Importing camper van from Germany

piet

Maybe making this a sticky for all the people wanting to buy direct in Germany?
The exact procedure to do the paperwork?
I spoke yesterday to someone frorm customs, who told me if you buy from a private person in Germany, you can do the paperwork here in Ireland.
On the vin number you can get insurance here awaiting Irish registration?
Campervans older as 15 years need to have a ingeneers report for the insurance!

Temporary insurance :
http://deckungskarten.eu/shop/catalog/browse?shop_param=cid%3D5%26
for 15 or 30 day coverage!
Can you get registration plates made before you go , to save time in Germany?

peasant

piet wrote:

Maybe making this a sticky for all the people wanting to buy direct in Germany?

As you wish !

The exact procedure to do the paperwork?

I would recommend buying from a dealer ...a for warranty and b because they can take care of all of that for you

I spoke yesterday to someone frorm customs, who told me if you buy from a private person in Germany, you can do the paperwork here in Ireland.

Thats news to me ...any more info?

On the vin number you can get insurance here awaiting Irish registration?

In theory maybe ...in practice this would't help you. On sale of a German reg vehicle, it has to be un-regged. This also involves handing back the number plates to the registration office. So you'd be driving a camper without plates ...which in turn would get you stopped and questioned within about five minutes ...Irish insurance or no Irish insurance. So you really need to get the export plates done, which in turn you can only get with the accompanying (German/international) insurance. And you won't get Irish plates before they've actually seen the vehicle at the VRO.

Campervans older as 15 years need to have a ingeneers report for the insurance!

correct ... could also be 10 years?

Can you get registration plates made before you go , to save time in Germany?

No ..they are issued on the date, there and then only. Unless you get the dealer to organise all this for you ...then you can just drive away.

peasant

To explain further

The exact procedure to do the paperwork?

German registrations work differently to Irish ones. The vehicle is always registered in connection with the place of residence of the current owner. If the vehicle is sold (or the owner moves) into a different county (or country), the vehicle has to be re-registered there and the old number plates handed back. In Germany the (two little stamps on) the number plates are also proof of registration, tax and NCT (TUEV). Anybody (private seller or dealer) letting you drive on their plates effectively lets you drive on their insurance.
This will not happen for an export, as people will not be prepared to take the risk.

Therefore you need export plates.

In order to get those, the following criteria have to be met:
-The vehicle needs a current NCT/Tuev cert (watch out for this if buying a motorhome thas has been off the road for a while)

-You need to bring along your passport / send a copy ahead if a dealer does the reg for you.

-You need insurance or rather what they call a "Doppelkarte". This is a statement from an insurance company, declaring that they will insure you, once the vehicle is registered in you name. any German insurance broker will sell this to you. Export insurance has relatively high (annual) premiums and only covers third party, nothing else. As the duration is limited to a few days/weeks (you can choose how long you need it for) the premium is not too expensive.

-you need the vehicle registration certificate or "Fahrzeugbrief". This is an A5 size (when folded) document that states all the particulars of the vehicle as well as all previous owners. It is also proof of ownership, whoever holds the "Fahrzeugbrief" is the legal owner of the vehicle. Make sure you don't get cheated into believing that the "KFZ-Schein" is the proof of ownership ...it isn't. It is a credit card size (when folded) document, basically a copy of the "Fahrzeugbrief" with the current owner's name and address on the front. This has to be handed back on de-registration anyway, whereas the "Fahrzeugbrief" remains with the vehicle until such time as it is registerd in Ireland (Then you get issued with an irish vehicle registration cert and the German one gets send back to Germany)

So, on the day (a weekday during office hours!:D ) you walk up to the German vehicle reg office, hand over your passport, your "Doppelkarte" , the TUEV cert, the "Fahrzeugbrief" and a fee and you get issued with a export number. That you take (usually across the road) to place that makes number plates, pay for them and then go back to the reg office, where you get handed your "Fahrzeugbrief" and temporary export certificate ...and off you go.


It isn't as complicated as it sounds really ...but if you don't speak the language or have somebody take you by the hand and guide you through the process, it could be a bit daunting.
Also, private sellers don't regularly export their vehicles and might be a bit worried and "difficult" about the proceedings, which to the average private German sound about as daunting as they sound to you right now

Hence my recommendation to buy from a dealer ...they should do this as part of their service and have the export plates on the vehicle, ready to go, if you buy from them.

