Lost phone - huge bill

cast_iron

Commander Vimes wrote:

Op, here's an idea. Some phones have a feature that when you lock them you need to enter the security code to unlock it. The 6230i is one example. Maybe you should invest in one

Indeed, but that won't suit in this case - it would require work for the OP every time he uses the phone. He wants o2 to do all the nannying.

DeepBlue

Commander Vimes wrote:

Not quite. The credit card system is quite flawed in that a card can be easily cloned and used without the owner's knowledge.

And the system that the phone companies use have no flaws? Reporting your phone missing within 24 hours will solve all situations?

Commander Vimes wrote:

you say that as if its some big evil conspiracy.

I never said anything about evil corporations - you seem to be reading things that aren't there.

However, as anyone that knows anything about business would tell you, any business will concentrate it's energies on issues where it can make money or where it can lose money.
Since telcos don't lose money by this theft (because they simply pass it on to the customer) and because they make a nice profit (as typically the thief will make high value calls) then a fix is not high on their lists of priorities. That's not because they are evil corporations - it's simply a matter of profit or loss.

Commander Vimes wrote:

Your credit card can be copied without your knowledge, your mobile cannot. All you have to do is not be a thick and report it before a bill is run up

That would make some sense if the only way to become a victim is to be stupid/lazy/irresponsible.
All a thief needs is access to your phone or SIM card and there are plenty of scenarios where one can be scammed where the victim is intelligent/hard-working/responsible. I won't suggest any here as there's no point in giving people ideas.

Once it starts to cost the telcos something then we'll suddenly be bowled over with security measures. Telcos use so much information technology I'm sure it won't be too onerous for them to come up with some system that works.

DeepBlue

Commander Vimes wrote:

Op, here's an idea. Some phones have a feature that when you lock them you need to enter the security code to unlock it. The 6230i is one example. Maybe you should invest in one

There's not much point investing in one if the security code can be reset at the cost of €5 - http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=11906

€5 isn't much of an investment if one plans to make €900 worth of calls and besides an experienced scammer will probably already know how to bypass it.
All the more reason for the telcos to introduce some security mechanism that works.

Random

But in order to do this you'll need to power off the phone (to get the IMEI) - and then you'll have to bypass the PIN to get your calls made.

Sam Vimes

DeepBlue wrote:

There's not much point investing in one if the security code can be reset at the cost of €5 - http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=11906

in fact it can be reset for free:
http://nfader.z-host.ru/

but the average scum bag doesn't know that

edit: i see ciaranfo already pointed out that its free

DeepBlue wrote:

And the system that the phone companies use have no flaws?

it has flaws in that sim cards can be cloned but the thief still has to have access to the sim to do it so there's not much point cloning it because he would have already stolen the genuine one.

if he somehow takes it temporarily and puts it back without the person noticing he'd have to wait until the guy turned his phone off because they can't both be active on the network at the same time. also sim cloning equipment is very expensive. hardly worth it

DeepBlue wrote:

Reporting your phone missing within 24 hours will solve all situations?

well, yes. i don't quite understand what you're saying here. o2 will accept liability for calls as long as it was reported within 24 hours so yes it will solve all situations

DeepBlue wrote:

I never said anything about evil corporations - you seem to be reading things that aren't there.

However, as anyone that knows anything about business would tell you, any business will concentrate it's energies on issues where it can make money or where it can lose money.
Since telcos don't lose money by this theft (because they simply pass it on to the customer) and because they make a nice profit (as typically the thief will make high value calls) then a fix is not high on their lists of priorities. That's not because they are evil corporations - it's simply a matter of profit or loss.

my point was you seemed to be suggesting that they could easily solve this problem but want to make profit from theft instead. how do you suggest they solve the problem besides what people have already suggested which would piss people off and result in thousands of false positives weekly.

i really can't understand why people have such a problem with getting to a phone within 24 hours of someone stealing their phone. is it that difficult?

DeepBlue wrote:

That would make some sense if the only way to become a victim is to be stupid/lazy/irresponsible.
All a thief needs is access to your phone or SIM card and there are plenty of scenarios where one can be scammed where the victim is intelligent/hard-working/responsible. I won't suggest any here as there's no point in giving people ideas.

such as what? other than the highly implausible sim card cloning scenario i mentioned above i can't think of any way someone could have access to your account for a consecutive 24 hour period without your knowledge

also, in a situation where the person couldn't have known that their account had been compromised such as having their card cloned, i'd be fairly positive o2 would accept liability. this case is not one of those situations

MOH

Commander Vimes wrote:

it has flaws in that sim cards can be cloned but the thief still has to have access to the sim to do it so there's not much point cloning it because he would have already stolen the genuine one.

if he somehow takes it temporarily and puts it back without the person noticing he'd have to wait until the guy turned his phone off because they can't both be active on the network at the same time. also sim cloning equipment is very expensive. hardly worth it

Utter nonsense. Have you not seen the Bourne Supremacy?