How to lose a stone before Christmas??

traceybere

Hi Guys,

I'm 12stone at the moment 5'4. I've an active enough job but wouldn't be overly fit. My generally calorie intake is 1400. I walk two – three evenings a week. I don’t have a lot of time to exercise as I have a four year old and a demanding job. I’m desperate to loose some weight . I know there is no quick fixes that would last long term but I would really like to try and drop a stone before Christmas. Would anyone have any ideas??

Thanks

Traceybere

Patto

Maintain your current calorie deficit but eat 5 to 6 small meals a day.
Cut out all carbs except fruit and veg. No potatoes, eat absolutely nothing sweet. Eat fresh food, eat nothing processed.
Eat more nuts and seeds and lean meats to make up for all the bread, pasta, potatoes, sweets and chocolate you have cut out.
Increase your walking mileage gradually up to 15 miles a week.

I counted 18 assumptions that I made based on the limited information provided.

Even if 17 of those 18 assumptions are wrong what I have said will work 100% guaranteed.

Have a read of the stickies for more info, better still just go and do it.:)

Potential-Monke

Or you could try the Lipotrim diet, where you don't eat but it will guarantee results. Only thing is though, you get very depressed for the first 2 weeks... And it apparently causes long term hair loss...

Those new tablets called Plavsa are supposed to be excellent. You eat as normal, and take one of these and it takes all the fat out of the food you ate before digestion and you pass it instead... Might try them myself someday.

seaner

what about weight watchers or something like that? My gf joined WW last year about 2 months before christmas and she got down to her ideal weight. Thing is she really enjoyed it, and she said it helped alot surrounding herself with others who were trying to achieve the same goal as her.

Newaglish

traceybere wrote: »

Hi Guys,

I'm 12stone at the moment 5'4. I've an active enough job but wouldn't be overly fit. My generally calorie intake is 1400. I walk two – three evenings a week. I don’t have a lot of time to exercise as I have a four year old and a demanding job. I’m desperate to loose some weight . I know there is no quick fixes that would last long term but I would really like to try and drop a stone before Christmas. Would anyone have any ideas??

Thanks

Traceybere

Are you losing weight at the moment? How long have you been on this diet? How much do you weigh/how tall are you?

Seems like at 1400 calories/day you should be losing weight!

Vegeta

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Or you could try the Lipotrim diet, where you don't eat but it will guarantee results. Only thing is though, you get very depressed for the first 2 weeks... And it apparently causes long term hair loss...

Those new tablets called Plavsa are supposed to be excellent. You eat as normal, and take one of these and it takes all the fat out of the food you ate before digestion and you pass it instead... Might try them myself someday.

Please tell me you are joking

To the OP Patto's advice is pretty spot on, but is your calorie defecit not a bit severe though for your weight (under eating will put your body in starvation mode and will hang on to fat as it is energy rich). I assume you mean you want to lose fat. Losing weight is actually pretty easy

For example I have lost a stone in 3 weeks. It aint all fat though, fluids, fat and glycogen. So what did I do, cut out all carbs bar vegetables, up my fat and protein intake and exercise 5-6 nights a week. Very straight forward

Losing a stone of fat by xmas is just about do able at 2lbs of fat a week.

You should cut out all crap of your diet
Eat 5-6 same size clean meals a day to reach your calorie intake (read the stickies to figure out that calorie figure, you may be under eating) keep a food diary it well help monitor you daily intake
Work your ass off at exercise, up the intensity of your walks (turn them into half jogs then eventually over the next 2 months to full jogs)

People are accused all the time here of offering over complicated advice so again in 3 simple steps

No crap food
Sort your diet
Exercise outside your comfort zone.

We all have commitments such as kids and jobs, stop using them as an excuse. If you want change badly enough you will make it happen

mack1

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Or you could try the Lipotrim diet, where you don't eat but it will guarantee results. Only thing is though, you get very depressed for the first 2 weeks... And it apparently causes long term hair loss...

Those new tablets called Plavsa are supposed to be excellent. You eat as normal, and take one of these and it takes all the fat out of the food you ate before digestion and you pass it instead... Might try them myself someday.

OP - I strongly urge you not to take such a desperate and unhealthy short-cut. There is no reason for anyone to do something like this. As others have said, cut out the processed crap, the sugar etc, build up the exercise, you'll get there, you'll stay there, and more importantly you won't have caused any permanent damage to your body!

