New Zealand -v- France

Steffano2002

Friday 01st June 2007

Once upon the time the whole rugby world would have been salivating over a meeting between New Zealand and France in Auckland. Today, not even the main protagonists can work themselves into anything vaguely resembling excitement.

"We did not want to come, but we must come," shrugged France coach Bernard Laporte as he flew south, not quite echoing the words of an expectant Caesar.

His counterpart, New Zealand boss Graham Henry, is equally downbeat about the two-Test series.

With domestic issues yet to be settled in France's Top 14 competition, Laporte was forced to travel to the land of the long white cloud without at least 30 of his top players.

In what seems to be the European vogue (see England's recent and forthcoming humiliations in South Africa), players who have propelled their clubs to play-off heights forfeit the chance to represent their country in the mid-year Tests - a seemingly bizarre rewards system that has irked Henry.

"The All Blacks team that went to Europe last November was the best All Blacks team that we could put on the track," he snapped after spying six new caps in the French XV for Saturday's encounter at Eden Park.

"We are holding up our end of the bargain, we are showing a lot of integrity, we are putting the international game first. I think people need to think about that."

Well, let's.

Is putting the international game first really the way forward? Henry obviously thinks so. He withdrew his troops from the first seven rounds of the Super 14, effectively scuppering New Zealand hopes of silverware and damaging viewer and advertising figures.

Just think about that for a moment. Whilst the All Blacks of yore downed pens and shovels and shearing tools in order to pull on a rugby jersey, the current crop of professional Chosen Ones actually forgo rugby for rugby.

Does that benefit the game? Could New Zealand rugby survive on just a handful of Tests per year? Well, the number of All Blacks clutching one-way tickets to the forthcoming Rugby World Cup seems to suggest that such an approach is not economically sustainable.

But one can sympathise with Henry's position, we'd all love to see a first-choice French XV in action in New Zealand.

Yet the heart of European rugby - French rugby, in particular - resides at the local level, and the international game is forced to play second fiddle between Six Nations, Rugby World Cups and Lions tours.

The answer to the problem surely lies somewhere betwixt the Test-centric vision as espoused by Henry and the pound-of-flesh taxation of Europe's top players. Let's just hope the game's punch-drunk administrators will realise that compromise doesn't have to mean capitulation, and soon.

In the meantime, we'd best make do with what has been dished up, and if truth be told, it's not such a meagre-looking dish.

With the risk of falling into the RWC-centric trap (it's so hard not to), the importance of this game is defined by what lies ahead.

Neutral observers are relishing the prospect of seeing these two nations play out the last act of the 2007 Rugby World Cup, a game that has already been billed 'the dream final'. Favourites versus hosts, south versus north, brooding perfectionists versus Champagne Charlies - it has it all.

And so to Saturday. Can the tourists put a dent in New Zealand's well-laid plans, or will the All Blacks extinguish France's global pretensions before a single fan has set foot in Paris? The smart money is on the latter.

Despite Henry's claims that the mid-year series is all about "rebuilding the foundations", the precise man-management and re-conditioning of the All Blacks mean that they will come out of the blocks as almost the finished article.

These All Blacks aren't just hunting for the 18-inch pot that has eluded them for twenty years, they are after the tag of 'best ever' and they will not kick off their season of destiny in second gear.

Given what is expected, nay, demanded of Richie McCaw's team, seeing them train is privilege enough. On Saturday we shall see them in full Test mode, so why all the long faces?

And let us not forget, France are the only side to have ever beaten New Zealand at Eden Park in over twenty years - that fine 23-20 victory in 1994, sealed, in typically outrageous behaviour, by Philippe Saint-Andre's last-gasp 'try from the end of earth'.

The French revel in their glorious unpredictability, and they love nothing better than being the underdogs. Indeed, the weight of expectation normally stifles their natural ability.

The good news is that musketeering spirit is still alive and well. It is almost comforting that Laporte was forced to admonish the Laharrague brothers for skipping a 'video analysis session'. What needs TacticZone© when you can sniff the opponents' tryline from behind your own posts?

Yet without the ballast supplied by the men from Stade Français, Biarritz, Clermont and Toulouse, the tourists' ship is sure to go down with all hands on deck.

Laporte will undoubtedly learn more about some of his lesser lights than Henry will garner from his tried and tested battalion, but that new knowledge is unlikely to encompass anything more than defensive aptitudes.

New Zealand have had the best side in the world for a long time; now they have the fanciest tackle-bags.

