Ugly people are genetically inferior?

Yook

DOLEMAN wrote:

*Nonsense*
Blackrock people are much better looking than Ballyfermot people.

Someone has some class issues then I think. :rolleyes:

Thirdfox

Well in general more affluent classes can afford better nutrition, better healthcare, better clothing/beauty products. So I would agree with the general statement that affluent areas has more "beautiful" people.

Having said that I find that beauty can be found everywhere, when I was in China I saw a 50 year old lady working on a farm, skin was ravaged by the sun and hands had calluses but I thought she was "beautiful" too.

Hobbes

Looks aint everything... Look at Nikki on bigbrother find me someone who would breed with her that wouldn't mean the person would impale themselves onto a rusty Iron railing rather then put up with her.

For those who don't know her..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLYsO_r3wiE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPPU4cl3Vag

Son Goku

Genetically inferior is a non-statement, nothing is genetically inferior.
Do they reproduce better or not? That is the only question you can really ask.

Aside from that beauty and ugliness are society dependant factors.
Even though a single given society probably has a fairly consistent definition of ugly, it's the variance of ugliness across societies which makes this much harder to assert.
Look at the women who were considered attractive in Egypt. Women who had birth deformities giving them elongated skulls, they'd without a doubt be ugly to most now.

Yook

I'm from a upper class area, my parents are pretty well off and I don't consider myself better looking/uglier/better than some random person from a lower class area.

I'm suprised at a lot of people on this one, what you people are saying is the definition of vain. I would like to know how you assume you are better looking than somone else?

edit:

slipss wrote:

We came to the conclusion that we don't think it's just physical either even though attractive people are always being desribed as stupid, is this not just something ugly people say to make them selves feel better, after all ugly people do tend to spend more time studying and reading than good looking people so wouldn't that explain why the top scoring people in school and college always seemed to be the ugliest.

By that logic, you are saying that you are dumb, maybe you're onto something there

Civilian_Target

lol

"I think I'm just special"

You sure are love.

I'd impale her though. And all you need to put up with her would be a good set of earplugs.

"What, are you talking again?"

Pigman II

DOLEMAN wrote:

There is actually a scientific/mathamatical way of calculating beauty. So beauty is not entirely in the eye of the beholder. There is a "who is most fertile" algorithm. Again, discovery channel...

I think you may be refering to the "Golden Ratio?" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_ratio#Aesthetic_uses

slipss wrote:

Is their uglyness a warning to potential mates that they would produce offspring that would lose in the survival of the fitest scenario?

If it is then it doesn't seem to be working as from personal observation it seems to be uglier (and stupider for that matter) people who breed soonest and most often.

seamus

Speking in pure animalistic terms, it's not always been the best-looking people or the ones with the best bodies that have been successful in love.

Women at a base level are drawn to "alpha" males. These are typically men who show themselves to be successful in the hunt, with a strong physique and strong immune system. When it comes to the initial attraction, money will always win out over looks, for 99% of women. The attractiveness of the face is largely irrelevant, though it's fair to say that deformities, or extreme distortion are a sign of a genetic problem anyway.

It holds true even more for men. The attractiveness of women changes continually. A few hundred yeasr ago, women with small breasts, a fair wad of flab and big asses were seen as attractive. Now they're a border case. BY far the most "desirable" (i.e. shown in all the media) women are those with small waists and large tits. Yet genetically men really only look for two things - large hips (better for childbearing) and a healthy amount of fat (produces healthier offspring).

So what's attractive? Whatever the media decides is attractive.

RedPlanet

As a whole, and in very general terms; do people think humans are getting prettier or uglier?

Through the course of time.

weemcd

whos to say what beauty is, sure in medieval times was it not considered a symbol of status and beauty for the women to be very fat, to show they could afford food, and have black teeth to show they could afford sugar. i am not making this up, i definatly read this somwhere before (yeah i know, dont believe everything you read )

New_Departure06

I think beards are ugly.

Terry

slipss, does your friend ever talk about her great aunt eva?

hobbes, i agree with you on that big brother chick. definitely someone you would have to gag while having sex with, and not in a kinky way.

6 billion and rising? WWM nailed it. it's all down to beer.