Cheeky_gal

How on earth is telling someone not to have carbs for a WHOLE MONTH good advice? I agree keeping carbs to a minimum is hands on advice but cutting them out altogether....

OP, realistically speaking, it's gonna be a very boring few weeks ahead of you if all you can eat for dinner is the same aul meat n veg, have carbs if you want carbs, but only have them at lunch or in the morning. But cutting them out altogher is gonna f*ck up your insides down the line.

Secondly, just increase your exercise intensity if you cant find time to exercise more. Simple as! Hope all goes well for ya!

And water, lots and lots of water!

Vegeta

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

How on earth is telling someone not to have carbs for a WHOLE MONTH good advice? I agree keeping carbs to a minimum is hands on advice but cutting them out altogether....

I haven't had any (other than veg) in 3 weeks (bar one day as a planned carb up day) and guess what I am not dead. In fact I hope to go 2 months without them. Why do you think they are needed?

OP, realistically speaking, it's gonna be a very boring few weeks ahead of you if all you can eat for dinner is the same aul meat n veg, have carbs if you want carbs, but only have them at lunch or in the morning. But cutting them out altogher is gonna f*ck up your insides down the line.

I am speaking from experience here when I say you are just straight out wrong

Cheeky_gal

Vegeta wrote: »

Why do you think they are needed?

It's been proven, simple as, those who've been on the Atkins or anyone who has just cut out carbs has had internal problems few years down the line. I'm not criticising you here, by no means, if you want to cut out carbs you cut out those carbs, sure it's every mans opinion for himself at the end of the day.

seaner

I totally agree with Cheeky gal.
Say what you wil, but cutting out a complete food group just seems insane.

How can slow releasing carbohyrdates be a bad thing? I couldn't live without my morning bowl of porridge!!
As the old saying goes - everything in moderation.

spiral

your not actually cutting them out at all if you eat sufficient veg fruit nuts and seeds you still probably have 30-40 % carbs in your diet and thats after getting rid of bread, pasta rice spuds.

Vegeta

seaner wrote: »

I totally agree with Cheeky gal.
Say what you wil, but cutting out a complete food group just seems insane.

How can slow releasing carbohyrdates be a bad thing? I couldn't live without my morning bowl of porridge!!
As the old saying goes - everything in moderation.

Obviously there is no convincing people with logic when they have sat themselves staunchly in the "its been proven" category

Your body does not need carbohydrates in the large quantities we usually eat them

You will notice we have told the OP to continue eating vegetables which do have carbs but also a decent amount of fibre, vits and minerals

To be blunt I crap every day like clockwork just like i did when eating carbs, you know why because i get my fibre from veg and other sources (milled flax seeds).

So please tell me with some logic how low carbing (not no carbing) will ruin my insides??

Vegeta

To the OP do not listen to the debate about low carbing as it is a side issue to your problem

rubadub

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

Atkins or anyone who has just cut out carbs has had internal problems few years down the line.

Atkins is a different story to what is being recommended here, Atkins advocates foods high in saturated fat, with no real concern about calorie control, and rules out more carbs than vegeta is suggesting.


I have followed lower carb diets and found they help, protein is a good appetite suppresant. I still have oats in the morning time, and some sugars during the day in sauces, but no bread or spuds.

mack1

rubadub wrote: »

Atkins is a different story to what is being recommended here, Atkins advocates foods high in saturated fat, with no real concern about calorie control, and rules out more carbs than vegeta is suggesting.

To be fair, it doesn't actually advocate that, that is just what the media have decided to spin it as. It's not all fry ups and butter, it was just one of the first diets to say that fat isn't the work of the devil etc etc.

Anyway - back on topic!

rovers_runner

Diet aside, cut out the walking in favour of decent exercise.
Walking isn't worth a lot to you unless you have reasons for not being more active.

Cycling/Running/Team Sports will cover the loss of more than enough calories to shed a stone in 8 weeks.

traceybere

Newaglish wrote: »

Are you losing weight at the moment? How long have you been on this diet? How much do you weigh/how tall are you?

Seems like at 1400 calories/day you should be losing weight!

I'm loosing around 1lb a week - only tried cutting my cal's in the last six weeks.

