2008 NFL Draft

Chucky the tree

Been meaning too start one for a while now that the combine is over. Here's the draft order for the first round:


1. Miami
2. St. Louis
3. Atlanta
4. Oakland
5. Kansas City
6. New York Jets
7. New England -- from San Francisco
8. Baltimore
9. Cincinnati
10. New Orleans
11. Buffalo
12. Denver
13. Carolina
14. Chicago
15. Detroit
16. Arizona
17. Minnesota
18. Houston
19. Philadelphia
20. Tampa Bay
21. Washington
22. Dallas -- from Cleveland
23. Pittsburgh
24. Tennessee
25. Seattle
26. Jacksonville
27. San Diego
28. Dallas
29. San Francisco -- from Indianapolis
30. Green Bay
31. New York Giants


So who do you think will go No.1? Who do you want your team too take(realistic onesp lease)? Who'll be a bust?

I think the dolphins will take Chris long DE, while QB is a big need for them the QB's in this draft arent worthy of a the No 1 overall. I wanted the raiders too take him but since he is gone I'd like too see us take Ellis. I dont think Tommy Kelly will fill our DT need, I dont like the injury concerns regarding Dorsey either.

Ideally I'd much prefer it if we traded with dallas cowboys if DMAC was there at 4.

Any idea's on what player will drop like BQ? I wonder if anyone will do a dolphins on it aswell!

GBX

your title suggests we will be waiting a while.... whats happening in this years one

Chucky the tree

who cares about this years one..

Dodge

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Any idea's on what player will drop like BQ?

Reading a couple of mock drafts and a fair few don't have McFadden in top 10.

Seems a few have Miami going for Matt Ryan #1

heyjude

Dodge wrote: »

Reading a couple of mock drafts and a fair few don't have McFadden in top 10.

Seems a few have Miami going for Matt Ryan #1

We won't know for sure till closer to the draft, if not on the day itself(April 26), but historically Bill Parcells seems to prefer working with experienced QBs, so whether he would opt to pick a QB with the first pick, knowing what he would have to pay and that probably that player wouldn't be the starter in week one, (especially if there is a delay in contract negotiations),is open to question.

The likes of Chris or Jake Long, Ellis or Dorsey, the other top names on most mock drafts would be expected to be starters from day one, which might appeal to a team that finished 1-15 last year.

Most of the teams at the top of the draft have greater needs in positions other than running back so McFadden could slide, unless Jerry Jones can work something out. But it would cost a lot, for example using the NFL Draft Point Value Chart and assuming that the Cowboys wanted to trade for the Raiders pick at 4(worth 1800pts), the Cowboys would have to offer both of their first round picks(worth 780pts and 660pts) plus their 2nd round pick(worth 292pts), that would still leave 68pts to find, which means 2-3 more lower round draft picks or an existing Cowboy being traded as part of the deal. In any case, it could end up costing 5 draft picks just to acquire McFadden. And trading up to the Dolphins pick would cost 3000pts, not to mention the huge salary that the first pick always gets. The Cowboys would love it if McFadden dropped out of the top ten, as the 11th position is worth 1250pts, so they would essentially be able to trade their two late round one picks for the 11th pick, assuming they could find any takers.

Manny7

I think that Jimmy Johnston value chart is a bit out-of-date now, by the sounds of it the huge cost of signing 1st rounders, and esp top 10 picks means teams might trade out for less than that chart says they should. Especially in a year like this, when there's no really obvious stars I'd say a lot of teams will look to trade down.

As for McFadden, I didn't see much college football this year but whenever I saw him play he was in that wildcat formation taking the direct snap. Will he be as good as a straightforward RB in the NFL?

I'm hoping the Patriots trade out of 7 if possible, otherwise take Gholston to play linebacker. I have a feeling it's going to be Ellis if they stay in the spot though, which leaves four in-their-prime first rounders playing for 3 spots in the D-Line, it seems a lot of money to tie up in that position.

