Guinness - the two-part pour. Why, exactly?

faceman

i wont name names here and im sure its not the only pub.

I kenw a guy who worked in a pub on the north side of dublin that has all but 1 of its guinness taps hooked up to the beamish kegs but charges for guinness... not sure if they are still getting away with it.

Lawless_Samurai

Been told it makes no difference what so ever. Its all in the mind. If you see a pint being pulled in one go you will instintly class that pint as a bad pint simply because it wasn't poured in two parts.

A friend of mine who works in a pub got into a heated argument with a few oul lads one night about this and to settle it he challenged them to try and tell the difference in a two part pour to a single poured pint and if they won he would pay for the pints used in the test and their drinks for the rest of the night. Big risk I thought but my friend said if they couldn't tell the difference they can never hassle him about it again (they brought this argument up alot) and to back him up if anyone else brought it up in the future.

Long story short the oul lads who were expert guinness drinkers could not tell the difference. Did the test three times and everytime they got it wrong.

In fairness the oul lads were true to their word as anytime this discussion comes up they back up my friend!

FunkyChicken

Any guinness drink with an ounce of brains (or perhaps a tongue) should be able to tell the difference between the two

edit: talking about Beamish and Guinness here

Lawless_Samurai

Well these lads couldn't tell the difference.

My dad too swears blind it makes all the difference. One night I was drinking with him and bought the round and told my friend to do it in a single pour.

Brought it down to him and he did not say a word.

I don't drink guinness but from what I've seen it really is all in peoples' heads.

kevmy

I've only once seen a single pour pint and it was also done straight ie. no tilt on the glass. I wasn't drinking it so I don't know taste wise how good it was. But then the guys did drink while it was still brown (settling) so I don't think it would have tasted great. It was in Luton airport btw and both barman and customer were English.

I still like to get mine the old-fashioned way even if it doesn't taste better it will look better. And as all top chefs tell you presentation is important.

View Profile

Worked for 7 years in hotel bar. We served excellent Guinness. Great flow on the tap and we had short lines which is key to a good pint of any beer/stout.
You do get people, usually older "professional" Guinness drinkers who have to have the perfect pint put in front of them or they will ask for another one. Wanted to punch them so many times!
Presentation is key, with the perfect sized head, no overspill, and in a Guinnesss branded glass with the brand name facing them and on a clean beer-mat. Very pedantic I know but it adds to the drinking experience.

Doing a one pour (tap fully down) will result in a massive head. You dont want that. And no scooping the head off with a knife. Not recommended as it can scratch the lip of the glass.

A one pour with the tap forward will result in a stale looking pint. As in it dosent need to settle as it will already be black. Dosent taste nice either.

Clubs generally have shyte Guinness as the taps are left idle all day. Guinness needs a good long flow. In the morning in the bar we would run off 2-3 pints before serving the first pint of the day. You can see the difference if you didnt, let alone taste the difference!

Tried O'Hara's stout there on the weekend and its lovely,a real old school beer!

KamiKazi

A good pint of Guinness is 75% presentation and 25% taste IMO.

The head sticking to the inside of the glass the whole way down is far more important than the pint tasting really nice.

Lawless_Samurai

So it does matter if it kinda tastes like crap so long as it looks good as you drink it!? Thats insane!

Like I've already said I don't drink guinness but I do drink whiskey and all I'm concerned with when I'm drinking it is that it tastes GOOD!!!!

KamiKazi

No, of course it needs to taste good.

My point was that the average punter will enjoy a pint that tastes good and looks great more than if it tastes slightly better than the first pint but looks crap.

Anyone else get what I mean?

The Chessplayer

FunkyChicken wrote: »

Any guinness drink with an ounce of brains (or perhaps a tongue) should be able to tell the difference between the two

edit: talking about Beamish and Guinness here

Beamish is a lovely drop I have to say, would be hard to call a favourite between it and guinness. I was down in Cork not so long ago, suppin on a few pints, and got talking to a few oul lads who maintained that the drinking of Murphy's in Cork is only a new sort of fad, a kind of tradition made up if you know what I mean. Must be a way for the Cork heads to assert their independence. Not to take away from Murphy's either - it's a quality drop as well, bit on the sweet side for me though. Lovely out of the bottles

faceman

when i was a student the local barman used to call beamish "a pint of social welfare"

guinnessdrinker

faceman wrote: »

when i was a student the local barman used to call beamish "a pint of social welfare"

Yeah, I remember when Guiness cost £2 a pint and Beamish was a full 15p cheaper at £1.85 per pint, that was in about 1999 or 2000! Beamish is still a nice pint though although I haven't seen it available on tap for a while.

