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Engagement Ring - FACTS, not fiction
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Contd...
Finding the baseline: online comparisons
Because we want to price a ring that is as good as, or slightly better than
average jeweller offerings, we need our search criteria to include:- Weight: just under 0.5 carat, i.e. 0.47 to 0.49 ct
- Colour: F colour, if very bright white is important. If white
rather than super-white is allowable, G or even H is a good bet
as long as the cut is at least very good. Lower colours are
advisable only if you and your partner find that you didn’t
notice or care about them during your ‘trying on’ expeditions,
particularly when close to the window
- Clarity: In general, VS2 clarities and above are guaranteed
to be eye-clean for round brilliant cuts – but what about lower,
cheaper clarities? For the purposes of online comparison (where
jeweller margins are most evident), we would need to locate an
eye-clean SI1 – but this is only possible with an online retailer
who supplies diamond photos and detailed certificates, or who
will physically inspect the stone for eye cleanliness for you. For
this reason our clarity requirement is VS2. - Cut: GIA ‘very good’, as this is typically what the average
jeweller stocks in Ireland. - Fluorescence: None or faint, unless you or your partner
specifically like the blue tint that florescence gives to a stone. - Symmetry: Very good (typical in Irish jewellery shops)
- Polish: Excellent (also typical)
In short, buy nothing below VS2 clarity online without the opinion of an
expert eye; a phone call or two could save you having to return and replace
your selection. If the retailer you’re dealing with doesn’t have access to the
stones, don’t buy – even if they’re giving it away! TBC... 0 - Weight: just under 0.5 carat, i.e. 0.47 to 0.49 ct
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Closing in: how to approach buying and discount
Once you get an idea of the range of possible markups on the type of ring
you’re after, you can work out an acceptable discount to push for. Most
jewellers will knock an instant 10% off their asking price if they get the
feeling that you’re serious. Based on our example comparison, the jeweller
probably has from between another 20 – 30 to approx. 50% of margin left
over even after such a discount. I find that a useful overall discount to aim
for is somewhere in the middle of all this, about 20 – 30%.
Soft hardball
To increase your chances of scaling back the cost, don’t enable the jeweller
to offer an initial 10% discount. It might be very tempting, but will limit how
far you can push it. Approaching the counter as an unassuming,
undemanding customer will put sales persons off their guard. Assuming that
you’re in a shop that you’ve found to have the stuff you want at the best
prices, zero in slowly and ‘accidentally’ on the area you’re interested in. Ask
to see a selection of the rings you’re considering all lined up together -- but
don’t comment on any one in particular except for to weigh up the 4Cs pros
and cons. Remain uncommitted and slightly hesitant for the biggest part of
the sales patter, and then, as your server starts to run out of steam,
indicate what you might be interested in, but fairly nonchalantly. When the
price is related to you express with some disappointment that you only have
exactly 70 to 80% (or thereabouts for less obviousness) of their asking price.
The chances are a special price will be worked out just for you. If it’s not to
your liking, be prepared to state (regretfully) the situation again and let them
feel the sale walking out the door, in a recession. Some savvy sellers will
wait for this critical moment before calling you back to renegotiate, it can be
quite suprising. If this doesn’t happen you have to be prepared to walk out
the door, and into another one, to start all over again. This approach has
been fairly successful for me, and that’s all the proof I can offer that it
works!