I'm 5'4 and 12stone

traceybere

Vegeta wrote: »

Please tell me you are joking

We all have commitments such as kids and jobs, stop using them as an excuse. If you want change badly enough you will make it happen

Just for the record i'm not using my child as an excuse - i'm a single parent who works a 45 hour week - i get out two evenings a week and when i do i walk or jog (well try to jog)

Degsy

Nobody has mentioned booze.Cut out beer if you want to loose weight.I find its the singular most fattening thing i consume.Your diet can be 100% but drinking regularly will greatly slow your weight loss.

crotalus667

traceybere wrote: »

I'm loosing around 1lb a week - only tried cutting my cal's in the last six weeks.

I'm 5'4 and 12stone

Up your cardio and it will fall off , your already losing 1lb per week if you burn an extra 3500 calories per week (500 a day ) you will up you weight loss to 2lbs a day , if your going low carb get the green isle bags of mixed veg they are normally 2 for 2:50 half a bag is normally a portion size for me (im a big guy ), 20 mins in the steamer cooks the whole bag

Vegeta

traceybere wrote: »

Just for the record i'm not using my child as an excuse - i'm a single parent who works a 45 hour week - i get out two evenings a week and when i do i walk or jog (well try to jog)

I don't mean to be an asshole but your exact words were

"I don’t have a lot of time to exercise as I have a four year old and a demanding job"

So the reason you gave for not exercising more was becuase of your child and job. I am not implying you are a bad parent (far from it if you have to work a 45 hour week, pay for child care and try to exercise) but they were the reasons given.

Now if you want weight loss bad enough you will find a solution. Adding weights/exercise at home. Adding an activity that you child can also enjoy, swimming, cycling, hill walking, martial arts.

Again I am not calling you a bad parent but in your own words the reasons for not exercising more were your child and job. I apologise if I caused any offence as it was not intended.

seaner

Vegeta wrote: »

Obviously there is no convincing people with logic when they have sat themselves staunchly in the "its been proven" category

eh, i don't think I said that anywhere in my post.

Cheeky_gal

seaner wrote: »

eh, i don't think I said that anywhere in my post.

I wouldn't worry Seaner, I think she was having a dig at me there...

mack1

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

I wouldn't worry Seaner, I think she was having a dig at me there...

To be fair to Vegeta, you did claim something had been proven yet never backed it up with any links etc.

Also, I highly doubt there is any proof that cutting carbs does any internal damage considering cavemen existed on a very low carb diet of meat, nuts and berries with not a slice of bread in sight for eons before we figured out that we could grow wheat and refine it.

Either way, the OP is not contemplating drastic low carb weightloss and us arguing back and forth is not helping her at all.

OP - you say you are losing about 1lb a week at the current rate - that's pretty good going. I know it is not going to meet your target of a stone by xmas but to be honest it is a nice sustainable rate of weight loss.
If you really want to lose some more weight I would say up the exercise intensity a bit, I know you are pushed for time, which is why I am saying up the intensity, not the time. If you are going for a 20min walk now, do 5min walk, 2mins running, 2mins walking, 2mins jogging, 2mins running etc etc you get the idea.
I wouldn't cut anymore kcals as 1400 is already very low.

Vegeta

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

I wouldn't worry Seaner, I think she was having a dig at me there...

Firstly I am a guy (but you could have been having a dig there too )

Was I wrong though, have you changed your mind on low carbing

Seaner yeah sorry I quoted you but inserted a phrase used by Cheeky_Gal, you were both of the same opinion so I was trying to address you both at once

spiral

your not actually cutting them out at all if you eat sufficient veg fruit nuts and seeds you still probably have 30-40 % carbs in your diet and thats after getting rid of bread, pasta rice spuds.

Cheeky_gal

Vegeta wrote: »

Firstly I am a guy (but you could have been having a dig there too )

LOL! Apologies...

Vegeta wrote: »

Was I wrong though, have you changed your mind on low carbing

Well I've just had a big bowl of pasta there and am off to the gym now so I think that should answer your question...

Dragan

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

It's been proven, simple as, those who've been on the Atkins or anyone who has just cut out carbs has had internal problems few years down the line.

Cheeky_gal,

can you please post some references to studies and online journal with regard to the above statement?

