Consequences of leaving the catholic church

Malari

Well, I just received my amended baptism cert today, which states that I "left the catholic church by a formal act of defection" - took 4 months to get it!

So I'll let you know about the consequences if and when they happen

Dades

Congratulations. It obviously means something to you.

Now stay away from holy water!

Malari

Dades wrote: »

Congratulations. It obviously means something to you.

Now stay away from holy water!

It obviously doesn't mean a lot to you But yes, I wanted them to know I wasn't a member of their club any more.

And I'll have no problem staying away from holy water as there is no such thing :eek:

nozzferrahhtoo

Malari wrote: »

It obviously doesn't mean a lot to you But yes, I wanted them to know I wasn't a member of their club any more.

And I'll have no problem staying away from holy water as there is no such thing :eek:

I realise it might be a long story so i hope you typed it already but can you tell me about this process from start to finish? What made you do it, what did you have to do to get it done, what problems did you hit, what addresses did you mail and so on and so on. I might like to emulate you on this one so the more infor the better. If youve already put up the full story somewhere then link me to it please!

Yours expectantly

DinoBot

Malari wrote: »

Well, I just received my amended baptism cert today, which states that I "left the catholic church by a formal act of defection" - took 4 months to get it!

So I'll let you know about the consequences if and when they happen

I think thats a great idea. I think I will be doing this myself :-)

Malari

nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »

I realise it might be a long story so i hope you typed it already but can you tell me about this process from start to finish? What made you do it, what did you have to do to get it done, what problems did you hit, what addresses did you mail and so on and so on. I might like to emulate you on this one so the more infor the better. If youve already put up the full story somewhere then link me to it please!

Yours expectantly

Ah, no, haven't typed it - didn't think there would be that much interest, as most of the replies seemed to be "why bother?"

I think the difficulty was that I was born in Dublin and live in Cork. I contacted my original parish first in writing. I just looked up the address my parents were living when I was born and where the nearest church was!

Got no reply for a month, so found an email and sent a message to the secretary. Also at this time sent a letter to the bishop of Cork :eek: wondering should I be asking him!

A few weeks later got a reply from both parties - each stating I should be contacting the other person! Apparently there is some difference between diocese and arch-diocese and the sharing of information.

Emailed both again, asking them to confer on what the best course of action should be. Eventually got a phone call from a very nice man in the Dublin parish, who said they could not find me on their records! So I went home to my parent's place and dug out a copy of my baptism cert and sent it to him.

A few weeks later my amended cert arrived in the post. Ta daaa! No-one tried to change my mind along the way, or even express regret that I had made this decision...maybe that was to do with the strongly worded nature of the original letter :rolleyes:

nozzferrahhtoo

Malari wrote: »

Ah, no, haven't typed it - didn't think there would be that much interest, as most of the replies seemed to be "why bother?"

Actually I think its a good thing to do if everyone who was an atheist did it. The church has been worried about lack of attendance and its made them sit back and think about what they are and have been doing wrong.

I think if a significant amount of people actively sought to officially leave the church it would wake them up even further to many of their failing. I hope many people do follow your suit.

nozzferrahhtoo

Malari wrote: »

Well, I just received my amended baptism cert today, which states that I "left the catholic church by a formal act of defection" - took 4 months to get it!

So I'll let you know about the consequences if and when they happen

Interesting wording. Did you have to defect to anyone in particular or was it just a general defection

Malari

nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »

Actually I think its a good thing to do if everyone who was an atheist did it. The church has been worried about lack of attendance and its made them sit back and think about what they are and have been doing wrong.

I think if a significant amount of people actively sought to officially leave the church it would wake them up even further to many of their failing. I hope many people do follow your suit.

I agree - it wasn't just a personal thing, I wanted them to know I was leaving. I don't what I'll do with the cert now though!

Malari

nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »

Interesting wording. Did you have to defect to anyone in particular or was it just a general defection

Their wording. It's what was written on the cert when I got it back, along with some Latin and abbreviations I didn't understand, and can't even read properly!

I think the formal act of defection is what they call a request to be officially removed from the church records. As opposed to excommunication, which is when they boot you out!

nozzferrahhtoo

Malari wrote: »

I agree - it wasn't just a personal thing, I wanted them to know I was leaving. I don't what I'll do with the cert now though!

Solid wood frames and hooks for your wall are quite cheap these days

iUseVi

Malari wrote: »

I agree - it wasn't just a personal thing, I wanted them to know I was leaving. I don't what I'll do with the cert now though!

bill_ashmount

Malari wrote: »

Well, I just received my amended baptism cert today, which states that I "left the catholic church by a formal act of defection" - took 4 months to get it!

So I'll let you know about the consequences if and when they happen

Nice one. Must look into this myself.

Malari

Thanks iUseVi, but I think I might just keep it handy in case I get accused of being a catholic again!

:pac:

lostexpectation

hers an example of what ya get when your defect

lostexpectation

Malari wrote: »

Ah, no, haven't typed it - didn't think there would be that much interest, as most of the replies seemed to be "why bother?"

I think the difficulty was that I was born in Dublin and live in Cork. I contacted my original parish first in writing. I just looked up the address my parents were living when I was born and where the nearest church was!

Got no reply for a month, so found an email and sent a message to the secretary. Also at this time sent a letter to the bishop of Cork :eek: wondering should I be asking him!