To play hardball directly use your pricing on Blue Nile Ireland and tell the
jeweller that you’re nice enough to consider giving him 70 to 80% of his
ridiculous asking price! Less fantastically, you could try using a price
comparison for a relatively superior ring on Blue Nile Ireland. For our example
this would involve F colour, VS2 clarity, excellent symmetry and polish, and
most of all, GIA excellent cut. If you can quote a realistic price for a similar-
but-superior product, this will give the jeweller a sense that he has a choice
in who gets your cash and that you know that better, cheaper options exist
elsewhere. A little bit of jeweller education
TBC... 0 -
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Decisions, decisions: why it might be worth buying in a shop
The biggest plus in buying in a ‘bricks and mortar’ shop is the after-sales
service. This involves cleaning, polishing and replating (e.g. white gold) your
ring and repairing any minor work that needs to be carried out cyclically, like
checking and tightening prongs holding your stone, for example. These are
surely useful services – but is it really worth paying over the odds in order to
gain them? The answer to this is that it depends on how much effort you
want to put into finding alternate arrangements. The trick is to find a
skilled bench-man or independent jeweller and
ask him to help maintain your pieces. There’s no harm in putting a few
queries their way, or any jeweller’s way before you make an online purchase,
for example. Also, a jeweller is more likely to extend his services to a foreign
engagement ring if both wedding bands are bought at his shop.
Weighing it up: platinum versus white gold
White gold
White gold is relatively light, highly lustrous and easily modified (size changed
etc). But as an alloy of yellow gold, palladium with nickel or zinc, it tends to
look vaguely yellow. Jewellers hide this yellow tinge under a plating of the
expensive and pure white metal, rhodium. Depending on the way your body
chemistry interacts with the metals making up white gold, it can cause
allergic reaction (nickel). To keep the bright white look the ring is likely to
need to be replated every 6 to 18 months. Before investing in a white gold
ring, make sure you or your partner aren’t allergic to typical white gold alloys.
If having your rings made up by an independent jeweller, ask for a higher
content of palladium in order to keep the metal alloy whiter than usual.
This should lengthen the gaps between replatings.
Platinum
Platinum is denser and so heavier than white gold. Because it is almost pure,
(typically 95%) it tends not to cause allergic reactions. It is more expensive
to have modified than white gold – this is because the skill-set and equipment
needed to handle this tougher metal is different and more unusual. The benefits
of platinum for setting a diamond might be worth the extra cost compared to
gold, according to these benefits: platinum doesn’t usually require any sort of
plating; it doesn’t ‘tarnish’ but gets many fine scratches on its surface – these
can be polished out with no loss of metal. This means that over many years gold
rings will eventually get thinner with polishing and wear, while platinum rings will
be the same weight. Check before buying that polishing platinum is doable by
your jeweller.
If the overall aim is lightness in the ring, with ease of changing sizes (i.e. every
average jeweller can approach it) and a super white look with cheaper costs at
the outset, white gold is a good option. If you’re more interested in avoiding the
maintenance issue of white gold, and willing to pay for the greater longevity of
the ring upfront, platinum is a good choice. Jewellers will try to push you into
what is easier or cheaper for them to stock or maintain – make the choice
your own!
Aftercare: generalities
It is generally recommended that you have a jeweller check your ring’s
prongs every six months – these things are rarely noticeable until the stone
goes missing! Polishing and replating are required in accordance with the way
you wear the ring, and how your body chemistry affects the rhodium plating
on white gold (platinum needs to be repolished rather than replated in most
cases). You might be lucky and not have to do any of this too often. As for
cleaning: warm water, liquid soap and a gentle toothbrush can always do the
trick.
Redressing the balance: going for gold online and abroad
If the ring you or your girlfriend wants is more complicated than that easily
bought online, what moves can you make to get a
good deal aside from bargaining down the price locally? The answer to this is
either plane tickets or importation. We’ll look first at the least physically
demanding option: importing from the States.
Non-letters from America
There are a few ways to tackle the importation prospect. The key thing to
remember is that the item will be taxed according to:
21.5% of (Import duty on (item cost + shipping charges))
Import duties will depend on what the specific item is. According to the EU
tax site, TARIC: http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds/cgi-bin/tarchap?Taric=7113110000&Download=0&Periodic=0&ProdLine=10&Lang=EN&SimDate=20091029&Country=
&YesNo=1&Indent=1&Action=1#OK
Relevant import taxes are:
• Loose stones, 0%
• Settings without stones, 2.5%
• Finished ring (stone + setting), 2.5%
Example calculation: a finished ring costs $3000 and $150 to ship.