Thank you.

Cheeky_gal

Dragan wrote: »

Cheeky_gal,

can you please post some references to studies and online journal with regard to the above statement?

Thank you.

Dragan,

Here's your link. ->
http://www.escardio.org/bodies/associations/EACPR/news/Lifestyle_CVD_Literature/2-diabetes-lowCarbohydrates.htm

My favourite though... ->
http://livinlavidalocarb.blogspot.com/2006/11/study-long-term-heart-health-issues.html

I'm sure if you mess around in google you will find many more articles like the above.

Thank you.

Vegeta

spiral wrote: »

your not actually cutting them out at all if you eat sufficient veg fruit nuts and seeds you still probably have 30-40 % carbs in your diet and thats after getting rid of bread, pasta rice spuds.

Not even close to that % I'd say more like 5%

I have a cup of green veg (broccoli, sprouts etc) with breakfast, mid morning meal and lunch and that's it veg wise. I have nuts (or nut butter) usually at mid morning and afternoon meals.

All in I'd say 30-35 grams of carbs which is roughly 120-140 calories which is in or around 5% of daily allowance

traceybere

mack1 wrote: »

To be fair to Vegeta, you did claim something had
OP - you say you are losing about 1lb a week at the current rate - that's pretty good going. I know it is not going to meet your target of a stone by xmas but to be honest it is a nice sustainable rate of weight loss.
If you really want to lose some more weight I would say up the exercise intensity a bit, I know you are pushed for time, which is why I am saying up the intensity, not the time. If you are going for a 20min walk now, do 5min walk, 2mins running, 2mins walking, 2mins jogging, 2mins running etc etc you get the idea.
I wouldn't cut anymore kcals as 1400 is already very low.

Thanks a million - thats sound like a plan

And thanks everyone for your responses - very much appreciated

Dragan

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

Dragan,

Here's your link. ->
http://www.escardio.org/bodies/associations/EACPR/news/Lifestyle_CVD_Literature/2-diabetes-lowCarbohydrates.htm

I'm sure if you mess around in google you will find many more articles like the above.

Thank you.

Cheers,

my main problem witht he above study is that they did not seem to do anything in conjunction with the subjects fat intake? The simply state that saturated fats are undesirable ( fair enough point ) but that his levels of unsaturated fats in a diet are difficult to maintain outside of Mediteranean countries?

Very few low carb plans that i have ever seen do a swap of carbs for protein, it is nearly always carbs for fats?

My second problem is that the do not mention if they performed any health history screening with the subjects.

My third is that the study was done by the subjects filling out a questionaire, which is a sure fire way to get things all messed up.

In short, i don't think the above would stand up to a massive amount of scrutiny by anyone........ much like a lot of the studies i have read where they advocate the opposite.

Cheeky_gal

Dragan wrote: »

Cheers,

my main problem witht he above study is that they did not seem to do anything in conjunction with the subjects fat intake? The simply state that saturated fats are undesirable ( fair enough point ) but that his levels of unsaturated fats in a diet are difficult to maintain outside of Mediteranean countries?

Very few low carb plans that i have ever seen do a swap of carbs for protein, it is nearly always carbs for fats?

My second problem is that the do not mention if they performed any health history screening with the subjects.

My third is that the study was done by the subjects filling out a questionaire, which is a sure fire way to get things all messed up.

In short, i don't think the above would stand up to a massive amount of scrutiny by anyone........ much like a lot of the studies i have read where they advocate the opposite.

I posted another link for you there if you scroll up to my comment.

If you don't agree with Pagona Lagiou (University of Athens Medical School, Greece)'s research that's your decision, I'm baffled as to how this debate is still going on, can people not just accept that everyone has their own opinion and move on...!?!

mack1

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

can people not just accept that everyone has their own opinion and move on...!?!

when you begin posts with "It has been proven..." you have gone beyond opinion. If your opinion is that you lose weight on a high carb diet then I don't think many would argue with you - but many people have experienced the opposite, so when you claim that there is proof that they are wrong an argument ensues.

BaZmO*

Eat less, exercise more. And when you do eat cut out the junk food by eating more wholefoods. Do that and you'll lose a stone by Christmas no probs.

I wouldn't worry about trying to get all scientific as it just gets all complicated and becomes a chore.

