basic Rules of The Road many People dont know.

Diamondmaker

The concurrent thread on the undertaking 306 got me thinking of this.

3 specific incidents where I get really pissed off. I am pretty sure of the rules in the situations but I am open to any correction or clarification from anyone who can SUBSTANTIATE what they say.

1. Right turn on a 1 way street. During my journey home every day I do this twice in the city centre.
Often you approach the end of the road, take up appropriate position on the right to make your turn.
A car already at the end of the road, on the left, then gives you looks and starts to indicate right also! I hold my ground and make my turn to a blast from their horn!
Right turn on 1 way street should be done from the RHS.

2. Similar to above. Approaching one of our fair cities many dodgy small roundabouts.
The rules of the road allow you pass straight through a R@B in both lanes only if there are 2 lanes on the other side also. Balinteer from the M50 has many such examples. You pull up in the left lane aside a car on the right. You indicate left to leave the 2nd exit (straight) and all of a sudden they are freaking out that you have "undertook" or "cut them off" when they realise there is only 1lane on the other side.
RHL is for RH turn in this case not straight.

3. Again quite similar. Approaching a cross roads 2 lanes in all directions. If you cannot see the first car in the queue on the RHS you cannot be sure they are not turning right and hence slow your progress. It obviuosly makes sense to use the LH lane. You drive up the LH lane and "queue jump" all the cars in the RH lane. Light goes green the cars in the RH lane want to go straight and lift you out of it. The LH lane is the default for straight for the obvious reason that RH turners can slow up traffic while waiting to manouvere.

I put all the above situations to my advanced driving instructor who confrimed what I thought. ....but the standard of knowledge out there is so poor that I am not 100% confident on anythng anyone tells you.
The roundabout scenario I looked up in rules of road. ( which does not cover 2 lanes to 1 scenario!! )
The 1 way street is deffo correct also from RoR.

Id like to hear further examples or corrections to mine.
cheers

Vegeta

Diamondmaker wrote:

The concurrent thread on the undertaking 306 got me thinking of this.

3 specific incidents where I get really pissed off. I am pretty sure of the rules in the situations but I am open to any correction or clarification from anyone who can SUBSTANTIATE what they say.

1. Right turn on a 1 way street. During my journey home every day I do this twice in the city centre.
Often you approach the end of the road, take up appropriate position on the right to make your turn.
A car already at the end of the road, on the left, then gives you looks and starts to indicate right also! I hold my ground and make my turn to a blast from their horn!
Right turn on 1 way street should be done from the RHS.

2. Similar to above. Approaching one of our fair cities many dodgy small roundabouts.
The rules of the road allow you pass straight through a R@B in both lanes only if there are 2 lanes on the other side also. Balinteer from the M50 has many such examples. You pull up in the left lane aside a car on the right. You indicate left to leave the 2nd exit (straight) and all of a sudden they are freaking out that you have "undertook" or "cut them off" when they realise there is only 1lane on the other side.
RHL is for RH turn in this case not straight.

3. Again quite similar. Approaching a cross roads 2 lanes in all directions. If you cannot see the first car in the queue on the RHS you cannot be sure they are not turning right and hence slow your progress. It obviuosly makes sense to use the LH lane. You drive up the LH lane and "queue jump" all the cars in the RH lane. Light goes green the cars in the RH lane want to go straight and lift you out of it. The LH lane is the default for straight for the obvious reason that RH turners can slow up traffic while waiting to manouvere.

I put all the above situations to my advanced driving instructor who confrimed what I thought. ....but the standard of knowledge out there is so poor that I am not 100% confident on anythng anyone tells you.
The roundabout scenario I looked up in rules of road. ( which does not cover 2 lanes to 1 scenario!! )
The 1 way street is deffo correct also from RoR.

Id like to hear further examples or corrections to mine.
cheers

Don't forget road markings they may negate your arguements in some cases, for example if coming up to a cross roads with 2 lanes and the LHL says left only well then you cant exactly drive straight but you know this and I am just saying it out loud.

same with round abouts sometimes road markings will dictate what lane can go where, in most cases though you are correct.

alias no.9

All of the above are correct unless there are signs or road markings that indicate differently for example there are cases where there are two lanes approaching traffic lights and the left one is marked left only and the right one is marked straight on and right. I know of at least one t-junction with traffic lights where coming off the side road there are two lanes, the right hand one marked for right turns and the left hand one marked for both right and left turns.

