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Disaster. Snappy snap crack :(

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  • Subscribers Posts: 4,076 ✭✭✭IRLConor


    rrpc wrote: »
    You have SERIOUS cant issues :eek:

    I cant about the same amount while prone. I'm rebuilding my position at the moment and it's one of the things I'm trying to reduce because it's a pain in the ass when adjusting the sights.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    IRLConor wrote: »
    I cant about the same amount while prone. I'm rebuilding my position at the moment and it's one of the things I'm trying to reduce because it's a pain in the ass when adjusting the sights.

    I used to be that soldier until I started getting very strange recoil characteristics (a sort of double recoil). The second part of it was almost infinitesimal but would result in an 8 if I was lucky. It was utterly horrible and couldn't be anticipated because I could get a 10 followed by an eight or worse.

    Everyone attempted to diagnose the problem including Barry Dagger, Dave Parish and anyone else I could grab a hold of. End result after about three years of fighting with this, I took the cant off and lo and behold it was gone.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    demonloop wrote: »
    Glad it got there in one piece (pun intended) :D
    Me too! Nice touch shipping it in the case :D

    On the cant, it'd be an issue in prone but in standing, you have to cant. Well. Granted, as with most of these things, you do get the odd genetic freak who doesn't and who's trained enough over twenty years to be able to shoot well with their heads at a 45 degree angle, but there's only one or two I've ever seen at world cup level. For most people, you keep the head upright (so the inner ears are level and working) and you cant the rifle in to you.

    It looks a little odd, but who cares when the shot goes through the middle?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    Nice to see you got it fixed Sparks, and it looks well too. You be competing this winter?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    That's the plan IWM. First air rifle match is the WTSC open, there are the various college opens, Cardiff (the Welsh nationals), and there might be Intershoot next February (not sure about that one yet, it's an NTSA gig and I've seen no call for EoIs yet).


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    Excellent. I'm sure I'll see you at matches so, once I acquire me a pair of trousers.


  • Posts: 6,176 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Excellent. I'm sure I'll see you at matches so, once I acquire me a pair of trousers.

    You don't need the pants! Just go shooting.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    Ah, I'll be starting off with just the jacket and such (training these days without a jacket to try and get a better feel for inner position) but I'll want to get trousers at some point as well.


  • Posts: 6,176 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    yeah, but don't skip matches because you don't have them


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    Agreed. If you wait until you have every last bit of kit available, you'll have waited until you have no excuse for not winning the match :D


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    Oh, absolutely not. May not have them in time for the first match or two, but I'll still shoot. Any suggestions of good, reasonably priced trousers?

    I may be at a disadvantage as club trousers don't fit around my generous upper legs. Does anyone make more loose sizes or would I have to go made-to-measure?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    Sparks wrote: »
    A more complete post to follow sometime tomorrow, but first a quick teaser (with thanks to demonloop for lots of logistical support):
    Finally wrote it up:
    FrankenRifle
    Okay, so after the Snappy Disaster in May, the air rifle has lain dormant in the safe in DURC while I tried to sort out a replacement part from Anschutz. I’m sorry to say that the fabulous after-sales experience I had described to me by those who praised Anschutz to the roof wasn’t quite as evident as I thought it should have been - as far as I was concerned, it was an Anschutz bag, which broke and then didn’t protect the rifle; the impact was not significant enough to my mind to cause the amount of damage it did without there being some design or implementation flaw at work in the Anschutz stock; and I bought the rifle and the bag directly from Uwe Anschutz himself personally.

    The inital response from Anschutz was that a replacement stock was available (good, since it’s not been made for a few years) for only €500.

    Yeah, I didn’t think “only” was an appropriate term there either. Mind you, I did look round a bit at this stage and contemplated other aftermarket stocks - about the only one that looked worth it was the MEC offering:
    mecmark1airlrg.jpg
    MEC Mark 1 Air Rifle Stock

    Which is both slinky and smart, but more importantly, is made from a solid block of aluminium which is milled to shape. Far stronger than the sintering process used for the 2002CA stock. However, that stock was “only” €1500 or so.