Costs: all in all, depending on how long you want the insurance for ...about 100 - 200 euro, including all fees and number plates.
When buying from a dealer, cost should be zero:D

3ps

I imported and had all the above done for me by a dealer for about €200 which included all the fees and charges for insurance etc.

I also had it done for my for my Mercedes when I imported it.

You will probably have to send across proof of IT with a real signature (not a fax) in advance to transfer authority to the dealer to do it for you.

peasant

Anybody import from anywhere else?

Please let us know about it !

Terrontress

I imported from Germany and did it myself.

It was realtively straightforward but a few annoying problems threw the whole thing off kilter.

To export, the two things you need is the double insurance card and export numberplates (Ausfuhrkennzeichnen).

*First thing to do is to buy the camper. You will then get the registration papers.
*Next get your insurance. ADAC will do two weeks insurance within the EU for €80. www.adac.de They need the registration papers of the van, your passport or identity card and driving license.
*Go to the Strassenverkehrsamt http://www.strassenverkehrsamt.de with your documents. The official there will check your registration documents, insurance and passport and charge you €85. He will then give you a document to enable you to get numberplates printed. These cost approx. €20.
*Go back to the van, fit the plates and drive it back to the Strassenverkehrsamt where the official will look at the chassis number and give you the export certificate / registration documents.

Then you are good to go.

It is a relatively straightforward procedure although I had one or two mishaps which, hopefully, you can avoid.

Firstly, the nearest ADAC office from where I was staying was 80km away which meant a lengthy journey there and back for what was a five minute procedure.

Secondly, when I got to the Strassenverkehrsamt I discovered, to my horror, that they close half day on Friday. This was at 12.40 on Friday. They closed at 12.30. I was forced to wait around Germany for the weekend and extend my annual leave by one day. I had, of course, already paid for the van by this stage and it had no numberplates on it so I could not bring it onto the road. This ended up costing a fortune in hotels, meals out etc. never mind the race home when I had intended to have a leisurely trip through Europe and stock up on wine in Calais.

If you can find a dealer who will do all of the above for €200 then I would certainly recommend it. Given that the van I bought was so inexpensive and was a private sale I had to do it myself. As I say, it was straightforward but I had a miserable 60 hour wait imposed on myself in the middle of it all.

If anyone needs any assistance then drop me a PM and I will do all I can for you.

stapeler

I imported from France about five years ago. All quiet straight forward, organised insurance, ferry etc. before heading over. Phoned VRT people before hand who gave me an accurate figure so no surprises.
Last year I imported from the UK and similiar experience. Insurance etc. all in order before heading over.

rachaich

Hi all

Just discovered this forum, and am very interested in all the great advise on offer! I am planning a trip to Germany in May with a view to buying my first motorhome. Can anyone recommend any good secondhand dealers in the Frankfurt / Koln / Dusseldorf areas? I have found a website for wohnmobil.com which seems to have a few on offer (does anyone have experience of this comany?), but would like to compare with other dealers if poss.
I have heard there are a few in this area but cannot find thier websites or addresses/phone numbers.
If anyone have any experience in this I would be hugely greatful. I would also be interested in any advise on the best method of payment used - perhaps bankers draft, but are these understood in Germany?

thanks in advance, Rachel

peasant

I'm from a different area so I can't really recommend anyone from that region.

A good way to find out what's on offer and who's offering it would be to go to
http://www.mobile.de/cgi-bin/searchPublic.pl?new=1&bereich=womo&category=1400&sr_qual=GN&sprache=2
enter the postcode ("Postleitzahl") of your target area and do a radius search ...that should bring up a few.

Also I have heard that in Muehlheim/Ruhr there is an area called the "Wohnmobilmeile" (the motorhome-mile) where there are several dealerships in very close proximity (which might be good for comparison purposes)

As for payment ...depends on the dealership really, if they are familiar with bankdrafts and accept them.
Have word with you bank, if they could facilitate you a quick (i.e. real time) bank transfer option ...in that case you could just give them a call (or send a fax) once the sale is agreed and you could transfer payment straight into the dealers account which they could then verify immediatedly.

piet

rachaich wrote:

Hi all

Just discovered this forum, and am very interested in all the great advise on offer! I am planning a trip to Germany in May with a view to buying my first motorhome. Can anyone recommend any good secondhand dealers in the Frankfurt / Koln / Dusseldorf areas? I have found a website for wohnmobil.com which seems to have a few on offer (does anyone have experience of this comany?), but would like to compare with other dealers if poss.
I have heard there are a few in this area but cannot find thier websites or addresses/phone numbers.
If anyone have any experience in this I would be hugely greatful. I would also be interested in any advise on the best method of payment used - perhaps bankers draft, but are these understood in Germany?