BeerNut

I'm on the marketing bullshít side on this one.

In Beer & Cider in Ireland: The Complete Guide (a fantastic book which anyone who drinks Irish beer should have) the author explains that in urban pubs up until the 1950s Guinness was a blend of fresh fizzy stout topped with aged "stale" Guinness. Waiting for the bubbles on the fresh beer to subside before adding the older stuff was normal, and blending them correctly was a skill. When Guinness began serving from nitrokegs in 1959, they invented the two-part pour to recreate the feel of the old system and reduce customer suspicion of the new product. It serves no purpose and certainly doesn't affect what little flavour draught Guinness has.

Monosharp, why aren't you drinking Hite Stout? It's amazingly similar to bottled Guinness.

gucci

Stirling wrote: »

The Two Part Pour - There are two lines, gas and beer, running into each Guinness Draught tap and on the first part of the pour the tap is bulled backwards to allow a free flowing mix of gas and beer to flow into the glass til it is 3/4 full.

Sorry to be anal here, but is there two lines, or just one line, with the stout and gas mixture inside.....that would be my understanding.
One beer line going into a Guinness tap.

Also (for extra information) the whistle noise you hear when guinness is being poured is the stout being forced though a jetting/foaming disc, or a disc with 5 or 6 very small holes in it to make it foam.

I have done the study (if you can call it that!) of the 1 and 2 part pour in a couple of places with very good guinness and to be honest i cant really tell the difference.

Good guinness is good guinness and in my opinion one of the finest drinks a person who likes a tipple could ever enjoy.

humberklog

There's a barman in harry byrnes in clontarf who pours it almost right to the top on 1st pour and the puts in a final 10mmtop up. It's different.Not siesmic but v.subtle. I avoid this barman. I think the most important part is the 45degree angle pour.

BeerNut

humberklog wrote: »

I think the most important part is the 45degree angle pour.

I think the most important part is the psychology.

mikemac

faceman wrote: »

when i was a student the local barman used to call beamish "a pint of social welfare"

lol, when I was a barman we called it the same. The only people who drank it were students and lads on the dole/disability.

Some people even look down on Beamish drinkers, "it's a poor mans's drink"

Edit: I'd go along with most people who say presentation of a pint is vitally important. Many so-called Guinness experts couldn't tella 2 part pour from a one part pour in a blind test.
A good pint in a Guinness pint glass looks great!
The next pint you order get the barman to use a branded glass, your money so your choice.

I insist on getting Carlsberg in a Carlsberg glass. It's not being anal, just getting what you want

Brockagh

BeerNut wrote: »

I'm on the marketing bullshít side on this one.

In Beer & Cider in Ireland: The Complete Guide (a fantastic book which anyone who drinks Irish beer should have) the author explains that in urban pubs up until the 1950s Guinness was a blend of fresh fizzy stout topped with aged "stale" Guinness. Waiting for the bubbles on the fresh beer to subside before adding the older stuff was normal, and blending them correctly was a skill. When Guinness began serving from nitrokegs in 1959, they invented the two-part pour to recreate the feel of the old system and reduce customer suspicion of the new product. It serves no purpose and certainly doesn't affect what little flavour draught Guinness has.

Monosharp, why aren't you drinking Hite Stout? It's amazingly similar to bottled Guinness.

This was my understanding. I believe it's exactly the same now, whether you pour it in one go or two. An important factor in the quality of the pint is that you're in a pub that serves a lot of guinness, as it shouldn't be sitting in the tubes for too long.

monosharp

BeerNut wrote: »

Monosharp, why aren't you drinking Hite Stout? It's amazingly similar to bottled Guinness.

Serious ? I was going to give it a go the other night but decided against it. Will try it tonight. Thanks mate.

p.s > I drink CASS and Hite and honestly ... I wouldn't be able to tell you which one was which when they are put in front of me. But me aussie mates say they are very different. Guess my beer tastebuds don't work on lager.

p.s > Soju is a lovely Korean Gem

TheNog

BeerNut wrote: »

I think the most important part is the psychology.