    Right. Spoke to Anschutz again, pointed out that I thought it wasn’t a very fair price, pointed out the exact nature of the failure and Uwe himself replied and said that because it had failed when dropped outside a range, it wasn’t considered a warranty affair; but that the spare part of just the stock itself would only cost €280.

    I’m starting to hate the way other people use the word “only” at this stage. But at this point, I’ve very few choices:
    • pay €280 for a stock part (which as far as I’m concerned, is just as fragile as the original);
    • take up one of the nine or ten exceptionally generous offers to weld the old stock (seriously, people just started coming out of the woodwork with offers of help from Ireland, N.Ireland and the UK - it was tremendously cheering to see folks doing that, and my sincere thanks to all of you);
    • buy a completely new rifle and set it up all over again;

    Not that the last wasn’t a temptation, but it’s just too expensive right now. Besides, I don’t like the current Anschutz rifles (too prissy), I’ve never liked Walther’s models (though the live/dry fire switch is a smart idea), and the Feinwerkbau P700 fits my hand perfectly, but it just feels too fragile compared to the old P70. Which just leaves the Steyrs. And there’s the temptation - the LG110 is probably the deadest rifle I’ve ever fired in my life. Shooters far better than me have said the same thing. You pull the trigger, you feel the trigger go back, you hear the shot, but the rifle just sits there. Seriously, it doesn’t move. Absolutely no recoil. Every other air rifle has some recoil, usually quite small, but always there and noticable. This just sat there. Magnificent engineering.

    Unfortunately, it “only” costs €2200…

    And I’d never be able to trust the repair job fully, so it comes down to door number one. But I’m not going to risk a recurrance, so the Anschutz backpack case gets retired, and I order a peli 1720 case from InterShoot as well as the replacement part from Anschutz. With a lot of logisitcal help from Ryan in InterShoot (for which, many thanks!) the peli and the rifle stock arrived in the lab in college last week. One slow, awkward bicycle ride over to the range later, and it’s all laid out, ready for major surgery :)
    DSC00591a.JPG

    So that’s the 1720 laid open. It’s a nice comprimise between the 1700 which was light but just too small - I’d have to be unbedding and rebedding the air rifle every time I put it in, which wouldn’t be impossible, just awkward - and the 1750, which is frankly enormous. Seriously, I could put my entire rifle into one fully assembled with about a foot of room to spare. However, the 1750 weighs 10kg empty so if you put the rifle alone in there, you’re over the weight limit for the airline. The 1720 with all the kit is just about on the line, and we never do manage to avoid hassle anyway, but the extra weight of the 1750 is no fun for me to lug about either.

    On the top is the old broken part, and underneath the new part which is, of course completely the wrong colour. Oh well. Appearance is decidedly secondary to performance. Move over all the mounting blocks and bold the action into the new part and viola: FrankenRifle!
    DSC00592a.JPG

    DSC00596a.JPG

    DSC00598a.JPG

    It doesn’t look quite that bad, but there’s a definite patchwork thing going on here :D

    So, that done, all that was left was to set up the peli case:
    DSC00601a.JPG

    That was an initial attempt, but the current layout is quite similar. Tools in one corner (the wheels are on the left, so that’s always going to be a bottom corner); air tanks are near the hinge and the rifle is above them by the handle; the buttplate comes off because the rifle won’t fit otherwise, but cheekpiece comes off too because that way if I adjust either of them, I don’t need to recut the foam. Sights go in as well in a top corner. Cutting the foam was done with a long knife and circles cut with a scissors; it’s a bit more ragged than I’d like but it’ll do. After trimming and checking the fit, the foam layer got glued to the bottom layer of foam in the base of the case (spray-on adhesive from an arts&crafts store) and that’s that.