BendiBus

Stopping in a yellow box when making a right turn is permitted BUT YOUR EXIT MUST STILL BE CLEAR. You can only stop in the yellow box because there is oncoming traffic. This causes me so much grief in the mornings as roads get blocked by right turning traffic when the lights change and they're in the yellow box with nowhere to go!

Vegeta

alias no.9 wrote:

All of the above are correct unless there are signs or road markings that indicate differently for example there are cases where there are two lanes approaching traffic lights and the left one is marked left only and the right one is marked straight on and right. I know of at least one t-junction with traffic lights where coming off the side road there are two lanes, the right hand one marked for right turns and the left hand one marked for both right and left turns.

yup what he said

prospect

Diamondmaker wrote:

You pull up in the left lane aside a car on the right. You indicate left to leave the 2nd exit (straight)

You only indicate left entering the roundabout if you are taking the first exit, (although this may be physically straight in front of you).
If the 'straight' exit is the second exit, then you do not indicate left until you are passing the first exit.

zuutroy

Diamondmaker wrote:

2. Similar to above. Approaching one of our fair cities many dodgy small roundabouts.
The rules of the road allow you pass straight through a R@B in both lanes only if there are 2 lanes on the other side also. Balinteer from the M50 has many such examples. You pull up in the left lane aside a car on the right. You indicate left to leave the 2nd exit (straight) and all of a sudden they are freaking out that you have "undertook" or "cut them off" when they realise there is only 1lane on the other side.
RHL is for RH turn in this case not straight.

Here's one for ya....coming over porterstown bridge there's a roundabout intersecting with Clonsilla Road with 2 lanes.....Exit 1 has one lane; Exit 2 (straight on) has one lane; There is no exit 3 as its a one way st.

Surely If I want to take exit 1 I get in the left lane and exit 2 I get in the right lane, but almost every day I see people using the left lane for exit 2 nearly causing a crash (not to mention the number of people that turn across you with no indicator on)

Diamondmaker

Vegeta wrote:

Don't forget road markings they may negate your arguements in some cases, for example if coming up to a cross roads with 2 lanes and the LHL says left only well then you cant exactly drive straight but you know this and I am just saying it out loud.

same with round abouts sometimes road markings will dictate what lane can go where, in most cases though you are correct.

100% agreed. Consider all my point where there are no extra road markings

thewing

My ROR bugbear has to be incorrect indication on a roudabout.If taking third exit you indicate right and then left after passing 2nd exit to show your takin 3rd exit.Most people either don't bother, or just go around indicating left, leaving people trying to gain entry to roundabout thinking they are goin to exit, leading to some near misses(I've seen them happen)....

fletch

zuutroy wrote:

Here's one for ya....coming over porterstown bridge there's a roundabout intersecting with Clonsilla Road with 2 lanes.....Exit 1 has one lane; Exit 2 (straight on) has one lane; There is no exit 3 as its a one way st.

Surely If I want to take exit 1 I get in the left lane and exit 2 I get in the right lane, but almost every day I see people using the left lane for exit 2 nearly causing a crash (not to mention the number of people that turn across you with no indicator on)

I see this all the time too and I'm not sure of the answer....if you are to go by the rules of the road then if you are going straight, you should use the left lane but then this would make the right hand lane redundant.....

Diamondmaker

prospect wrote:

You only indicate left entering the roundabout if you are taking the first exit, (although this may be physically straight in front of you).
If the 'straight' exit is the second exit, then you do not indicate left until you are passing the first exit.

sorry put a comma in instead of a full stop.


You pull up in the left lane aside a car on the right, <then> you indicate left to leave the 2nd exit (straight) ( after passing the 1st. Not indicating at time of pulling up )

Diamondmaker

zuutroy wrote:

Here's one for ya....coming over porterstown bridge there's a roundabout intersecting with Clonsilla Road with 2 lanes.....Exit 1 has one lane; Exit 2 (straight on) has one lane; There is no exit 3 as its a one way st.

Surely If I want to take exit 1 I get in the left lane and exit 2 I get in the right lane, but almost every day I see people using the left lane for exit 2 nearly causing a crash (not to mention the number of people that turn across you with no indicator on)

100% agreed we have these magic rounabouts every where with so many different variations. Strictly speaking you probably should use the LHL to go straight but practically it makes no sense.

This is where the relevant authorities should splash out and use some more paint and put up relevant signage where these "non standard" sceanrios occur.

