from the rooftops when they win an undefended case. A big spread in the Indo is expected. They will be claiming it as an epic win.
It would be important in the propaganda war to keep the peasantry compliant.

Sizzler

MYOB wrote: »

Its run by a firm called Bet Eire Flow, not the NRA themselves.

Correct, but the point of the NRA's details being posted on here are because ultimately they are the organ grinder in this whole farce and if enough people complain to them about this shoddy outfit they will have to take action....as they appear to have done by switching some of their business around.

whiterebel

And here I go again........

Have had a tag from Fermoy almost 12 months. After receiving mountains of fines from eFlaw, they eventually realised, apologised and everything was ok. Changed the car in February, I correctly notified changes to Direct Route/Intolligent and now eFlaw are back after me again for 2 trips up and back the M50 in the new car. One is disputed, but the other, in their wisdom, they have said is a valid transaction and lumped it up to €47, despite me giving them the account and tag numbers. Beauty of it all, is that the photographs they have included? You can see the tag!!!!! I have written to them today, told them I'd be more than happy to see them in court, and to be prepared to pay for my time and expenses writing, emailing, answering their correspondence etc.

Jesus, how one company can be so incompetent defies belief.

Carawaystick

Telgere wrote: »

Finally after 6 or so months got back the 200€ they overcharged us for two trips in the same day. After 20 odd calls faxing cc statements etc. Joke of an operation they have running.

if you're a private (not a commercial) driver, you can make a small claim against them online.

regarding beteire flow, If you got your baggage damaged on a ryanair flight, would you blame the handling agent or Ryanair?
you have a contract with the nra for using the westlink, and the advertised price for a car is EUR3. This is all you owe, and you owe it to the nra.

Our man in Havana

I am sure that their penalty charges are unlawful.
It will be interesting to see how a properly defended case goes in court.

rustbucket

Hey

Just got a notification from E-flows solicitors about an unpaid fine, I now owe them €152.

I have a pay monthly eflow tag on my car and have always paid by direct debit. I decided to take a trip north in my old mini (no tag) and forgot about the toll.

I have bought a house and the last 4 months has been a nightmare and I genuiniely forgot to pay the inital toll and fine. I even asked them at one stage to transfer the fine to my Tag account whihc they said they could not do.

I have rung the solicitors to explain the situation as well as Eflow and both say they cannot reduce the amount and it has to be paid within 7 days.

Bottom line is I didnt understand the post payment thing initially as I normally pay by direct debit and I should have paid the €40 fine when I got it but I genuinely forgot.

Does the fact that I always pay on my account stand for nothing? I am more than happy to pay the €40 fine but feel €152 for 1 trip unpaid is grossly excessive?

Anyone got any suggestions. certainly wont be taking my old car out for a spin anytime soon

boarddotie

rustbucket wrote: »

Hey

Just got a notification from E-flows solicitors about an unpaid fine, I now owe them €152.

I have a pay monthly eflow tag on my car and have always paid by direct debit. I decided to take a trip north in my old mini (no tag) and forgot about the toll.

I have bought a house and the last 4 months has been a nightmare and I genuiniely forgot to pay the inital toll and fine. I even asked them at one stage to transfer the fine to my Tag account whihc they said they could not do.

I have rung the solicitors to explain the situation as well as Eflow and both say they cannot reduce the amount and it has to be paid within 7 days.

Bottom line is I didnt understand the post payment thing initially as I normally pay by direct debit and I should have paid the €40 fine when I got it but I genuinely forgot.

Does the fact that I always pay on my account stand for nothing? I am more than happy to pay the €40 fine but feel €152 for 1 trip unpaid is grossly excessive?

Anyone got any suggestions. certainly wont be taking my old car out for a spin anytime soon

Just pay it. I was in a similar situation a while back. Some background:

boarddotie wrote: »

Eeek, I still owe €146 to the solicitors and I am very near to paying. I have held out this long but Im getting kinda scared...just a bit of background to my situation:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=59439241#post59439241

I have sent them a letter like I was advised to do with all my details, receipts and the sequence of communications that I have had with both e-flow and the solicitors. I have told them I made a genuine mistake when originally paying for my trips but that when i contacted e-flow they said it was sorted. I got a letter back saying I still owe one €146 regardless (I got the other €146 cancelled out) and the whole case still stands.

I know people are saying I will never go to court but it would be just my luck that it would! I am studying abroad for the Summer and dont want to have to come home early to face a court session. My Ma is up the walls as the letters go to my home hom first (and of course she opens them :rolleyes:) and says she will ring them up and pay it just to get it sorted and I am beginning to feel that way now too...

I have now paid one full €146 that they claim I owe but technically I should just owe a €6 from the start. I felt bullied into it and the only thing that could support my case was an record with the e-flow call centre of me having made the phone call to them and them saying that my account was fine, and it was their error. No such record exists they tell me. So I was willing to take my chances in court if it ever came to court but to have a properly defended case etc would cost me more monetarily and more in trauma and worry. So i just pay the gaddam thing and I think you should do the same. It was your fault and as bad and inefficient as their system is, we have to be realistic here.

Our man in Havana

Why are people simply rolling over?

Seth Brundle

When threatened, its easy to believe that solicitors are in the right!

boarddotie

Bond-007 wrote: »

Why are people simply rolling over?

I had fought my 'case' for 6 weeks now and got one of my €146 cancelled. There was no rolling over by me. It was more of a very very slow flop...

kbannon wrote: »

When threatened, its easy to believe that solicitors are in the right!

Very true, but after 6 weeks of trying to prove my case I had exhausted all avenues save paying €90 to write me a solicitors letter. For a fine of only €146 I didnt see the point. My principles and my strong views against them were gone. I am away with work in the US for thw whole Summer and I didnt want it hanging over me.

Those solictiors are not right but at some stage its ok to come off the high horse and cut your losses.