2.5% of the total, $3150, is $79. The taxable amount for VAT is
then $3229. 21.5% of $3229 is $694.
The best way to handle this option depends on exchange rate values on the
day of purchase. For example, if the objective is to set a 1 carat F VS2 GIA
triple Ex (cut, symmetry and polish) with no fluorescence into an unusual
designer setting available in America, we can start out by comparing the
cost of the required diamond on an american website to the same on an irish website. Today (29/10) the difference in cost ex VAT is only $400. By the
time shipping and import taxes are added, it makes better sense to source
the stone on the irish website. If the exchange rate between the Dollar and
Euro should climb towards 2:1, it might be worth importing.
What to expect on delivery when importing
Usually the courier will take your package through customs and pay the
attendant charges and then deliver to you with an invoice for those extra
charges and a set fee (about 20 Euro). If you deal only with reputable
American vendors there won’t be any issues related to incorrect declarations
and so on, which could delay or interrupt the process.
Importing the setting alone
If you decide to buy your stone in Ireland and import the setting from the
US, you will have to supply the exact stats of your stone to the US supplier.
All this information is on the stone’s cert (GIA etc.). Apart from this, you
have to find a jeweller to set your stone into the setting. This can be
problematic as you’d expect. The best way to handle this is to check with an
independent jeweller before the move is made that he’d be willing to set it,
and for how much. Look into insuring against the setting process going
wrong: stones can break during this high-temperature pastime – and there’s
no comeback from your supplier in that case. Going in, make sure you have
the GIA cert to hand. Usually a unique GIA number is inscribed onto the girdle
of your GIA-certified diamond. This might be useful later if you’re in any way
concerned about your diamond – although it takes another unsetting and
special equipment to read the inscription! Despite this, its presence would
make a swap scenario much more unlikely to occur. In the case that your vendor
hasn't had the stone inscribed you can have an independent jeweller verify
that the stone contains the exact same inclusion types and positions as
are identified on the cert.
Importing the full deal
In the case that you decide to import a setting with a stone already in it,
you’ll be in need of a good comprehensive stone-and-setting site.
TBC...0 -
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Returning your items: how to avoid double charges
What happens if you need to return your item for refund of repair? First
you’ll need to call the customs and excise office (Dublin phone number =
(1) 8171920 or (1) 6475000) for specific codes to put on your package to
indicate that it’s a return and not a sale into America. Check with your
vendor that they will place the correct codes on the return package to you
– so that you don’t need to pay VAT and import duty again. Dealing with
reputable sellers will decrease the likelihood of ever needing to do this. In my
experience, good American sellers are willing to give you their shipping
account details so that you can return easily and at a discounted price –
there’s no harm in asking
Post-purchase moves: insurance
When your ring has been acquired from outside of Ireland, it’s important that
you have a valuation carried out for the purposes of insuring it. Generally
jewellers tend to charge some set fee plus 1% of the valuation total! To
avoid this nonsensical approach, look for an independent, properly qualified
appraiser.
More to come...0 -
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Buying Abroad: New York and Antwerp
There are several international spots in which to find good deals on
diamonds. These include New York, Antwerp, Amsterdam and South Africa.
To handle the prospect successfully it is wise to be well informed on current
diamond prices for what you’re after at these locations, and to have a simple
strategy for peace of mind after purchasing.
New York diamond district
The diamond district in New York is a chaotic jewellery bazaar. If buying in a
shop or booth that doesn’t have a multi-million dollar image to protect, make
sure to protect yourself by having the ring independently appraised before
you leave the country. If certified by GIA, IGI, HRD or AGS labs there is less
need to have the piece appraised generally but it still is advisable. In the
case that the cert is from EGL Europe or another unusual lab appraisal is
strongly advised.