Xavi6

My Chiefs need a top player in a premier postion on offence i.e. QB or WR. We've struggled badly in those positions lately and need to take some of the pressure off LJ and Gonzalez.

davyjose

Will Matt Ryan want to go to miami - great history, especially QB, but still?
New England buying out SF's place means they muct be up to something. Could be interesting.

And what's with the Colt's? I'm a little concerned. No action in the Free Agency, and now seemingly little in the draft. Good side last year but not good enough, we need a new WR for Manning to throw to, a la Moss for NE (the difference last yr between the sides), and maybe a new safety.

jdivision

New England got San Fran's pick from a trade

I think Jake Long goes number one. Too many questions about Ryan. I think he could slip to Baltimore. Miami could trade up to tail end of round one and take joe deflacco. More a Parcells type guy when you look at patience he had with tony romo - small school QB with a big arm made good.

Chucky the tree

davyjose wrote: »

Will Matt Ryan want to go to miami - great history, especially QB, but still?
.

Of course he will. The money he will get for no1 spot is huge. He's not hugely sought after either so he could easily slip down a bit so he'd be crazy too refuse it.

Leslie91

The amazing thing about this draft is there is no consensus number one player. Sure there are a few top 5 calibre guys eg. Jake Long, Chris Long, Vernon Gholston, but I'm not sure Matt Ryan would be a top 5 pick were those picking there be happy with their QBs. This is not the case both Miami and Atlanta are looking for a QB but is Matt Ryan worth the top pick?. I don't believe he is. Someone like Brohm or Flacco might be still there in round 2.

Even McFadden is a bit of a risk. Mendenhall might be a surer bet.

Looking forward to this draft. I'm hoping Brandon Alberts is there at #27.

tallaghtoutlaws

Leslie91 wrote: »

The amazing thing about this draft is there is no consensus number one player. Sure there are a few top 5 calibre guys eg. Jake Long, Chris Long, Vernon Gholston, but I'm not sure Matt Ryan would be a top 5 pick were those picking there be happy with their QBs. This is not the case both Miami and Atlanta are looking for a QB but is Matt Ryan worth the top pick?. I don't believe he is. Someone like Brohm or Flacco might be still there in round 2.

Even McFadden is a bit of a risk. Mendenhall might be a surer bet.

Looking forward to this draft. I'm hoping Brandon Alberts is there at #27.

Matt Ryan as an Overall QB is better than Brohm and Flacco and Andre Woodson. He is well worth the top QB pick and if coached properly in the NFL will eventually be among the top QBs in the NFL in years to come. The fact he played for 2 months with a broken ankle with outstanding numbers and 4th qtr wins then to go on into 2007 and carry a lacklustre BC to decent D1 season making the ACC Champ game proves he is capable of anything in the NFL.

BizzyC

heyjude wrote: »

but historically Bill Parcells seems to prefer working with experienced QBs

Parcells drafted Bledsoe and made him a franchise QB. He has no problems in drafting a starter.


In a perfect world, Chris Long would drop to 7th, but there's no chance of the Jets passing him up....

heyjude

BizzyC wrote: »

Parcells drafted Bledsoe and made him a franchise QB. He has no problems in drafting a starter.


In a perfect world, Chris Long would drop to 7th, but there's no chance of the Jets passing him up....

I said Parcells seems to prefer to work with experienced QBs, you have to remember that he's been an NFL coach for 19 seasons since 1983 and his main starting QBs and their ages (at the time),since then are: Scott Brunner(26), Phil Simms(30-36yrs), Drew Bledsoe(21-24yrs), Neil O'Donnell(31), Vinny Testaverde(35), Ray Lucas(27)/Rick Mirer(29)(Lucas started 9 games,Mirer started 6 that season), Quincy Carter(26),Vinny Testaverde(41), Drew Bledsoe(33) and Tony Romo(26)/Drew Bledsoe(34)(Romo started 10 games, Bledsoe started 6).

