Are you a 'Republican'?

darkman2

Thought id ask this question. I will start by saying that if you are not a 'Republican' then you dont believe in Ireland (or the Republic of Ireland) being an independent nation state (how could you? You're either a Republican or your not). I ask because of the bad press 'Republicanism' has attracted over the years because of IRA violence. I am proud to live in a Republic and to be a Republican and Nationalist. I dont believe Sinn Fein or the IRA have ever had a monopoly on the term and never will. Many say they are not 'Republican' because of the bad name associated with it. But if you're not - then what are you? (someone who believes Ireland's future is best served within the UK?). Of course not. There is no other term to describe those who believe in the democratic, non monarchy, independent country. Thats what we have. So would you label yourself a 'Republican'? Or do you want to, but feel you can not, because of its association with violence? If so what do you call yourself?

patrickc

...
from dundalk shud be more republican than most here but am not

darkman2

patrickc2006 wrote: »

from dundalk shud be more republican than most here but am not

But why not? Thats the question........

Karoma

I removed your posts now. Stop spamming - take it to PM.

5starpool

I am happy that we are in a repulic down here, and would have liked the whole country to have been included in that years ago, but as it stands now I'm happy enough with the way things are. Leave the north as the north. Too many burdens.

Senna

darkman2 wrote: »

Thought id ask this question. I will start by saying that if you are not a 'Republican' then you dont believe in Ireland (or the Republic of Ireland) being an independent nation state (how could you? You're either a Republican or your not). I ask because of the bad press 'Republicanism' has attracted over the years because of IRA violence. I am proud to live in a Republic and to be a Republican and Nationalist. I dont believe Sinn Fein or the IRA have ever had a monopoly on the term and never will. Many say they are not 'Republican' because of the bad name associated with it. But if you're not - then what are you? (someone who believes Ireland's future is best served within the UK?). Of course not. There is no other term to describe those who believe in the democratic, non monarchy, independent country. Thats what we have. So would you label yourself a 'Republican'? Or do you want to, but feel you can not, because of its association with violence? If so what do you call yourself?

Yeah, cause you really have to put a name on everything, you can believe whatever you want and you don't have to be labeled by it.

darkman2

Senna wrote: »

Yeah, cause you really have to put a name on everything, you can believe whatever you want and you don't have to be labeled by it.

With respect, you have not answered the question. Yes, btw, there is (whether you like it or not) terminology for those who believe certain things politically. For the vast majority in this country the term is 'republican' which is closest to their ideals. Or else they would not live in a Republic! Or are you content to allow SF/IRA dictate what hibrid term you choose to adopt?

Senna

darkman2 wrote: »

Or are you content to allow SF/IRA dictate what hibrid term you choose to adopt?

Me, i haven't adopted any term. Its you that wants the term republican used. I have no problem with the term, at face value, but why do you want everyone labeled by it.
The term was adapted by SF and such, so let them be labeled by it, i'd prefer if it was used by a small minority of idiots, rather than used as a term for all Irish people that want a republic (which i know it is)

Its the same with loyalist. The term has out grown its base meaning.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

bloody foreigners!

Rob_l

I am a republican but I am an old school republican I believe in Arthur griffiths Republic I believe in a republic for the people, I dont believe we replaced the brithish with a new ruling class a new upper class, arthur griffiths the head of sinn fein did not want a new british state in ireland run by rich irish men arthur griffiths wanted a new irish state run by irish men for irish men a state to free us from oppresssion not to drive us to a new europrean greed for money




My friends say dublin 24 32 county sovereignty

A Dub in Glasgo

I am an Irish republican and a Scottish republican in that I believe both countries should be independent from the UK and be republics

mikemac

Tbh Republican has almost become a dirty word.
Rob l, I thought Griffith belived in the monarchy and didn't want a full republic for Ireland.

However it's a good point. We do have a quasi ruling class in Ireland and they call themselves property developers and they are fantastic lobbyists.
Publicans and other gombeen men as well I suppose.