Before purchasing make sure that the ring’s return period is long enough to
have it appraised and potentially returned and/or replaced. If buying
uncertified (not recommended) expect there to be some variance between
what the jeweller says and the appraisal results. A general rule of thumb is
to return the item if the jeweller stats are more than one colour or clarity
grade away from the appraiser’s opinion. Your appraiser should have no
trouble in advising you on whether it was a good buy or worth returning
and so on. Here’s a descriptive list of New York area independent appraisers:
http://www.pricescope.com/appraisers_NY.aspx
Antwerp
Heading to the medieval town of Antwerp is an easier and less expensive trip
than New York. To keep things transparent and fair for the foreign consumer,
the Antwerp Diamond High Council has accredited five trustworthy jewellers.
These are listed here: http://www.adja.be/frammembers.htm
Some of the five are not open during the weekend and some require an
advance appointment. Send a few e-mails up front to the vendors you’re
considering for price quotes on your preferred stone type and to make
appointments. On purchasing, make sure your stone is HRD, IGI, GIA or
AGS lab certified. Avoid EGL Europe certified stones – these certs are not
up to standards set by the other labs, and usually indicate that you’re being
overcharged. An example of this would be an EGL Europe certed G VS2 stone
with Excellent cut being later graded by GIA as I SI1 Very good cut, etc. If
possible pay whatever you can muster in cash, as this will entitle you to
a 21% discount!
In all cases it might be necessary to have the ring re-appraised by an
independent appraiser in Ireland for insurance purposes. An example of
such an appraiser is: http://www.dublinjewelleryvaluations.ie/
Before you leave home you can compare and contrast stats and prices
between Blue Nile Ireland, your discounted local independent jeweller or
average jeweller, online American vendors and your Antwerpian contacts and
bargain away at will. It isn’t the most romantic way to go about acquiring a
symbolic piece – but hopefully the non-romance of it will fade, while the
well-chosen diamond will endure
TBC with the "sciency" bit -- how to identify a good candidate from
numbers and plots.0 -
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Diamond proportions and performance
What you can determine from numbers and plots
As good internet retailers are at pains to let you know, the subjective
beauty of a diamond can be at least partially ‘captured’ by objective
measurement. This beauty is determined by a stone’s ability to reflect
ambient light into the viewer’s eye in such a way as to produce brilliance
(overall light return); dispersion, (produces flashes of ‘fire’ in the stone), and
scintillation (flashes of light or ‘sparkle’ throughout the stone as you rotate
it). This light ‘performance’ is mainly determined by the stone’s cut. The
exact relationship between performance and cut is complex and only partially
understood – but there are basic indicators that we can use to evaluate
whether or not a stone might be worth purchasing from afar or sight unseen.
For an in-depth discussion, good references for this topic are ‘Diamond
Grading ABC’ by Pagel-Theisen (11th edition) and ‘GIA Diamond Dictionary’
(3rd edition).
Assessment requirements
When buying online always ask for the lab report if it’s not already provided.
Websites offering no cut information or limited stats (i.e. no plots or
proportion diagram) and no option to enquire should be avoided. Keep in mind
that only round brilliant and princess cuts are currently gradable by labs.
Let’s take a typical report and look at the information it provides, for a 0.9
carat F SI1 GIA triple excellent stone:
Inclusions
To sidetrack a bit – what to make of the two clouds right in the centre of
the table in this SI1? In general you’d like inclusions to be away from the flat
plain or ‘table’ of the stone as this is where you’re more likely to see them
with the naked eye. However, the fact that SI1 status was earned by two
items rather than just one means that each one is probably not going to
impact the brilliance of the stone at all. To know for sure, ask your vendor if
the brilliance is impacted at 6-8 inches in all light-types. If crystals are
indicated make sure to ask about their colour: black is more likely to be
visible. Feathers are more acceptable if located away from the table but not
right at the perimeter of the stone. If this is the case, ask your vendor about
possible durability issues. If a feather is large enough and close enough to
the stone’s edge it can potentially become larger and visibly crack the stone
over time or after exposure to high heat etc. A good general resource is
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diamond_clarity, and for good quality example
pictures either http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/ or the book ‘Photo
Masters for Diamond Grading’ by Gary Roskin.