    So, how does FrankenRifle shoot?
    DSC00603a.JPG

    Pretty well :)

    Only thing left now is to find a source for closed-cell foam for the case; the foam in the 17xx series is just a tad too floppy for my new paranoia about my stock :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,612 ✭✭✭jwshooter


    Sparks wrote: »
    Finally wrote it up:

    Only thing left now is to find a source for closed-cell foam for the case; the foam in the 17xx series is just a tad too floppy for my new paranoia about my stock :D
    going to watch a bit of olympic games to nite but thats a good five shot 100 yard group was it windy


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    'twas terribly windy allright jw, blew the pellets clear down the range :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,612 ✭✭✭jwshooter


    Sparks wrote: »
    'twas terribly windy allright jw, blew the pellets clear down the range :D
    only mess n with you sparks is there any ranges that shoot , game targets in wood land and would there be a interested in it ,i know its big in the uk


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    jwshooter wrote: »
    only mess n with you sparks is there any ranges that shoot , game targets in wood land and would there be a interested in it ,i know its big in the uk

    Field Target? I believe there's a complex in the north somewhere doing it. I think it may be near Newry.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    There's one or two up North allright jw, but down here it's more field archery than field air rifle.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    Sparks wrote: »
    Me too! Nice touch shipping it in the case :D

    On the cant, it'd be an issue in prone but in standing, you have to cant. Well. Granted, as with most of these things, you do get the odd genetic freak who doesn't and who's trained enough over twenty years to be able to shoot well with their heads at a 45 degree angle, but there's only one or two I've ever seen at world cup level. For most people, you keep the head upright (so the inner ears are level and working) and you cant the rifle in to you.

    It looks a little odd, but who cares when the shot goes through the middle?

    Just coming back to this now because after watching the men's air rifle final, I noted that not one of the finalists had their sights canted :confused:

    They seemed to keep the rifles vertical and at the same time had very little if any tilt to their heads. I especialy noticed the Romanian guy could bring his head down to the sights without tilting.

    Are they all freaks of nature? :eek:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    Actually, most of them were canting their rifles rrpc, it's just harder to spot. If you look at Zhu, for example, his sights aren't cantable - his whole rifle cants. Rounded bottom to the stock stitting in a well in the frontend. Means his rifle cants and the point where his hand makes contact under the foreend is level which is a better design than the Anschutz one. Some of them, like Gonci, don't cant - they bring their head over. But just as you're not about to start shooting kneeling with one knee floating a few inches off the ground, or using a post sight element instead of a ring, I'm not about to try to mimic Gonci without knowing how he's able to do what he does and what the tradeoffs are.

    And while few folks seem to have such an obvious cant as mine, it's hardly unusual for a shooter to have a more extreme setup when they need it. Look at Debevec's sight blocks for example, or Schumann's weights. In my case, something about my facial structure is a bit awkward (namely the distance from the pupil to the bottom of the cheekbone). I know only one other person who can see though my sights at all when his cheek is on the cheekpiece properly. And awkward is the right word, it's made setting up a working position rather difficult. But them's the breaks. And if everyone from Matt Fox and Geoff Cooney through to Jozef Gonci, Juha Hirva and Kimmo Yli-Jaskari all think my setup is fine, then I think my setup's fine too :)

    Besides, you're comparing my setup to folks who train for eight hours a day during their downtime (Gonci used to train 16 hours a day all year round but has now switched to a cyclical training arrangement). Give me 16 hours a day for fifteen years like Gonci and I could learn to shoot with a live chicken on my head. That wouldn't make it the best way for someone who's not fulltime to train.

    The point of the cant, remember, is that we're standing up - and if you cant the rifle instead of your head while standing, your inner ears can work better and help maintain your hold better. Those of us who can't afford to train fulltime need tricks like that. So maybe you don't need to cant as much as I have to, but canting is still a good idea.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18 FowlerC


    Sparks wrote: »
    In my case, something about my facial structure is a bit awkward (namely the distance from the pupil to the bottom of the cheekbone).

    This is because you are ugly Sparks.
    I know only one other person who can see though my sights at all when his cheek is on the cheekpiece properly.

    Wait hang on, you can sight my rifle perfectly. Comment re ugliness redacted you handsome devil.
    The point of the cant, remember, is that we're standing up - and if you cant the rifle instead of your head while standing, your inner ears can work better and help maintain your hold better.

    Ooooh I must right this one down in the diary.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    FowlerC wrote: »
    This is because you are ugly Sparks.
    I prefer to think of it as having a face only a mother could love :D
    Ooooh I must right this one down in the diary.
    If you remember to bring it with you this time :rolleyes:


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