So in 19 seasons he's had 9 different QBs as his main starting QB and all of them except Bledsoe were aged 26 or older at the time. It is true that age doesn't always mean playing experience, but it does seem to show that Parcells doesn't seem to draft big name QBs with his first round picks and defence is probably a bigger need for them right now, unfortunately!

kev_s88

oh what i would give to see either Chris Long or Vernon Gholston somehow manage to stay around til pick #26 and hop on board with my Jags.

but according to the most recent mock draft they're looking to be getting Kentwan Balmer a DT.although i really dont think they need any more DTs what with John Henderson, Grady Jackson, Derek Landri and Tony McDaniel.

man im gonna miss that beautiful defense team of John Henderson and Marcus Stroud

BizzyC

heyjude wrote: »

I said Parcells seems to prefer to work with experienced QBs, you have to remember that he's been an NFL coach for 19 seasons since 1983 and his main starting QBs and their ages (at the time),since then are: Scott Brunner(26), Phil Simms(30-36yrs), Drew Bledsoe(21-24yrs), Neil O'Donnell(31), Vinny Testaverde(35), Ray Lucas(27)/Rick Mirer(29)(Lucas started 9 games,Mirer started 6 that season), Quincy Carter(26),Vinny Testaverde(41), Drew Bledsoe(33) and Tony Romo(26)/Drew Bledsoe(34)(Romo started 10 games, Bledsoe started 6).

So in 19 seasons he's had 9 different QBs as his main starting QB and all of them except Bledsoe were aged 26 or older at the time. It is true that age doesn't always mean playing experience, but it does seem to show that Parcells doesn't seem to draft big name QBs with his first round picks and defence is probably a bigger need for them right now, unfortunately!

Yes, but out of all those teams and QB's, how many times did he have the opportunity to draft a top 10 overall QB prospect to a team who actually needed a QB?
Probably only Bledsoe.
If they dont pick up a pretty good vet before then, I see Ryan going 1st.
Otherwise I'd expect to see a trade for a few more high round picks.

heyjude

BizzyC wrote: »

Yes, but out of all those teams and QB's, how many times did he have the opportunity to draft a top 10 overall QB prospect to a team who actually needed a QB?
Probably only Bledsoe.
If they dont pick up a pretty good vet before then, I see Ryan going 1st.
Otherwise I'd expect to see a trade for a few more high round picks.

The Giants had only had one winning season in the ten years up to the time Parcells took over. Parcells in his first season benched the 29 year old Simms and started Brunner as QB, he was woeful and they won just 3 games that season. But with the third overall pick of the draft, Parcells took LB Carl Banks and he gave Simms back the starting job the following season. It could be argued that with one winning season in a decade and with Simms approaching 30, a new QB was needed and he could have taken the top college QB that year, but Parcells took Banks to play alongside then 24yo Lawrence Taylor !

The Dolphins took QB John Beck in the second round of the draft last season and may decide to give him a fair shot, especially if they can shore up the defence and give him more playmakers on offence. They would hardly cut Beck after just one season and if they take another top QB this year, they'd have two very inexperienced QBs on their roster.

jdivision

Beck is already old as these things go, he'll be 27 when seasons starts

BizzyC

heyjude wrote: »

The Giants had only had one winning season in the ten years up to the time Parcells took over. Parcells in his first season benched the 29 year old Simms and started Brunner as QB, he was woeful and they won just 3 games that season. But with the third overall pick of the draft, Parcells took LB Carl Banks and he gave Simms back the starting job the following season. It could be argued that with one winning season in a decade and with Simms approaching 30, a new QB was needed and he could have taken the top college QB that year, but Parcells took Banks to play alongside then 24yo Lawrence Taylor !