Players to watch:

For New Zealand: New Zealand have struggled to fill the void left by Tana Umaga at outside centre, but their search for a replacement is now at an end. Enter Isaia Toeava, for many the outstanding performer of the 2007 Super 14. Strong, intelligent, dextrous, athletic, dynamic, explosive - the Blues centre has it all, he's a super-sized Brian O'Driscoll. And he's just 21. Gulp.

For France: If there's one man who encapsulates the mercurial nature of French rugby it is Thomas Castaignède. The veteran playmaker has two settings - artist or ordinary. Castaignède was very ordinary in his last appearance - Gloucester's hammering of Saracens, a game he described as the lowest point of his career - and he'll need to find the magic if he wishes to exorcise those memories and inspire the neophytes around him.

Head-to-head: Chris Masoe (New Zealand) v Sébastien Chabal (France): Two players who pride themselves on their physical game; two players who have been given the chance to stake their claim. Divert your eyes - it will be violent.

Recent results:

2006: New Zealand won 23-11 at Stade de France, Paris
2006: New Zealand won 47-3 in Lyon
2004: New Zealand won 45-6 at Stade de France, Paris
2003: New Zealand won 40-13 at Stadium Australia, Sydney (RWC)
2003: New Zealand won at Jade Stadium, Christchurch
2002: Match drawn 20-20 Stade de France, Paris
2001: New Zealand won 37-12 Westpac Trust, Wellington
2000: France won 42-33 in Marseille
2000: New Zealand won at Stade de France, Paris
1999: France won 43-31 at Twickenham, London (RWC)
1999: New Zealand won at Athletic Park, Wellington
1995: New Zealand won at Parc des Princes, Paris

The teams:

New Zealand: 15 Leon MacDonald, 14 Joe Rokocoko, 13 Isaia Toeava, 12 Aaron Mauger, 11 Sitiveni Sivivatu, 10 Daniel Carter, 9 Piri Weepu, 8 Chris Masoe, 7 Richie McCaw (captain), 6 Reuben Thorne, 5 Ali Williams, 4 Chris Jack, 3 Carl Hayman, 2 Keven Mealamu, 1 Tony Woodcock.
Replacements: 16 Andrew Hore, 17 Neemia Tialata, 18 Troy Flavell, 19 Rodney So'oialo, 20 Brendon Leonard, 21 Nick Evans, 22 Ma'a Nonu.

France: 15 Thomas Castaignède, 14 Jean-Francois Coux, 13 Arnaud Mignardi, 12 Jean-Philippe Grandclaude, 11 Benjamin Thiéry, 10 Benjamin Boyet, 9 Nicolas Durand, 8 Sébastien Chabal, 7 Olivier Magne, 6 Gregory Le Corvec, 5 Pascal Papé (captain), 4 Julien Pierre, 3 Nicolas Mas, 2 Sebastian Bruno, 1 Christian Califano.
Replacements: 16 Raphaël Ibañez, 17 Franck Montanella, 18 Olivier Olibeau, 19 Damien Chouly, 20 Mickael Forest, 21 Nicolas Laharrague, 22 Ludovic Valbon

Date: Saturday, 2 June
Venue: Eden Park, Auckland
Kick-off: 19:35 (07.35 GMT)
Conditions: Clear spells with heavy showers, strong north-westerly winds - max 16°C, min 8°C
Referee: Stuart Dickinson (Australia)
Touch judges: Matt Goddard (Australia), James Leckie (Australia)
Television match official: George Ayoub (Australia)

EdgarAllenPoo

What a bloody woeful game both in terms of the play and referees. The ref touch judge(can't remember which one) and the tmo were just horrendous.

RuggieBear

yeah. pretty awful game. Dickerson was just BAD. The touch judges were even worse. How bad is reffing in Australia if that is an international crew!?:eek:

France tackled well but NZ had so much ball that it was really just counting down the minutes till NZ would run up the big score.

shoutman

Both teams looked very rusty, unforced handling errors were poor. I thought in the first half the the NZ back row did very well with ball in hand in open play but besides that some good defence from the french kept NZ largely at bay. But I dread to think what the score could of been if NZ were more clinical and i'm sure it will come with match practice.
Whats everyones opinion on the first NZ try? I thought it was no try as there was no real downward pressure he more just rolled the ball on. France got unlucky with many reffing decisions.
And ooooh what a hit by Chabel....

Worrytahs

Funkstard wrote:

Henry was giving out earlier about teams fielding second rate players - what about when he completely changed the side against us last year?

As I said elsewhere, I trust he was equally angry at the lack of All Blacks playing in the Super 14s this year

Worrytahs

RuggieBear wrote:

yeah. pretty awful game. Dickerson was just BAD. The touch judges were even worse. How bad is reffing in Australia if that is an international crew!?:eek:

France tackled well but NZ had so much ball that it was really just counting down the minutes till NZ would run up the big score.