Vegeta

fletch wrote:

I see this all the time too and I'm not sure of the answer....if you are to go by the rules of the road then if you are going straight, you should use the left lane but then this would make the right hand lane redundant.....

yup the left hand lane is for the second exit, the right hand lane is for third and subsequent in this case probably going back the way you came as you cant take the third exit.

They should put down road markings and that'd sort it out

Diamondmaker

Another scenario where a sign or a splash of paint would save so much traffic chaos.
Going down dundrum road towards Milltown there is a small RH turn onto Bird Ave. If any one is turning right there is often not enough room to go inside them to carry on straight.
The junction itself is wide enough that if a decent road position is taken by the RH turner traffic can continue straight in both direction while they wait.
A bit of paint dictating to keep straight lane clear would save mad tail backs here every day due to the straight ahead lane coming to a complete stop as 1RH turner has to wait a whole light cycle to make their turn.

GGGRRRRR:mad:

prospect

Diamondmaker wrote:

sorry put a comma in instead of a full stop.


You pull up in the left lane aside a car on the right, <then> you indicate left to leave the 2nd exit (straight) ( after passing the 1st. Not indicating at time of pulling up )

I figured you meant that, I was just making it clear in case any of the idiots you are giving out about are reading this..

BrianD3

Diamondmaker wrote:

2. Similar to above. Approaching a one of our fair cities very dodgy small roundabouts.
The rules of the road allow you pass straight through a R@B in both lanes only if there are 2 lanes on the other side. balinteer from the M50 has many such examples. You pull up in the left lane aside a car on the right. You indicate left to leave the 2nd exit and all of a sudden they are freaing out that you have undertook them when they realise there is only 1 lane on the other side. RHL is for RH turn in this case not straight.

3. Again quite similar. Approaching a cross roads 2 lanes in all directions. If you cannot see the first car in the queue on the RHS you cannot be sure they are not turning right and hence slow your progress. It obviuosly makes sense to use the LH lane. You drive up the LH lane and "queue jump" all the cars in the RH lane. Light goes green the cars in the RH lane want to go straight and lift you out of it. The LH lane is the default for straight for the obvious reason that RH turners can slow up traffic while waiting to manouvere.

I agree with what others have said about road markings. The road markings/design contribute to both of the above IMO. There is a lack of consistency in signage, road designs and road markings which confuses drivers. Eg if you're on a road with two lanes and you approach a junction and want to go straight you can't be sure what lane you're supposed to be in till you're virtually on top of the junction. You could find that the right lane is marked for straight/right and the left is left only. Or vice versa. Or you can go straight in either lane. Probably depends on the traffic light sequence.

Same with roundabouts - often there are direction arrows marked on the approach to roundabouts. Sometimes the LH lane is marked as left (first exit) only and the RH lane is straight/right. Also if there are two lanes approaching a roundabout and only one on the 2nd exit drivers may not know this until they reach the exit.

Tobias Greeshman

There's a roundabout in Maynooth at the Business Park, that has the slip road off the M4, which lets traffic onto the roundabout. Every 2 months or so, some idiot tries to drive up the slip-road (it really has to be seen to be believed). On a roundabout sign a small red rectangle means that you cannot go down that exit (either it's closed off or one-way traffic). But some people must think it's meant to signify the business park.

The most recent idiot was driving a cement truck.

Vegeta

BrianD3 wrote:

I agree with what others have said about road markings. The road markings/design contribute to both of the above IMO. There is a lack of consistency in signage, road designs and road markings which confuses drivers. Eg if you're on a road with two lanes and you approach a junction and want to go straight you can't be sure what lane you're supposed to be in till you're virtually on top of the junction. You could find that the right lane is marked for straight/right and the left is left only. Or vice versa. Or you can go straight in either lane. Probably depends on the traffic light sequence.

Same with roundabouts - often there are direction arrows marked on the approach to roundabouts. Sometimes the LH lane is marked as left (first exit) only and the RH lane is straight/right. Also if there are two lanes approaching a roundabout and only one on the 2nd exit drivers may not know this until they reach the exit.

nail on the head.

In Ireland you have to know all the roads, crosses, junctions and lights to drive safely without impeeding other road users. The most stressful thing about driving in Irish cities is the above, unless you know the junctions it is often difficult to know which lane you should be in. Nightmare if you drive into a different city for the first time and have to start lane hopping and holding up traffic.