The Dolphins took QB John Beck in the second round of the draft last season and may decide to give him a fair shot, especially if they can shore up the defence and give him more playmakers on offence. They would hardly cut Beck after just one season and if they take another top QB this year, they'd have two very inexperienced QBs on their roster.

Yeah, but you have to ask yourself, who was the best QB available at that pick, and was that rookie QB a better prospect than Simms?

Honestly I think Ryan could be a guy who can lead a team which is the most important thing to have when you're rebuilding a franchise. I dont see a QB in free agency who fits the bill and Beck certainly doesn't IMO. Thats why I can see Ryan go 1st.

tallaghtoutlaws

BizzyC wrote: »

Yeah, but you have to ask yourself, who was the best QB available at that pick, and was that rookie QB a better prospect than Simms?

Honestly I think Ryan could be a guy who can lead a team which is the most important thing to have when you're rebuilding a franchise. I dont see a QB in free agency who fits the bill and Beck certainly doesn't IMO. Thats why I can see Ryan go 1st.

Agreed.

heyjude

BizzyC wrote: »

Yeah, but you have to ask yourself, who was the best QB available at that pick, and was that rookie QB a better prospect than Simms?

Boomer Esiason was the top QB that year(1984 draft) and he was available when the Giants picked in the first round, but the Giants waited till the third round and picked Jeff Hostetler instead.

But hey, thats what makes the draft fun, you never know whats gonna happen and which players will rise or fall.

davyjose

BizzyC wrote: »

Yeah, but you have to ask yourself, who was the best QB available at that pick, and was that rookie QB a better prospect than Simms?

Honestly I think Ryan could be a guy who can lead a team which is the most important thing to have when you're rebuilding a franchise. I dont see a QB in free agency who fits the bill and Beck certainly doesn't IMO. Thats why I can see Ryan go 1st.

+1 - Peyton Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, straight in off the draft, both making an instant and massive difference to their respective franchises. No reason Ryan can't do the same.

jdivision

Manning was very good in his rookie season but he didn't make a massive difference. They finished 3-13, same record as previous season. Don't forget that the colts were intrigued by the thought of drafting Ryan Leaf but he blew them off when they asked to interview him.
Roethlisberger was a caretaker in his rookie season, he was never really asked to win games, merely to give them options. That was a power running team.
I do take your point though, some turn out to be ready in their rookie seasons. In general though guys who sit for first or first two seasons tend to do better these days. The difference in speed between college and NFL is massive and unless you're a team that was decimated by injuries, getting you into position to land No1 pick, and have a really good o-line I think sitting the QB in year one is best way to go

Chucky the tree

davyjose wrote: »

+1 - Peyton Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, straight in off the draft, both making an instant and massive difference to their respective franchises. No reason Ryan can't do the same.

Manning didnt make an instant impact.


For your manning and Roethlisbergers you have yor leaf's, couch's harringtons and Carr's.

If Ryan was in last years draft he would of been rated the 3rd QB imo. The dolpins have too many holes too fill that no one player will turn them into a winning team so I'd draft Long(de) instead.

tallaghtoutlaws

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Manning didnt make an instant impact.


For your manning and Roethlisbergers you have yor leaf's, couch's harringtons and Carr's.

If Ryan was in last years draft he would of been rated the 3rd QB imo. The dolpins have too many holes too fill that no one player will turn them into a winning team so I'd draft Long(de) instead.

Dolphins wont take a QB in draft its funny to think people are still talking about it. I will be very surprised if they draft a QB. They need to protect whatever QB they get and they also need to strengthen their D a QB would be a daft decision. Right now the only team that truly need to waste a top draft pick on a QB imo would be the Falcons. Ryan will fit them as they are looking to stick the draftee in straight away and Ryan fits that bill. Time to sink or swim for both Ryan and the Falcons.I agree Long the DE Long that is will go to Dolphins.

jdivision

I know i'm in the vast minority but I'll repeat what I said earlier. They need an OT so i still think you draft Jake Long. he's good at run blocking and they'll be a running team next year. Joe Thomas had a massive impact for the Browns and I don't think he's as good a power blocker as Long (and I think Thomas is fantastic)