Cut proportion significance
As you can guess, a diamond’s light performance is determined by the
relationships between the stone’s facets, which can be gauged by relative
angles. The ‘excellent’ cut grade tells us that the proportions fall within a
certain well-defined range of accepted ratios – but we can compare,
contrast and exclude similar potential purchases by looking at specific
relationships for each stone. For example, if our vendor offers us the choice
of three suitable stones (all F, VS2, excellent cut), we can gauge their
relative performance by using the given angular information. Luckily you don’t
have to calculate this yourself. A software tool known as the HCA or
‘Holloway Cut Advisor’ (http://www.pricescope.com/cutadviser.asp) can
provide a quick gauge.
For the diamond above, the required stats are: total depth percentage (the
stone’s total depth as a percentage of width) = 62.3%; table percentage
(flat plain at the stone’s top as a percentage of total width) = 55%; crown
angle (angle at which upper faceting intersects the girdle) = 35.5 degrees;
pavilion angle (angle at which lower faceting intersects the girdle) = 40.6
degrees and culet percentage (pointed end) = 0 in this case. Inputting this gives
the result:
Reading HCA results
According to this analysis, our 0.9 carat Ex cut falls within the accepted
proportions for GIA Excellent and AGS 0 (ideal) cuts, with a Total Visual
Performance of 1.3. In general a result between 1 and 2 indicates that the
stone is most likely a top-end performer. All scores below 2 are worth
investigating further with ASET and Idealscope images (covered next) for
extra information on the proportions in the 3-D diamond (rather than the 2-D
diagram given in the report). Scores greater than 2 can also be worth
investigating further – but this depends on how they compare price-wise to
the top scorers. For example, if three F VS2 stones score at 0.9, 1.4, and
2.2, and the 2.2 is considerably cheaper than the others, it might be worth
while asking your vendor to compare the 2.2 to the 1.4 in images. You can
then figure out if the 2.2 stone is acceptable and if the extra cash would be
worth the extra perfection in the 1.4
TBC...0 -
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AGS ASET images
An ASET (Angular Spectrum Evaluation Tool) image is a map showing areas of
light return intensity in a diamond. The pattern of areas of red, green, blue
and black or white reveal a stone’s full optical symmetry. If interested in
the ‘how’, detailed information is here:
http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance
Examples for top-end excellent, excellent/very good, good and poor
cut are:
In general, red and pink indicate strong light return (pink to a lesser degree),
and are dominant in the best cut stones. Green indicates regions of reflected
light and should be less in evidence. Blue/purple indicates dark areas created
by the viewer’s head – this creates contrast pattern in a diamond. Black or
white indicate light loss or ‘leakage’ – areas that return little to no light.
Stones being sold in average jewellers in Ireland would tend to fall into the
‘above average’ and ‘common’ examples. The ‘common’ type cut can be
pleasing to the eye because it maintains quite strong light return with
contrast areas in the right regions – even if not that precisely rendered. The
‘poor’ example represents a total waste of cash in that it has a large green
region around the perimeter of the stone – this means the diamond will look
quite a bit smaller than its actual size in some light conditions. The
blue/purple pattern around the inner area reveals that the stone will have
‘fish eye’ – a dark line running around a bright centre.