It probably causes very few deaths as it would be relatively low speed stuff but very annoying all the same.

Anan1

Agree fully with what Diamondmaker has said, and have one of my own to add. There's a normal, fairly small junction with lights near where I live. Imagine I'm the second car at the lights when they go green, with a queue of cars behind me. The car in front of me wants to turn right, but is prevented from doing so by oncoming traffic. Rather than move forwards to the centre of the junction so that we can pass around them, they sit at the lights until they get the green filter light at the end of the cycle to turn right. The result is that maybe 15 fewer cars get to pass through the green light.

dubred

Diamondmaker wrote:

2. Similar to above. Approaching one of our fair cities many dodgy small roundabouts.
The rules of the road allow you pass straight through a R@B in both lanes only if there are 2 lanes on the other side also. Balinteer from the M50 has many such examples. You pull up in the left lane aside a car on the right. You indicate left to leave the 2nd exit (straight) and all of a sudden they are freaking out that you have "undertook" or "cut them off" when they realise there is only 1lane on the other side.
RHL is for RH turn in this case not straight.

I use these roundabouts on a daily basis, the one at Wesley College really only has 2 proper roads exiting it as does the next one at what used to be Gort Mhuire (if you observe the sign on the right approaching the Gort Mhuire one it suggests the 3rd exit is not a road!!), in both cases the 2nd exit could be described as beyond straight.

I tend to use the RH lane with extreme care when coming from the M50 (or sometimes both lanes just in case;) ) and LH lane when approaching the M50 in the case of these roundabouts for the very reasons you describe.

I believe these particular roundabouts would benefit from specific markings to clarify the situation.

I normally observe the rules as you have stated them but I think in these particular cases you have to assess the situation as you arrive at it.

Am I completely wrong??

Vegeta

Anan1 wrote:

Agree fully with what Diamondmaker has said, and have one of my own to add. There's a normal, fairly small junction with lights near where I live. Imagine I'm the second car at the lights when they go green, with a queue of cars behind me. The car in front of me wants to turn right, but is prevented from doing so by oncoming traffic. Rather than move forwards to the centre of the junction so that we can pass around them, they sit at the lights until they get the green filter light at the end of the cycle to turn right. The result is that maybe 15 fewer cars get to pass through the green light.

on that note i have to ask the question

What is the legal position there, some roads have boxes out in the centre with arrows going right indicating the driver should pull out and some roads don't. Can i legally (as in i wont fail my test for doing so) drive into the centre of all junctions (what about yellow box) with the indicator on waiting for a gap in traffic.

Also what happens if the light goes red (didn't get a gap in traffic) while I am in the centre of the road.

Hope that's clear

EDIT: for the recod i do pull out (unless there's a yellow box) and wait for a gap but i want to know what happens in the test if i do this and the lights go red

Diamondmaker

If you did not get a gap in the traffic and the light goes red you should high tail it out of there on your merry way, you cant sit there for any reason.

Dubred yes those are the very R@Bs im on about. I think it is clear so far and confimred from all so far that the RH lane is for the RH turn in these instances where 2 lanes become 1. These rounabout all have a RH turn also which make the sitaution more clear cut unlike the 1 way street scenario mentioned

But people do not know this and will continue to crash or blast people who drive through in the Left lane.

Diamondmaker

Anan1 wrote:

Agree fully with what Diamondmaker has said, and have one of my own to add. There's a normal, fairly small junction with lights near where I live. Imagine I'm the second car at the lights when they go green, with a queue of cars behind me. The car in front of me wants to turn right, but is prevented from doing so by oncoming traffic. Rather than move forwards to the centre of the junction so that we can pass around them, they sit at the lights until they get the green filter light at the end of the cycle to turn right. The result is that maybe 15 fewer cars get to pass through the green light.

Damn it its no fun if we agree with each other;)

shoegirl

A lot of Irish roundabouts are very badly designed or badly finished, I notice the difference in the UK where I drive regularly every couple of months around the M4 between Heathrow and Berks.