thanks in advance, Rachel

cash is the only thing understood:(

rachaich

Thanks for the advise. I have heard that there are 2 types of export licence -a red one and a yellow one? We are planning to come back to Ireland via the UK, and someone mentioned to me that I would need a different type of export plate - can anyone shed any light on this?

thanks again!

peasant

For export (to pretty much anywhere, and certainly everywhere in the EU) there is only one plate, the "red" one: (called "Ausfuhrkennzeichen" or "Exportkennzeichen")



The first letter(s) indicate where the registration was done, the numbers are random and the dates in the red field display at what date the insurance (and registration) for this plate becomes invalid ...so get home before then:D

There is a similar plate with a yellow field, but that's for travel within Germany only

rachaich

Thanks for clearing that up - so to get this straight. The export plates and the accompanying export insurance bought in Germany will cover me all the way back home, including the journey through Ireland to get back? Or do I need to set up temporary insurance here as soon as I hit Irish shores until I get it re-registered here? Sorry to bother you, but I am getting conflicting info on this...Thanks.

peasant

The export insurance covers you in almost every country (with the exception of Afghanistan and other hotspots) until the day it expires, but:

It is third party only !

I don't know how and where you could possibly get fully comprehensive cover.

jsmith

I am thinking of buying a motor home (campervan) from a dealer in Germany and would like to learn what I need to do before I go. I have seen a motorhome on their web page it looks good but photos may not show all. I can’t insure it before I go over because I won’t have a REG number, How do get around that, or do I have to go back a second time?. or could I arrange the insurances before I go and phone my insurances Co with the new number.? Also the motorhome I’m looking at is 3500kg , 3050kg what VRT will I have to pay on it.
Many thanks for any help received
Joe

3ps

you get the insurance over there. you have to pay and the dealer will get you export plates which includes 3rd party insurance. You can then insure it when you get home. You can't get comprehensive.

if it's saying an UNLADEN weight of 3050 it's close and they will probably get you to weigh it. You are looking at 20-30% (i can't remember the rate) of the value of the vehicle in Ireland. Be very careful here!

Terrontress

jsmith wrote:

I am thinking of buying a motor home (campervan) from a dealer in Germany and would like to learn what I need to do before I go. I have seen a motorhome on their web page it looks good but photos may not show all. I can’t insure it before I go over because I won’t have a REG number, How do get around that, or do I have to go back a second time?. or could I arrange the insurances before I go and phone my insurances Co with the new number.? Also the motorhome I’m looking at is 3500kg , 3050kg what VRT will I have to pay on it.
Many thanks for any help received
Joe

Hi jsmith

I would recommend you get in touch with ADAC before you go over there for your insurance.

They really seem to be the cheapest and are in every German city which of a medium size. They also seem to have agents in smaller towns so it is possible to organise your insurance in advance of going.

The registration is done through Strassenverkehrsamt who have a webiste.

If you are doing this yourself, make sure they will be open when you go. Once you do go to them and your papers are in order, it is an extremely simple process.

I would just urge caution that you are not going out there to look at a vehicle that you will feel obliged to buy because you have gone out with no return flight etc. I would buy a return flight from Ryanair or something cheap anyway so you know you can walk away from the van if you are not happy.

It is a small price to pay compared with the cost of being landed with a dog of a van.

rachaich

Hi Joe.
We have just bought a 1993 5 berth Hymer back from Dortmund.
We initially flew out and had a look at a few campers in dealers around the Bad Honnef and Mulhiem an der Ruhr areas, but found that the condition of the age we were looking for was not great at all so we came back home. The pictures on the web look fine, but when you get up close and can see the bodywork and check the exhaust emmisions, we were not too impressed. I think this is the wrong time of year to get a good bargain from a dealer - but you may be lucky.
We ended up going back again and doing a private sale on a van we had viewed on the first trip, and are very pleased with the condition - we managed to negotiate on the asking price, but probably would have done even better at the end of the season.
The people we bought from helped us with the paperwork, and we were able to get insurance, plates and export documents for €200. This was all done in the suburbs of Dortmund and the insurance broker was the same place that makes the plates, which was across the road from the registration office. I think ADAC do cheaper insurance, but it was handier for us to have it all done in the space of an hour and drive away.
Good luck in your search - and I would endorse what Terrontress says about being prepared to walk away. We have paid a little more for the flights than was intended, but are happy that we got the van we wanted.:)