I'd proud we have a Republic which is why this thread pissed me off.
Our president is doing a fantastic job and has >80% approval ratings and we get stupid goddamn nerds coming here and calling her a "cow" and her husband is a "leach". Brave men behind a keyboard!
And they don't understand why there was no election last time and believe it was a FF conspiracy.
A bit of respect please for your head of state of your Republic :mad:

arybvtcw0eolkf

Yes I'm a republican. I'm an Irish national and very proud of it.

I want to live in an Ireland free of British occupation.

super_furry

No. I'd suppose the concept of a united Ireland is a nice one, but it's not something I feel anyway passionate about.

Xavi6

Not passionate in the slightest about it. Obviously one united nation would be great but it's too much hassle and I don't want to be painted with the same brush as knacker 'Eire 32' Celtic fans.

tbh

Mairt wrote: »

Yes I'm a republican. I'm an Irish national and very proud of it.

I want to live in an Ireland free of British occupation.

I understand that is is going to seem like I'm arguing with you - I'm not at all, I'm just curious. Here's the question: "Why?" I mean - what difference does it make to you who controls the North, or by extension - anywhere? Do you think if the North was under Irish rule, rather than the devolved system they have there now that your life would be any different? The reason I'm asking is that it seems to me that there's not much that can change - really. I mean, you won't be able to go places that you can't go to now, and in about fifty years there will probably be more catholics than prodestants, or else the line will be so blurred that it won't make any difference (in terms of historical abuses of power etc), so what difference does it make who the titular head of the province is?

I've been thinking lately that nationalism of any kind is a strange thing - just because I was born here, does that make me more Irish than someone who wasn't? Why should any government say "You can live on this rock, possibly never pay tax and in fact be a net burden on society, but you (to an immigrant) can't live here, even if your kids turn out to be net benefactors to society for generations to come".

Again, I understand that these decisions have to be made, but where do we draw the line? What makes someone Irish, and someone else a "non-national"?
Can you be "more" Irish than someone else? I see a lot of Irish scumbags around that place that I wouldn't want to be associated with. I'm proud of my country, but if I were born somewhere else, I'd be proud of that country as well. So why is it important whether the person who still, remember, gets voted in by the majority of the people - lives on this island, or one who lives on a neighbouring island? It seems to me that nationalism is like a religion - I do respect people who believe in it, but I just don't get it.

I know I'm going off topic there Mairt, I'm not putting words in your mouth and I know you were not thinking along the immigration lines whatsoever when you made your post, it's just the direction my mind takes on this subject.

So - long story short - what difference does it make who runs where? Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

super_furry

I'd be happy for the six counties to join with the Republic when and if there's a clear majority living in Northern Ireland that want to see it happen. Until such a time, I think self governance there is by far the best option.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

*slaps tbh around with a wet sliotar*

MrJoeSoap

I could not care less to be honest, because the impact it has on me (living in Dublin) is absolutely minimal. Whatever makes people stop fighting I suppose, but thats never going to happen.

mike65

I wonder if the timing of this thread is coincidence?

Mike.

arybvtcw0eolkf

No, I didn't think you were arguing with me, or trying to put words into my mouth.

My feelings are just something I was brought up with. I can't articulate it properly here, but its a feeling deep inside me.

And don't get me wrong about something either. I'm glad the war in N.I. is over. I don't think another soul should die in the cause for Irish freedom. But N.I. is Irish, its not British, and thats my feelings on it.

I wouldn't try tell you or anyone else you should feel the same because its a personal thing with me.

I hold no ill will against English people for the sin's of their fathers, but I want the occupation of N.I. ended.

Do I lose sleep over it?.. No.

I lose sleep over the fvcked up health service, crime rates, my mortage, my childrens school (and soon to be college fee's). I lose sleep over too many other things to get my knickers up in a twist over N.I. so you won't get an argument out of me on it.. Again like you, I'm not putting words into your mouth because I realise I'm also sounding argumentative.

Terry

Xavi6 wrote: »

Not passionate in the slightest about it. Obviously one united nation would be great but it's too much hassle and I don't want to be painted with the same brush as knacker 'Eire 32' Celtic fans.

But that's the exact point the OP was making.