My main problems are the following:

1. Not understanding the meaning of a red light -
- going through a red light when turning left or right because driver didn't understand that junctions were NOT slip roads
- ignoring a red light because there is no other traffic on the road
and my big annoyance - driving through a pedestrian light when the pedestrian light is green because they were turning the corner and ignored the red light at the crossing
2. Not understanding how to use a pelican crossing - i.e. the ones where there are no buttons and the pedestrian just walks out onto the road - have seen many clueless young males (its always clueless young males!) on one at Midleton who seemed to thing that they had a right to drive straight through even though there was a pedestrian already crossing.
3. Treating STOP signs as if they were YIELD signs
4. Indicating right when entering a roundabout and then driving striaght ahead
5. Cabbages who allow themselves to become totally distracted by their passengers
6. Discourteous parking, especially double-parking on busy streets
7. Cabbages who overtake a cyclist and then immediately turn left
8. People who cross two lanes at once, usually when exiting a two-lane carriageway onto an exit road
9. Tailgating - arrgh!

prospect

Diamondmaker wrote:

If you did not get a gap in the traffic and the light goes red you should high tail it out of there on your merry way, you cant sit there for any reason.

Might not be that simple as there may be a green light for pedestrians on the road you are turning into.

Anan1

Diamondmaker wrote:

Damn it its no fun if we agree with each other;)

Patience, it won't last forever.;)

Vegeta

prospect wrote:

Might not be that simple as there may be a green light for pedestrians on the road you are turning into.

i think it might be one of those damned if you do and damned if you don't situations. Its been driving me nuts not knowing exactly what to do in a test situation :mad:

Blitzkrieger

shoegirl wrote:

on one at Midleton who seemed to thing that they had a right to drive straight through even though there was a pedestrian already crossing.

You know it's amazing how easy it is to not see that. When you've spent ten years zooming over the bridge and hoping to god there's not another tractor in front of you no amount of stripes and flashing amber lights will force you to not see what you're expecting to see.

What I hate about Midleton is how close fuppers park to the corners, on double yellows usually. Put it in the car park and walk you lazy twits!

Diamondmaker

Yeah and you look like a muppet floating there in no mans land!!

Yeah yeah yeah yeah!!!!

Another one!

Do red lights mean anything in this country??I work with a lot of foreign preofessionals and they are all shocked from Slovakia to Sweden and UK to UAE ( not really but rhymed:D )

During rush hour every junction has several cars clearly break the red light every time guaranteed.
The effect of a back log of cars in the junction who skipped the light delays the oncoming traffic to differing degrees. This knock on effect of the oncoming traffic losing green time beacuse of extra cars ahead that skipped the light have to clear first causes a viscous circle where cars can never go on green but have to wait for these to clear. The cycle continues and the delay grows and it goes on forever. The cops watch I have never ever seen a car pulled from breaking a light like this even though I would say I see it done to and from work 20/30 times a day easy.

Wishbone Ash

Anyone familiar with Collinstown Cross junction on the R132 near Dublin Airport?

Travelling southbound there are two lanes. The left lane is marked for going straight ahead. The right lane is marked for going straight ahead also or for turning right.

The problem arising is with the traffic light sequence. It provides a green right filter arrow with a red light. Many motorists who are unfamiliar with the light sequence and who wish to travel straight ahead use the right lane. They are technically correct as the lane is marked so but this appears to incur the wrath of motorists (especially taxis) who wish to turn right and get caught behind them.

I would have assumed that a green right arrow should only be used where there is a dedicated lane.

Fey!

Young lad goes for driving lessons, and as he approcahes the first set of traffic lights, the light turns amber. He drops a gear and floors it, flying through the lights.

"Why'd ya do that?" asks the instructor.
"Da brudders a taxi droiver, 'n 'e tole me dat wen da lites go oranje, it means speed upp" comes the reply.

Next set of lights go red just as they reach them, so the youngster again drops a gear and floors it through.

"Why the hell did ya do that????"
"Da broider tole me dat wen da lites go red, nuttin'll be cummin for a few sekonds, so ya can still get thru"

Next set of light go green just as they reach them, and the young lad hits the anchors with all of his might.

"What the f^*k did you do THAT for?" roars the insructor.

"Jaysus, boss, d'ya tink oim mad; da broider mite be cummin da udder way!!!"

Tobias Greeshman

Fey! wrote:

Young lad goes for driving lessons, and as he approcahes the first set of traffic lights, the light turns amber. He drops a gear and floors it, flying through the lights.

"Why'd ya do that?" asks the instructor.
"Da brudders a taxi droiver, 'n 'e tole me dat wen da lites go oranje, it means speed upp" comes the reply.

Next set of lights go red just as they reach them, so the youngster again drops a gear and floors it through.

