JC Decaux signs start appearing - Shocking.

LostinBlanch

A pavement extension is the last thing that Richmond Road needs. It's hard enough to get through as it is. But that sign is still there.

eringobragh

LostinBlanch wrote: »

A pavement extension is the last thing that Richmond Road needs. It's hard enough to get through as it is. But that sign is still there.

x2 i've nearly been minus my wingmirror there a couple of times and Yes it's still up MadsL

MadsL

Shockingly DCC could be left with taxpayers responsible for any liability issues...:eek:

From The Sunday Times
August 10, 2008

Dublin bike scheme wobbles over liability
Billboards are deemed unsafe, write Colin Coyle and Ruadhan MacEoin



DUBLIN'S "free bike scheme" for its citizens has encountered an
unexpected obstacle.

It has emerged that the city council will be liable for accidents
caused by the billboards that have been erected on the capital's
streets as part of the scheme, even though the boards are privately
owned.

The council has allowed JC Decaux, a French company, to erect 72
advertising panels in exchange for 450 bicycles in a
"bikes-for-billboards" scheme. But the panels have been criticised as
unsafe by drivers, pedestrians and the National Council for the Blind
of Ireland (NCBI).

Unlike usual billboards, the advertising panels are attached to the
footpath, with edges finished in steel. Drivers claim they block
sightlines and could cause accidents.

Legal advice given last year to Jim Keogan, the city planner, from
Terence O'Keeffe, a law agent, states that as the council is
responsible for all "repairs and maintenance", it also becomes
"responsible for any public liability issues that arise in those areas
in the event of accidents etc, occurring".

The council asked O'Keeffe for legal advice before a hearing into the
bikes-for-billboards scheme last October. In Chicago, a similar scheme
is on hold because of questions over public liability.

"It's all about lawyers. That's the only hang-up," Chicago's mayor,
Richard M Daley, said earlier this month.

Ian Lumley of An Taisce, said: "It is bizarre that the local authority
may be carrying the can of legal responsibility for units belonging to
a private developer."

Lumley's criticism is echoed by former Lord Mayor and Labour
councillor Dermot Lacey, who is calling for the scheme to be
"immediately suspended". Lacey said that it would be "completely,
totally, and utterly unacceptable" for the council to be responsible
for private commercial hoardings that are "potentially dangerous" and
"visually obtrusive".

In some instances, such as at Synnott Place on Dorset Street, and at
Rathmines, billboards were quickly removed after motorists complained
they obscured sightlines.

Des Kenny of the NCBI said: "JC- Decaux was offered assistance \ 18
months ago. We were surprised when the offer was not taken up, as it
was made free-of-charge."

He added: "If the company was already aware that it was not legally
responsible for the billboards, did it take as much care in its
attention to design and location as it would have otherwise?"

The council will receive no revenue from the advertising or rental of
the advertising spaces, but 32 panels will carry civic information on
one side. However, there is still no sign of the promised bikes. The
council said this weekend that they are due to arrive next spring. It
has yet to disclose how much it will cost Dubliners to use them.

In other cities where JCDecaux has set up schemes, users pre-register
with a credit card, paying about €30 a year on top of the charge for
using a bicycle. If someone loses a bicycle or fails to return it to a
docking station within a set period of time, the replacement cost of a
bicycle, about €150, is deducted from their credit card.

The company has established schemes in 21 cities, including Paris,
Seville, Cordoba, Brussels, Vienna and Lyon.

In Paris, 100,000 people use the 20,000 Velib bikes every day, but
vandalism and the cost of spare parts for the bikes cost JCDecaux
€20.6m in the first half of the year. In the first year, a third of
the bikes were damaged or stolen.

Two Velib riders have been killed and the French Cycle Touring
Federation said there have been problems with "letting loose hundreds
of people who haven't been on a bike in years".

Dublin city council said this weekend that its legal department was
still examining the issue of public liability over the billboards.

JCDecaux declined to comment.

gibo_ie

The board at the west end of Parnell Street (Outside cineworld) was gone this morning!!
Cobblelock is back in place, this only happened since friday as i walked down here then...
Hopefully this is one of many which will disappear!!

BrianD

Got a letter from DCC saying that there was no planning issues with the Charlotte Way/Camden St. signs and that my query was being passed to health and safety for review.

spurious

I see they have started putting scrolling ads in them now - for that little bit more distraction for drivers.

BrianD

Yeah, I think DCC have got their month of free adverts. They're running some generic advert that I am sure will be researched to demonstrate how effective they are. Rate card has now been published for both of these new formats.

I wonder who will be first to advertise?

donvito99

there ws one in rathmines blocking the whole footpath , and blocking most of the sunlight from a takeaway

Seth Brundle

BrianD wrote: »

I wonder who will be first to advertise?