So far in Europe only vendors selling high performance stones will generally
have the ability to produce ASET images for you, while most prominent
American online vendors use images like this in order to sell. Two relatively
local high-performance stone sellers are:
http://www.bestdiamonds.co.uk/default.asp (London) and
http://www.craftedbyinfinity.com/index.php (Antwerp)
Idealscope
The Idealscope is an ASET forerunner device and generally available to the
public for their excursions to jewellery shops and to test diamonds sent to
them for inspection by online retailers. You can purchase both the
ASET-scope and Idealscope and other kits here:
http://www.ideal-scope.com/cart_order.asp
A comparison of ASET and Idealscope images for the same diamonds shows
how they relate the same information:
In Idealscope images red indicates all returned light (i.e. both direct and
reflected, red and green on ASET). Black shows areas of obscured light that
create contrast (blue/purple on ASET). This tool is most suitable for judging
light return in round brilliant cuts, while ASET can be used for all types. Both
tools are useful for gauging optical symmetry, contrast pattern precision and
leakage problems areas, and probably a must if your objective is to obtain
the most perfect cut that you can for your cash. Sellers will sometimes have
other imaging or scanning tools available to help you narrow down the cut
choice. These include: Sarin, OGI, Helium, and Isee2. Demand these report
-types from your local diamond dealer in order to push for increased availability
Summing up
The short-format advice condensable from the rest roughly is:- Research what your requirement is for colour, clarity, size, cut and setting type;
- Research what this might cost abroad and online to get an idea of the baselines;
- Make trips to local independent and average jewellers and try to talk them
down -- the independent jeweller is infinitely more likely to meet your requests; - If not successful to the degree you would like, shop online armed with
knowledge of the right questions to ask, or head abroad to Antwerp or NY.
Best of luck in the hunt for the right ring 0 - Research what your requirement is for colour, clarity, size, cut and setting type;
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Additional notes: internet purchasing specifics
In the case that you are considering purchasing an expensive
diamond online, is it possible to select based purely on numbers
and plots? The answer to this is absolutely never: human eyes
have to gauge your candidate before the 'buy' button is clicked
The issue then is knowing which questions to ask about the
stone, and what to make of the answers.
It is advisable to select a few candidates when buying online,
with the intention of asking the vendor to compare and contrast
on your behalf. Good internet vendors are happy to answer your
queries before they send a stone out to you, it's in their best
interests when they have excellent return policies -- so don't be
shy and get technical about what your requirements are
For example, say we're looking for a round G-coloured SI1 stone
(a good spec to save cash with) in the 0.8 carat range and a
'very good cut', and come up with a list of three that fulfill our
requirements on screen. We're confident the colour suits us from
past research so that doesn't require checking, but clarity issues
in SI1 stones can sometimes be seen with the naked eye (and
very very occasionally (approx. 1%) in VS2 stones). And what
of the cut? 'Very good' encompasses cuts that can stun with
their liveliness and relative duds (not necessarily very bad but
just not as good as possible). How to gauge from here?- The first move to make is to use the HCA to select your, say,
three candidates based on their results. 'Very good' cuts
usually won't score under 2 -- but you can select stones that
are as close to 2 as you can find. This minimises your chance
of buying a worse cut that you have to.
- Second is the clarity issue, how can we have the vendor
test reliably for eye-cleanliness in SI1s? As suggested earlier,
the trick is to ask for an examination of the stone at 6-to-8
inches in incandescent (indoor) and diffuse (natural) light,
both stationary and gently rocked from side to side. This will
ensure that you won't be able to notice any marks from the
top of the stone. If you intend to mount your diamond in a
setting that enables you to see the stone from the side, you
might want to ask for the eye-cleanliness test to include
side views as well. Generally though, not many people pay
attention to this. Where you have candidates with lower
clarity than this, like SI2, (where most inclusions are visible
to the unaided eye), you can ask the vendor to select the
most eye-clean stone for you.