rachaich

Hi Joe.
We have just bought a 1993 5 berth Hymer back from Dortmund.
We initially flew out and had a look at a few campers in dealers around the Bad Honnef and Mulhiem an der Ruhr areas, but found that the condition of the age we were looking for was not great at all so we came back home. The pictures on the web look fine, but when you get up close and can see the bodywork and check the exhaust emmisions, we were not too impressed. I think this is the wrong time of year to get a good bargain from a dealer - but you may be lucky.
We ended up going back again and doing a private sale on a van we had viewed on the first trip, and are very pleased with the condition - we managed to negotiate on the asking price, but probably would have done even better at the end of the season.
The people we bought from helped us with the paperwork, and we were able to get insurance, plates and export documents for €200. This was all done in the suburbs of Dortmund and the insurance broker was the same place that makes the plates, which was across the road from the registration office. I think ADAC do cheaper insurance, but it was handier for us to have it all done in the space of an hour and drive away.
Good luck in your search - and I would endorse what Terrontress says about being prepared to walk away. We have paid a little more for the flights than was intended, but are happy that we got the van we wanted.:)

fits

Can I ask the region of the price you paid?

rachaich

We paid €13,000. There were quite afew extras fitted, low milage and good service history and condition.
I am sure there are cheaper vans out there, but you may have to spend a month there to track them down....
By the time we pay the VRT, it may well be the equivilent price of buying one here, but the condition, extras and service history tip the balance in favour to get one in Germany in my opinion. Plus there are so many more vans to choose from.
We looked on it as being a holiday/road trip and had great fun bringing it back across Germany, Holland, Belgium and France - picking up a few bottles along the way!
P.S. We used Norfolkline to get from Dunkirque to Dover - only €53 inlcuding tax for the camper and 3 people booked only 12 hours in advance. Very nice boat and cheaper food on board!:D

jsmith

I have seen a nice Motorhome in Ireland at what looks a good price.

3ps

jsmith wrote:

I have seen a nice Motorhome in Ireland at what looks a good price.

impossible!

TIPPMANEEN

Hello to all,

I'm a first time "Boarder" so bear with me if I post this in the wrong location etc.!!

I am looking seriousley at buying a new/ nearly new camper at present and I am very tempted by massive savings that appear to be possible by importing from Germany. I have a few queries, if someone could help out I'd appreciate:

1. Has anybody purchased new/ nearly new in Germany and had difficulty with warrantee repairs etc.
I just can't imagine an Irish dealer welcoming you with open arms when you come with a van that you've imported yourself.
Would Renault or Fiat Ireland stand over chassis & cab warrantee issues??

2.Are the savings to be made counteracted at trade in or resale time. Are dealers, or buyers generally, wary of imports.

3. Finally, the camper that I am leaning towards is the Adria A 697 SG. There seems to be anywhere between €6-8K to be saved buying new in Germany. Does anybody have opinions good or bad on this model.

Again, I would appreciate any help or advice.

Bye for now.

peasant

Buying new or nearly new from outside Ireland isn't really that big a saving.
If the vehicle is under 6 months old and/or has under 6000 km on the clock you will not only have to pay VRT but VAT as well. Both will be calculated from the Irish list price (if there is a list ...otherwise just chose a random, ridiculously high price), so your saving will shrink quite considerably. Plus there is the added hassle of claiming your German VAT back.
The biggest problem is that there is no transparency in the system and you don't know exactly how much you will have to pay before you commit and you may be in for a big surprise when you finally register your "bargain" here.

As for warranty, theoretically and by law any European Adria dealer should honour your Adria warranty. In practice, of course, they will try and wriggle out of it as much as they can. (Partly because a lot of motorhome manufacturers can be quite difficult to deal with when it comes to recognising and refunding claims)

On the base vehicle your chances for warranty work are somewhat better as warranty procedures are a lot better established with the big automotive companies.

Overall, a vehicle that is a year old (or older) seems a better bet IMO.

If you want new or nearly new, it might also be worth it to collect (German)prices of your dream motorhome off the internet and present an Irish dealer with the choice of buying off him for a price near-ish the German one (taking VRT into calculation, of course). Not all motorhomes sell quickly ...if you're lucky, you might find a dealer with YOUR motorhome that's been sitting there for a while and he might be prepared to do a deal. At least you'd have your service and warranty partner sorted then (which in itself should be worth a few hundred extra)

When looking at German prices, keep in mind that dealers like Gante or Palmowski (usually the cheapest ones) are "Supermarkets". They offer great prices, but their service is dire ...even for German customers. So it would be a bit unfair to take their prices as a benchmark.