"Why the hell did ya do that????"
"Da broider tole me dat wen da lites go red, nuttin'll be cummin for a few sekonds, so ya can still get thru"

Next set of light go green just as they reach them, and the young lad hits the anchors with all of his might.

"What the f^*k did you do THAT for?" roars the insructor.

"Jaysus, boss, d'ya tink oim mad; da broider mite be cummin da udder way!!!"

ROFL!!
Damn how I laughed at that, should post it on the Humour forum.

nialler

East link roundabout, both north and south. South (Sean Moore Road) is particularly viscious, Eastlink is actually the 2nd exit so you have the feckers indicating left (I'm sat on Pigeon House Road) assuming they're turning down PHR about to pull into the flow and off they zoom through, it is a yield they'll lose approx 3 secs letting the people out from PHR but NOOOOOOOO.

Now even more dangerous than that is the truck drivers coming out of the docks on that side, yes they're driving 40 tonnes of killing machine and they know it, absolutely no consideration for the cars on the roundabout, I've nearly driven under a few of them and another note is that my father in law reckons most of them had alcohol on them when driving (he worked down there for many years loading the trucks). Absolute lunacy.

Saruman

Yup everything you said is correct unless as people said.. here are signs to say otherwise.
I posted about the roundabout one a few weeks back.

Here is one a lot of people do not know... Yield signs.. mean YIELD!!! Give way to other traffic as they have right of way.

Also when on a roundabout NEVER EVER EVER cut across lanes!! Some stupid woman in a 4x4 last night almost creamed me. It was at coming off M4 to Maynooth. there are 2 lanes and a roundabout. Ledt lane is marked for left and straight through for Naas/Straffan which is where she was going. I was in the right going to 4rd exit for Maynooth (needed fuel). We both go she goes straight through and only notices im there when i blast the horn at her inches from the side of my car.

I have experienced all the muppetry you mention and more Everyone in this country should be made to take an advanced motoring course or loose their license.

Its crazy! Few weeks back.. again another roundabout incident im heading straight through the Ballycoolin roundabout (by ebay) heading towards Blanch and as im half way through this female taxi driver comes tearing from my left (2nd exit) without even looking to see if there are any cars... only notices when i blast my horn there are about 3 cars or so on the roundabout!! And i swear im positive the same woman did the same thing the previous month.. im positive.. some woman, same car and same roundabout!!

Another VERY dangerous place i notice is the Auburn roundabout. If coming from the castleknock side there are 2 lanes.. and the stupid thing is they are CLEARLY MARKED!!!! Left hand lane is for LEFT or STRAIGHT!! In other words left to M50 or straight to go around the roundabout or straight on to the 2nd exit which is Dunsink lane. The Right hand lane is marked Straight ahead or Right. The ammount of idiots in the right hand lane who try to go Left to the M50 is idiotic!!! Today i was in the left hand lane and i was going straight to Dunsink (2nd Exit). Some idiot in front and to the right cut across to go left. She was before me and did not cause me any difficulty but i still blasted the horn to let her know she was doing something illegal and dangerous.

Another black spot is heading down from Ballyfermot under the overpass to Chapelizod. Two lanes clearly marked. left is for going LEFT for local access and the hotel. Right is obviously for right.. So many idiots think its fun to bypass the Q turning right, fly down the left and try and undertake them on a turn!!! Its so dangerous!! There is only 1 lane for feck sake!!!!! One asshole almost ran me off the road trying to do that.

Saruman

Vegeta wrote:

i think it might be one of those damned if you do and damned if you don't situations. Its been driving me nuts not knowing exactly what to do in a test situation :mad:

Since the law states you can stop in a yellow box if you are turning right then i think you might fail if you did not do so. And If the lights go red and you CANT go because of a pedestrian right of way (i have yet to see this scenario anywhere) then i would myself start moving slowly and wait for the pedestrian light to change then proceed as otherwise i would be blocking the traffic in the other direction.

mike65

Which lane would you use for the Carrick-on-Suir exit?



Mike.

Vegeta

here's something i see everyday and have to wonder about it, it kind of follows on from Sarumans post

If on a dual carraigeway and you approach a roundabout from the clock position of 6 o clock, no road markings other than broken white line in the centre.

This roundabout has 3 exits, one at 9 o clock, one at 3 o clock and the one you are entering from i.e. 6 o clock (which would be a u turn effectively)

Ok as i was saying you approach the roundabout from 6 o clock there are 2 lanes in and the exit at 9 o clock (the first exit) has 2 lanes out.