People are lead to feel ashamed for wanting to declare themselves republican because of the association with Sinn Fein and their scumbag element, who really haven't got a clue about the intricicies of the sitchi-a-shun.

johnnyskeleton

darkman2 wrote: »

I will start by saying that if you are not a 'Republican' then you dont believe in Ireland (or the Republic of Ireland) being an independent nation state (how could you? You're either a Republican or your not).

Republican is a political belief as to how the state should be run. Beliveing in self determination and autonomism is an essential part of republicanism, but republicanism is not an essential part of self determination and autonomism. So you can be a democrat, a communist or a monarchist and still believe in Ireland being an independent nation state.

darkman2 wrote: »

But if you're not - then what are you? (someone who believes Ireland's future is best served within the UK?). Of course not.

The problem I have with your argument is that you start off trying to sever Republicanism as a policital belief generally (the belief that a country should be run by a democratically elected president or counsul and there should also be an accountable legislature and an independent judiciary to provide checks and balances), but then go back on yourself in saying that a republican is someone who doesn't want to live under UK rule. Yet, you try to disassociate yourself with the more extreme end of the not-under-british-rule Republicanism. Do you see the tautology in your argument?

darkman2 wrote: »

There is no other term to describe those who believe in the democratic, non monarchy, independent country. Thats what we have. So would you label yourself a 'Republican'? Or do you want to, but feel you can not, because of its association with violence? If so what do you call yourself?

Yes there is: Democrat.

micmclo wrote: »

I'd proud we have a Republic which is why this thread pissed me off.
Our president is doing a fantastic job and has >80% approval ratings and we get stupid goddamn nerds coming here and calling her a "cow" and her husband is a "leach". Brave men behind a keyboard!
And they don't understand why there was no election last time and believe it was a FF conspiracy.
A bit of respect please for your head of state of your Republic :mad:

I disagree with you strongly. Your beliefs are anti-democratic in that you do not believe in freedom of speech. The greatest part of this immutable and self evident right is the right to criticise the ruling class with immunity (provided you speak the truth). It is my right to criticse the president if I believe that she is not carrying out her functions correctly. If I do so somewhat inelegantly so be it. But it is only in repressive anti-democratic regiemes that you cannot criticise your leaders without fear of persecution (e.g. Pakistan at the moment).

Time Magazine

Mairt wrote: »

I want to live in an Ireland free of British occupation.

You do already

I'd like to see the North reunited with us but not until, you know, the majority of Northerners want that. It's not really "occupation" if a clear majority want it. Otherwise we're occupied by the Gardaí.

boneless

Me? A Republican Socialist.

Cheeky_gal

Biggest Republican in Dublin I'd say....


Tiocfaidh ar la!

TragicJohnson

If by Republican you mean, am I in opposition to having a Monarchy as head of state, then yes I am a Republican.

However I think it is foolhardy to take pride in being from a particular country over another, it's a complete fluke where you are born and you have no choice in it!

thelordofcheese

Not really, i find it hard to get worked up over where i was born, it's not like i had anything to do with it.

Mr.Micro

No .republican has bad connotations associated with it here in Ireland ,the IRA and all that.,who have monopolised the word .I think it is a redundant word in 21st Century Ireland and democrat is probably a better word .

Dudess

I don't like the idea of a chunk of an island being governed by another island - not just because I'm Irish, it would strike me as, among other things, illogical if it was the case anywhere in the world. I like the idea of a united Ireland but the scenario becoming a reality? That could open up a very dangerous can of worms.

JohnnyStones

Republican?

No way I'm a loyalist
:eek:

Dudess

JohnnyStones, your sig makes me feel special...

KlondikePaddy

It isn't really an issue whether whether a person is a republican or not-under the EU we as a nation can't even fart without Brussels permission-thata fact. So Hans, Jurgen, Francois and their EU mates are running the North!:D

JohnnyStones

Dudess wrote: »

JohnnyStones, your sig makes me feel special...

Your NOT
but you really do think you are:mad::mad:

Dudess

It's "you're not".

arybvtcw0eolkf

Dudess wrote: »

It's "you're not".

Defo a Provo/Nazi here

super_furry

Dudess wrote: »

It's "you're not".

You lose.

KIVES

Dudess wrote: »

It's "you're not".