Well, if TMOs are going to give tries where a Mr Leota can score with his right t*t, then any old numpty at the screen would give Sivivatu's 'try' :mad:

Steffano2002

How do I feel after watching this game? @$$ r@ped is how I feel!

What kind of referee do they have in Australia? I'm so angry at this "dick-headson" bollix I could actually see myself punching the head of him... J4 referees are more competent! So frustrating! :mad: :mad: :mad:

I'm proud of the lads though. Defended well, got a try and we got to see a superb hit by (my hero) Chabal. We deserved to lose. But not by more than 10~15 points...

Dickinson I hate you!!! :mad:

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

shoutman

No dave they didnt, however they did give a try for a blatent forward pass.. how he missed that I dont know, and another try for a dubious grounding of the ball.

nacho libre

Steffano2002 wrote:

That's pure BS as far as I'm concerned. To me, Club Rugby is far more important and interesting than International Rugby... You talk like Syd Millard...

you are only saying that because France are crap:p

Worrytahs

Pinetree Boy wrote:

Perhaps that attitude explains the difference and the gulf between the NH and the SH. Down here we only care about the Super 14 until the tests start- then couldn't give a toss.

Across the dutch, no-one gives a stuff about the Super 14s eh?
I would disagree. Watch any game involving a Noo Zulland side against a non-Noo Zulland side, with a Kiwi and you'd witness quite the opposite

cgf

If I was a French supporter I wouldn't be too worried about today's result. Ye had a 'B' team against the All Black No. 1 team and the score was flattered by 3 dodgy tries.

The reffing was shocking :eek: and when ye get those home-town decisions going your way in October, who knows.....

Steffano2002

cgf wrote:

If I was a French supporter I wouldn't be too worried about today's result. Ye had a 'B' team against the All Black No. 1 team and the score was flattered by 3 dodgy tries.

It was actually more like a 'C' or 'D' team we lined up. It was nice to see players I've never even heard of before play against the All Blacks! I think we're going to get absolutely hammered in the second test though...

cgf wrote:

The reffing was shocking :eek: and when ye get those home-town decisions going your way in October, who knows.....

God I hope you're right!

Oh and, if you want to see the highlight of this match, here you have it!

My hero: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xrbp1ASVhCg

Pinetree Boy

The score flattered the ABs. They looked rusty and the midfield is still a problem. The French defence was great and they got hammered by piss poor rulings.For a make shift third string combo the French were bloody good.

One of the real worrying things for the WRC was the standard of referees. It has been obvious in the Super 14 how bad some of them are.

Steffano2002

Pinetree Boy wrote:

The score flattered the ABs. They looked rusty and the midfield is still a problem. The French defence was great and they got hammered by piss poor rulings.For a make shift third string combo the French were bloody good.

Good analysis! Fully agree with you!

Pinetree Boy wrote:

One of the real worrying things for the WRC was the standard of referees. It has been obvious in the Super 14 how bad some of them are.

I'm afraid I also have the same fears... The majority of these SH referees really are piss poor... I mean, if Stuart Dickinson was to referee France -v- Argentina for example, I believe it would literally be the end for us... Simple as that!

RuggieBear

Steffano2002 wrote:

Good analysis! Fully agree with you!

I'm afraid I also have the same fears... The majority of these SH referees really are piss poor... I mean, if Stuart Dickinson was to referee France -v- Argentina for example, I believe it would literally be the end for us... Simple as that!

http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/NR/rdonlyres/38A44E64-1CCC-424F-961B-E512C67DBCA0/0/070424CCAppendixERWC07APPOINTMENTSxls.pdf

here are the pool refs...dickerson is as touch judge. spreaders is reffing

Steffano2002

RuggieBear wrote:

http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/NR/rdonlyres/38A44E64-1CCC-424F-961B-E512C67DBCA0/0/070424CCAppendixERWC07APPOINTMENTSxls.pdf

here are the pool refs...dickerson is as touch judge. spreaders is reffing

Well that's just great...

Pinetree Boy

Steffano2002 wrote:

Well that's just great...

Dickenson and Lawrence on the sidelines!! You can expect about 12 minutes of actual rugby.

Steffano2002

Pinetree Boy wrote:

Dickenson and Lawrence on the sidelines!! You can expect about 12 minutes of actual rugby.

If we're lucky!