DOLEMAN

Yook wrote:

Someone has some class issues then I think. :rolleyes:

Noooo, you have class issues if you can't admit there are differences in our society...

Everyone knows wealth attracts babes. Combine this with comfortable surroundings, good food, and expensive dental work when you're growing up, and you're guaranteed to have more good looking children.

Go to "Bondi Beach" in Stillorgan and then some local in a rough area. ON AVERAGE Bondi Beach will have a much higher babe ratio.

SpAcEd OuT

I hate ugly people

Kernel

Son Goku wrote:

Genetically inferior is a non-statement, nothing is genetically inferior.
Do they reproduce better or not? That is the only question you can really ask.

Aside from that beauty and ugliness are society dependant factors.
Even though a single given society probably has a fairly consistent definition of ugly, it's the variance of ugliness across societies which makes this much harder to assert.
Look at the women who were considered attractive in Egypt. Women who had birth deformities giving them elongated skulls, they'd without a doubt be ugly to most now.

Totally agree. Ugliness is determined by social trends, and have varied wildly over the years. The stick thin waif is not genetically superior to the fuller figured person, since they show malnutrition, usually a weaker immune system, and are less efficient at storing energy from food (fat). In that case, they would not be as likely to survive natural (in historical human terms) conditions in the wild. In Africa, heavier women are seen as more desirable, since it shows they can survive with less food.

More women are actually having trouble giving birth naturally, because their hips are narrowing - and yet this is seen as a desirable trait. I remember watching a documentary where Kate Moss or some other supermodel spent time with a South American primitive tribe, and they thought she was really ugly and undesirable, and couldn't believe that people thought she was beautiful - in fact they were laughing at her when told this!

Also, bone structure can be weaker on the modern good-looker. Appearance can be a guideline (healthy skin, hair etc) as to health, but there is no easy way to spot genetic defects until they occur in offspring, or weak hearts etc.

The whole class system of selective breeding, by definition leads to inbreeding within a shallow gene pool, producing many genetic abnormalities - look at the history of the British royal family!

Dudess

Take a look at 1940s/50s films. Women who were deemed sexy at the time look totally different to their counterparts today. Not just their fuller figures, but they were (or looked) older and their make-up and dress also made huge differences. I wouldn't consider many of them that beautiful to be honest, but at the time, they were sex goddesses!
Then the waifs came along in the 1960s and what was once deemed really desirable - the hourglass figure - became unattractive.

New_Departure06

Ugly is as ugly does!

Pepe LeFrits

I hope for your own sake that you're at least pretty!

Bottle_of_Smoke

Probably at one stage it was advantageous to reproduction. Probably not too much in this country

No need for it anymore - ugly people have just as many kids

biko

Beauty wins http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=ugly&word2=beautiful

constitutionus

Thirdfox wrote:

Well in general more affluent classes can afford better nutrition, better healthcare, better clothing/beauty products. So I would agree with the general statement that affluent areas has more "beautiful" people.

true, but then its been my experience that the more affluent the area the LESS likely you are to find a naturally good looking women. to paraphrase to old debbie magee joke "tell me young man, what first attracted you to the ugly milloinairess":D
lets be honest, if you dont have good looks in a poor enviroment you dont get laid by a brad pitt type . but any minger from foxrock will get fixed up with that type if moneys there. throw in all the inbreeding between the solicitors/consultants/doctors and its monsterville (i mean hell just look what copper face jacks is doing to the genepool ,its like some nurse/gardai breeding program )

Pigman II

Hobbes wrote:

Looks aint everything... Look at Nikki on bigbrother find me someone who would breed with her that wouldn't mean the person would impale themselves onto a rusty Iron railing rather then put up with her.

For those who don't know her..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLYsO_r3wiE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPPU4cl3Vag

I'd still give her one tho .... 'a bottle of water' that is!

Haha I'm joking! I of course mean 'a slap'

No no, I'm still joking. I of course mean 'aggressive sexual intercourse'.

