Pot limit Vs NL

samelterrance

WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY (talking about SE here)
do they not have NL games, I hear they do on the weekend, but I was there on Monday night, and they had 3 FULL tables of Pot Limit 1/2.

Why don't they deal NL and make 250 or something min to sit down with.
PL 1/2 you get drunk people sitting down with 50.

P.S I F*KIN HATE POL LIMIT

Tar.Aldarion

Yes.

El Stuntman

why don't you ask them?

there's usually a NL table on Fridays/Saturdays, it's still 1/2 though

samelterrance

I asked them and they wouldn't put one on.

I even asked if they could take a vote of how many people wanted NL and to stick them on another table, if there were enough the other two tables would still have been full. they wouldn't

and been able to sit down 50 is just a joke. Maybe have one table just for a 50 Min for the drunk people but not every table.

mdwexford

your thread title is misleading, limit is not pot limit

samelterrance

mdwexford wrote:

your thread title is misleading, limit is not pot limit

Yes, you are correct and apologise !!!!
Thanks

Mr.Plough

more rake

samelterrance

Mr.Plough wrote:

more rake

speaking of rake, now that I'm on a rant ..
why not just charge everyone at the table every half hour or hour like they do in the UK !!!! that's the proper way of doing it.

Mr.Plough

not good for nut peddlers like myself.

The_Daddy_H

More rake, people dont lose all their money quite so fast.

Samba

try learning PL it's a far more skillful game

samelterrance

Samba wrote:

try learning PL it's a far more skillful game

What, PL is more skillful !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you have got to be kidding me.

bohsman

PL is a far more skillful game, poor players cant just push all in, they actually have to play more than one street.

LuckyLloyd

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samelterrance

What, are you afraid of ALL INs .. that's where the skill comes in, do I call, do I not call,

PL, you know exactly how much you have to potentially pay out to see another card.

NL is by far the game that requires more skill.

LuckyLloyd

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samelterrance

I am so curious

what makes you think PL is more skillful than NL

samelterrance

LuckyLloyd wrote:

wrong, very wrong. I actually don't know where to begin. Someone help?

"Pot-limit has more skill to it than limit poker, but no-limit has far more skill than pot-limit." [135]

taken from Inside T.J. Cloutier's Championship No-Limit and Pot-Limit Hold'em



but maybe you know better than the pros.

Jesus Wept

Samba wrote:

try learning PL it's a far more skillful game

Load of balls. If they made it double PL preflop it might be skillful, but when 6 people take every flop (ala 1-2 PL in dublin), there is f-all skill in that.

samelterrance

The-Rigger wrote:

Load of balls. If they made it double PL pf it might be skillful, but when 6 people take every flop, there is f-all skill in that.

FINALLY, someone that is making sense

5starpool

samelterrance wrote:

but maybe you know better than the pros.

TJ Cloutier's words does not mean he can generically be referred to as "The Pros".

I think it was HJ who posted recently something along the lines of "If you never bet more than the pot you will rarely, if ever be making a mistake". There are different skills in NL that are not used in PL, but there are also shortcuts in NL that will allow weaker players to prevail over the short term. NL is a field leveller in many respects. PL is usually a more skill based games overall. When played properly, there is not a huge difference, except perhaps preflop, between PL and NL in most respects.

samelterrance

5starpool wrote:

there is not a huge difference, except perhaps preflop, between PL and NL in most respects.

How can say that is not a huge difference..that's the game !! It's a massive difference.

samelterrance

5star and lucky,

would you/have you, lost more money playing PL or NL.

5starpool

samelterrance wrote:

How can say that is not a huge difference..that's the game !! It's a massive difference.

There are several streets to play you know, it is not all preflop as your above post, taken in isolation seems to imply. It is mostly the first raise preflop that is affected.

5starpool

samelterrance wrote:

5star and lucky,

would you/have you, lost more money playing PL or NL.

I almost exclusively play NL tournies, or cash PLO anyhow. There may be a part of me that just enjoys disagreeing with people, but not all of my points relate to that.

Edit: Nice phrasing of the question btw.

samelterrance

5starpool wrote:

There are several streets to play you know, it is not all preflop as your above post, taken in isolation seems to imply. It is mostly the first raise preflop that is affected.

I do agree, there are several streets to play, but it all stems from pre-flop nevertheless.

ollyk1

samelterrance wrote:

5star and lucky,

would you/have you, won more money playing PL or NL.

FYP

samelterrance

5starpool wrote:

I almost exclusively play NL tournies, or cash PLO anyhow. There may be a part of me that just enjoys disagreeing with people, but not all of my points relate to that.

the majority of time though, you play PL cause NL is not available or you just prefer Omaha ?

samelterrance

ollyk1 wrote:

FYP

sorry, what is FYP ?

5starpool

samelterrance wrote:

the majority of time though, you play PL cause NL is not available or you just prefer Omaha ?

I prefer Omaha by far in cash games. However, there is as you say, no option to play NLHE anyhow. I agree with you that there should be NL games, but that is a different point. I think worse players and better players due to the worse players, would play NL games anyhow.

5starpool

samelterrance wrote:

sorry, what is FYP ?

This means that he updated your post in the quoted part of his reply to change a part of it to a correct meaning. In other words, Fixed Your Post (FYP). In the above case he changed lost to won.

LuckyLloyd

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Ste05

samelterrance wrote:

would you/have you, lost more money playing PL or NL.

I smell a little bit of trolling here.

Instead of continually asking people why PL is more skillful than NL, why not explain why in your opinion NL is more skillful then PL.