Pinetree Boy

A war of words down here. Henry accusing the French of slowing the game down and Laporte hitting back. Much as it pains me I think Laporte is right. Henry is being a dork. Does he really think that we believe the ABs never deliberately slow a game down? Any prop who can't fake an injury when his team are about to have a defensive scrum on their goal line doesn't deserve to be there.

Got tolove Laporte- best call- Henry wasn't quite so loud when he was coaching Wales.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Steffano2002

Pinetree Boy wrote:

A war of words down here. Henry accusing the French of slowing the game down and Laporte hitting back. Much as it pains me I think Laporte is right. Henry is being a dork. Does he really think that we believe the ABs never deliberately slow a game down? Any prop who can't fake an injury when his team are about to have a defensive scrum on their goal line doesn't deserve to be there.

Got tolove Laporte- best call- Henry wasn't quite so loud when he was coaching Wales.

I'm not a huge fan of Laporte but I fully agree with him in this particular case!

I too enjoyed his "Henry wasn't quite so loud when he was coaching Wales" comment!

Steffano2002

daveirl wrote:

This post has been deleted.

I think NZ won't be as rusty as last week and the score difference will be even bigger this time around.

Who's the referee anyway? Probably some idiot from SA or OZ am I right?

Sangre

daveirl wrote:

This post has been deleted.

I hear even the super 14 refs have started pinging him badly for it. 2 yellows this season is it? And he didn't even play the first half of it.

I'm often screaming at a TV when McCaw playing, regardless of who it is against as he is a serial ball killer, most notably by lying on the wrong side of the tackle and not rolling away. Although kudos if he gets away with it.

Linford

Sangre wrote:

I hear even the super 14 refs have started pinging him badly for it. 2 yellows this season is it? And he didn't even play the first half of it.

I'm often screaming at a TV when McCaw playing, regardless of who it is against as he is a serial ball killer, most notably by lying on the wrong side of the tackle and not rolling away. Although kudos if he gets away with it.

Maybe that's why he didn't perform that well in the Super 14s this season..

Pinetree Boy

I don't know if it is so much the refs (the Super 14 whistleblowers were bloody awful). I do think there are now a number of players who can counter Mc Caw better than in the past.

Personally I hope the experiment at Stallenbosch works out and the laws arejust changed to allow hands in the ruck.

Steffano2002

The coach, the ref and the hotel foyer

Sunday 10th June 2007

International Rugby Board (IRB) referees chief Paddy O'Brien has expressed measured concern following reports of an alleged confrontation between France coach Bernard Laporte and referee Stuart Dickinson on the eve of the second Test between New Zealand and France.

Laporte was openly critical of Dickinson's officiating of France's 42-11 defeat in the first Test and the Sunday Star Times reports that he made his feelings known as the Australian prepared to touch-judge Saturday's encounter at the Westpac Stadium.

The coach allegedly cornered Dickinson in the foyer of his Wellington hotel and, wielding a laptop, confronted him with selected highlights from last week's match.
Coaches are entitled to meet with referees prior to matches, but it is highly unusual for them to meet with touch judges.

"If you are appointed to any French games at the World Cup, the French team will not turn up," Laporte is reported to have said.

"We have had enough of you. All the time you do this to us."

The impromptu 'meeting' appears to contravene the IRB's code of conduct forbidding anyone from abusing, threatening or intimidating referees and touch judges.

O'Brien told the newspaper that he would expect a report from Dickinson if the Australian had felt threatened or intimated by Laporte's behaviour.

"I'm surprised to hear this and disappointed if it's true, but I need to hear from Stuart himself," he said.

"If the meeting was out of hand I will hear from Stuart Dickinson.

"If there was a breach or Stu felt intimidated, I expect to hear from him.

"We will not have coaches telling us who will referee games."

To that end, Australian Rugby Union referees boss Peter Marshall has confirmed that he has spoken to Dickinson and said that a report will be sent to the IRB.

O'Brien added he would also expect a report from Laporte if he was unhappy with the officiating of the two-Test series in New Zealand.

zAbbo

What, no youtube post of Chabal breaking Ali Williams's jaw ? shame on you steffano

http://youtube.com/watch?v=PqGRZBPTlHM

NZ Second Row Crisis!!!!

Steffano2002

I am so terribly sorry! I forgot!

Here's a better quality one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHjjIYD8Nhw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHjjIYD8Nhw

Pinetree Boy

I feel sorry for Laporte. It is just frustration which lots of us feel with the whole secret society of refs. If they fronted up after a game and told us why they ruled the way they did or admitted mistakes then there would be a lot less anger and frustration. Dickenson only admitted mistakes after Laporte had a go at him and I doubt we would have heard anything from Paddy if the incident hadn't happenned.