They've cut three tackles and still don't have a LT (given Carey will probably move to RT) so they're gonna have to take one. The tackle draft is deep this year so unless they can trade down to 10-12 and take Clady and pick up other draft picks, then i think they'll take j long

tallaghtoutlaws

jdivision wrote: »

I know i'm in the vast minority but I'll repeat what I said earlier. They need an OT so i still think you draft Jake Long. he's good at run blocking and they'll be a running team next year. Joe Thomas had a massive impact for the Browns and I don't think he's as good a power blocker as Long (and I think Thomas is fantastic)

They've cut three tackles and still don't have a LT (given Carey will probably move to RT) so they're gonna have to take one. The tackle draft is deep this year so unless they can trade down to 10-12 and take Clady and pick up other draft picks, then i think they'll take j long

For me also its either Long or Long. And Jake Long is legend would love if he dropped to the 7th pick and the Pats picked him up Brady would have hours in that pocket.

davyjose

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Manning didnt make an instant impact.

From Wikipedia, so I'll allow you to correct me if any of these are wrong:

Rookie records
Most passing attempts: 575
Most completions: 326
Most passing yards: 3,739
Most touchdown passes: 26
Most consecutive games with a touchdown pass (games 4-16): 13

I'm not following the sport long, but those look like records any QB would be proud of in any year. That to me is an instant and massive impact!
Ok, perhaps not to the overall scheme of things, but it proves that a Rookie can be a class act from day one.

tallaghtoutlaws

davyjose wrote: »

From Wikipedia, so I'll allow you to correct me if any of these are wrong:

Rookie records
Most passing attempts: 575
Most completions: 326
Most passing yards: 3,739
Most touchdown passes: 26
Most consecutive games with a touchdown pass (games 4-16): 13

I'm not following the sport long, but those look like records any QB would be proud of in any year. That to me is an instant and massive impact!
Ok, perhaps not to the overall scheme of things, but it proves that a Rookie can be a class act from day one.

I could be wrong but I think Chucky meant in the grand scheme of things that year the colts were still sh*t so he really didnt make an instant impact. As an individual yeah defo every right to be proud as a rookie. But then again on the flipside he did make an instant impact but the rest of the team didnt live up to the challenge.

davyjose

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

Dolphins wont take a QB in draft its funny to think people are still talking about it. I will be very surprised if they draft a QB. They need to protect whatever QB they get and they also need to strengthen their D a QB would be a daft decision. Right now the only team that truly need to waste a top draft pick on a QB imo would be the Falcons. Ryan will fit them as they are looking to stick the draftee in straight away and Ryan fits that bill. Time to sink or swim for both Ryan and the Falcons.I agree Long the DE Long that is will go to Dolphins.

My philosophy would be - get the best available QB, and build a team around that. No matter who they get, they're not gonna make the playoffs.
To take jdivisions point about Mannings Rookie season and the Colts finishing 3-13 - they finished 13-3 the very next. That says something. If you get a guy who will throw 4000 yards a season you can get guys into the team then.
I'm not following the sport long - you guys know the game better than me, but that, to me, seems logical.

tallaghtoutlaws

davyjose wrote: »

My philosophy would be - get the best available QB, and build a team around that. No matter who they get, they're not gonna make the playoffs.
To take jdivisions point about Mannings Rookie season and the Colts finishing 3-13 - they finished 13-3 the very next. That says something. If you get a guy who will throw 4000 yards a season you can get guys into the team then.
I'm not following the sport long - you guys know the game better than me, but that, to me, seems logical.

I agree with you. Why Ryan makes sense to the Falcons imo as they have offloaded all the old and want to bring in all new players build a rookie team around a rookie QB that has talent. Ah sure we are going to have to wait and see what happens roll on the Draft.