Planning consultants and Personal Injury Solicitors

lostexpectation

council-objects-to-stencilled-ad-on-wall
http://www.herald.ie/national-news/city-news/council-objects-to-stencilled-ad-on-wall-1544661.html

DECEMBER ISSUE - PLAN MAGAZINE, Ireland's leading architectural publication, has conducted a major investigation the results of which are published in our current issue. In conducting our research, we uncovered key findings including:

Dublin City Council's own internal report finds majority of units inspected to be deficient regarding road safety yet units nonetheless deemed as compliant

No schedule yet for the independent safety audit, although vast majority of units are in place.

JC Decaux's list of 50 predominantly already obsolete billboards accepted as complying with the condition that sought to reduce 100 billboards around the city

Billboards erected on roads known to have a bad safety record

Alcohol adverts now flashing outside schools

"Having published the previously secret rezoning map in April used to deliver the Decaux scheme, Plan Magazine lifts the lid and again further exposes significant new shortcomings some of which are potential public safety hazards."
Synopsis of our findings:

1. On request by councillors, city officials conducted an internal audit whereby 32 site inspections were carried out in city-centre areas, primarily on the smaller "metropanel" units, now freestanding on footpaths. Twenty-seven had been erected at time of inspection, yet of the units only eight appear to be completely free from "road user infringements". Although the majority appear to have deficiencies in terms of road safety and could be potentially dangerous, such as "blind spots" (council's own description) and sightlines blocked, all bar one have been deemed to be compliant.

2. Forty-six other units, primarily the larger "metropole" type, do not appear to have been inspected; however Plan Magazine has correlated data provided by the Gardai with locations of development, and it appears that approximately 25 have been built on roads known to have bad history of accidents. (Any of the larger "metropole" units that were appealed to An Bord Pleanála were shot down, primarily because of road safety concerns; in contrast Dublin City Council approved 100% all such applications in the first instance. No Environmental Impact Assessment was ever carried out.)

3. In total, of the 78 "metropole" and "metropanel" units, approximately 50 raise problems in terms of road safety, or are located on dangerous roads. Despite this the independent safety audit required has not even been advertised for contract with no timetable apparent as to when it is likely to be carried out.

4. The condition stipulating a cleanup of the city by the removal of 100 billboards has seemingly been retrospectively changed to 50, yet the evidence of decommissioned hoardings by JC Decaux appears to have significant peculiarities. Of the 50 units, 30 roads and streets are listed – yet only 20 of these are identifiable with specific numbers provided. Having conducted site examinations of the locations, Plan Magazine has discovered that many of the sites were already under or effected by redevelopment, including in one case state land where a garda station is being built, while in other instances it appears that some addresses provided do not exist.

5. Other matters including alcohol adverts outside schools such as on Dorset Street, land ownership issues, estimates of the scheme being worth €150 million, liability questions and more!


h/t cactus flower at machinenation

Ste.phen

lostexpectation wrote: »

council-objects-to-stencilled-ad-on-wall
http://www.herald.ie/national-news/city-news/council-objects-to-stencilled-ad-on-wall-1544661.html

DECEMBER ISSUE - PLAN MAGAZINE, Ireland's leading architectural publication, has conducted a major investigation the results of which are published in our current issue. In conducting our research, we uncovered key findings including:

I like the juxtaposition there, but it could have been clearer
The incredible hypocrisy is astounding! Even if the stencil ads are on private property, is theree a law against partially cleaning someone else's wall?

BrianD

I hear a rumour that a similar deal has been done with DLR CC. Check for planning applications!

lostexpectation

and we won't find out the details of that because they'll be negotiating with other councils and on and on...

plan ireland are making themselves useful whos behind that?

somebody go get a full copy, and must send more emails to the council when here next meeting?

lostexpectation

billboards-on-citys-streets-are-not-safe
http://www.herald.ie/national-news/city-news/billboards-on-citys-streets-are-not-safe-1556470.html

Highsider

It's bang out of order that they are being allowed to get away with this. The signs are a danger everyone.:mad:

Judgement Day

It's been the same on CIE/IE for years where stations have been regarded as vacant space for every type of crap advertising sign going. I would like to see where the revenue goes - bet precious little of it to improving facilities for rail travellers. Bray station is cluttered with this c..p and there is no waiting room whatsoever for passengers - even inter-city ones - and the whole station is a no-go area. Disgusting toilets, no security and village idiots running riot while the staff at the ticket barriers appear to serve no useful purpose. Sorry for wandering off the point but I am tired of writing to the CEO of IE about same.