If you're gonna start correcting JonathanStones for poor grammer and dodgy punctuation - you'll end up like King Canute (probably spelt that one wrong but what the heck...)-And as regards it being unusual for one part of an island to be governed seperately by another power, methinks a geography lesson may be in order - Republicanism - pah, causes/ideologies always end up confusing you and driving you to despair

Dudess

KIVES wrote: »

If you're gonna start correcting JonathanStones for poor grammer and dodgy punctuation - you'll end up like King Canute (probably spelt that one wrong but what the heck...)

Ah I only did that because of him having a go at me.

And as regards it being unusual for one part of an island to be governed seperately by another power, methinks a geography lesson may be in order - Republicanism - pah, causes/ideologies always end up confusing you and driving you to despair

Not unusual, but unjust.

Terry

JohnnyStones wrote: »

Your NOT
but you really do think you are:mad::mad:

You might want to change that sig.

Ruen

People in Ireland associate being a Republican with being a shinner and only concerned about irish unity and I think it's unfair to people who believe in the traditional ideals of a Republic where every citizen is equal and freedom is cherished through the practice of democratic rights, the French national motto is the best way to describe the Republicanism I believe in "Liberty, equality, fraternity".

Gavin "shels"

I would be a lean towards being a "republican". Also we live in the Irish Republic not Éire, Republic of Ireland, etc...

solas

Yes I am, the older I get the more closely I align with the concept and more grateful I am for those who fought for it.

mikemac

Gavin shels wrote: »

I would be a lean towards being a "republican". Also we live in the Irish Republic not Éire, Republic of Ireland, etc...

Wtf?
What's wrong with Republic of Ireland?
Republic of Ireland is wrong but Irish Republic is correct?

And you do know of course that Irish is the first offical language of the state and:
The name of the State is Éire, or, in the English language, Ireland.
Article 4 of the constitution
Source:http://www.taoiseach.gov.ie/index.asp?docID=243

Red Hand

There are worse places to live in the world, so I'm glad I live here.

But why feel proud of something that really has little to do with you? You could just as easily have been born in a different country and would be expected to show pride in it. Its just a system of government on a random piece of earth-nothing to get worked up about.

Its pure chance that I live in a society that treats me decently. The Netherlands is a Monarchy and I can't see how being born into a similiar social class and background there, would result in me being any differrent (other than, say, paying extra taxes for the Royal family, which may be a bit more than the family we elect into the Phoneix Park every few years.;))

phantom_lord

yep

WhiteWashMan

darkman2 wrote: »

Thought id ask this question. I will start by saying that if you are not a 'Republican' then you dont believe in Ireland (or the Republic of Ireland) being an independent nation state (how could you? You're either a Republican or your not). I ask because of the bad press 'Republicanism' has attracted over the years because of IRA violence. I am proud to live in a Republic and to be a Republican and Nationalist. I dont believe Sinn Fein or the IRA have ever had a monopoly on the term and never will. Many say they are not 'Republican' because of the bad name associated with it. But if you're not - then what are you? (someone who believes Ireland's future is best served within the UK?). Of course not. There is no other term to describe those who believe in the democratic, non monarchy, independent country. Thats what we have. So would you label yourself a 'Republican'? Or do you want to, but feel you can not, because of its association with violence? If so what do you call yourself?

living in a republic, i am going to assume youre already a republican, no?

im_invisible

Lump wrote: »

I don't what a verb is,

think thats bad? i still dont know what a tracker mortgage is

Terry

WhiteWashMan wrote: »

living in a republic, i am going to assume youre already a republican, no?

Does that make you a monarchist?

Terry

im_invisible wrote: »

think thats bad? i still dont know what a tracker mortgage is

I think you're in the wrong thread.

layke

I don't know what to call myself tbh. I don't beleive in a united Ireland and personally I couldn't care less if the Dail or Crown govern it as long as I get to live in my 1st world country. The north is fine as is, we dont' need the crap that would come with bringing it back to Ireland and the people are better off imo.

These feeling stems from the face I have little confidence in Irelands current leadership of old men who clearly have nothing but vested interests and personal gain in their minds. Also, this united Ireland malarke has to stop, were all part of Europe and I hope it will become more centralised and less indepandant over time.

So, pro Europe con Ireland.