Nuttzz

i've lost a stone in the last month,

changes i've made

porridge and a bagel and black tea for breakfast (8-9am)

lunch at 1pm, normally brown sandwich or light meal

normal enough dinner at 6pm

I dont eat anything after 7 bar a piece of fruit if peckish, same between meals.

I drink about 3-4 litres of water.

I walk every evening for 35 minutes at a brisk pace

I run on a saturday and do a 5km walk

Started at Sept 29th weight 18st 8 ibs, today 17st 6ibs. Herself started the same time on the same plan and has lost 10ib

This week i have started to un the training by going back to the gym and doing bike work and weights.

Good luck but as yousay yourself there is no quick fix

Cheeky_gal

mack1 wrote: »

when you begin posts with "It has been proven..." you have gone beyond opinion. If your opinion is that you lose weight on a high carb diet then I don't think many would argue with you - but many people have experienced the opposite, so when you claim that there is proof that they are wrong an argument ensues.

Nah, it has been proven sure look at the articles...omg! And yes, it's obvious you'll lose weight if you cut out carbs...thats been proven too! :rolleyes:

Anyways look at the comment above mine by Nuttzz, now theres proof. Congrats Nuttzz...

Dragan

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

I posted another link for you there if you scroll up to my comment.

If you don't agree with Pagona Lagiou (University of Athens Medical School, Greece)'s research that's your decision, I'm baffled as to how this debate is still going on, can people not just accept that everyone has their own opinion and move on...!?!

Thank you,

the second link you posted seems to mostly back up low-carb diets?

Also, it's not that i don't agree with Pagona Lagious, simply that by the end even she was saying her study is far from conclusive, and more work needs to be done? It's also not the researcher i would ever disagree, simply that i have certain things i like to see when reading these studies and if they are not in place i don't take them too seriously.

From my day job i am more than aware of how numbers can be easily skewed an manipulated....i like to see that people have safeties in place to ensure this cannot happen during studies such as the above.

Finally, the 7th Rule of Debate Club is debates will go on as long as they too.....everything in this thread has so far been very polite....i see no reason to end the discussion?

spiral

Vegeta wrote: »

Not even close to that % I'd say more like 5%

I have a cup of green veg (broccoli, sprouts etc) with breakfast, mid morning meal and lunch and that's it veg wise. I have nuts (or nut butter) usually at mid morning and afternoon meals.

All in I'd say 30-35 grams of carbs which is roughly 120-140 calories which is in or around 5% of daily allowance

Fair enough thats yourself but I said if you eat sufficient veggies fruit etc you can still have a reasonable amt of carbs without eating bread etc.

Vegeta

spiral wrote: »

Fair enough thats yourself but I said if you eat sufficient veggies fruit etc you can still have a reasonable amt of carbs without eating bread etc.

Oh hell yeah, if you are eating carbs the more you get from vegetables and the likes the better.

I should be very clear here actually. Carbs are not evil, they have a purpose. I am trying to lose bodyfat while retaining my muscle so low carbing, I have found, is working for me, very well actually.

This thread has gone way off topic and I fell a little responsible for that so apologies to the mods. I think the OPs questions have been well answered

Transform

Anyone can drop a few pounds hell even a few stone if they are coming from being very overweight

For example i have a client who started at 16 stone (female at 5'10" - so very overweight), she is now down to 14 stone in a year (yes not amazing progress but still).

Now she has made no major changes to diet other than cutting out the junk and lowering her portions HOWEVER she will not drop any futher weight until she address her excessive carb intake - this is yes specific to her but common to soooooooooo many clients i have delt with.

Watching your carb intake is essential for those with some (no more than a stone) weight to drop but for those that have more to drop then hell doing all the obvious s&*t will work as they have put in practice at eating too much crap.

Focus on getting all your carbs from fruit, veg and some whole grains -its not Atkins, Zone etc its just what works for most and if you look in the miror and don't like the results your getting then your plan is obviously not working.

rubadub

traceybere wrote: »

I'm loosing around 1lb a week
I'm 5'4 and 12stone

Slower the better IMO. For most people 2lb per week is the most fat they can loose per week. Also in your first month or so weight loss is easier as it is liquids & other factors causing you to lose more. So 1lb per week is very good at this stage.