Thirdfox

constitutionus wrote:

true, but then its been my experience that the more affluent the area the LESS likely you are to find a naturally good looking women. to paraphrase to old debbie magee joke "tell me young man, what first attracted you to the ugly milloinairess"
lets be honest, if you dont have good looks in a poor enviroment you dont get laid by a brad pitt type . but any minger from foxrock will get fixed up with that type if moneys there. throw in all the inbreeding between the solicitors/consultants/doctors and its monsterville (i mean hell just look what copper face jacks is doing to the genepool ,its like some nurse/gardai breeding program )

Actually I just find that people from these "affluent" areas (girls mostly) look the same - same top, same hair, clothes - quite scary actually!

I would have thought that guys are less attracted to the money and more towards the looks - rich people can afford to battle it out and out do each other in terms of beauty treatments, holidays in the sun etc.

constitutionus

not to mention the scourge of fake tan i mean what the hell is that all about? no bloke i know likes tanned girls unless their foreign. you do bring up an interesting thing on beauty treatments. seems to me alot of girls seem to be trying to impress other girls which is why we seem to be getting this little waif thing. i cant speak for every guy but the stick insect thing doesnt do anything for me so why do girls try to look like posh spice.

Thirdfox

Oh yes competition is fierce!

Girl: "I shall wear high heels to the cobblestone ball"
Me: "But wouldn't your feet be swollen after a while?"
Girl: "Yes, I'm bringing some flats too - I'll change after everyone is too drunk to notice."
Me: "...?"

gerrycollins

i thought this started as a ugly vs. good looking debate and now it has turned into a class debate

I'm ugly lol and not afraid to say it but the one thing i did notice

im 27 and last year got married

for our wedding my now wife and i joined weight watchers to lose weight obviously for the big day

i lost 5 stone to trim to what is medically regarded as my ideal weight

then i noticed more women look at me on the street or in the shops(did i become vain i dont think so)

the funny part is i never had any problems pulling women in clubs or social events when i was fat i dont think they looked at that part of me only my personaility,

but one night my wife was at a work "do" when i called to collect her i was in the suit just after work and one of her new collegues who i never met before started cracking onto me so for once is was not me doin the chasing lol

im fiancally suscessful,married baby on the way,college degree,own my own house but i always consider myself ugly so i dont think looks has anything to do with your outcome but what you make of it

we rely and look towards the media too much and this is whats mentally retarded us to others regardless of their looks or "class" status

Dudess

constitutionus wrote:

i mean hell just look what copper face jacks is doing to the genepool ,its like some nurse/gardai breeding program )

Hee hee! Brilliant!

CathyMoran

I have found that really masculine men can be also borderline ugly but there is something really attractive about them and they are the only ones that give me massive chemistry. Masculine men would be the alpha males and would not be considered genetically inferior.

constitutionus

CathyMoran wrote:

I have found that really masculine men can be also borderline ugly but there is something really attractive about them and they are the only ones that give me massive chemistry. Masculine men would be the alpha males and would not be considered genetically inferior.

actually this is quite interesting cause i was writing from a blokes point of view. girls dont seem to employ the same criteria we do in terms of whats considered classically good looking. i know alot of girls of model standard in terms of looks going out with some compleate brutes, nice guys but sweet jesus you'd **** yourself if you met them in a dark alley, a good looking face doesnt seem to be up there in a girls view.
personally i have to have a pretty face, shallow prehaps, but thats me. but then again there is the phenomenon where the more you get to know a girl the better looking she gets. fecked if i know how that really works but its happened to me on many occasion (and no, beer ISNT involved )

CathyMoran

constitutionus wrote:

actually this is quite interesting cause i was writing from a blokes point of view. girls dont seem to employ the same criteria we do in terms of whats considered classically good looking. i know alot of girls of model standard in terms of looks going out with some compleate brutes, nice guys but sweet jesus you'd **** yourself if you met them in a dark alley, a good looking face doesnt seem to be up there in a girls view.
personally i have to have a pretty face, shallow prehaps, but thats me. but then again there is the phenomenon where the more you get to know a girl the better looking she gets. fecked if i know how that really works but its happened to me on many occasion (and no, beer ISNT involved )

I never got it either until I met my first love - he had something, I knew it the moment I saw him even though his looks repulsed me, sure he had the most wonderful eyes but...he just had "it", whatever that is, he was the first guy that I had to bite my lips to stop myself kissing him. He did have a great personality as well as it turns out! I do think that those kind of men evoke a lust response more than a love response though, more if you wanted a good time than a lifelong partner.