Specific questions can relate to the visibility of clarity
characteristics marked on the lab-report plot. Are crystals
light coloured or dark, and how visible are they; is a feather
well-hidden, or is it in a location (such as the lower pavilion)
where it can be reflected internally within the stone; where
exactly is an indented natural and does it have any effect
on the face-up appearance of the stone. If you are assured
of eye-cleanliness at a distance that suits you, none of these
questions are needed.
- Third is gauging cut. No matter what the numbers may say,
the human eye must decide which stone has the best overall
response in different light. Questions to ask here are 'which
stone has the highest level of brilliance (white light return),
fire (dispersion of light into spectral colours) and scintillation
(sparkle as the stone is rotated). The stone to pick has the
best overall response. Generally online vendors have a few
gemologists on hand to answer your questions, so you are
guaranteed a meaningful discussion on the relative virtues of
each of your candidates.
Good luck on confidently finding your perfect stone online
P.S. I am still un-allied with any facet of the jewellery industry,
do not know any dealers I can refer anyone to and generally
have no magic cash-saving capabilities 0 - The first move to make is to use the HCA to select your, say,
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check what you get!
i wish i had read about getting a ring from a reputable source before going to get my wifes second engagement ring. she's had three from me already
the first was a temporary thing i got just to ask her to be my ball and chain. i knew i'd be better off letting her pick out her own.
anyway, as soon as i gave her the temporary ring and asked i told her that we could go away somewhere for a weekend and pick out her actual engagement ring. how wrong was i. in about 40 minutes we were at a jewellers in carlow looking at a years mortgage to fit on her finger. this is where we went wrong.
this ring we were sold from a jeweller in carlow town was valued by the jeweller at 4,500 euro, but as it was christmas eve when i asked her he knocked it down to 4,300. it was supposedly 18 carat gold and have such and such grade/size of diamond. not sure what grade and size and i didn't care.
she had to get it re-sized and on coming back from the operation one of the stones was loose. this annoyed her as she wanted to wear it all day, everyday, and tell everyone. girls are so weird. so she brought it back again and got it set. a couple of days later another stone started to come loose and this really annoyed her so she took it to a jeweller in enniscorthy and asked him to take a look at it. she brought the appraisal form with her.
while she was there she just asked the guy for what his opinion of the value would be. he came up with 2,000 euro and gave some very knowledgeable reasons why, it was only 9 carat and the diamonds were of a far lesser grade than what was qouted. when she said she bought it in carlow for 4,300 and it was valued for 4,500 he actually asked her if she had bought it in the jewellers where it was bought. he knew the name so it was obviously something that had happened before. she said yes and told him that she would be returning it.
after this visit she was very,very upset and wasted no time in going back to the orginal carlow jeweller ready to fight it out to get a refund. when she got there the jeweller didn't once raise an objection and simply handed back the money. he even said to her 'the less said about this, the better'.
with the refund she went back to enniscorthy and got her third ring and she's certain of the value and quality.
the point i'd like to make is that there is no reason why you shouldn't bring your shiny new expensive ring into someone for a second valuation if you're in any way unsatisfied or uncertain of the quality. we wouldn't even have known how bad ours was if the stones hadn't come loose.0 -
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TBH when we were looking at rings I found two that I really liked above all others. When it came to chosing them I was really stuck because they were both very different; one was a 3 stone understated ring and other was quite blingy. In the end and contrary to what I would've thought I'd like I went for the blingy one. Even as my OH paid for it I was thinking 'have I made a mistake, would I prefer the other one?' but now I love it and so glad I was brave and chose something a little different.
Should i just KNOW when it is the one - will there ever be DOUBTS
I like the three stone - I am just terrified of paying out this money and then deciding a few months down the line that it's not the one I want.
I get lots of compliments on my ring simply because it's not a solitare so it looks a little different.
Also, I see from one of your other posts you said you were attracted to a 3 stone ring which suprised you but the jewellers we went to told us that it happens all the time. Once you start trying on rings you find that maybe the one you thought you liked doesn't look as good on your finger as another one. That was why she showed us lots of different types of rings.