If I was a 5'4'' woman I would be very happy with 1lb per week, in fact I would be aiming for lower loss rates. It is a higher % of your weight being lost than say a large man. Rushing it will only screw your metabolism more.

I lost about 3 stone of fat at around 0.25lb per week and it has stayed off.

traceybere

Nuttzz wrote: »

i've lost a stone in the last month,


Started at Sept 29th weight 18st 8 ibs, today 17st 6ibs. Herself started the same time on the same plan and has lost 10ib

This week i have started to un the training by going back to the gym and doing bike work and weights.

Good luck but as yousay yourself there is no quick fix

WOW Nutzz - thats good going - fair play @)

seaner

hi
is cutting down on carbs a sustainable lifestyle change? I'm genuinely wondering, cuz to me, it would seem hard to try and keep this up...forever?

g'em

traceybere, losing a stone by Christmas is entirely do-able. It's not particularly easy, but it's not particularly hard either.

these points have been made already, but I'm going to say them again just to point out that they work :

* Eat smaller portions
use a smaller plate if needed to make your plate look fuller than it is. Do NOT, however, starve yourself or undereat, this is counterproductive.

* Eat more often
most of us are indoctrined to eat at breakfast, lunch and dinner. It's fine to eat snacks between meals, just reduce the size of your 3 'main' meals to compensate

* Cut out junk.
If it's deep fried/ battered/ from a chipper/ called an "extra-value-meal"/ out of a cardboard box in the freezer section/ has more than five ingredients/ you don't understand what any of the ingredients are... just don't eat it. Sounds horrendously hard? Nah, not really, we've just become so accosted to taking the lazy option for eating we've forgotten how to eat well.

* Drink more water
the better your body is hydrated, the less blaoting and water retention you'll suffer

* Move more.
Run around the park with the kids. Take the dog for two walks a week. Get off the bus two stops early. Take the stairs instead of the lift. Put on your favourite CD and dance (endless entertainment for the kids!!). Instead of chatting on the phone with a friend suggest you meet up and walk together. If you're feeling crappy don't reach for the crisps - get up, put on some runners and go outside. I *promise* you'll feel better within minutes. Join a salsa class. Go for a swim. Cycle at the weekends. Get a skipping rope and skip in the back garden.

It's abosltuely and utterly ALL do-able, it just requires a bit of initial effort

Colm_OReilly

As a suggestion to the OP, play with your child more. Physical play I mean. Pick them up, swing them around, push them up overhead, lie on your back and try to balance them on your feet for a bit, if you can do that press them out with your feet, do jockey back, piggy back races with them, exercise together and it'll be fun. You'll be doing weight training and bonding with your child as well.

http://media.crossfit.com/cf-video/CrossFit_Masons1stVid.wmv

This is a vid link of a kid shooting his parent's workout and then doing one of his own. I've seen vids with parent's using their kids as weights but can't find any now.

Hope this helps,
Colm

Cheeky_gal

g'em wrote: »

* Drink more water
the better your body is hydrated, the less blaoting and water retention you'll suffer

I just have a question. As tea and coffee both act as diuretics and make you dehydrated, how many glasses/bottles of water would you need to replace a cup of coffee?

mack1

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

I just have a question. As tea and coffee both act as dilutes and make you dehydrated, how many glasses/bottles of water would you need to replace a cup of coffee?

Actually, while the the substance Tea and Coffee themselves dehydrate, I've read that having a cup of either has more than enough water to produce a net hydrating effect. Only alcohol actually dehydrates.

PS - I know I've broken the rule I pointed out to you earlier by not providing a link to prove this, but I will try find it for you later!

Cheeky_gal

mack1 wrote: »

Actually, while the the substance Tea and Coffee themselves dehydrate, I've read that having a cup of either has more than enough water to produce a net hydrating effect.

PS - I know I've broken the rule I pointed out to you earlier by not providing a link to prove this, but I will try find it for you later!

haha you're grand, thanks for replying, I don't quite get what you mean though by "net hydrating effect"?!? Is this a good thing cuz I drink about 3 cups of coffee a day.

seaner

read this: http://advance.uconn.edu/2002/020722/02072207.htm

now personally I find that when i drink tea or coffee I need the loo more than if I drank teh equivalent in water. But interesting thoughts in the above link....