A few weeks later got a reply from both parties - each stating I should be contacting the other person! Apparently there is some difference between diocese and arch-diocese and the sharing of information.

Emailed both again, asking them to confer on what the best course of action should be. Eventually got a phone call from a very nice man in the Dublin parish, who said they could not find me on their records! So I went home to my parent's place and dug out a copy of my baptism cert and sent it to him.

A few weeks later my amended cert arrived in the post. Ta daaa! No-one tried to change my mind along the way, or even express regret that I had made this decision...maybe that was to do with the strongly worded nature of the original letter :rolleyes:

I wonder how they eventual found you.

Malari

I sent them a copy of my baptism cert. I think they were looking in the wrong church records or something.

PDN

nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »

Actually I think its a good thing to do if everyone who was an atheist did it. The church has been worried about lack of attendance and its made them sit back and think about what they are and have been doing wrong.

I think if a significant amount of people actively sought to officially leave the church it would wake them up even further to many of their failing. I hope many people do follow your suit.

Of course it may have the opposite effect and make them more reactionary and conservative. At present they are aware that a significant portion of supposed Catholics are unhappy with some of the more hardline dogma. However, atheists who have not defected are being included in those figures. If a huge amount of you were to formally defect then they might come to the conclusion that Irish Catholics (real Catholics, not just atheists who happen to still be on the roll) are really more conservative than supposed. That would be an incentive for them to be more hardline in their beliefs and practices - which would probably suit all of us.

death1234567

PDN wrote: »

If a huge amount of you were to formally defect then they might come to the conclusion that Irish Catholics (real Catholics, not just atheists who happen to still be on the roll) are really more conservative than supposed. That would be an incentive for them to be more hardline in their beliefs and practices - which would probably suit all of us.

More Hardline??? Surely not.

I think a more modern,moderate, sensible (if that's possible) catholic church would be better for everyone, both catholics and atheists.

nozzferrahhtoo

PDN wrote: »

That would be an incentive for them to be more hardline in their beliefs and practices - which would probably suit all of us.

This would suit me also if it were to happen but I see no reason to think it would. Many arguments against the churches involvement of society suffer from moderates. People who say "Oh well we dont ALL feel that way, you are arguing against positions we dont espouse". This is like a frustrating wall of foam that you bounce off when working towards certain ends and so discourse is prevented from moving forward.

If the group instead became a smaller more hardline group then they would lose this foam buffer and it would become quite clear just who and what is being argued against.

PDN

death1234567 wrote: »

More Hardline??? Surely not.

I think a more modern,moderate, sensible (if that's possible) catholic church would be better for everyone, both catholics and atheists.

Well I am neither a Catholic or an atheist. Personally I prefer the old Catholic Church that showed its true colours rather than the new attempt to appear cuddly. I was delighted when Ratzinger became Pope for the same reasons.

I think a large proportion of practising Catholics in Ireland would be happier with a more hardline approach since it is closer to the Church in their native Poland. Irish practicing Catholics tend to be much older and also conservative.

Atheists should be happier with a more hardline Catholicism because it will alienate moderates and thus diminish the Church's interference with what should be a secular society.

DinoBot

PDN wrote: »

Well I am neither a Catholic or an atheist. Personally I prefer the old Catholic Church that showed its true colours rather than the new attempt to appear cuddly. I was delighted when Ratzinger became Pope for the same reasons.

I think a large proportion of practising Catholics in Ireland would be happier with a more hardline approach since it is closer to the Church in their native Poland. Irish practicing Catholics tend to be much older and also conservative.

Atheists should be happier with a more hardline Catholicism because it will alienate moderates and thus diminish the Church's interference with what should be a secular society.

+1

Agree 100%, bring on the thought police

Dades

PDN wrote: »

If a huge amount of you were to formally defect then they might come to the conclusion that Irish Catholics (real Catholics, not just atheists who happen to still be on the roll) are really more conservative than supposed. That would be an incentive for them to be more hardline in their beliefs and practices - which would probably suit all of us.

Hmmm. I can't see how you (or the CC) could draw the conclusion that people leaving in droves means that the remainder are more conservative than supposed.

To me, that would mean that people dislike the conservatism in general, and the remainder are more than likely either content with the system, or simply set in their ways.

But either way I agree that it would be a good step towards a more secular society if their à la carte members were alienated.

Malari

Dades wrote: »

Hmmm. I can't see how you (or the CC) could draw the conclusion that people leaving in droves means that the remainder are more conservative than supposed.

Yes, I don't really see the connection here. If anything I would assume the church would become more lax and less outspoken about their conservatism.

PDN

Malari wrote: »

Dades wrote: »

Hmmm. I can't see how you (or the CC) could draw the conclusion that people leaving in droves means that the remainder are more conservative than supposed.

Yes, I don't really see the connection here. If anything I would assume the church would become more lax and less outspoken about their conservatism.

I don't see that as inevitable. The Church could easily say, "Look, all those who kept moaning obviously weren't really Catholics at all, so let's stop trying to please those who don't come to Church anyway and instead we'll cater to our loyal core."

STBR

seamus wrote: »

Most religions tend to allow anyone into their church (unless you're female of course :rolleyes:)

*BA DUM TISH*

STBR

humanji wrote: »

That happened to me, so I placed my hand on the guys head and said "I now baptism you into the church of Satan! There, you're a devil worshipper now, even though you didn't want to be." They shut up after that.

EPIC WIN!!!

No really, I love it. xD