MadsL

If you haven't already seen some these safety failures and DCC's city manager's failure to order a immediate safety review, either view my channelon youtube or see below...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ka2xiMQtqFA

City Manager's refusal to conduct a independant safety review

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyYqE6lv2M8

lostexpectation

so is this report available

MadsL

(Hopefully) there will be a an emergency motion at tonight's (1st Dec) Dublin City Council meeting requesting the City Manager to bring a report about the €185m that JCD will make from these scheme - see todays Examiner (page 3)

€185m for them, 450 bikes for us....:mad:

Emergency motions are usually taken at 9pm - watch live here

http://www.dublincity.public-i.tv/site/#webcast

Seth Brundle

Any update on that meeting (not holding my breath on anything positive!)

MadsL

Motion passed

Watch this space!

lostexpectation

the newspapers talked about report already done, is that report being made public.

plan ireland seem to have most of it already.

MadsL

http://www.dublincity.public-i.tv/site/#webcast

Watch from about 9 minutes (the emergency motion got 'lost')

Then keep watching to see Dermot Lacey bring this up again.

The Finance SPC is today...(but I doubt the report will be)

lostexpectation

the manager knows nothing

he hasn't read the report , thats an extraordinary admission.

bfc

Damn - they're actually doing it...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ratRVRSoPBA

Seth Brundle

seemingly!
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/0501/1224245759208.html?via=mr

Labour councillor Andrew Montague, who has campaigned for the scheme for several years, said the rental rates had been set at a level which would attract a high number of users.

“It will cost €10 a year to join and the first half an hour rental will be free; there will be an increasing scale of rents after that to encourage a frequent turnover of the bikes at the stations.”

The bicycles will also be available to tourists at a reduced joining fee. The scheme, which has been run by JC Decaux in several cities including Paris, Vienna and Lyon, has proved extremely popular, Mr Montague said.

FFS charging a "joining fee" to tourists!

Cookie_Monster

indo wrote:

JC Decaux in several cities including Paris, Vienna and Lyon

A joining fee for tourists is pretty low alright.

Do they have to pay it in the quoted cities?

monument

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

A joining fee for tourists is pretty low alright.

Do they have to pay it in the quoted cities?

In Paris they do anyway. The subscription fee is also low in cost -- it's minimum. And with a lot of people only taking less then a half hour from station to station that may be the only cost they pay.

parsi

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

A joining fee for tourists is pretty low alright.

Do they have to pay it in the quoted cities?

You have to pay it in Luxembourg.

dereko1969

i used these in paris and felt it was a great system, i hadn't signed up but my mate who was living there at the time had and it was brilliant for cycling up along the seine from the metro stop to a museum.

once you know where the location of a 'station' is you're grand. i think it could prove very useful for people cycling to and from heuston or connolly to stephen's green and not wanting to get stuck in traffic. or even for scooting around town to meetings during the day.

Rawr

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

A joining fee for tourists is pretty low alright.

Do they have to pay it in the quoted cities?

Here in Oslo you pay about 10 euro a year for the service.
But that's it. You can freely use the bike for 2 hours each time, with no additional charge.
Although this is run by Clear Channel, and not JCD.

L1011

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

A joining fee for tourists is pretty low alright.

Do they have to pay it in the quoted cities?

Might discourage tourists used to European levels of driver courtesy/knowledge of cyclists from trying (and dying) to cycle through Dublin...

bfc

here's a clearer vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjyP40QqMXo

I'll admit that I'd be tempted, as long as there was a docking point free at the station I'd arrive at (coz if there isn't - it's your tough).

The real pity is that this couldn't have been accomplished as part of the city's "real" public transport system. So instead of having something that works well and makes everyone happy, we have something that might work, but which we ultimately know serves JCDeceaux's interests far above the interests of Dublin City Council and the inhabitants of Dublin. I guess the argument by DCC would be that they are too stupid/slow to get something like this going on their own (or even broker a decent deal), and that's fair enough...

magwea

Anyone have a map with all the bike stations?

Had seen the metal frame for these at Bolton street a few weeks ago , and couldn't for the life of me figure out what they were.

bg07

magwea wrote: »

Anyone have a map with all the bike stations?

Had seen the metal frame for these at Bolton street a few weeks ago , and couldn't for the life of me figure out what they were.

http://www.aaireland.ie/download/bikescheme.pdf

magwea

Thanks bg07, had just stumbled onto this page myself and was about to reply to my own question.

Looking at the map there are 24 bike stations on the south side vs 16 on the north side. Aren't the greatest amount of JCDecaux signs on the northside? What gives?

enda1

magwea wrote: »

Thanks bg07, had just stumbled onto this page myself and was about to reply to my own question.

Looking at the map there are 24 bike stations on the south side vs 16 on the north side. Aren't the greatest amount of JCDecaux signs on the northside? What gives?

Why should the placement of the advertisements and the bikes be somehow related?

magwea

Well yes, the advertising is paying for the bikes. Why should certain areas have to pay the cost of the scheme form which they gain no benefit. Seems a bit unfair. Or am i being naive.