I see people constantly pull into the right hand lane beside me and then take the first exit in the right hand lane. Cutting across the left hand lane to take the first exit

My question is how do they know I am not in the left hand lane wishing to take the second exit, in which case they are cutting me off?

Fair enough the second exit is at 3 o clock which is over 180 degress but i am entitled to take the second exit if in the left hand lane am i not?

Vegeta

Saruman wrote:

Since the law states you can stop in a yellow box if you are turning right then i think you might fail if you did not do so. And If the lights go red and you CANT go because of a pedestrian right of way (i have yet to see this scenario anywhere) then i would myself start moving slowly and wait for the pedestrian light to change then proceed as otherwise i would be blocking the traffic in the other direction.

my housemates brother failed his driving test for exactly this he, was in the middle of the road wanting to go right but didn't get a chance and then the lights went red

Vegeta

mike65 wrote:

Which lane would you use for the Carrick-on-Suir exit?



Mike.

if there are no road markings

legally you can use the left hand lane A.

In practice B makes more sense, there should be road markings on this round about.

andrea

You should probably use B? But if you do then you're assuming that anybody in A is going to leave at the first exit!

My favourite is when people indicate on roundabouts on the M50, half of them are indicating which exit they're going to leave at, the other half are going to change lane in front of you and it's pot luck which they are going to do!

At the Tallaght exit people use the wrong lane on the roundabout then cut in in front of you at the last minute to get off for Tallaght. Taxis are the worst for this and cut it more tightly too. And if you use your horn you're letting yourself in for a load of abuse all the way down the N81!

prospect

mike65 wrote:

Which lane would you use for the Carrick-on-Suir exit?



Mike.

Nice picture.

NeMiSiS

andrea wrote:

You should probably use B? But if you do then you're assuming that anybody in A is going to leave at the first exit!

My favourite is when people indicate on roundabouts on the M50, half of them are indicating which exit they're going to leave at, the other half are going to change lane in front of you and it's pot luck which they are going to do!

At the Tallaght exit people use the wrong lane on the roundabout then cut in in front of you at the last minute to get off for Tallaght. Taxis are the worst for this and cut it more tightly too. And if you use your horn you're letting yourself in for a load of abuse all the way down the N81!

You mean they stay in the inside lane right until the last minute and then belt across in front of you right at the exit of the n81? Through the hatched markings ?

TK

Saruman

mike65 wrote:

Which lane would you use for the Carrick-on-Suir exit?



Mike.

A I would NOT use B at all as there is only one lane on second exit (that i can see) on that picture. Unless you just did not draw in the lines. If there are 2 lanes on the second exit then B is also fine as long as you stay in the right hand lane when you exit and not assume the left hand lane is free and just cut across!!

Another thing i have seen is coming off N32 on the M50 roundabout there. There are 3 lanes that are CLEARLY marked. Left and middle lanes are for straight ahead (middle also for going right around roundabout taking next exit for Belfast/airport. Then a 3rd right lane that is clearly marked RIGHT!!! in other words Belfast turn or back around the way you came.
So many people go into the right hand lane either from the N32 or from the M1 side going on the M50 and take the far right lane then at last minute cut across cars in the middle lane... likewise people in the middle lane cut across into the left hand lane in front of cars in the left lane heading on the M50. One woman almost ran me off the road doing that a few years back.

Also notice heading inbound on N4 as you approach the M50 roundabout there are 3 lanes which were recently changed. The layout and road markings are actually CLEAR but people do not get it.
LEft hand lane is for LEFT onto M50 North ONLY!!! You cant go straight on towards town. Middle is for straight ONLY but the line painting brings you in to the left hand lane on the bridge.
Right lane is for straight ahead or Right on the M50 southbound. Once you enter the roundabout the lane splits into middle for straight ahead ONLY or Right for straight ahead or more likely right to M50.
I see so many people in the middle lane cut straight through cutting off cars in the right lane and leaving the left hand lane empty.

andrea

NeMiSiS wrote:

You mean they stay in the inside lane right until the last minute and then belt across in front of you right at the exit of the n81? Through the hatched markings ?

TK

That's exactly what I mean. Dangerous doesn't quite cover it.

Fey!

Mike - I'd use B, as the exit is well over 180 degrees to the entry road.

NeMiSiS

andrea wrote:

That's exactly what I mean. Dangerous doesn't quite cover it.