It certainly is important part of the ritual. To see a barman take his time over pouring the pint using different angles and pours is vital. The customer should always watch the barman go through the process from start to finish. MUch better than having a pint of cider or lager 'cos I feel it is just slapped up to you.

I remember back home when me and my group of friends (about 6 of us) went to the local pub we all drank Guinness and we all ordered at the same time. We watched very step of the process with anticipation until the pints were respectively placed in front of us by the barman as if he were giving us a piece of communion. We could've nearly bowed our heads to the Guinness before we viewed the pint from all angles,waiting for them to settle, viewing the pint again from all angles before taking the first sip followed by an "Ahhhh".

On a typical Saturday night in a small country village pub the barmen would have anywhere between 15 to 20 pints on the first pour and waiting for orders. It was a great sight to behold and the barmen had the whole timing down to a tee.

BeerNut

monosharp wrote: »

p.s > I drink CASS and Hite and honestly ... I wouldn't be able to tell you which one was which when they are put in front of me.

Same goes for OB for me. Korea is not one of the world's great beer destinations.

monosharp wrote: »

But me aussie mates say they are very different..

Carlton or VB drinkers, I assume. Generally speaking I'd take an Aussie's word on beer just ahead of an Iranian's.

Have you been to Platinum in Seoul? I loved their cream stout in a pint-sized Kwak-style glass. Not for the beer, just the weirdness. I had a good night there once about four years ago, though I'm told it has taken a turn for the worse since. Still, can't be worse than drinking Korean cooking lager. I think.

gucci

TheNog wrote: »

On a typical Saturday night in a small country village pub the barmen would have anywhere between 15 to 20 pints on the first pour and waiting for orders. It was a great sight to behold and the barmen had the whole timing down to a tee.

Tis a great sight to behold id love a pint now....so what if its only 10 in the morning

Stirling

gucci wrote: »

Sorry to be anal here, but is there two lines, or just one line, with the stout and gas mixture inside.....that would be my understanding.
One beer line going into a Guinness tap.

Not anal at all! You're right - ultimately there is just the one line going into the tap but there are two seperate lines with beer and gas earlier in the process mixing into one - you could say I was looking at it from the point of view of the Keg rather than at the outlet/tap just to illustrate my point of the gas and beer being seperate components

BeerNut

That's not unique to Guinness, though: all keg beer works this way. For most keg beers the gas is carbon dioxide, for "smoothflow" beers -- your Guinnesses and Kilkennys and John Smithses -- it's a mixture of carbon dioxide and nitrogen.

_blank_

humberklog wrote: »

There's a barman in harry byrnes in clontarf who pours it almost right to the top on 1st pour and the puts in a final 10mmtop up. It's different.Not siesmic but v.subtle. I avoid this barman. I think the most important part is the 45degree angle pour.

Serious?

Which barman?

Blisterman

Worst pour of Guinness I've ever seen was in Koko in London.

Bartender pulls out a CAN of Guinness, opens it, sticks a plastic cup over the top, flips it upside down, pulls the can out, as it pours. Crushes the can to get it to pour faster, and hands it to me. Took about 5 seconds in total.



Tasted alright though.

BetsyGray

LOL @ Blisterman.

Still makes me want a pint now tho!

Elem

Make's no difference, topping up or filling to the top. Same Guinness.

gucci

Blisterman wrote: »

Worst pour of Guinness I've ever seen was in Koko in London.

Bartender pulls out a CAN of Guinness, opens it, sticks a plastic cup over the top, flips it upside down, pulls the can out, as it pours. Crushes the can to get it to pour faster, and hands it to me. Took about 5 seconds in total.



Tasted alright though.

And to show your genuine irishness you drank it down in 4 seconds right?
Sounds like the way they serve beer at concerts from cans

Beerlao

gucci wrote: »

And to show your genuine irishness you drank it down in 4 seconds right?
Sounds like the way they serve beer at concerts from cans

good guess... KoKo's a concert venue

it can be genuinely shocking to see a pint of guinness being poured in some bars abroad. when i was in melbourne i saw the dreaded no-tilt single pour, scrape-the-head-off method and i was reduced to drinking their own muck, Carlton (although some aussie beers like Coopers are really good)