And I wouldn't take everything you read in a named pro's book to be gospel.

5starpool's post above explained it well I think:

"There are different skills in NL that are not used in PL, but there are also shortcuts in NL that will allow weaker players to prevail over the short term. NL is a field leveller in many respects. PL is usually a more skill based games overall. When played properly, there is not a huge difference, except perhaps preflop, between PL and NL in most respects."

In my opinion PL is more skillful in general because to get someone's whole tank into the pot it takes more streets of play. However as the Rigger says when there's 5 or 6 people seeing every raised flop, the skill is slightly negated, because it basically becomes the same as NL when there might only be 1 or 2 pot bets allowed.

Anyway, I've my troll sniffing hat on right now and I've set it to maximum power. Seeing as Dom seems to be on happy pills today :rolleyes:

El Stuntman

LuckyLloyd wrote:

The fish PREFER pot limit.

.

the NL game is usually no value with the likes of halfbaked owning it

samelterrance

Yeah, getting side tracked.

My original post basically was ranting about not enough availabilty for NL games.
Not trying to sound condescending by any means, but I think alot of people in dublin might have the attitude of PL has more skill to NL because they haven't experienced enough sessions of proper NL.

But as said, just dissapointing not having the option.
Apologies to anyone if I ruffled the feather btw.

LuckyLloyd

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Ste05

samelterrance wrote:

My original post basically was ranting about not enough availabilty for NL games.
Not trying to sound condescending by any means, but I think alot of people in dublin might have the attitude of PL has more skill to NL because they haven't experienced enough sessions of proper NL.

It's actually the other way round usually, normally people haven't played much PL and don't give it the respect it deserves, and think PL doesn't require the same skill, whereas, actually it generally you're at a semi tough table the skill needed is much higher. I certainly was guilty of that when starting out in the PL games in town.

LuckyLloyd

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mdwexford

down in my part of the country (Wexford/Waterford) it is all no-limit, there is no such thing as pot-limit because all the donks love their 25 on the blind rubbish and ridiculous overbets.

i much prefer pot-limit but both games have aspects which require different skills and its hard to say one requires more than the other imo.

Ste05

LuckyLloyd wrote:

You were also guilty of being fcuked out of your head drunk on some occassions.

LOL, only on some occasions!! I can't actually remember the last time I played cash sober...

HalfBaked

samelterrance wrote:

I asked them and they wouldn't put one on.

I even asked if they could take a vote of how many people wanted NL and to stick them on another table, if there were enough the other two tables would still have been full. they wouldn't

and been able to sit down 50 is just a joke. Maybe have one table just for a 50 Min for the drunk people but not every table.

I don't really think it's the SE fault that there's no NL game Mon - Thur. They always have it as an option on the board and once there's sufficient interest they always start a game (on occasion there has been a NL game on a wed / thur).

I was in the SE Monday and to be honest I don't think it would have got started even if they had asked around. John & Alex both know the player tendencies and if they felt there was a chance a game would have got going the would have tried to start it. I know it must be frustrating for you when they don't even ask around, but I think they know most players answers already (the same people say yes / no all the time).

Ace2007

If you get the numbers and ask in the fitz they will do it for ya, have seen it once or twice- but it looked stupid - u had guys betting €25 into a €4 pot,

Katooey

I'm surprised people think there is more skill in PL. I think poorer players' games are exposed more in NL on every street.

Also, PL players in Ireland screech pot at every opportunity. In NL you have to keep track of the pot

Macspower

LuckyLloyd wrote:

Funnily enough, I was lucky to get a seat to the great man's immediate left on the night in question. And I was thankful for it. There was some value on the table obv - but the really bad regulars were sitting in the PLHE like they always do.

I remember this game.... unfortunately had 2 great men to my left... wasn't a lot of value at it but thanks to self believing fitz dealers it became a profitable game for me... As you say the fish were at the PL tables as usual..

Simple really ... fish like Pot Limit as they limp into every pot.... I like fish

Mac

Ace2007

Katooey wrote:

In NL you have to keep track of the pot

a little OT, but out of interest in a NL does a player have the right to ask and get the right answer from the dealer- as to how much is in the pot???

LuckyLloyd

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LuckyLloyd

This post has been deleted.

Macspower

and why not? I don't know the answer but surely entitled to ask or see for himself?

5starpool

LuckyLloyd wrote:

no.

Most dealers in Ireland though will answer or count the pot though, even if they technically shouldn't. Perhaps this is due to a lack of caring, or a lack or awareness that they shouldn't, or both.

Katooey

Macspower wrote:

and why not? I don't know the answer but surely entitled to ask or see for himself?

It is considered a skill. If you are playing 5/10 in Vegas you are usually playing with 10 dollar chips and notes. If you push a few stacks of 10 forward to bet, the dealer will knock them into the pot if the bet is called. You are left with a large amount of chips in the pot. It would be difficult to count it, if you hadn't been keeping track in your head.

Due to the fact that it is NL, players can be put test of making difficulty decisions on all streets. It clearly requires more skill. Your average fish in the SE doesn't want to play NL, and if he does it is gamble gamble. I have seen dudes opening the pot for a 100 in a 1/2 games there.

Ste05

Katooey wrote:

It clearly requires more skill. Your average fish in the SE doesn't want to play NL, and if he does it is gamble gamble. I have seen dudes opening the pot for a 100 in a 1/2 games there.

You think being able to keep count makes NL more skillful then PL??

Then you go and prove exactly why PL is more skillful, how easy is it to stack the moran that opens for 100???