I'd bet the next thing they do is pull into the inside lane on the dual carraige way. That road is a ****ing nightmare, it's grand if people actully drive at the posted limit, but more often than not you will find yourself doing about 25MPH and hitting every red light until you get to Citywest, and then sure you will get stuck behind a truck or some asshole driving about 30mph the whole way to Blessington... that's if you don't meet the cows at Hempstown, and have to stop alltogether.

I was stuck behind a tractor for 3 miles yesterday because the learner driver behind it would not overtake it, even though there was safe and clear places to do so, and the driver behind the learner did not not want to over take both the learner and tractor... N81 also.

Sunday I was behind a woman in a puegot van/people carrier type thing. She was traveling at 70MPH, when she came to a bend she would brake hard, reduce her speed to 25 - 30 MPH (and less), riding the brake the whole way round and then.. accelerate up to 70 again.. I counted 16 cars trawling behind her before I got to overtake her.. she was sat up on her steering wheel as if she was riding a horse. N81 again. On the way back.. same deal except a driver travelling at about 30 - 40 MPH reducing their speed to half that for a bend, I was six cars back from here.. and best I could figure she caused a convey of about twenty two cars to build up behind her all domino braking for every bend.

Coming into Naas saturday going up by Brennans hardware, there was a lady in a Micra travelling at and this is not a conservative estimate 7MPH, she stopped dead at a cross roads and sat there for at least 20 seconds waiting to turn left.. where she had right of way (there was also no traffic .. at this point.. except cars _behind_ her), she eventully continued left.. at this snails pace.. and pulled into a car park. She had no L plates displayed or anything that would suggest she was a learner.

Next heading towards Newbridge/M7 out of Naas, where you come down the hill and meet the newish roundabout and the next round about would be the one that leads to M7 Biz Park, Newbridge, and the M7.

At the first round about (the Woodies one), there is a clear view all round the roundabout, and you can see traffic coming onto it from a considerable distance away. She slammed on her brakes, stops dead on the round about.. looked left.. looked right..looked left looked right.. turned on her right indicator.. and went straight through the roundabout. At the next roundabout, she entered in the left hand lane, turned on her left indicator, same thing .. stopped dead.. looked left, right.. left, right.. then took the M7 Biz Park exit.. indicating left the whole way round the round about in the inside lane.. and finally indiacting right as she left the round about..


I don't know what kinda lessons these people have had, or what kind of grasp on reality they have. Also I have nothing against female drivers, I am just pointing out they were female.. and all this in the past two days. I could tell you as many stories about male drivers

TK

andrea

I have no problem with criticisms of female drivers, they do as much wrong as male drivers! In general women tend to do less aggressively stupid things though, although obviously there are plenty of exceptions to that!

What's funny is that I still have my L plates on the car (waiting times suck!) and I have to watch people who have presumably passed a test at some point doing this kind of ridiculous stunt. And they obviously fully believe that they are in the right.

Vegeta

Fey! wrote:

Mike - I'd use B, as the exit is well over 180 degrees to the entry road.

well as its past 12 o clock i'd nearly agree but its others who use the left hand lane for the second exit you'd have to watch, they don't have to cross lanes either which makes it easier for them

Vegeta

andrea wrote:

What's funny is that I still have my L plates on the car (waiting times suck!) and I have to watch people who have presumably passed a test at some point doing this kind of ridiculous stunt. And they obviously fully believe that they are in the right.

Never a truer post made.

mike65

In the roundabout 'what I drew' traffic overwhelmingly uses the B right hand lane for Carrick, last week some guy on the "A" left lane undertook me on it, I could hear a sudden rise in revs by the passenger window and knew what was coming so I tucked right a bit. I was indicating right on the approach which the guy behind clearly should have seen but it seems did'nt.

Any potential confusion could be ended by have the left lane marked for turning to Kilkenny only.

Mike.

Vegeta

mike65 wrote:

In the roundabout 'what I drew' traffic overwhelmingly uses the B right hand lane for Carrick, last week some guy on the "A" left lane undertook me on it, I could hear a sudden rise in revs by the passenger window and knew what was coming so I tucked right a bit. I was indicating right on the approach which the guy behind clearly should have seen but it seems did'nt.

Any potential confusion could be ended by have the left lane marked for turning to Kilkenny only.

Mike.

I understand your frustration, my exit gets blocked on the roundabout everyday