TIPPMANEEN

Thanks for that. You've given me more food for thought.

Has anyone any comments on the Adri 697 SG

Benny-c

Hi All,

Re. Buying in Germany, does anyone know the 'best' time of year for choice & price eg. is September & October better than May/June when there may be more on the market???

Benny

peasant

For dealer sales autumn is best.
That's when the rentals get turned over and new models come out and people leave in their trade-ins.

Most private sellers try selling early in the season in the hope to get the best price.

Generally speaking prices are lowest in winter ...but so is the choice, as many people wait for the season (and higher prices)

Having said all that, once you see THE motorhome for you at a reasonable price it's best to pounce, regardless of time of year.

Macspower

Hi all,

My first post in this section ... any help appreciated..

The time has come to retire my Transit camper... After many year of troubleless service we've decided to buy a motorhome....

The budget is not that big at around 15k euro or under if possible... age doesn't really bother me as I'm a mechanic and can fix most things myself but would like something as fresh as possible for the money...

Was looking at going the German route and have been scouting mobile.de over the last few weeks. I've found a number that suit and have replied to the adds but not even one reply from any of them... anyone else experience this?

I'm looking for something like this maybe.

http://www.mobile.de/SID7tsZ8FX.BiUwUf35P0pqYg-t-vaNexlCsCsK~BmSB11JparkingBayJ1186768145A2D5000B-4/cgi-bin/da.pl?bereich=all&sprache=2&id=11111111269823753&

I've sent many e-mails in both english and german(through a translator programme)...

Also considering something from the UK maybe like this.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/95-M-REG-FIAT-DUCATO-1-9-TD-MOTORHOME-GRANDUCA-5-BERTH_W0QQitemZ170135833308QQihZ007QQcategoryZ14256QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

but the value is not the same over there...

A few other questions if you don't mind...

has anyone imported from eastern europe? is this a viable option or is there any available there?

I phoned the VRT office yesterday and they explained the procedure to me... if it's over 3000kg reg it for 50 euro? is this correct.... they told me to go and get it weighed in a local weighbridge and bring a printout of the weight with me when reging it.... Is this normal..... ( can see me with a tonne of lead in the back?)

any other advice or suggestions welcome.

Many thanks,

Mac

peasant

Macspower wrote:

Hi all,

Was looking at going the German route and have been scouting mobile.de over the last few weeks. I've found a number that suit and have replied to the adds but not even one reply from any of them... anyone else experience this?

Lots of the "Nigerian scams" in Germany unfortunately operate via mobile.de and in english / with english mail addresses. So lots of people simply bin foreign e-mails. Make sure to make your mail sound as much non-scam as is possible

I'm looking for something like this maybe.

http://www.mobile.de/SID7tsZ8FX.BiUwUf35P0pqYg-t-vaNexlCsCsK~BmSB11JparkingBayJ1186768145A2D5000B-4/cgi-bin/da.pl?bereich=all&sprache=2&id=11111111269823753&


Also considering something from the UK maybe like this.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/95-M-REG-FIAT-DUCATO-1-9-TD-MOTORHOME-GRANDUCA-5-BERTH_W0QQitemZ170135833308QQihZ007QQcategoryZ14256QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Personally I would advise against the 1.9 TD engine. A fine engine, but very near its limits in a heavy camper. Go 2.5 or 2.8 if you can (tax will be the same anyway)

has anyone imported from eastern europe? is this a viable option or is there any available there?

Eastern Europe is only just starting to get into motorhomes. A lot of old "crap" from Germany goes east to be tarted up there. You may get a good, well repaired motorhome there ...but finding it will be difficult.

I phoned the VRT office yesterday and they explained the procedure to me... if it's over 3000kg reg it for 50 euro? is this correct

correct

.... they told me to go and get it weighed in a local weighbridge and bring a printout of the weight with me when reging it.... Is this normal..... ( can see me with a tonne of lead in the back?)

No this is not normal (for the very reason you mentioned) ...they are supposed to be present at the weighing. Quite a few threads about weight here, just have a rootaround

Macspower

Thanks for your replies Peasent.... I'm still having problems making contact of any type with anyone on mobile.de

I've sent 12 replies using the automated reply system but no answer from anyone... Do I ned to ring them??

Also any suggestions on something for my 15k budget? I have a C1 licence if it makes a difference.. Was considering some like the above but am open to suggestions.

Mac