I think that there is a leap of faith especially if you like more than one ring or the style is something very different to your initial idea. I'm sure whichever one you get you'll love it but I understand why you're nervous. It's a big investment for something you'll be wearing every day for years to come. 0 -
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Hehe, do not be consternated! Being worried about swapping rings out alone is no suprise. The trick is to do it once and do it right -- in which case you can do no better than select a ring both you and your other half know objectively to be the most suitable piece for you. After the proposal it's a sign of commitment and probably just needs time to feel like part of your hand. Good luck 0
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@ greeno
If the cost is close to what you can gauge online (especially the American sites) then there's probably not too much left in the discount. No one ever got shot for trying though :pac:
@ Unwilling
The cost versus result conundrum is up to you and your partner. Go forth and do the right thing for you 0 -
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@ Unwilling
The cost versus result conundrum is up to you and your partner. Go forth and do the right thing for you[/quote]
Intothesea
But that is easier said than done. I am just so afraid of buying this beautiful ring and finding out that if I'd have waited a month I'd have found it on line, or in Dubai, or in South Africa for cheaper!!
It's not that we don't have the money, it's that I want VALUE for my money.
Just cause I have it doesn't mean I want to spend 5k on something I could get elsewhere for 3k!
Why also is having a CERT so important... if you buy from a well known reputable jeweler who make their own rings... is their in house certification not sufficient!?0 -
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@ Unwilling
It's not that we don't have the money, it's that I want VALUE for my money.
Just cause I have it doesn't mean I want to spend 5k on something I could get elsewhere for 3k!
The options are there to make a saving as long as you can tolerate the relative risk for the results.
Keep in mind that the further you go to make a saving, the more you shake up local concerns and their cartel-style pricing schemes. In this sense buying abroad or online is a small step towards forcing local retailers to cut the 200 to 300% margins on average (by this I mean not particularly high-end spec) jewellery. Seeking value for money deflates the cash balloon for all the other engagement couples arriving in your wake. Well worth the effort if you care about retail condition in Ireland as well as getting a good deal Apologies if you happen to work in jewellery sales -- I can't tow a line to suit anyone there :pac: 0 -
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Why also is having a CERT so important... if you buy from a well known reputable jeweler who make their own rings... is their in house certification not sufficient!?
Sorry for the delay with this. In-house certification is a bigger issue with on-line sales entities, on the basis that a misrepresented stone is much harder to send back and have addressed (i.e. a swindling online outfit probably won't even acknowledge your queries when you realise the 'mistake'). This is why only well-known online vendors are to be trusted. With bricks-and-mortar reputable shops there's always the option to walk back in after the appraisal and bring up your concerns (or insist on a stone-switch etc.), so the in-house certification is not so big a deal in that case. Hope that answers the question!
@ An rí: let's hope a sudden wakening would mean dopey-headedness in either case 0 -
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Hello there. I don't know of any jewellers off hand who offer this, though it seems to be quite common online probably only as a sweetener for online purchasing. Your best bet is to ring a few jewellers you're interested in and ask. Look out for your local independent jewellers' terms and conditions. The chances are that a remote prospective buyer will be told of less options than someone in the shop with chosen ring and a credit card If you're interested in negotiating a better price there's also a good chance that payment plan options will disappear. For this reason I'd go the credit union/bank route and shop with the advantage of having substantial cash in hand -- discounts are easier to approach then. HTH 0
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Don't panic!! If you're compelled to buy a ring after trying it on it usually is the right purchase. It might just take some time to get used to a permanent piece of symbolic jewellery if you had no rings beforehand. If your issue is with the ring itself (doesn't suit, wrong stones, wrong shape), I'm sure your jeweller will do whatever he can to sort it out for you in the shape of an exchange at least. How about giving it another week of constant wearing and thinking about your next move then? The best of luck 0
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